OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
Hi everyone!
Im riding a 2015 mp3 business model.
Inner tube of Tail pipe broke at around 8000 km
I only understood it happened when i had ot serviced for 10000 km
During the service the mechanic found the oil stick empty.
Air filter was full of oil.
It rode ok for about 600 km but after 1000 km oil is back to minimum level.
I have 2 questions:
1. Mechanic told me its because i ride it too hard on my 100 km trips from sea level to 1000 meters altitude in the mountains. I do it once a week for work. Isnt this vehicle supposed to endure long rides at 130 km an hour? Thats why i bought ot for... Do u think oil losage is for that?
2. Do u think maybe the tail pipe breaking caused my whole engine to be overcompressed resulting in loose piston rings and lose of oil?


What would u suggest i do.i have one year left on my gurantee. Please. I would much approciate ure advice and help!
Thank you!
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
I doubt you're riding too hard. Sounds like a lazy mechanic to me or worse a dealer who doesn't want to work warranty.
Many 500's - mine included - develop a oil consumption issue because the rings allow excessive blow by. Many owners have discovered cracked pistons or rings.
If the mech cleaned your filter and it happened with a clean filter I'd be getting them to take a closer look and inspecting for a cracked piston or faulty rings - it is not normal to blow that much oil out and it just gets worse.
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
carter decompression valve needs replacing
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
Could u please post a link with an explanation on what is carter decompression valve?
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
its in the flywheel cover at the top where the breatherpipe is going to the airfilter

its a membram like valve
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
I will tell my mechanic. I hope it is that and not that my pistons are broken...
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
its in the flywheel cover at the top where the breatherpipe is going to the airfilter

its a membram like valve
You do remember that many of us tried cleaning that thing to no avail. I even drilled the drain hole out larger in the theory that it was getting clogged or unable to return fast enough.
Simple truth is that there shouldn't be enough mist in that line to empty the sump. The only thing that will cause that is excessive blowby from the piston/rings. Note that I'm assuming teh engine is fundamentally the same as the earlier 500 engines.
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
you all did it wrong there is a valve thats going out it suppose to let some oil out due to overpressure but not a lot when it does that you need to replace it otherwise it will cost ou a new piston and cylinder
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
First of all thank you to all who commented.
They are gonna send my bike in for treatment at the dealer but what maksur says makes me think they are aiming at changingqfixing the piston when the problem is with a a valve! it kinda makes sense since at the treatment i had for 10k they found no dirt on the oil filter to signle metal came of f the piston or to hint that it broke.

I wonder if i should tell my mechaninc to tell the dealr's mechanic.

Maksor,

Is it true for new model 2015 mp3 500 engine as well?
if you have a link earlier threads on this matter it would be great if you post it.
thank you!

nir
@klaborde avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
 
Ossessionato
@klaborde avatar
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
UTC quote
This post is making me a little nervous...
I thought the Cylinder issue was for the older MP3 500's.

Our 2016 500's in the US, I would assume is the same engine as this fellow's 2015? Watching with interest...

Keith,
Marietta, GA
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Nirontrip wrote:
First of all thank you to all who commented.
They are gonna send my bike in for treatment at the dealer but what maksur says makes me think they are aiming at changingqfixing the piston when the problem is with a a valve! it kinda makes sense since at the treatment i had for 10k they found no dirt on the oil filter to signle metal came of f the piston or to hint that it broke.

I wonder if i should tell my mechaninc to tell the dealr's mechanic.

