Vespa GTS Sport, Yamaha Xmax 300, or BMW C400x
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Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:23 pm quote
I finally boarded the XMAX train yesterday. Got a yellow one. Was holding out for the iron max XMAX but the matt black, matt blue and matt red are not that attractive in person and I'm done with matt paint on bikes period. Too much work.

Installing the exclusive XMAX pipe by Akropovic when it arrives tomorrow.
It's half the price of the Akropovic non exclusive one and I don't know why but I'm not complaining.
I have a feeling that you aren't able to remove the DB killer plug on the XMAX exclusive pipe. Doesn't have the grommet underneath the tip which houses the screw to remove it.
I'm too old for that much noise anyway.

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Wed Jan 02, 2019 11:09 pm quote
I have the same exhaust on my Xmax, the sound is wonderful!!!

Enjoy

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:27 am quote
northernerbill wrote:
I have the same exhaust on my Xmax, the sound is wonderful!!!

Enjoy
Interesting. I can see some differences already. Fancy aluminum trim on the left and right lids.
I don't have lock on the gas cap or left lid and the ignition is different. I have no key in the ignition so if keyless fob fails , I'm screwed.

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:00 am quote
Iím sure itíll be fine ignition wise.

I especially like the new front mudguard design yours will have.

Best upgrade Iíve fitted is the wind deflectors though. Really work for my long legs and makes it look meatier too.

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:01 am quote
And from the inside

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:47 am quote
northernerbill wrote:
Iím sure itíll be fine ignition wise.

I especially like the new front mudguard design yours will have.

Best upgrade Iíve fitted is the wind deflectors though. Really work for my long legs and makes it look meatier too.
Yeah I saw some wind deflectors on eBay and didn't understand where they went. Now it's clear. I need them.
What I also need is a taller screen as the standard one is about 3 inches too short. I can feel half my head is protected and the other half is getting blown off once over over 100kph.

Ohlins do a front spring kit along with rear dampers. Nearly a 1000 bucks for the set. I like the comfort of the standard ride so I'll wait and see.
I've had the bike for 24 hours and already racked up 200kms of riding. I can't get off it.
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 4:49 am quote
mickfitz76 wrote:
northernerbill wrote:
Iím sure itíll be fine ignition wise.

I especially like the new front mudguard design yours will have.

Best upgrade Iíve fitted is the wind deflectors though. Really work for my long legs and makes it look meatier too.
Yeah I saw some wind deflectors on eBay and didn't understand where they went. Now it's clear. I need them.
What I also need is a taller screen as the standard one is about 3 inches too short. I can feel half my head is protected and the other half is getting blown off once over over 100kph.

Ohlins do a front spring kit along with rear dampers. Nearly a 1000 bucks for the set. I like the comfort of the standard ride so I'll wait and see.
I've had the bike for 24 hours and already racked up 200kms of riding. I can't get off it.
I bought a Puig windscreen for my Xmax.

I found the stock windscreen created much turbulence in both positions.

The Puig is approximately 6 inches taller and created a much more comfortable ride.

Still a little wind but very comfortable now.

I might look into the side wind deflectors but have not noticed a problem. I ride in warm Florida.

As for the keyless ignition, I was skeptical but it works very well.

I will be buying a spare soon.

5000 miles now in three months.

Bill

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The Puig windscreen makes it almost perfect for touring.

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:06 am quote
Yeh I donít really get affected too much as I only really ride around the city so never really get much above 40mph.

I have got one of small sports screens ready for summer though. You get lots of buffeting but I my speeds when itís really hot Iím sure itíll appreciated.

Pictured but not currently fitted.
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:06 am quote
Sorry

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 5:41 am quote
I have wind deflectors and a Givi aftermarket screen on my maxi-scoot. It's too bad Givi doesn't make a screen (or does it?) for the Xmax. Nice thing about the C650GT is the ability to adjust the screen high on the fly using your left thumb. When up all the way I get very slight buffeting on the top of my helmet with the Givi, I'm 5'11' .

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Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:20 am quote
Givi makes a screen for the Xmax.

I chose the Puig because it is a few inches shorter.

I look through the top of the screen when I slouch while riding, but well over the top when I sit up straight.

It offers much better wind protection than the short OEM screen.

The Givi height would make me look through it all the time. Simply too tall for my taste.

