Charging issue resolved. Step 2 Bleeding the brakes
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Tue Apr 30, 2019 9:11 am quote
My MP3 500 has been sitting for 4 years with a no charge issue. Been riding the BV 350 and haven't looked at the MP3 since my first try at diagnostics.
So got back to look at the MP3, stator tested good, regulator replaced right before it was parked. Tested 30 amp fuse in the relay (Tested, DID NOT remove the fuse, that was a mistake).
Could not find a problem, so started looking again. Tested stator again, tested 30 amp fuse, Then I pulled out the 30 amp fuse and only one leg of the fuse was attached.
The plastic around the fuse looked like it got hot at some point. The reply is done, grabbed the reply off the parts MP3 and think I am good to go now. Waiting on a new battery from Amazon.
If it works, I then need to replace the Tilt Lock Pressure Sensor and do the gonzo fix on one of the forks and the MP3 will be back on the road.

Will fix the notch once I do the valve adjustment on the BV 350 (Which is the reason for getting the MP3 back on the road) The BV350 uses shims for valve adjustment, so have to measure clearance on the valves, then pull each shim out to get the thickness off the shim, then order the correct thickness shims.

So the moral of the story is, pull the 30 amp fuse to check it, don't just test it with a meter.

Last edited by WEB-Tech on Sun May 05, 2019 12:01 pm; edited 2 times in total
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun May 05, 2019 3:46 am quote
It is charging.

Now if I could just get the air out of my brakes after doing the front fork bearings.
Tried pushing from one caliper at a time, did a Tee and tried both at the same time. Tried the conventional pumping a million times.
At this point it is worse than when I started, there is no resistance at all on the lever.
At work today, so back to it Thursday.
Going to try the tie the break lever closed trick when I get home tonight.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 5343
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Sun May 05, 2019 8:01 am quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
It is charging.

Now if I could just get the air out of my brakes after doing the front fork bearings.
Tried pushing from one caliper at a time, did a Tee and tried both at the same time. Tried the conventional pumping a million times.
At this point it is worse than when I started, there is no resistance at all on the lever.
At work today, so back to it Thursday.
Going to try the tie the break lever closed trick when I get home tonight.
Did you put new pads on, or only bleed?
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun May 05, 2019 9:39 am quote
Madison Sully wrote:
WEB-Tech wrote:
It is charging.

Now if I could just get the air out of my brakes after doing the front fork bearings.
Tried pushing from one caliper at a time, did a Tee and tried both at the same time. Tried the conventional pumping a million times.
At this point it is worse than when I started, there is no resistance at all on the lever.
At work today, so back to it Thursday.
Going to try the tie the break lever closed trick when I get home tonight.
Did you put new pads on, or only bleed?
I had the whole front end off fixing the notch the dealer didn't do right.
Was a lot easy than I was expecting by myself. Only thing I could not do was get the bearing off the shaft, my air chisel appears to be dead. So ran by the local Volvo dealer a buddy works at and he had the bearing off in 5 minutes. Slipped him 10 bucks. Then I stopped by Home Depot to buy a 2 foot piece of 1 1/2" i.d. Schedule 40 PVC pipe, or better known as a bearing install tool
Bleed tilt lock first because, "it's the hardest", Yeah right

Next step is to tefon tape the bleed screws and vacuum bleed it from the top.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 5343
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Sun May 05, 2019 10:47 am quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
WEB-Tech wrote:
It is charging.