Maksor,

Is it true for new model 2015 mp3 500 engine as well?
if you have a link earlier threads on this matter it would be great if you post it.
thank you!

nir
Nobody that had the cracked piston found metal in their oil. Not a good indicator.
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
you all did it wrong there is a valve thats going out it suppose to let some oil out due to overpressure but not a lot when it does that you need to replace it otherwise it will cost ou a new piston and cylinder
Maksor - that little flappy valve - there's no way to do it "wrong" It's a fripping tiny hole covered by a thin rubber flap. The hole is known to sludge up and you can clean it with a small drill or wire.
In addition there is no way that it is normal to pass your entire sump out the airbox in 100 km. What are you smoking buddy?
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
you don't drill holes in it then it will leak its supose to let pressure out on highway speed with the oil as a fog then it will burn of the oil when the membram is kaputtt it will alwaays let pressure and oil out its not designed that way


i do a lot off maintenance for customers all the oil leaks are fixed by doing the membram replacement and when people did drive to long with it also the piston rings

The membram is only 5 euro the gasket 30


there is a simple test to see if its works a new membram makes a sound like riet from a sax or clarinet a worndown one don't make any sound
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
do i have to take the cover off or is it visible in plain sight
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
besides, i think they will have to make sure the piston is ok too so they will take it apart anyway.
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
i always look with a endoscope ( a digital camera through the sprakplug hole) for the piston rings

and yes for the membrame you have to take the cover off
@ramblerdan avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2009 MP3 400
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2008
Location: Saratoga, N.Y.
 
Ossessionato
@ramblerdan avatar
2009 MP3 400
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2008
Location: Saratoga, N.Y.
UTC quote
Is this "membrane" aka "decompression valve" what others have referred to as the "reed valve"? If so, more discussion here:

Why does the engine blow oil out the breather pipe?

However, with total oil loss in few miles, my money's on a cracked oil ring. This is all a good reason for us to check the oil level every riding day. Blowing oil means you might need a costly repair. Running out of oil means a new engine/bike.
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
the cracked pistonring is the result of "reedvalve"
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
you don't drill holes in it then it will leak its supose to let pressure out on highway speed with the oil as a fog then it will burn of the oil when the membram is kaputtt it will alwaays let pressure and oil out its not designed that way


i do a lot off maintenance for customers all the oil leaks are fixed by doing the membram replacement and when people did drive to long with it also the piston rings

The membram is only 5 euro the gasket 30


there is a simple test to see if its works a new membram makes a sound like riet from a sax or clarinet a worndown one don't make any sound
Maksor - you should remember when we were testing the valve. the valve was working. The return drain was what was drilled *slightly* bigger - there was ALREADY an oil problem before with the valve working properly.
Anyway - anyone with search can look that up in the oil thread.
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
the cracked pistonring is the result of "reedvalve"
That my friend is utter bullshit.
That "reed" flappy valve is in no way responsible for a cracked piston or broken piston ring.
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
Well how many did you do maintance on got 45 returning customers now and lots that customers that come for chancing the piston and reedvalve

i'm also working with a Piaggio trained mechanic and he is saying the same thing we do all sorts of projects with piaggio group eningens from tuning to rebuilding when we see lots off oil in the airbox we change the reedvalve and look with a endoscope if the pistonrings are not broken most of them we are on time otheres that did drive on to long with it need a more expensive rebuild

Reason

Due to underpressure when the reedvalve is lost its strenght the piston won't get enough lube the oilspray is going directly out of the breatherpipe


you see this the most on engine that do the most miles on the highway
or very long rides

When you drive on with the oil leaks without changing it the pistonrings will brake when you drive on with the broken piston rings the valves will snap with a lot more demage

But be my guest not to change the reedvalve its a cheap fix 35.- usd or so and wait till you have to change the cylinder and piston and maybe even head and crankshaft
@madison_sully avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7542
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@madison_sully avatar
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7542
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
UTC quote
Quote:
you see this the most on engine that do the most miles on the highway
or very long rides
Sh!t.
Oh well so far so good.
@mvtroiano avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1211
Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1211
Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
UTC quote
Doesn't the reed valve come out when you take the waterpump cover off?
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
Well how many did you do maintance on got 45 returning customers now and lots that customers that come for chancing the piston and reedvalve

i'm also working with a Piaggio trained mechanic and he is saying the same thing we do all sorts of projects with piaggio group eningens from tuning to rebuilding when we see lots off oil in the airbox we change the reedvalve and look with a endoscope if the pistonrings are not broken most of them we are on time otheres that did drive on to long with it need a more expensive rebuild