Bill, I may try that sport screen as it might get the turbulence from the OEM screen off my head. But my main use is touring, typical speeds between 55 and 80 mph, so the big Puig suits me well.

Bill
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:32 am quote
2019 XMAX 300
zwniana wrote:
the Yamaha xmax300 looks sweet too and the price point is great. Unfortunately only available in white in the US market.
The 2019 Yamaha XMAX 300 is black!

https://www.yamahamotorsports.com/scooter/models/xmax
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:50 am quote
WLeuthold wrote:
Givi makes a screen for the Xmax.

I chose the Puig because it is a few inches shorter.

I look through the top of the screen when I slouch while riding, but well over the top when I sit up straight.

It offers much better wind protection than the short OEM screen.

The Givi height would make me look through it all the time. Simply too tall for my taste.

Bill, I may try that sport screen as it might get the turbulence from the OEM screen off my head. But my main use is touring, typical speeds between 55 and 80 mph, so the big Puig suits me well.

Bill
Like you I generally don't like looking through a screen. I only raise it to that level when on the highway or in inclement weather. However if lowering the screen is not an option I would go for a shorter one I can see over. That's why I went with the Cupini and not the OEM taels screen on the GTV. It's a shame the Xmax doesn't offer the ability to adjust screen height, it is a very handy option.
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Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:08 am quote
Harbinger wrote:
Like you I generally don't like looking through a screen. I only raise it to that level when on the highway or in inclement weather. However if lowering the screen is not an option I would go for a shorter one I can see over. That's why I went with the Cupini and not the OEM taels screen on the GTV. It's a shame the Xmax doesn't offer the ability to adjust screen height, it is a very handy option.
I use the Faco or Malossi mid narrow screens on my three Vespa GTs. They have served me well over the years.

It sits well under my sight line and is so close that I can see the road just in front of the scooters.

The Puig screen on the Xmax is maybe two inches too tall but I am getting used to it. I really like the wind protection and it is so clear that looking through it is not an issue.

As for screens that can be raised and lowered with a touch of a switch, I would prefer that too. Yamaha does not offer it on the Xmax. I could have waited for the new Honda Forza 300 with its electric screen, but opted to jump in with the Xmax. Who knows when the Forza will actually get to the US.

Bill
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Wed Jan 09, 2019 9:03 pm quote
mickfitz76 wrote:
Installing the exclusive XMAX pipe by Akropovic when it arrives tomorrow.
It's half the price of the Akropovic non exclusive one and I don't know why but I'm not complaining.
I have a feeling that you aren't able to remove the DB killer plug on the XMAX exclusive pipe. Doesn't have the grommet underneath the tip which houses the screw to remove it.
I'm too old for that much noise anyway.
Thatís the pipe Iíd like, but itís not available in US. Evey place Iíve looked Iíd need to order it from overseas and itís around $700+ which is wayyy too much. It looks awesome, tho. Congrats on the new Xmax, we need a yellow picture.
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Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:08 am quote
ScooterFish wrote:
mickfitz76 wrote:
Installing the exclusive XMAX pipe by Akropovic when it arrives tomorrow.
It's half the price of the Akropovic non exclusive one and I don't know why but I'm not complaining.
I have a feeling that you aren't able to remove the DB killer plug on the XMAX exclusive pipe. Doesn't have the grommet underneath the tip which houses the screw to remove it.
I'm too old for that much noise anyway.
Thatís the pipe Iíd like, but itís not available in US. Evey place Iíve looked Iíd need to order it from overseas and itís around $700+ which is wayyy too much. It looks awesome, tho. Congrats on the new Xmax, we need a yellow picture.
Well I ended up not getting the pipe first because I fell in love with the Termignoni slip on for XMAX. It's a real beauty and I love the sound.
I need to wait one week for it.
But what I did do was install the front and rear Ohlins today. Finished about 30 mins ago. What a transformation.
Nose isn't diving anymore under braking. It's a new bike altogether. It's dark out here now but I can give you a picture or two until the morning. It's pretty dirty after getting the fork oil everywhere.

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Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:26 am quote
WLeuthold wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
Like you I generally don't like looking through a screen. I only raise it to that level when on the highway or in inclement weather. However if lowering the screen is not an option I would go for a shorter one I can see over. That's why I went with the Cupini and not the OEM taels screen on the GTV. It's a shame the Xmax doesn't offer the ability to adjust screen height, it is a very handy option.
I use the Faco or Malossi mid narrow screens on my three Vespa GTs. They have served me well over the years.

