What Coolant Do You Use?
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Member
Vespa GT 200
Joined: 25 Aug 2015
Posts: 12
Location: Granby, CT
Sun Sep 20, 2015 1:38 pm quote
I need to change the coolant in my GT200. The stuff the dealer sells is pretty expensive and they don't have any anyway. (I would have bought it if they had it). So I'm curious as to what you guys use.
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GTS 250ie
Joined: 21 Jun 2008
Posts: 2046
Location: Rhode Island
Sun Sep 20, 2015 2:13 pm quote
Pentosin Pentofrost SF. Not cheap, but better than the dealer stuff. Available at many local Auto Parts places, notably Pep Boys.

You need ethylene glycol type, silicate free, so be careful.

The Pentosin is not premix, use distilled water to make your 50-50 mix.

P
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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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Sun Sep 20, 2015 2:24 pm quote
Cheapo pre-mix silicate-free from Pep-Boys (or your other FLAPS).
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2005 GT 200
Joined: 19 Jun 2010
Posts: 2083
Location: Montgomery,Alabama
Sun Sep 20, 2015 7:56 pm quote
Any silicate, borate and phosphate free coolant should be okay. I buy it by the gallon at the Honda car dealership.

Coolant_OL999-9011.JPG

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GTS250, P200E
Joined: 11 May 2008
Posts: 731
Location: Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Mon Sep 21, 2015 10:03 am quote
Any antifreeze that meets the GM dex-cool specification. Contrary to old beliefs, it's perfectly safe to use in systems where air is NOT introduced to the top of the radiator(s). As Vespas have a pressure bottle at the top of the system, that's what I use.

Cheers,
Bob
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Joined: 22 Feb 2013
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Location: Seattle Washington
Mon Sep 21, 2015 10:55 am quote
Interesting topic. Can I just use any ole coolant that's already premixed or is bike coolant different?
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GTS250, P200E
Joined: 11 May 2008
Posts: 731
Location: Oshawa, Ontario, Canada
Mon Sep 21, 2015 11:57 am quote
ma_ttcald, I will let you do the research but one of the differences in automotive factory coolant has as much to do with the hardness of water in the area of origin (Europe, Asia, or North America) as it has to do with the metals in the engine's cooling system.

Coolant threads can be as err... interesting as oil threads.

Cheers,
Bob
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2015 Piaggio BV350 ie - 2017 Vespa Primavera 150 3V ie IGET
Joined: 25 Mar 2015
Posts: 62
Location: North-West Florida, USA
Mon Sep 21, 2015 7:12 pm quote
I use AGIP Permanent Spezial -40 C CUNA NC 956-16.

It's all mixed and ready for use; it's pink.
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Vespa s 125 ie 4t
Joined: 31 Mar 2015
Posts: 871
Location: Telford
Tue Sep 22, 2015 1:23 am quote
We use demineralised water mixed with antifreeze 50-50 for the gts, had a leak somewhere (mechanic put some orange stuff in) however after using this simple stuff it seems to have stopped... Probably has nothing to do with it but ill carry on using the clear stuff;')

Its bot branded, its as basic mixture you can get but it meets the cooling specs... If I remember rightly its good for -45c untill 145c.
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
Joined: 19 Feb 2015
Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:03 am quote
Does Vespa/ Piaggio like phosphate in their coolant like the Japanese - P-OAT coolant?

What about 2-eha? That's a big one many miss.
Mfg are moving away from using 2-eha.
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
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Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:05 am quote
Hachi wrote:
Any silicate, borate and phosphate free coolant should be okay. I buy it by the gallon at the Honda car dealership.
So that is a phosphate OAT coolant w/ no 2-eha.
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
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Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:10 am quote
Peak Global Lifetime has no phosphate, silcates, amines, nitrates & 2-eha.
Available at Walgreens.

Good option if Piaggio is against phosphate & 2-eha.

https://peakauto.com/products/antifreeze-and-cool/auto/globallifetime-5050/

Last edited by Eakins on Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:21 am; edited 2 times in total
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
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Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:16 am quote
Paul G. wrote:
Pentosin Pentofrost SF. Not cheap, but better than the dealer stuff. Available at many local Auto Parts places, notably Pep Boys.