Reason

Due to underpressure when the reedvalve is lost its strenght the piston won't get enough lube the oilspray is going directly out of the breatherpipe


you see this the most on engine that do the most miles on the highway
or very long rides

When you drive on with the oil leaks without changing it the pistonrings will brake when you drive on with the broken piston rings the valves will snap with a lot more demage

But be my guest not to change the reedvalve its a cheap fix 35.- usd or so and wait till you have to change the cylinder and piston and maybe even head and crankshaft
Quoting a Piaggio mech isn't much of an endorsement from what I've seen - they routinely denied the front bearing issue and never did own up to it - they just released a bulletin with a revised torque procedure then released a tool. Just like they released a zerk fitting after the enthusiasts came up with that solution.
#1 - given the wall clearances I call bullshit on seeing the rings and whether they're broken with an endoscope.

Engine Fitting clearance (Cylindrin/Pison)Standard coupling clearance
A 0.9 - 0.005 -0.030mm
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
Dealer mech says they tested the bike and nothing is wrong with it. Said that oil in the airfilter is normal especially with a pattern a lot of highway driving.
@madison_sully avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7542
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@madison_sully avatar
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7542
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
UTC quote
Nirontrip wrote:
Dealer mech says they tested the bike and nothing is wrong with it. Said that oil in the airfilter is normal especially with a pattern a lot of highway driving.
Sure, if there is too much oil in there in the first place.
When I first got my MP3 500, I had oil blowby to the extent of over a fluid ounce per day on my commute. It was greatly reduced, then recently I'll say virtually eliminated by:
1. Below halfway up the recommended filling. Usually just barely over the minimum.
2. Lots of miles. Could be the cylinders got worn in so the cylinder to ring seal is improved.
3. Ponydrvr airbox mod. Basically entails removal of the inlet snorkel and widening of the (new) inlet in the airbox, and addition of a plate to direct all the air through the filter. This helps reduce the vacuum seen by the engine pressure relief line.

I just went for a ~1,650 mile trip where probably 1,400 of it was above 70 (usually hovering around 75) MPH. No oil (NONE) in the airbox when I took it apart at the end. Just a bit of Kansas dust.
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
The quantity of oil is the detail to look for.
I believe the OP said he damn near drained his sump. That is indicative of a problem in the combustion chamber.
Flappy valve be damned the oil has to get in the airbox by only one route - the engine breather. The valve offers no impediment to the oil getting out - only back in.
A small amount of oil is expected - like the front drain tube full after a days ride at highway speeds. Emptying your sump is assuredly excessive.
When mine started I took a 60 mile ride with PapaBear and after 40 miles I had oil dripping on the ground - used almost a half quart in that time.
@klaborde avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
 
Ossessionato
@klaborde avatar
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
UTC quote
Question...

Can someone that has the knowledge update this picture where the oil is blowing into the Air Filter. Is it flowing through #6.

Having a High Performance Exhaust (LeoVince, etc...), does this change the Oil Flow to the Air Box making it better or worse.


Thanks,
Keith
Marietta, GA
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
from pipe number 23 and no driving style is the colperate
@klaborde avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
 
Ossessionato
@klaborde avatar
2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4308
Location: Marietta, GA
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
from pipe number 23 and no driving style is the colperate
Ok, Thanks...
OP
UTC

Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
 
Member
Mp3 500
Joined: UTC
Posts: 25
Location: Israel
UTC quote
Maksor, does it also apply to 2015 500's?
Also, told my mech (high ranking mech at the exclusive dealer of piaggio) about reed valve. He said he never heard about it andwill ask piaggio. Will they own up?admit they have a problem? Should i expect any answer?
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
Not in the US nobody bin there to italy

my mate is a schooled motorcyle mechanic did work for Ten Kate Honda racing team
also for a Triumph and Piaggio dealership


and yes you can see with a endoscope if the pistonrings are gone you will see scratch marks on the wall and also a pitted cylinder because parts of the top ring will demage the piston before the blow out the exhaust


the so called reedvalve is a membrame it has to hold a x amount of pressure before releasing it then it will release a fine spray of oil by flapping the membrame, that spry will be burned by the cylinder and that the whole working

when the membrame is to week its will let out oil because it stays open and not in a fine spray that cant be burned

this what i've always said also in earlier topic where you all added a oilcatcher and drilled holes in valves