It sits well under my sight line and is so close that I can see the road just in front of the scooters.

The Puig screen on the Xmax is maybe two inches too tall but I am getting used to it. I really like the wind protection and it is so clear that looking through it is not an issue.

As for screens that can be raised and lowered with a touch of a switch, I would prefer that too. Yamaha does not offer it on the Xmax. I could have waited for the new Honda Forza 300 with its electric screen, but opted to jump in with the Xmax. Who knows when the Forza will actually get to the US.

Bill
XMAX is killing the new Forza in sales in Thailand. Forza had the 300cc market cornered until XMAX arrived. Even after the new model dropped you barely see them on the road. I looked at one before taking the XMAX and I can tell you it's ugly as f@#k. Those mirrors are just horrible. The front lights are design overkill and the rear light are the PCX design. Feels rushed and thrown together. It's also got 3hp less than the XMAX.
The fit and finish of the XMAX is far superior.

Even if the Forza comes to the U.S, you aren't missing a thing except the novelty screen. You got the best.
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Fri Jan 11, 2019 8:26 am quote
Yamaha Niken GT
Just got a blurb on the new 2019 Yamaha Niken GT.
What a bomb! Close to 900 cc's on a 3 wheeler. It's $21k as it comes out of the crate but close to $26k out the door.

Would like to see one in the flesh so to speak One dealer said not until late summer. We shall see.
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Fri Jan 11, 2019 10:14 am quote
mickfitz76 wrote:
Even if the Forza comes to the U.S, you aren't missing a thing except the novelty screen. You got the best.
Unless you mean a recent redesign, we have gotten the Forza here for several years. As far as I can tell, it has never really attracted very much attention. Hondas occupy a funny position in the American market. Honda motorcycles sell well and have a great reputation for reliability. Honda scooters don't have much of a market share. Honda dealers floor very few, service very few, and have few scooter accessories or parts. The lukewarm approach Honda takes to scooters in the US creates a great opportunity for Yamaha, Vespa, Genuine, what-have-you.
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Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:18 pm quote
There you go. Cleaned and ready to roll.
Metallic yellow looks great in the sun.

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Fri Jan 11, 2019 6:22 pm quote
Dooglas wrote:
mickfitz76 wrote:
Even if the Forza comes to the U.S, you aren't missing a thing except the novelty screen. You got the best.
Unless you mean a recent redesign, we have gotten the Forza here for several years. As far as I can tell, it has never really attracted very much attention. Hondas occupy a funny position in the American market. Honda motorcycles sell well and have a great reputation for reliability. Honda scooters don't have much of a market share. Honda dealers floor very few, service very few, and have few scooter accessories or parts. The lukewarm approach Honda takes to scooters in the US creates a great opportunity for Yamaha, Vespa, Genuine, what-have-you.
In Thailand Honda dominated the market for decades. Last few years they were comfortable with their lead and didn't really innovate.
Once other manufacturers started building bikes here they got taken over.
Yamaha has made leaps and bounds in the last 5 years to go number 1.
Honda dealers were nearly in every corner but now you notice a few closing. The dealer network is shrinking whilst Yamaha is opening more.

Competition is good for the consumer.
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Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:26 am quote
mickfitz76 wrote:
There you go. Cleaned and ready to roll.
Metallic yellow looks great in the sun.
That looks stunning. Yamaha sooo got the design right with the Xmax.

