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Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 1280
Location: California
Sun Jan 10, 2021 6:38 pm quote
Hi Mendozaram not there so a little difficult to know exactly but sounds almost like ignition is having trouble maybe not carb sputtering?
Hooked
2005 Stella 2T
Joined: 14 Jun 2020
Posts: 115
Location: MA
Mon Jan 11, 2021 4:47 am quote
mendozaram wrote:
So, in this vídeo. The setup is the same Drilled mainjet from the last vídeo But AC160-BE3https://youtu.be/39BtjyCBqnc
That sounds a little better to my ear, so I think you are on the right track. But, you can still hear splutter at WOT. The AC160 and BE3 are as lean as you would want to go on the air tube and the mixer tube, so nothing left to do now except start walking down the main jet. My advice is to order a range of main jets between 120 and 130 and be patient. Your scooter sounds like it will still be quite rideable while you are waiting.
Hooked
1958 Allstate Super Cruisaire 2005 70cc Yamaha Vino
Joined: 23 Aug 2020
Posts: 263
Location: Philadelphia
Mon Jan 11, 2021 10:48 am quote
Shipped my PX150E to Gick to have this installed this weekend. Excited to see how it does.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Mon Jan 11, 2021 6:46 pm quote
hibbert wrote:
Hi Mendozaram not there so a little difficult to know exactly but sounds almost like ignition is having trouble maybe not carb sputtering?
Hi Hibbert, hello @kowaslki, thanks again. I had installed a brand new BGM HT CDI/COIL when the VMC was installed. After your comment Hibbert, this morning i'd installed the HT CDI/Coil that was installed before the new one from BGM

Guess What? Look this one bellow

https://youtu.be/PXMyfUyj11U

Maybe , a faulty unit. I don't know if those HT coils from BGM limits RPM.

Currently running on ID 55/160 2.25 turns out
Main Stack : AC140-E3- MJ Unknow (bigger than 120, smaller than 130)
Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 1280
Location: California
Tue Jan 12, 2021 6:44 am quote
Another good video Mendozaram sounds different. Maybe ignition trouble. Need for the jets to arrive and find the too rich point. Might try a AC120 now and moving forward. I have chased my tail a few times over a fouled spark plug.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Tue Jan 12, 2021 9:49 am quote
hibbert wrote:
Another good video Mendozaram sounds different. Maybe ignition trouble. Need for the jets to arrive and find the too rich point. Might try a AC120 now and moving forward. I have chased my tail a few times over a fouled spark plug.
Yes, i have to wait for the set of MJ. but the spluttering on High RPM it's gone after the HT Coil swap. I'm hating BGM for that 😆. And yes, now i'll try AC120 and see how the ride is.
Hooked
2005 Stella 2T
Joined: 14 Jun 2020
Posts: 115
Location: MA
Tue Jan 12, 2021 11:50 am quote
mendozaram wrote:
Guess What? Look this one bellow

https://youtu.be/PXMyfUyj11U

Maybe , a faulty unit. I don't know if those HT coils from BGM limits RPM.

Currently running on ID 55/160 2.25 turns out
Main Stack : AC140-E3- MJ Unknow (bigger than 120, smaller than 130)
Sounds much better. Good catch Hibbert. The good news/bad news is now you can/should start over on the main stack. I would begin with the AC120/BE3/MJ130 and take it from there.

I will add that now you have me questioning the coil on my own scooter. I've been getting what I thought was splutter despite a main stack that seems pretty lean compared to what others have been using. I see a new coil is only $25, so it is worth a try when scootering weather returns this part of the world.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Tue Jan 12, 2021 12:12 pm quote
Kowalski wrote:
mendozaram wrote:
Guess What? Look this one bellow

https://youtu.be/PXMyfUyj11U

Maybe , a faulty unit. I don't know if those HT coils from BGM limits RPM.

Currently running on ID 55/160 2.25 turns out
Main Stack : AC140-E3- MJ Unknow (bigger than 120, smaller than 130)
Sounds much better. Good catch Hibbert. The good news/bad news is now you can/should start over on the main stack. I would begin with the AC120/BE3/MJ130 and take it from there.