Now if I could just get the air out of my brakes after doing the front fork bearings.
Tried pushing from one caliper at a time, did a Tee and tried both at the same time. Tried the conventional pumping a million times.
At this point it is worse than when I started, there is no resistance at all on the lever.
At work today, so back to it Thursday.
Going to try the tie the break lever closed trick when I get home tonight.
Did you put new pads on, or only bleed?
I had the whole front end off fixing the notch the dealer didn't do right.
Was a lot easy than I was expecting by myself. Only thing I could not do was get the bearing off the shaft, my air chisel appears to be dead. So ran by the local Volvo dealer a buddy works at and he had the bearing off in 5 minutes. Slipped him 10 bucks. Then I stopped by Home Depot to buy a 2 foot piece of 1 1/2" i.d. Schedule 40 PVC pipe, or better known as a bearing install tool
Bleed tilt lock first because, "it's the hardest", Yeah right

Next step is to tefon tape the bleed screws and vacuum bleed it from the top.
When I replaced the front pads on my MP3 I bled at the same time. After several attempts with spongy brake lever, I went for a ride. Turned out the pads needed to bed in; then the lever was feeling normal again. Just wondering if it's possible one or more pads were displaced, causing similar issue.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun May 05, 2019 10:51 am quote
I can turn the wheel hub with my hand, that is how little force is being applied by the brake.

Want to get MP3 done so I can do the Euro turn signals and new fork springs on the BV350 when the parts arrive.
Still need to do belt on the MP3 too.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun May 05, 2019 11:20 am quote
I'm going to try dry bleeding. When I worked at the Chevy dealer as a kid in highschool sweeping the vase.
They used to have to put the cooling system under a vacuum to pull the air out because the radiator was lower than the engine on Corvettes.
That got me thinking, and little bit of googling and I found this. It's a thing and Ford and some other manufacturer recommended on certain clutch system types.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21338
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Sun May 05, 2019 1:00 pm quote
awesome find on the dry vacuum bleeding techniques
Hooked
2008 fuoco.T3 guzzi california outfit
Joined: 19 Jul 2015
Posts: 187
Location: United Kingdom.
Mon May 06, 2019 1:05 am quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
I'm going to try dry bleeding. When I worked at the Chevy dealer as a kid in highschool sweeping the vase.
They used to have to put the cooling system under a vacuum to pull the air out because the radiator was lower than the engine on Corvettes.
That got me thinking, and little bit of googling and I found this. It's a thing and Ford and some other manufacturer recommended on certain clutch system types.
Well thats new to me. Thanks.Next time i do the brakes and have a problem i'll try it.
Hooked
2008 fuoco.T3 guzzi california outfit
Joined: 19 Jul 2015
Posts: 187
Location: United Kingdom.
Mon May 06, 2019 1:09 am quote
When I replaced the front pads on my MP3 I bled at the same time. After several attempts with spongy brake lever, I went for a ride. Turned out the pads needed to bed in; then the lever was feeling normal again. Just wondering if it's possible one or more pads were displaced, causing similar issue.[/quote]

I had EXACTLY the same issue drove me nuts bleeding the rear brake must have used over a litre of brake fluid doing it Now i know.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sat May 11, 2019 6:29 pm quote
We're not talking spongy brakes, I can turn the hub with my hand. That's how little breaking power there is.

I've been trying to seal the master cylinder so I can get a vacuum on it. Tonight I have finally determined the only way to do it is the silicone the cap on. So waiting for the silicone to dry. Will try it tomorrow afternoon sometime. Did have just under 15 PSI pressure when it blew out on my silicone test try. Didn't wait long enough for it to dry.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Mon May 13, 2019 11:30 am quote
Well it has been at 15 psi since Sunday morning. Going to try the brakes when I get home. Not holding much hope at this time.
Hooked
Gilera Fuoco
Joined: 17 Sep 2017
Posts: 107
Location: Birmingham, England
Tue May 14, 2019 8:57 am quote
A little trick I use to bleed troublesome brake lines - I duct-taped an old electric toothbrush to the brake hose and left it running overnight until the battery went flat. Next morning, problem solved.

Tip - remove the rubber diaphragm and leave the master cylinder cap loose whilst the toothbrush does it's work
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21338
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Tue May 14, 2019 1:52 pm quote
Taught2BeCautious wrote:
A little trick I use to bleed troublesome brake lines - I duct-taped an old electric toothbrush to the brake hose and left it running overnight until the battery went flat. Next morning, problem solved.