You need ethylene glycol type, silicate free, so be careful.

The Pentosin is not premix, use distilled water to make your 50-50 mix.

P
No mention if 2-eha is added or not however?
Any idea?

2-eha is not compatible with silicone hose or gasket anywhere in the motor and thus why the Japanese do not allow it. They use long life silicone in their motors. They also feel phosphate is needed while other mfg do not
Hooked
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Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:45 am quote
There are 2 links to the Agip PDFs for the factory red coolant
Click on here & here.

https://www.ducatiforum.co.uk/threads/coolant-alternative-to-agip.61918/

Read the second one.
Down the chart for the permant special one.

https://www.af1racing.com/store/Scripts/prodView.asp?idProduct=7331

That is an OAT coolant...ie NO phosphate used.
The Japanese coolants have phosphate.

And I'm betting NO 2-eha as that is old tech going away fast...unless someone else has more info?

Thus Peak Global is a great substitute.
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:51 am quote
For those who do not yet know in Italy there is a clone site:

https://www.modernvespa.it/topic/201-manutenzione-vespa-gts-sostituzione-liquido-radiatore/

There is a comprehensive post and I quote it:

Coolants are meant to

- Protect from freezing (this is the feature that is less interesting to Vespa ....... but then we will see why a low freezing point is important anyway ...)

- Protect from corrosion (it is the most important feature in my opinion as it extends the life of the water pump, the radiator and the entire cooling system (therefore lower repair costs and longer life of our Vespa). cooling must be replaced because the anti-corrosion inhibitors with time decay and lose effectiveness)

- Protect from boiling (personally I consider it second-rate as I consider the system well-sized and hardly the temperatures go up too much (at least with my driving style).

All modern liquids are free of nitrites, amines and phosphates (considered extremely harmful for the environment) and composed of ethylene glycol.

There are liquids that offer only protection from corrosion and boiling (for example Motul Mocool) but have specialized use (elaborate engines) and are much more expensive than common antifreeze liquids which are divided into 3 categories:

- Traditional liquids: blue or green-blue in color have a duration of 2 years and are recommended by Piaggio for the Vespa 125-200 Granturismo (LEADER engine) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Compatible with cast iron engines - They are sold both to be diluted (e.g. Paraflu 11) or ready to use (e.g. Paraflu 11 FE)

- OAT liquids. red in color, it has a duration of 5 years (Long Life) and is used on Vespa with Quasar engine (trade name Paraflu UP or ENI Antifreeze Bike S) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Specific for I.E. in aluminum, They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

- Blue (or yellow) Hybrid liquids last 3-4 years and are recommended as a replacement for traditional liquids (trade name Eni Antifreeze Bike P) - can be mixed with traditional liquids and OAT - Compatible with cast iron and aluminum motors. They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

The main rules to follow are:

1) DO NOT mix different colors and keep the type prescribed by the manufacturer:

RED = OAT (Long Life)
GREEN or BLUE-GREEN = traditional liquid or Hybrid.

2) There is NO difference between automotive and motorcycle liquids (for example the Selenia Paraflu UP has been used on all FCA cars since 2006 ... the equivalent for Selenia Moto Rider motorcycles costs only more but is identical !!! (see technical sheet)

3) The best protection against corrosion is obtained by using a dilution between 40 and 50% of ethylene glycol. Even if this concentration leads to protection from "Siberian" frost (-38 -40 ) remember that you will have the best protection from corrosion and boiling (therefore it is the dilution recommended by Piaggio).

4) If you do not purchase a "ready-to-use" product, you can prepare it by diluting the concentrated product with demineralized water or with "fresh" drinking water (follow the manufacturer's instructions as some types may only require demineralized water). With a liter of concentrated product you can prepare the quantity required by the Vespa to the ideal concentration (about 2.15 liters).

5) If you use a diluted liquid with -20 protection, shorten the replacement periods as it offers less protection from corrosion (which is still acceptable)

6) The GT 125-200 system is self-purging, while for the other models the system must be purged by means of a special screw on the head.

