[SSR] Questions for dealer when buying an ADV bike
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Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Sun Jan 27, 2019 1:30 pm quote
Hi all

So a little slowish around here so though some of you may have fun with this and help me in the process. I have another Ural post but now I have decided to buy for sure. I have time to decide what I want and am putting together a list of questions and an accessory/cosmetics wish list.

My wife has already said she doesn't want to be in the sidecar and will ride pillion. OK...sure. I hope that changes but I need to plan for a pillion.

Below is what I have thrown together in a few minutes. I'd love some input. YES I could post in a more ADV/Ural based forum but I know the crew here and consider many of you friends.

So here it is - what would you add? Or want for yourself if you could pick. This even in some ways applies to scooters as some options will work for any bike.

Thanks!

“Oh shit!” bars for pillion
Pillion backrest - rider backrest? So saddle options in general
Pillion foot pegs - are there options?
Heated Grips and winter riding stuff in general
Sidecar Liner
Sidecar door
Adjustable windscreen - or large(ish) - No windsail though
Blacked out engine (blacked out bike?)
Lighting packages?
Grills for lights to protect against rocks etc
Additional racks
Mount for BMW Garmin GPS and power
Power for heated gear - gloves and vests etc.
Blinker Fluid - only the best!
Undercoating for winter salt and that sort of crap
Exhausts - maybe a raised exhaust
Paint chips - how easy does it chip and touch up paint?
Winter tires
Molto Verboso
Xmax 300
Joined: 02 Jul 2016
Posts: 1204
Location: Adelaide
Sun Jan 27, 2019 2:13 pm quote
Coffee cup holders
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Sun Jan 27, 2019 2:22 pm quote
Sledge wrote:
Coffee cup holders
Opps yeah missed that. My Vespa has one and so may as well get one for this bike.

There are a few available and they are even self balancing.
Molto Verboso
2009 GTS 250, 2013 Buddy 125, 2014 Triumph Bonneville
Joined: 23 Apr 2016
Posts: 1574
Location: North Jersey
Sun Jan 27, 2019 2:23 pm quote
I'll bet you a beverage of your choice that once she tries the sidecar she'll change her mind. It would be good if you knew someone with one, no matter what the brand bike, to take her on a test ride.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Sun Jan 27, 2019 3:20 pm quote
I'd buy one or 2 anyway bet or not.

She can be stubborn at times and can dig in. She's a cops daughter after all I hope you're right though and she warms up to it. Sidecars are really rare around here. I've only seen one other in the city.

Vintage1 wrote:
I'll bet you a beverage of your choice that once she tries the sidecar she'll change her mind. It would be good if you knew someone with one, no matter what the brand bike, to take her on a test ride.
Hooked
'04 Stella 2T GB150 '15 Genuine Roughhouse 50 '17 Kawasaki Versys 650
Joined: 08 Jun 2012
Posts: 348
Location: Philadelphia
Mon Jan 28, 2019 4:37 am quote
Don't forget to ask for a center stand.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:01 am quote
RoaringTodd wrote:
Don't forget to ask for a center stand.
It comes with and apparently is a beast to get up in the stand.
Molto Verboso
2009 GTS 250, 2013 Buddy 125, 2014 Triumph Bonneville
Joined: 23 Apr 2016
Posts: 1574
Location: North Jersey
Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:35 am quote
Harbinger wrote:
I'd buy one or 2 anyway bet or not.

She can be stubborn at times and can dig in. She's a cops daughter after all I hope you're right though and she warms up to it. Sidecars are really rare around here. I've only seen one other in the city.