I will add that now you have me questioning the coil on my own scooter. I've been getting what I thought was splutter despite a main stack that seems pretty lean compared to what others have been using. I see a new coil is only $25, so it is worth a try when scootering weather returns this part of the world.
i'll ask to 10pollici (i bough the Blue BGM HT Coil to them) whats the difference between the blue and the red one. The blue says ORIGINAL, the red one says PRO. Maybe the blue one limits the RPM.

Yes, i'll test the AC120... For mainjet i have to wait some time.

bgmht.jpg

Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 2209
Location: Veria, Greece
Tue Jan 12, 2021 12:46 pm quote
Both are the same. Scooter Center marketing crap...
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:26 pm quote
Kowalski wrote:
...Sounds much better. Good catch Hibbert. The good news/bad news is now you can/should start over on the main stack. I would begin with the AC120/BE3/MJ130 and take it from there...
AC120-BE3- Mainjet somewhere between 120-130. I felt a little bog but passing 1/2 throttle it's fine

This is the plug with 10miles ride, a couple of short WOTs , normal shutdown.... Picture under sunlight, in the shadow looks darker than this pictures

IMG_20210113_171758.jpg

IMG_20210113_171839.jpg

IMG_20210113_171858.jpg

Molto Verboso
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 1532
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Wed Jan 13, 2021 4:51 pm quote
Are those silver specs? If so that's melted aluminum from the piston. Which would mean your to lean and running hot, have detonation issues from timing advance or both.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:59 pm quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Are those silver specs? If so that's melted aluminum from the piston. Which would mean your to lean and running hot, have detonation issues from timing advance or both.
Maybe sunlight ? This is without sunlight

IMG_20210113_172002.jpg

IMG_20210113_171953.jpg

Hooked
2005 Stella 2T
Joined: 14 Jun 2020
Posts: 115
Location: MA
Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:54 am quote
mendozaram wrote:
AC120-BE3- Mainjet somewhere between 120-130. I felt a little bog but passing 1/2 throttle it's fine

This is the plug with 10miles ride, a couple of short WOTs , normal shutdown.... Picture under sunlight, in the shadow looks darker than this pictures
Plug looks fine to me. If you're getting a bog at mid-throttle, try using your E3 mixer tube instead of the BE3. Leave everything else the same.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:02 pm quote
[quote="Kowalski"]
mendozaram wrote:
....Plug looks fine to me. If you're getting a bog at mid-throttle, try using your E3 mixer tube instead of the BE3. Leave everything else the same.
E3 looks similar to BE5, richer than BE3. I'll try, but i was thinking , it would have more bogging. Let me try with E3
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:19 am quote
Finally , i got a set of MJ from BGM from 115 to 138. I'd put again the deblued Air filter with heart drilled. With MJ130 in got bog. So...

Main Stack AC120-BE3-mj125 , IJ 50-120 screw 2 1/4

IMG_20210408_121050.jpg
Normal Shutdown IJ 50-120 Screw 2 1/4

IMG_20210408_114459.jpg
4th Gear WOT. AC120-BE3-mj125 (under sunlight)

IMG_20210408_114517.jpg
4th gear WOT. AC120-BE3-mj125 (without sunlight

Jet Eye Master
PX221 Malossi, O tuned PX200 and some motorbikes
Joined: 14 Jun 2017
Posts: 2692
Location: London UK
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:08 am quote
Nice progress. Change the BE3 for a BE5, then I think you'll be ok.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:57 am quote
Jack221 wrote:
Nice progress. Change the BE3 for a BE5, then I think you'll be ok.
Thanks Jack. Right now i dont have a BE5. But i have a E3 from LML. For what ive seen. E3 its richer than BE3 right?