7) For the DIY operation the total cost does not exceed 10 euros (concentrated liquid OAT or Hybrid + Demineralized water + 25-40 mm stainless steel hose clamp .... and we are confident for 4 or 5 years.

8 ) Periodically check the liquid level cold.

9) A good rule would be to wash the system by circulating only water, then empty and put the liquid at the correct dilution. No "flush" liquids are needed if the liquid is not particularly deteriorated (change of color or turbidity, traces of rust). During the first replacement, the original hose clamp must be "blown" and replaced with a screw clamp (preferably in stainless steel) which can be maintained in subsequent replacements.

10) The brand does not count but choose a reliable and quality product (to name Motul, LiquiMoly Arexons in addition to the ENI-Paraflu recommended by Piaggio) in an auto parts that has lower prices than a shop specializing in motorcycles / scooters).

Last edited by Attila on Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:53 am; edited 1 time in total
Hooked
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Posts: 395
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:53 am quote
Here is that Motul listed

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/141?f

Once again no mention of 2-eha
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 2:56 am quote
Eakins wrote:
Here is that Motul listed

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/141?f

Once again no mention of 2-eha
Check the release date of the list, often the sites are not updated correctly.
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
Joined: 19 Feb 2015
Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:05 am quote
Attila wrote:
For those who do not yet know in Italy there is a clone site:

https://www.modernvespa.it/topic/201-manutenzione-vespa-gts-sostituzione-liquido-radiatore/

There is a comprehensive post and I quote it:

Coolants are meant to

- Protect from freezing (this is the feature that is less interesting to Vespa ....... but then we will see why a low freezing point is important anyway ...)

- Protect from corrosion (it is the most important feature in my opinion as it extends the life of the water pump, the radiator and the entire cooling system (therefore lower repair costs and longer life of our Vespa). cooling must be replaced because the anti-corrosion inhibitors with time decay and lose effectiveness)

- Protect from boiling (personally I consider it second-rate as I consider the system well-sized and hardly the temperatures go up too much (at least with my driving style).

All modern liquids are free of nitrites, amines and phosphates (considered extremely harmful for the environment) and composed of ethylene glycol.

There are liquids that offer only protection from corrosion and boiling (for example Motul Mocool) but have specialized use (elaborate engines) and are much more expensive than common antifreeze liquids which are divided into 3 categories:

- Traditional liquids: blue or green-blue in color have a duration of 2 years and are recommended by Piaggio for the Vespa 125-200 Granturismo (LEADER engine) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Compatible with cast iron engines - They are sold both to be diluted (e.g. Paraflu 11) or ready to use (e.g. Paraflu 11 FE)

- OAT liquids. red in color, it has a duration of 5 years (Long Life) and is used on Vespa with Quasar engine (trade name Paraflu UP or ENI Antifreeze Bike S) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Specific for I.E. in aluminum, They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

- Blue (or yellow) Hybrid liquids last 3-4 years and are recommended as a replacement for traditional liquids (trade name Eni Antifreeze Bike P) - can be mixed with traditional liquids and OAT - Compatible with cast iron and aluminum motors. They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

The main rules to follow are:

1) DO NOT mix different colors and keep the type prescribed by the manufacturer:

RED = OAT (Long Life)
GREEN or BLUE-GREEN = traditional liquid or Hybrid.

2) There is NO difference between automotive and motorcycle liquids (for example the Selenia Paraflu UP has been used on all FCA cars since 2006 ... the equivalent for Selenia Moto Rider motorcycles costs only more but is identical !!! (see technical sheet)

3) The best protection against corrosion is obtained by using a dilution between 40 and 50% of ethylene glycol. Even if this concentration leads to protection from "Siberian" frost (-38 -40 ) remember that you will have the best protection from corrosion and boiling (therefore it is the dilution recommended by Piaggio).

4) If you do not purchase a "ready-to-use" product, you can prepare it by diluting the concentrated product with demineralized water or with "fresh" drinking water (follow the manufacturer's instructions as some types may only require demineralized water). With a liter of concentrated product you can prepare the quantity required by the Vespa to the ideal concentration (about 2.15 liters).