( LOL I got your point. Cop's daughter, I not only have a daughter, my wife is also a cop's daughter! )

A good friend and club member sold his sidecar a few years back that he had for his BMW. A couple years ago he gets married and introduces his wife to the motorcycle world. She rode pillion and IMO she does fine, but she admitted to always being a little nervous. Well, at our annual camping rally this past September, a club member shows up with his sidecar rig. He gives my friend's wife a quick ride around the parking lot and she is absolutely hooked. My friend just tracked down the same model of sidecar he sold and bought the 'new' one.
Member
Piaggio BV250 Tourer - Vespa Primavera 150
Joined: 04 May 2016
Posts: 29
Location: Santa Maria, California
Mon Jan 28, 2019 10:40 am quote
Re: [SSR] Questions for dealer when buying an ADV bike
Harbinger wrote:
My wife has already said she doesn't want to be in the sidecar and will ride pillion. OK...sure. I hope that changes but I need to plan for a pillion.
I have never driven a Ural rig but I've had sidecars on both a BMW and a Royal Enfield. They were a lot of fun and my wife enjoyed the ability of "napping" on longer trips. Mine were much more difficult to drive without weight in the sidecar. Once the chair "flies" on a right turn steering instantly switches to a counter steer and the line of travel would change dramatically. I would expect that adding a pillion to the bike with and un-weighted sidecar would require a great deal of extra care.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Mon Jan 28, 2019 11:03 am quote
Re: [SSR] Questions for dealer when buying an ADV bike
ddennis669 wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
My wife has already said she doesn't want to be in the sidecar and will ride pillion. OK...sure. I hope that changes but I need to plan for a pillion.
I have never driven a Ural rig but I've had sidecars on both a BMW and a Royal Enfield. They were a lot of fun and my wife enjoyed the ability of "napping" on longer trips. Mine were much more difficult to drive without weight in the sidecar. Once the chair "flies" on a right turn steering instantly switches to a counter steer and the line of travel would change dramatically. I would expect that adding a pillion to the bike with and un-weighted sidecar would require a great deal of extra care.
Good point. I won't be taking her on it until I'm very comfortable with the bike. I will pick up some bags of cement or something similar to toss in the sidecar while I learn to ride it and the first time I ride with a pillion with no one in the sidecar. Hopefully she comes around on riding in the sidecar as nature intended it.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Wed Jan 30, 2019 3:20 am quote
My updated list. The dealer (lucky bastard) is currently down south enjoy some sun and warmth and not back until next week. Ironically so is my Vespa dealer.


“Oh shit!” bars for pillion
Pillion backrest - rider backrest? So saddle options in general
Pillion foot pegs - are there options? I think the Gear Up comes with.
Heated Grips and winter riding stuff in general. Handlebar muffs?
Sidecar Liner
Sidecar door
Adjustable windscreen - or large(ish) - No windsail though
Black powertrain - (blacked out bike?) - Black exhaust - trade in value on stock exhaust?
Lighting packages? Sidecar spotlight/extra riding light
Grills for lights to protect against rocks etc
Additional racks
Crashbars
Mount for BMW Garmin GPS and power
Power for heated gear - gloves and vests etc. I’d like easy access to plug in accessories
Blinker Fluid - only the best!
Undercoating for winter salt and that sort of crap
Exhausts - maybe a raised exhaust?
Paint chips - how easy does it chip and touch up paint?
Winter tires - Can purchase later just want to ensure they are available.
Hand protectors (muffs)
Steering damper - is it needed on new models?
Hooked
Joined: 11 Mar 2017
Posts: 186
Location: Toronto, ON
Wed Jan 30, 2019 8:14 am quote
Curious if you picked the colour you want for you new Ural?

I won't be able to help you much regarding your list but... steering dumpers are needed depending on bike model. Some bikes will come from factory with one already installed, my take is it depends on geometry of the bike (front fork trail and rake angles). I have couple Moto Guzzi bikes, 2009 California Vintage was fitted with dumper by factory where as 2016 Audace has no steering dumper. I experiment with Vintage and purchased Matris Steering Damper SD-R Kit (https://www.matrisdampers.com/en/prodotto/products/sdr/) which is equipped with “SpeedSensitive” system. This system suppose to increase dumping force at high speed without affecting handlebar movements at slow speed. I have to admit that after installing it on my bike I hardly felt any difference in comparison to factory dumper.

Insired by your quest for some new wheels, I sold Vintage couple weeks ago and just put deposit for 2016 Eldorado. In my case selection of accessories is very simple just hard-case side bags:

2019-01-30_1106.png

Veni, Vidi, Posti
LX150, GTS300, BV350, EN650
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5124
Location: Home of the Alamo
Wed Jan 30, 2019 8:20 am quote
My question would first be, What do you intend on using it for?