The membrame is a 15dollar part but also said earlier be my guest not to replace and wiat till you need a new cylinder and piston
⚠️ Last edited by Maksor on UTC; edited 2 times
@maksor avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
 
Ossessionato
@maksor avatar
Gilera Fuoco 500ie
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4521
Location: Netherlands Olst
UTC quote
No Not from piaggio


All master engine will get this problem soner or later got a X9 15.000km and a Aprillia Atlantic 500 80.000km from customers that also leak lots of oil but because the mp3 is a much heavier bike it seems to occure earlier with them especiialy with bike that do a lot of highway and hard driving fullthrottle when its has a cold engine


driving style is the key got also a customer with a 09 with 125.000km on it never had to replace it the driver won't go faster then 55/60 miles an hour
@vespagt250 avatar
UTC

Hooked
2016 MP3 500 ABS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 342
Location: Mableton, GA
 
Hooked
@vespagt250 avatar
2016 MP3 500 ABS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 342
Location: Mableton, GA
UTC quote
This is starting to bother me. As I told Keith and my local dealer here in Georgia I feel like I am driving a 2 stroke.

I have had two Vespas a 200 and a 250 and never had to add oil between oil changes and would do 3 day weekend rides upwards to 800 miles + and highway to boot!

This past February I bought a brand new 2016 MP3 500 with only 3 miles on it and did the proper break-in. Once I hit the 600 mile mark I had the dealer do the first oil change which was around the end of April I believe.

On the 10th of June my bike had over a 1200 miles and my wife and I went on a 3 day trip to NC and did about 700 miles mostly back roads and some motorway coming back with speeds from 60 to 73mph. Before I left for our trip I fueled up and checked my oil. I was between high and low. When we got back on Sunday evening I did not check my oil till the following morning and was shocked to see nothing registering on my dip stick. It took about an ounce get back just above the min mark.

Not knowing of the issues with this motor and going back and forth to work for the rest of June the oil stayed in the middle where I filled it. 5th of July my son and I went on a 367 mile trip in the GA mountains and came home via highway the next morning I was down to the min mark on the dip stick and also for the 1st time noticed the oil bulb full of oil and got almost 56ml once I drained the air filter.

I have informed my dealer and am waiting for a response from the rep and also learned a lot from Keith and will try some of his ideas to see where my sweet spot is, if I have one.

I really hope I don't have a major issue and I really do not like the idea it seems anytime I go on a long trip to bring plenty of oil.
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
Not in the US nobody bin there to italy

my mate is a schooled motorcyle mechanic did work for Ten Kate Honda racing team
also for a Triumph and Piaggio dealership


and yes you can see with a endoscope if the pistonrings are gone you will see scratch marks on the wall and also a pitted cylinder because parts of the top ring will demage the piston before the blow out the exhaust


the so called reedvalve is a membrame it has to hold a x amount of pressure before releasing it then it will release a fine spray of oil by flapping the membrame, that spry will be burned by the cylinder and that the whole working

when the membrame is to week its will let out oil because it stays open and not in a fine spray that cant be burned

this what i've always said also in earlier topic where you all added a oilcatcher and drilled holes in valves