5) If you use a diluted liquid with -20 protection, shorten the replacement periods as it offers less protection from corrosion (which is still acceptable)

6) The GT 125-200 system is self-purging, while for the other models the system must be purged by means of a special screw on the head.

7) For the DIY operation the total cost does not exceed 10 euros (concentrated liquid OAT or Hybrid + Demineralized water + 25-40 mm stainless steel hose clamp .... and we are confident for 4 or 5 years.

8 ) Periodically check the liquid level cold.

9) A good rule would be to wash the system by circulating only water, then empty and put the liquid at the correct dilution. No "flush" liquids are needed if the liquid is not particularly deteriorated (change of color or turbidity, traces of rust). During the first replacement, the original hose clamp must be "blown" and replaced with a screw clamp (preferably in stainless steel) which can be maintained in subsequent replacements.

10) The brand does not count but choose a reliable and quality product (to name Motul, LiquiMoly Arexons in addition to the ENI-Paraflu recommended by Piaggio) in an auto parts that has lower prices than a shop specializing in motorcycles / scooters).
Thanks!

Issues:

Moto and Auto are the same.
Red is OAT
No phosphates in modern coolants.
All are ethylene glycol

Response:

All the Japanese specify phosphate a P-OAT formula - fact.
Red color in the US is Toyota P-OAT. Maybe red in EU is OAT but thru the rest of the world it's P-OAT.
Most modern coolants found thru the world are still propylene glycol.
It's still more effective, but not eco.

Still no mention of 2-eha

World translated use:

Choose a OAT coolant (regardless of color)
ie no phosphate, silicates etc.
& I'm guessing no 2-eha...hard on silicone parts.

Care to respond to 2-eha?

Last edited by Eakins on Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:17 am; edited 4 times in total
Hooked
2008 MP3 400
Joined: 19 Feb 2015
Posts: 395
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:08 am quote
Attila wrote:
For those who do not yet know in Italy there is a clone site:

https://www.modernvespa.it/topic/201-manutenzione-vespa-gts-sostituzione-liquido-radiatore/

There is a comprehensive post and I quote it:

Coolants are meant to

- Protect from freezing (this is the feature that is less interesting to Vespa ....... but then we will see why a low freezing point is important anyway ...)

- Protect from corrosion (it is the most important feature in my opinion as it extends the life of the water pump, the radiator and the entire cooling system (therefore lower repair costs and longer life of our Vespa). cooling must be replaced because the anti-corrosion inhibitors with time decay and lose effectiveness)

- Protect from boiling (personally I consider it second-rate as I consider the system well-sized and hardly the temperatures go up too much (at least with my driving style).

All modern liquids are free of nitrites, amines and phosphates (considered extremely harmful for the environment) and composed of ethylene glycol.

There are liquids that offer only protection from corrosion and boiling (for example Motul Mocool) but have specialized use (elaborate engines) and are much more expensive than common antifreeze liquids which are divided into 3 categories:

- Traditional liquids: blue or green-blue in color have a duration of 2 years and are recommended by Piaggio for the Vespa 125-200 Granturismo (LEADER engine) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Compatible with cast iron engines - They are sold both to be diluted (e.g. Paraflu 11) or ready to use (e.g. Paraflu 11 FE)

- OAT liquids. red in color, it has a duration of 5 years (Long Life) and is used on Vespa with Quasar engine (trade name Paraflu UP or ENI Antifreeze Bike S) - Cannot be mixed with different formulations - Specific for I.E. in aluminum, They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

- Blue (or yellow) Hybrid liquids last 3-4 years and are recommended as a replacement for traditional liquids (trade name Eni Antifreeze Bike P) - can be mixed with traditional liquids and OAT - Compatible with cast iron and aluminum motors. They are marketed both to dilute and ready to use.

The main rules to follow are:

1) DO NOT mix different colors and keep the type prescribed by the manufacturer:

RED = OAT (Long Life)
GREEN or BLUE-GREEN = traditional liquid or Hybrid.