Tip - remove the rubber diaphragm and leave the master cylinder cap loose whilst the toothbrush does it's work
great idea. thanks for sharing this tip
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 5343
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Tue May 14, 2019 2:25 pm quote
old as dirt wrote:
Taught2BeCautious wrote:
A little trick I use to bleed troublesome brake lines - I duct-taped an old electric toothbrush to the brake hose and left it running overnight until the battery went flat. Next morning, problem solved.

Tip - remove the rubber diaphragm and leave the master cylinder cap loose whilst the toothbrush does it's work
great idea. thanks for sharing this tip
I think so, too.
But I wonder if something a little more, um, robust could be used to shake the neighborhood....

Hmmm....
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21338
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Tue May 14, 2019 6:47 pm quote
Madison Sully wrote:
old as dirt wrote:
Taught2BeCautious wrote:
A little trick I use to bleed troublesome brake lines - I duct-taped an old electric toothbrush to the brake hose and left it running overnight until the battery went flat. Next morning, problem solved.

Tip - remove the rubber diaphragm and leave the master cylinder cap loose whilst the toothbrush does it's work
great idea. thanks for sharing this tip
I think so, too.
But I wonder if something a little more, um, robust could be used to shake the neighborhood....

Hmmm....
well they do make concrete vibrators.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Wed May 15, 2019 3:49 am quote
old as dirt wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
old as dirt wrote:
Taught2BeCautious wrote:
A little trick I use to bleed troublesome brake lines - I duct-taped an old electric toothbrush to the brake hose and left it running overnight until the battery went flat. Next morning, problem solved.

Tip - remove the rubber diaphragm and leave the master cylinder cap loose whilst the toothbrush does it's work
great idea. thanks for sharing this tip
I think so, too.
But I wonder if something a little more, um, robust could be used to shake the neighborhood....

Hmmm....
well they do make concrete vibrators.
And I still have one for sale from building my paver patio. Hum.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun May 19, 2019 3:23 am quote
Went by and talked to a friend that builds cusotmer motorcycles for a living. He told me to stop by next Thursday if I don't have it fixed by then and he will give it a shot.

Motorelic.jpg

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Mon May 27, 2019 3:28 am quote
Took it to the shop.

Well after 2 hours I have brakes again, not perfect ,but there are brakes in the front now.
The air was trapped in the outside piston side of the calipers, where there is no bleed screw. He took the calipers off and turned them upside down, then pushed the outside piston in and i would pump it back up, then bleed. Each time we would get a little more air out.

There is still air somewhere and I just have to keep opening banjo fittings and turning the calipers over. Right now it is on a dry vacuum bleed with the calipers on their sides.
I have a good solid lever most of the time, then there is that one time I pull and nothing. But getting somewhere now.

Oh and my tilt lock pressure sensor failed, took the one out of the parts bikes, no horn blasting now.

Was kind of funny, while I was at the guys shop a person came up and asked what he worked on. Sean told him he builds custom bike and does stuff other shop don't. No maintenance work or standard repairs. Then he looked and me and said, well except for this guy, he's an exception to my rule of what I work on.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Mon May 27, 2019 1:01 pm quote
And I forgot to bring my new brake pads with me when I when to get the brake fixed. We let me have a choice between a Triumph Triple or a Aprilia 200cc Scooter, I choose the scooter
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350
Joined: 13 Oct 2012
Posts: 7205
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
Sun Aug 25, 2019 5:53 am quote
Ok, bleeding 100% right now. The brakes have just been ok, still had air.
Well I finally got ALL the air out.

Picked the rear end up about 4 and a half feet to get the bleed screw and brake line so they were straight up and down. Bled it three or four times and all the air is out. Lever is rock solid now.
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