The membrame is a 15dollar part but also said earlier be my guest not to replace and wiat till you need a new cylinder and piston
I can agree with everything you just wrote - except for the reed valve operation. It's intended functionality is simply to allow vapors out of teh crankcase from normal blowby and recycle that to the airbox so any vapors can be burned. It was not intended to pass oil in any large quantities nor mist it by "flappy action". It's main function is to simply alleviate crankcase pressure would could accumulate and blow a seal.
I did not see any damage to my piston, did not see any wall scratches.
My 500 would still cruise at 80 mph but it did not have the oomph to maintain it up steep inclines that it could before the issue.
I put a pressure gauge on the breather pipe and could measure in excess of 30 PSI on the line at sustained speeds. That little membrane is only good for fractional pressures as it is held closed only by the elasticity of teh flap itself.
Perhaps a good test of "normal" would be to measure the pressure as I did. I asked others having teh oil problem to do so before but nobody took em up on it. I used a simple fuel PSI gauge.
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8926
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@web-tech avatar
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8926
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
UTC quote
BubbaJon wrote:
#1 - given the wall clearances I call bullshit on seeing the rings and whether they're broken with an endoscope.
You're not trying to look at the rings, you're trying to look at the walls of the cylinder for damage broken rings would have done if it has them
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
#1 - given the wall clearances I call bullshit on seeing the rings and whether they're broken with an endoscope.
You're not trying to look at the rings, you're trying to look at the walls of the cylinder for damage broken rings would have done if it has them
Which is exactly zero guarantee. If there is scratches then you win - if no, then you're still in the dark.
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8926
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@web-tech avatar
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8926
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
UTC quote
BubbaJon wrote:
WEB-Tech wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
#1 - given the wall clearances I call bullshit on seeing the rings and whether they're broken with an endoscope.
You're not trying to look at the rings, you're trying to look at the walls of the cylinder for damage broken rings would have done if it has them
Which is exactly zero guarantee. If there is scratches then you win - if no, then you're still in the dark.
If you don't have scratches it's one of two things, either you don't have cracked rings, or they just cracked and haven't scored the cylinder walls yet.
@bubbajon avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@bubbajon avatar
RIP: MP3 500 - Brutto Moto
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5288
Location: Austin, TX
UTC quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
WEB-Tech wrote:
BubbaJon wrote:
#1 - given the wall clearances I call bullshit on seeing the rings and whether they're broken with an endoscope.
You're not trying to look at the rings, you're trying to look at the walls of the cylinder for damage broken rings would have done if it has them
Which is exactly zero guarantee. If there is scratches then you win - if no, then you're still in the dark.
If you don't have scratches it's one of two things, either you don't have cracked rings, or they just cracked and haven't scored the cylinder walls yet.
I have seen rings snap clean and simply stop sealing. They only scratch if they're short enough to cock in the land. Plus pistons have gaps behind the rings for oil and a small piece off an end can just pass straight through - into the sump hopefully.
UTC

Ossessionato
Scarabeo 500GT(hers), `07 250 MP3, `09 400 MP3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2592
Location: Kingman, Az.
 
Ossessionato
Scarabeo 500GT(hers), `07 250 MP3, `09 400 MP3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 2592
Location: Kingman, Az.
UTC quote
Maksor wrote:
No Not from piaggio


All master engine will get this problem soner or later got a X9 15.000km and a Aprillia Atlantic 500 80.000km from customers that also leak lots of oil but because the mp3 is a much heavier bike it seems to occure earlier with them especiialy with bike that do a lot of highway and hard driving fullthrottle when its has a cold engine


driving style is the key got also a customer with a 09 with 125.000km on it never had to replace it the driver won't go faster then 55/60 miles an hour
Aprilia Atlantic 500 has a 460cc motor iike my Aprilia Scarabeo 500GT. Isn't that the piston you put on your 400 MP3?
DoubleGood Design banner

Modern Vespa is the premier site for modern Vespa and Piaggio scooters. Vespa GTS300, GTS250, GTV, GT200, LX150, LXS, ET4, ET2, MP3, Fuoco, Elettrica and more.

Buy Me A Coffee
 

Shop on Amazon with Modern Vespa

Modern Vespa is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to amazon.com


All Content Copyright 2005-2024 by Modern Vespa.
All Rights Reserved.


[ Time: 0.2029s ][ Queries: 45 (0.1575s) ][ Debug on ][ 313 ][ Thing One ]