The rear shocks really look nice!!
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Sat Jan 12, 2019 10:41 pm quote
Those shocks are awesome. Iíd like to get some rear shocks with rebound damping, but itíll have to wait a while. Nice looking scoot in yellow, the bees probably love it.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 3:55 am quote
In Italy when it comes to Vespa it is called The Scooter ... the others are just scooters.
All even better from many points of view and with special features but Vespa is a style that goes beyond simple use.
This site is called Modernvespa (I believe) because the concept of scooter has now become more extensive but the term "Vespa" is inextricably linked to a type of vehicle that has made history. Those who buy Vespa look at this and look at the concept of a simple mobility, without frills.
If I'm wrong, say so, thank you.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:20 am quote
Attila wrote:
In Italy when it comes to Vespa it is called The Scooter ... the others are just scooters.
All even better from many points of view and with special features but Vespa is a style that goes beyond simple use.
This site is called Modernvespa (I believe) because the concept of scooter has now become more extensive but the term "Vespa" is inextricably linked to a type of vehicle that has made history. Those who buy Vespa look at this and look at the concept of a simple mobility, without frills.
If I'm wrong, say so, thank you.
Spot on Hun!
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:30 am quote
Attila wrote:
In Italy when it comes to Vespa it is called The Scooter ... the others are just scooters.
All even better from many points of view and with special features but Vespa is a style that goes beyond simple use.
This site is called Modernvespa (I believe) because the concept of scooter has now become more extensive but the term "Vespa" is inextricably linked to a type of vehicle that has made history. Those who buy Vespa look at this and look at the concept of a simple mobility, without frills.
If I'm wrong, say so, thank you.
True, well put. Nothing else is a Vespa except maybe I will argue Lambretta. Lambretta is no longer what it was but Piaggio has been very careful with the Vespa line as I believe they know and respect the brand. I will always have a Vespa because I love the styling and tradition behind the brand. I will also always have another bike as I do like the bells and whistles and the larger engine but to me the loyalty is not the same. I can see my next second bike being a Triumph, Ducati or maybe another BMW. The only true "scooter" I see myself ever owning however is Vespa.

*EDIT* - My comments are for the 650. The 400 even the guys at BMW don't see the same. Still a good scooter but without many of the benefits. In the 400 category I would look at the Burgman or the whatever Bill has option. If you can afford the C650 and it isn't too big for you I would consider it though.

Last edited by Harbinger on Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:52 am; edited 1 time in total
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:42 am quote
Attila wrote:
In Italy when it comes to Vespa it is called The Scooter ... the others are just scooters.
All even better from many points of view and with special features but Vespa is a style that goes beyond simple use.
This site is called Modernvespa (I believe) because the concept of scooter has now become more extensive but the term "Vespa" is inextricably linked to a type of vehicle that has made history. Those who buy Vespa look at this and look at the concept of a simple mobility, without frills.
If I'm wrong, say so, thank you.
As far as modern Vespa goes, I don't think the 4t Vespa is a real Vespa.
I own a Modern Sprint and two PX 2t.
For me, Vespa died when the two stroke motor got discontinued. The new ones are Vespa by badge only.
There are much better scooters out there compared to the modern Vespa of today.
Even the Piaggio line is better than Vespa with he 4v engines whilst the Vespa line drags behind with the 3v.
As far as design goes they look great but really don't ride as nice as other offerings.
It's become a status symbol only.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:52 am quote
To be clear, I have never bought or ridden any PTW for the purpose of it being a "status symbol"! That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, no matter what has however many valves or hp or gets in the movies more, so on...
Given some of the Vespa gear they sell, there's no doubt that some see them selves in a mirror?
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:19 am quote
Kantuckid wrote:
To be clear, I have never bought or ridden any PTW for the purpose of it being a "status symbol"! That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, no matter what has however many valves or hp or gets in the movies more, so on...
Given some of the Vespa gear they sell, there's no doubt that some see them selves in a mirror?
Shouldn't things like HP matter? Owning a Vespa is to some extent about owning a "status symbol" like it or not. It is a great scoot but there are cheaper options out there that do the same thing at the end of the day. You can apply that to SO many things... There is nothing wrong with liking nice things that cost more than something else that does the same thing. Everything is relative to your situation and priorities.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:37 am quote
Harbinger wrote:
Kantuckid wrote:
To be clear, I have never bought or ridden any PTW for the purpose of it being a "status symbol"! That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, no matter what has however many valves or hp or gets in the movies more, so on...
Given some of the Vespa gear they sell, there's no doubt that some see them selves in a mirror?
Shouldn't things like HP matter? Owning a Vespa is to some extent about owning a "status symbol" like it or not. It is a great scoot but there are cheaper options out there that do the same thing at the end of the day. You can apply that to SO many things... There is nothing wrong with liking nice things that cost more than something else that does the same thing. Everything is relative to your situation and priorities.
I agree with you but when I like a machine it's not because of status. I was drove my first BMW car in 1969. It certainly wasn't a status symbol then. I am what I easily describe as a greasy guy. That test drive was done with a real live mechanic in the passenger seat who also raced in SCCA, plus worked at that dealership. I still yet remember that ride. For a number of years I was involved with British cars and they had some posers and some greasy fingernail folks too.
In the years I belonged to the BMWMOA BMW MC club I saw many posers and even more yet non-posers. It comes both ways with we humans but a blatant fact that car & PTW mfg.'s use status to sell their stuff!
Vespa is surely no different as it's the humans who are talking about this...
Kymco as a status symbol is sort of funny but the new BMW C 400 scooter is an Asian built machine which offends some peoples "Built by Bavarian Elves" with a squad of engineers watching them mentality.
Status & quality get mixed up in advertising somewhat?
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:42 am quote
Kantuckid wrote:
To be clear, I have never bought or ridden any PTW for the purpose of it being a "status symbol"! That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it, no matter what has however many valves or hp or gets in the movies more, so on...
Given some of the Vespa gear they sell, there's no doubt that some see them selves in a mirror?
Don't get me wrong, they are number one when it comes to style.
But at the end of the day they aren't up to other offerings in the market.
You buy one to be exclusive. It's much like jewellery than it is the riding experience.