2) There is NO difference between automotive and motorcycle liquids (for example the Selenia Paraflu UP has been used on all FCA cars since 2006 ... the equivalent for Selenia Moto Rider motorcycles costs only more but is identical !!! (see technical sheet)

3) The best protection against corrosion is obtained by using a dilution between 40 and 50% of ethylene glycol. Even if this concentration leads to protection from "Siberian" frost (-38 -40 ) remember that you will have the best protection from corrosion and boiling (therefore it is the dilution recommended by Piaggio).

4) If you do not purchase a "ready-to-use" product, you can prepare it by diluting the concentrated product with demineralized water or with "fresh" drinking water (follow the manufacturer's instructions as some types may only require demineralized water). With a liter of concentrated product you can prepare the quantity required by the Vespa to the ideal concentration (about 2.15 liters).

5) If you use a diluted liquid with -20 protection, shorten the replacement periods as it offers less protection from corrosion (which is still acceptable)

6) The GT 125-200 system is self-purging, while for the other models the system must be purged by means of a special screw on the head.

7) For the DIY operation the total cost does not exceed 10 euros (concentrated liquid OAT or Hybrid + Demineralized water + 25-40 mm stainless steel hose clamp .... and we are confident for 4 or 5 years.

8 ) Periodically check the liquid level cold.

9) A good rule would be to wash the system by circulating only water, then empty and put the liquid at the correct dilution. No "flush" liquids are needed if the liquid is not particularly deteriorated (change of color or turbidity, traces of rust). During the first replacement, the original hose clamp must be "blown" and replaced with a screw clamp (preferably in stainless steel) which can be maintained in subsequent replacements.

10) The brand does not count but choose a reliable and quality product (to name Motul, LiquiMoly Arexons in addition to the ENI-Paraflu recommended by Piaggio) in an auto parts that has lower prices than a shop specializing in motorcycles / scooters).
The bag of red Agip coolant - Piaggio coolant looks like it's premixed from AGIP's PDF s.
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:30 am quote
... when i go to my assistance service (which is also Piaggio) i will ask ... is urgent say it?
Hooked
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 3:34 am quote
Eakins wrote:
Here is that Motul listed

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/products/141?f

Once again no mention of 2-eha
Seems this is near impossible to find in the US, except for intl shipping.
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Mon Mar 02, 2020 5:13 am quote
I use Prestone. It meets the specs and it's super cheap.

IMG_20200302_070929.jpg

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Wed Mar 04, 2020 3:32 am quote
Internet
In this internet age, I use exactly what the manufacturer specifies. Given the change interval, cost is irrrelevant. On the other hand, the cost of using a non-standard coolant can be substantial, from trashed water pumps to corroded/leaking/overheating engines. You may get lucky and have no problems. I prefer not to gamble. I figure no one knows more about what the cooling system needs than the manufacturer.

If you decided to mix your own, highly recommended to use distilled (not demineralized) water, rather than tap water. Again, cost is trivial, and you have a known quality.

Wife bought a used Nissan. Heater didn't work especially well. Found that the entire cooling system was mineralled-up, presumably due to tap water usage. And the water pump needed replacing shortly after we got it. Was tempted to flush it with some acid, but was afraid of what might start leaking or get plugged. Changed the coolant, and the air bleed hole was so plugged I had to drill through to get the air out. Never did get the heater to work right. Traded it in a few years later.

So now, proper coolant, and distilled water. One less thing to worry about.
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Wed Mar 04, 2020 7:51 am quote
jimc wrote:
Cheapo pre-mix silicate-free from Pep-Boys (or your other FLAPS).


I will stick with this
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Location: Fairfax, Virginia, USA
Fri Mar 06, 2020 9:57 am quote
G12 (US) or G30 (Europe) Coolant

Either of these coolants are 'PINK' ethylene glycol-based antifreeze/coolant specifically developed for use in any European vehicle requiring a silicate/phosphate-free formulation.

They contain high-quality organic acid technology (OAT) corrosion inhibitors and are free of borate, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, silicate and amines chemicals.
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Hooked
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Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:11 pm quote
That's a hybrid HOAT coolant not OAT.
It has low silicate, not NO sillicate.