Once you've answered this question, most all of the "needed" accessories/upgrades should be apparent. Then your only job is to chose the proper vendor and in what order to get them.

Good luck!
Hooked
'13 Buddy 125 Seafoam
Joined: 25 Oct 2018
Posts: 127
Location: Southcoast, MA
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Typhoon 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 10539
Location: Oregon City, OR
Wed Jan 30, 2019 1:13 pm quote
Vintage1 wrote:
I'll bet you a beverage of your choice that once she tries the sidecar she'll change her mind.
I'm with you on this one. My wife absolutely loved that sidecar, and she rides her own scooter.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Thu Jan 31, 2019 5:00 pm quote
Thanks Point37.

To answer JP's question. Heavy winter riding and the ability to go off road as well as lots of cartage ability. I have two other bikes perfectly suited for the highway and urban riding respectively. Both can do either task but excel at what they were made for. So the Ural will be the bike that sees the most abuse and will go places the other bikes are better to avoid.
Molto Verboso
Triumph Street Scrambler 2018, Suzuki VanVan200 (sold), 2015 Sprint 125 (sold)
Joined: 12 Apr 2015
Posts: 1662
Location: Finland
Fri Feb 01, 2019 2:27 pm quote
Harbinger wrote:
Thanks Point37.

To answer JP's question. Heavy winter riding and the ability to go off road as well as lots of cartage ability. I have two other bikes perfectly suited for the highway and urban riding respectively. Both can do either task but excel at what they were made for. So the Ural will be the bike that sees the most abuse and will go places the other bikes are better to avoid.
Harbinger, I thought of you today

I was at a motorcycle show in Helsinki, Finland.
From inside, I saw an old Ural parked outside!
But while I found my route there, it was already gone. I would have loved to take a photo of that Ural in the middle of snow for you... as a consolation prize, here's a pic of other bikes that still were there

IMG_20190201_151432.jpg

Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Fri Feb 01, 2019 3:16 pm quote
RRider wrote:
Harbinger, I thought of you today

I was at a motorcycle show in Helsinki, Finland.
From inside, I saw an old Ural parked outside!
But while I found my route there, it was already gone. I would have loved to take a photo of that Ural in the middle of snow for you... as a consolation prize, here's a pic of other bikes that still were there [/quote]

Thanks! (^_^)

Still a good pic.

After now I think 6 days without riding I really am looking forward to it. I actually did go out on the BMW today but WAY too slick so turned around after a few blocks.

The Ural is absolutely a done deal. Tried the subway to go to a client meeting and it got shutdown about 5 stops away because of "track signal" issues. I think that's about 4 times this week during the deep freeze. So had to grab a cab to the meeting and all in all the trip sucked. Large client with 3 divisions we support and it was a contract renegotiation as they have grown. Outside of their frustrating in house lawyer it went well and the increase pays for the new bike as my "allowance" should go up more than enough.
Hooked
BV 350
Joined: 22 Nov 2016
Posts: 220
Location: Nebraska
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:19 am quote
Important Ural accessory
Probably want to bring along something to do while you are waiting for the tow truck. Books, magazines, games. Maybe a space blanket, some food and water if you are going to be away from civilization and not riding with a group.

I think I have finally tamped down and buried the urge to buy a Ural. Outside of the insane price, lack of local dealers, horrible reputation for reliability, and mediocre performance, along with a long and tenuous parts supply chain, I like the idea of the bike. I had considered buying a used one, and grafting in a BMW airhead engine, but it sounds like the powertrain was already overstressed, even with the OEM squirrelpower. Thought it'd be nice to update the powerplant from WWII tech all the way up into the '80s. Now that many of the local highway speed limits are 65 or 70 (with drivers going another 5 over), all the reviews suggest you'd be thrashing the powerplant if you were trying to keep up, and most likely failing.

From what I've read, it appears that it is very, very tricky to ride someone pillion if there's no load in the sidecar. Please beware.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:48 am quote
Re: Important Ural accessory
Jimding wrote:
Probably want to bring along something to do while you are waiting for the tow truck. Books, magazines, games. Maybe a space blanket, some food and water if you are going to be away from civilization and not riding with a group.