I got a GSF Dyno made with AC140-E3-Unknow Mainjet (in RED) (between 120 and 130) without Air Filter and one from today (in BLUE) with AC120-BE3-122 and Drilled Air Filter. 2nd gear. Main Gearing 23/68 and lost some HP. I will try mj 125 and see how performs

Jetting 08-4-21.jpg

Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:48 pm quote
2 runs in 3rd gear. Each jetting is in the description field of GSF Dyno

Jetting 08Abril 2nd run.jpg

Hooked
2005 Stella 2T
Joined: 14 Jun 2020
Posts: 115
Location: MA
Fri Apr 09, 2021 5:40 am quote
Plug photos and dyno charts are nice, but how does it feel?

Were you getting any mid-throttle bogging or WOT spluttering with the AC120/BE3/MJ125 combo? If no mid-throttle bogging with the BE3, you do not need the richer E3 or BE5. If no WOT spluttering with the MJ125, the MJ122 will be too lean. If anything, you will want to go up to the MJ128 and see if that splutters.
Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 1280
Location: California
Fri Apr 09, 2021 6:07 am quote
Looks like good progress Mendoza. Take my comments with a grain of salt we have different cylinders but similar capacities.

Might want to first find the sputter point with the main. I found a 135 main would sputter 1/2 throttle and beyond no matter which mixer. I know that because I recorded the tests.

On the mixer in my case a BE3 was on the borderline seemed to work good but under engine braking and opening throttle had a slight surge. A richer mixer BE5 seemed to correct a BE4 ran too rich.

With the BE5 a 132 would run but not clean. A 130 ran good a 128 ran better.
Member
2005 Star Dlx - VMC 187ccm
Joined: 19 Nov 2019
Posts: 38
Location: Venezuela
Fri Apr 09, 2021 10:13 am quote
Kowalski wrote:
Plug photos and dyno charts are nice, but how does it feel?

Were you getting any mid-throttle bogging or WOT spluttering with the AC120/BE3/MJ125 combo? If no mid-throttle bogging with the BE3, you do not need the richer E3 or BE5. If no WOT spluttering with the MJ125, the MJ122 will be too lean. If anything, you will want to go up to the MJ128 and see if that splutters.
With AC120-E3-MJ125 i got low to mid-throttle bogging, and some WOT splutters. AC120-BE3-MJ125, got mid-throttle ssplutters,then cleans up at higher revs but still having small sputters. The WOT bogging occurs with mj130. MJ132 it's just unrideable.

1/4 throttle or less, there is some 4 stroking. IJ is 50-120 2 1/4 turns out. I'm thinking to try 55-160 and see if cleans the 4stroking
hibbert wrote:
....With the BE5 a 132 would run but not clean....
just like this is what i felt with AC120-E3-MJ125, runs But not clean

How can i send here the WAV files i'd recorded. I tried But got error sendind the post
Hooked
2005 Stella 2T
Joined: 14 Jun 2020
Posts: 115
Location: MA
Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:05 am quote
As far as the main stack, it sounds like you are too rich all across the board, which is unexpected with a BE3 and an MJ125 on a 187. I would try a larger air tube--AC140 or even AC160--next.

The 50/120 idle jet is almost certainly too rich. Definitely try the 55/160 and note any changes.
Molto Verboso
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 1532
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Sat Apr 10, 2021 7:14 am quote
Kowalski wrote:
As far as the main stack, it sounds like you are too rich all across the board, which is unexpected with a BE3 and an MJ125 on a 187. I would try a larger air tube--AC140 or even AC160--next.

The 50/120 idle jet is almost certainly too rich. Definitely try the 55/160 and note any changes.
Doesn't the idle circuit, add fuel to the mid and wot circuits? I was thinking the circuits are cumulative. Wouldn't you want to try the leaner idle first to clear up the 4 stroking and see where your at after that?
Jet Eye Master
PX221 Malossi, O tuned PX200 and some motorbikes
Joined: 14 Jun 2017
Posts: 2692
Location: London UK
Sat Apr 10, 2021 9:11 am quote
E3 is very similar to BE5 for what you are doing.

From all you've said I would run AC120 E3 MJ122 52/140 this should be about right and worth a few plug chops to find out.
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