I think it also 2-eah plasticizes.

My answer would be no.

Agip factory is OAT with no mention of 2-eah

Just go to Walgreens and get Peak global 50/50

https://peakauto.com/products/antifreeze-and-cool/auto/globallifetime-5050/
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Hooked
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Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Fri Mar 06, 2020 1:42 pm quote
Pegasus Prime wrote:
G12 (US) or G30 (Europe) Coolant

Either of these coolants are 'PINK' ethylene glycol-based antifreeze/coolant specifically developed for use in any European vehicle requiring a silicate/phosphate-free formulation.

They contain high-quality organic acid technology (OAT) corrosion inhibitors and are free of borate, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, silicate and amines chemicals.
Found this:

Volkswagen's coolants have been 2EHA free forever AFAIK... G11 (blue), G12 (pink), G12+ (lilac), G12++ (rosy purple) & G13 (nuclear pink).

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3070272#Post3070279

Looking deeper the Japanese don't use 2-eha...but they have phosphates.

Nor does G-05 coolant...but it has silicates, but low.

Dexcools, all Prestone have 2-eha.

Peak Global in the US is the closest to Euro OAT coolant.
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Sat Mar 07, 2020 9:38 am quote
Thanks so much for the confirmation. I will NOT use this Zerex thing. That said, apparently Peak global is not avail at any Walgreens near me, but is indeed avail commonly at Walgreens. Must be a Republik of Cali problem. Looking for that (or G12 coolant), now.
Eakins wrote:
Pegasus Prime wrote:
G12 (US) or G30 (Europe) Coolant

Either of these coolants are 'PINK' ethylene glycol-based antifreeze/coolant specifically developed for use in any European vehicle requiring a silicate/phosphate-free formulation.

They contain high-quality organic acid technology (OAT) corrosion inhibitors and are free of borate, nitrite, nitrate, phosphate, silicate and amines chemicals.
Found this:

Volkswagen's coolants have been 2EHA free forever AFAIK... G11 (blue), G12 (pink), G12+ (lilac), G12++ (rosy purple) & G13 (nuclear pink).

https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=3070272#Post3070279

Looking deeper the Japanese don't use 2-eha...but they have phosphates.

Nor does G-05 coolant...but it has silicates, but low.

Dexcools, all Prestone have 2-eha.

Peak Global in the US is the closest to Euro OAT coolant.
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Sat Mar 07, 2020 1:36 pm quote
I have found some Peak Final Charge Global which says it is non 2-EH, OAT and is nitrate, phosphate, silicate and borate free. I saw it at WalMart. Has anyone used that?
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Sat Mar 07, 2020 2:55 pm quote
😊
A I R.
I recommend it.
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Sat Mar 07, 2020 6:35 pm quote
wbdvt wrote:
I have found some Peak Final Charge Global which says it is non 2-EH, OAT and is nitrate, phosphate, silicate and borate free. I saw it at WalMart. Has anyone used that?
I just got a gallon of that. I've been using Bel Ray Moto Chill for a long time, because it's non-toxic, but I want to see if this will be better for the engine. I will probably do a compressed air reverse flush to get anything that's in the system out with the coolant, and then fill it up and see what happens.
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Sat Mar 07, 2020 7:59 pm quote
Air?
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Sun Mar 08, 2020 2:28 am quote
Iamthegump wrote:
Air?
Air compressed reverse flush only MV could come up with that.
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Sat Jun 27, 2020 12:14 pm quote
Florida-Tom wrote:
I use AGIP Permanent Spezial -40 C CUNA NC 956-16.

It's all mixed and ready for use; it's pink.
Good to know. It's been a while since I've added it. I have the same one but couldn't remember if you need to mix 50/50 with water or not.
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Sat Jun 27, 2020 7:06 pm quote
dougsfield wrote:
Florida-Tom wrote:
I use AGIP Permanent Spezial -40 C CUNA NC 956-16.