I had a GTS super and I hated how it rode but it looked damn good in the orange.
Then I had a 946, that was looks all day long. It was slow and heavy but again, it was jewellery.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 5:47 am quote
Kantuckid wrote:
I agree with you but when I like a machine it's not because of status. I was drove my first BMW car in 1969. It certainly wasn't a status symbol then. I am what I easily describe as a greasy guy. That test drive was done with a real live mechanic in the passenger seat who also raced in SCCA, plus worked at that dealership. I still yet remember that ride. For a number of years I was involved with British cars and they had some posers and some greasy fingernail folks too.
In the years I belonged to the BMWMOA BMW MC club I saw many posers and even more yet non-posers. It comes both ways with we humans but a blatant fact that car & PTW mfg.'s use status to sell their stuff!
Vespa is surely no different as it's the humans who are talking about this...
Kymco as a status symbol is sort of funny but the new BMW C 400 scooter is an Asian built machine which offends some peoples "Built by Bavarian Elves" with a squad of engineers watching them mentality.
Status & quality get mixed up in advertising somewhat?
Cool, makes sense and I get where you are coming from.

Is the BMW 400 really made in Asia? I know the 650 engine is made by Kymco but the rest of the bike is made by the Bavarian elves. Funny thing about the 650 is the first version BMW was pretty heavily involved in the engine design. It wasn't until they gave Kymco more freedom to revise the engine that performance improved and by no small amount. Those asians make a lot of CVT transmission scooters and have learned a thing or 2 over the decades.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:12 pm quote
I think the Vespa is unique for more than its history or ďstatusĒ, itís unique in its short wheelbase while still having a bit of power. I think this combo is unbeatable around town. Quick turning and quick on the throttle, itís a lot of fun. That quasar engine too, while not having the power of some others is a smooth quick revving engine, and thatís what you want with a scooter in my opinion.

That being said, SoCal is all about freeways and I wanted something smoother on the freeway, so I am trying the XMax. Yes there are some things that arenít quite as nice like a lot of plastic, but the ride is nice, itís smooth and quick with much better suspension than a Vespa and a load more storage. Itís way more stable at freeway speeds and has a higher top end speed. But itís not as fun around town for sure and the ergonomics arenít as easy.

Thereís no perfect scooter or motorcycle, itís all about compromises and how you use them and whatís important to the owner. Iím sure Iíll own another Vespa or two again. Just my $0.02.
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Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:15 pm quote
Harbinger wrote:
Kantuckid wrote:
I agree with you but when I like a machine it's not because of status. I was drove my first BMW car in 1969. It certainly wasn't a status symbol then. I am what I easily describe as a greasy guy. That test drive was done with a real live mechanic in the passenger seat who also raced in SCCA, plus worked at that dealership. I still yet remember that ride. For a number of years I was involved with British cars and they had some posers and some greasy fingernail folks too.
In the years I belonged to the BMWMOA BMW MC club I saw many posers and even more yet non-posers. It comes both ways with we humans but a blatant fact that car & PTW mfg.'s use status to sell their stuff!
Vespa is surely no different as it's the humans who are talking about this...
Kymco as a status symbol is sort of funny but the new BMW C 400 scooter is an Asian built machine which offends some peoples "Built by Bavarian Elves" with a squad of engineers watching them mentality.
Status & quality get mixed up in advertising somewhat?
Cool, makes sense and I get where you are coming from.