I think I have finally tamped down and buried the urge to buy a Ural. Outside of the insane price, lack of local dealers, horrible reputation for reliability, and mediocre performance, along with a long and tenuous parts supply chain, I like the idea of the bike. I had considered buying a used one, and grafting in a BMW airhead engine, but it sounds like the powertrain was already overstressed, even with the OEM squirrelpower. Thought it'd be nice to update the powerplant from WWII tech all the way up into the '80s. Now that many of the local highway speed limits are 65 or 70 (with drivers going another 5 over), all the reviews suggest you'd be thrashing the powerplant if you were trying to keep up, and most likely failing.

From what I've read, it appears that it is very, very tricky to ride someone pillion if there's no load in the sidecar. Please beware.
Yeah I've done more research and the pillion idea is out the window. She will have to get used to being in the sidecar.

The improvements in the last few years are apparently pretty impressive and reliability has improved.

I have 2 other bikes and one is perfect for highway riding. The C650GT can go 85 MPH all day (goes 110 MPH) if you want it to and the Malossi kitted Vespa also manages highway speeds with no problem at all. The Ural will be my laid back bike and something for winter riding and occasional off road . As far as cost goes I'm fortunate enough in life at least in that regard to not worry so much about it. I'll die with money left over in the bank. I've been slacking on revising a few client contracts and finally got around to it. The increases pay for the Ural in just the first year.

I don't think the breakdown on the newer Ural's are as bad as you make it out to be.

2019 Ural info.

https://www.topspeed.com/motorcycles/motorcycle-reviews/ural/2019-ural-gear-up-ar183381.html

https://www.motorcyclistonline.com/preview-2019-urals-now-with-modernized-engine#page-2

https://www.rideapart.com/articles/279276/first-ride-2019-ural-gearup/
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Typhoon 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 10539
Location: Oregon City, OR
Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:49 pm quote
Jimding wrote:
I think I have finally tamped down and buried the urge to buy a Ural. Outside of the insane price, lack of local dealers, horrible reputation for reliability, and mediocre performance, along with a long and tenuous parts supply chain, I like the idea of the bike. I had considered buying a used one, and grafting in a BMW airhead engine, but it sounds like the powertrain was already overstressed, even with the OEM squirrelpower. Thought it'd be nice to update the powerplant from WWII tech all the way up into the '80s. Now that many of the local highway speed limits are 65 or 70 (with drivers going another 5 over), all the reviews suggest you'd be thrashing the powerplant if you were trying to keep up, and most likely failing.
Isn't this an awfully lot of Ural bashing from someone who has never owned one, or evidently even ridden one? Urals have their strengths and weaknesses. I think several owners and past owners who have posted on this thread have been pretty straight about their actual experiences, and about the bike's quirks.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Typhoon 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 10539
Location: Oregon City, OR
Fri Feb 08, 2019 1:56 pm quote
Harbinger wrote:
I will pick up some bags of cement or something similar to toss in the sidecar while I learn to ride it and the first time I ride with a pillion with no one in the sidecar.
I made several bags out of jeans denim (pieces of the legs of old jeans) filled with lead shot. I made them at 25# each and found that 3 on the floor of the hack balanced the bike nicely for me when riding solo.
Ossessionato
Modded Vespa 2017 GTV 300, BMW 2017 C650GT, Ural 2019 Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 4463
Location: Downtown Toronto
Fri Feb 08, 2019 2:01 pm quote
Dooglas wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
I will pick up some bags of cement or something similar to toss in the sidecar while I learn to ride it and the first time I ride with a pillion with no one in the sidecar.
I made several bags out of jeans denim (pieces of the legs of old jeans) filled with lead shot. I made them at 25# each and found that 3 on the floor of the hack balanced the bike nicely for me when riding solo.
Thanks for the tip and I will ensure I weigh the sidecar down while I learn to ride it. I am a good rider of motorbikes but I'm very aware that it may even work against me on this in some ways. Do you have any issues mentally shifting from riding a hack to a motorbike on the say the same day?
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