It's all mixed and ready for use; it's pink.
Good to know. It's been a while since I've added it. I have the same one but couldn't remember if you need to mix 50/50 with water or not.
That could be a 50:50 answer - but the container should say if it is concentrate "Add Distilled Water" or already diluted "This is 50:50, DO NOT DILUTE".
Hooked
Vespa GT 200L
Joined: 07 Feb 2011
Posts: 244
Location: San Clemente
Sat Jun 27, 2020 10:09 pm quote
jimc wrote:
dougsfield wrote:
Florida-Tom wrote:
I use AGIP Permanent Spezial -40 C CUNA NC 956-16.

It's all mixed and ready for use; it's pink.
Good to know. It's been a while since I've added it. I have the same one but couldn't remember if you need to mix 50/50 with water or not.
That could be a 50:50 answer - but the container should say if it is concentrate "Add Distilled Water" or already diluted "This is 50:50, DO NOT DILUTE".
That's what I thought but nothing on the bottle indicates that it is concentrated or that it is a 50:50 mixture. So I just assume it is ready to go as is. If it expected you to add water, it should say so but it would be nice if it just spelled it out.
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 2772
Location: East Anglia, The power house of the UK
Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:05 am quote
And just a reminder to everyone, that colour of the coolant is not a sign of it's type. There are red and pink HOAT's, POAT's, NOAT's and OAT's. Plus a dozen other types (and brands) of coolant that can be any colour you name. So any red or pink coolant can be any different type and may not be what you are looking for. There are Red, green, blue, yellow, black, brown etc. My car has a brown coolant in it! It has a ten year life in my car, but only a 5 year life in other cars that use it. Yeah, I know brown looks disgusting. Some are long life and some are most definitely short life. Rarely do different coolants actually mix without doing some damage over time. The blurb on the bottles of coolant is often misleading and is often misinterpreted as being safe to mix with any coolant. Usually this is not the case.

These different coolants all work differently and must never be mixed. Doing so will often severely damage your motor, hoses and radiators. Even flushing the motor several times won't always make it safe to change type of coolant as some of these coolant lay down a layer of anti-corrosive protection inside the engine, the hoses and rads. This cannot be flushed out easily and usually requires a special additive to be used to clear the engine. Often hoses need replacing too as the rubber won't give up it's layer of protection. That protection when mixed with OAT will start a chemical reaction that causes the coolant to start to gel. This blocks the engine coolant passages and rads over time and overheats the motor. I've seen several cases and you cannot easily resurrect the motor after that.

Do also bear in mind that often well meaning folks on the internet will tell you stuff that is categorically incorrect concerning coolant. It's one of the most misunderstood subjects. I've seen it on MV many times to the detriment of several folks on here where they have ended up having motor trouble. Only use coolant type that is specified in your owners manual. It's the only safe way to go. Using all these so called 'better' coolants of a different type is not needed, even in tuned motors. Over the years I've tried them all using the correct procedures for clearing the engines of old coolant types, and there really isn't any big differences between them even in the race world where I was involved in clubman race engine development for years. Zero benefit in actual fact. Just be very careful on what coolant you use. Cannot say that enough.

PS, the coolant change interval for the GTS bikes is every two years with the correct OAT coolant. It must not be left in for 5 years as sometimes the bottle of coolant will tell you it can be. Long life coolant with a 5 year life span becomes a two year coolant in our bikes because of our cast iron cylinders. Cast iron (of which there are several types in use) actually corrodes quickly when in contact with water. OAT coolant attacks corrosion at its site of origin (in this case the cast iron cylinder), it does not lay down a layer of protection as other types of coolant will do. This means it uses up it's additives quite quickly and then starts to become acidic so it does require changing at regular 2 year intervals to prevent water pump seal damage and active corrosion of the metals inside your cooling system. All this information is available on PROPER technical sites (not forums) and the technical reasons as outlined above are made clear. I'm only mentioning the basics here. It's much more complex that anything I am saying in this post.
Hooked
2015 Vespa GTS300 Super
Joined: 26 Sep 2017
Posts: 442
Location: Connecticut
Mon Jun 29, 2020 5:39 am quote
Ive been using the below, but its harder to find and/or expensive...

7C5E8D21-06EE-454D-A7BA-9891D7316F45.jpeg

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