Is the BMW 400 really made in Asia? I know the 650 engine is made by Kymco but the rest of the bike is made by the Bavarian elves. Funny thing about the 650 is the first version BMW was pretty heavily involved in the engine design. It wasn't until they gave Kymco more freedom to revise the engine that performance improved and by no small amount. Those asians make a lot of CVT transmission scooters and have learned a thing or 2 over the decades.
Yes the C400 is made in China by Loncin under contract by BMW.
Molto Verboso
2018 Vespa GTS 300 ABS- Bianco
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1507
Location: E. KY
Sun Jan 13, 2019 12:41 pm quote
The BMW G650GS I sold last August, engine was formerly made by Loncin now the new scooter. The newish BMW 300 series MC is Indian built. It is an attempt to get younger riders interested as lower price point and lightweight, less hp for a newbie rider. It could fit this threads list of machines as it performs similar to these scoots.
Hooked
Yamaha Tricity 155 2018 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 410
Location: Latina (Italy)
Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:26 am quote
ScooterFish wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
Kantuckid wrote:
I agree with you but when I like a machine it's not because of status. I was drove my first BMW car in 1969. It certainly wasn't a status symbol then. I am what I easily describe as a greasy guy. That test drive was done with a real live mechanic in the passenger seat who also raced in SCCA, plus worked at that dealership. I still yet remember that ride. For a number of years I was involved with British cars and they had some posers and some greasy fingernail folks too.
In the years I belonged to the BMWMOA BMW MC club I saw many posers and even more yet non-posers. It comes both ways with we humans but a blatant fact that car & PTW mfg.'s use status to sell their stuff!
Vespa is surely no different as it's the humans who are talking about this...
Kymco as a status symbol is sort of funny but the new BMW C 400 scooter is an Asian built machine which offends some peoples "Built by Bavarian Elves" with a squad of engineers watching them mentality.
Status & quality get mixed up in advertising somewhat?
Cool, makes sense and I get where you are coming from.

Is the BMW 400 really made in Asia? I know the 650 engine is made by Kymco but the rest of the bike is made by the Bavarian elves. Funny thing about the 650 is the first version BMW was pretty heavily involved in the engine design. It wasn't until they gave Kymco more freedom to revise the engine that performance improved and by no small amount. Those asians make a lot of CVT transmission scooters and have learned a thing or 2 over the decades.
Yes the C400 is made in China by Loncin under contract by BMW.
It's true, BMW does not have the know-how to build on its own even scooters ... it would take too much time to design and test them and to make investments in engine construction would cost too much. But this also happens for many European cars that have engines of various origins (Mercedes uses Renault engines, Mini has used Toyota and Fiat engines).
It is the effect of globalization.
Molto Verboso
2018 Vespa GTS 300 ABS- Bianco
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1507
Location: E. KY
Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:39 am quote
I am asking to your point above, do you actually know what you said about BMW not knowing and not having designed their own engines?
Molto Verboso
2018 Vespa GTS 300 ABS- Bianco
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1507
Location: E. KY
Mon Jan 14, 2019 5:45 am quote
While true that many mfg.'s share technology, do you actually know that BMW lacks know how to build scooters or that engine?
I thought it was more about cost to build or strategical locations to build stuff or mfg. capacity.
I read an article many years ago in Business Week magazine about Germans using Turkish workers as they had too few to staff their own factories. To this day BMW and most mfg.'s around the world hire globally when talent is needed. As my e.g., the Z3 was designed by an American guy.
Me thinks your off track a bit here?
Molto Verboso
2009 GTS 250, 2013 Buddy 125, 2014 Triumph Bonneville
Joined: 23 Apr 2016
Posts: 1376
Location: North Jersey
Mon Jan 14, 2019 6:59 am quote
BMW is quite capable of designing and building any motorcycle or scooter they choose to. But to build something at a sub $10K or thereabouts price point, they need to outsource production to a cheaper country and/or use someone else's proven engine.
Hooked
Yamaha Tricity 155 2018 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 410
Location: Latina (Italy)
Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:52 am quote
Kantuckid wrote:
I am asking to your point above, do you actually know what you said about BMW not knowing and not having designed their own engines?
I report how much i read in the italian magazines of motorcycles and scooters.
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