PX tire questions
Post Reply    Forum -> Not-So-Modern
Author Message
Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Wed Oct 02, 2019 10:15 am quote
I know nothing about tires and rims and after researching Modern Vespa, Scooterwest and SIP I still have some questions:

If I buy tubeless premounted SIP Performance tires can I get larger tires without making any gear ratio or other adjustments. There seem to also be options for rims. I know a lot of you have these tires. I would like to know the best tire size / rim size combination (upgrade if possible) that only involves off with the old, on with the new. That's as much as my skill level will allow.

Will an upgraded spare tire still fit the battery/cowling compartment or should I just keep the spare I've got even though the rubber is too old?

Last (and stupidest) question: Any reason not to go with red rims? Sorry - I know very little will be visible, but I think the red would go well with silver.

Thanks in advance as always!
Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Sun Oct 06, 2019 4:30 pm quote
Sorry to bump my own post, but I thought I would give another shot at somebody knowing an easy answer to this.
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Sun Oct 06, 2019 7:36 pm quote
3.5x10 tires mounted on a 2.10" rim is what you're looking for. Don't skimp out on cheap rubber. There are lots of good brands out there. The Conti Zippy 1's are my peronal favorite all around tire. I've tried the Michelin S1, a few different varieties of the Heidenaus, some Dunlops, and a few others. It's more or less player's choice (that and what kind of weather and roads you're on).

The latest trend is to buy tubless rims from SIP. Lots of folks think that that the tried and true split rims are death traps (thousands upon thousands of riders have proved different for the past 50 years). I have 4 different sets of the SIP tubeless, but i got them because they are lighter weight, and i wanted less unsprung weight for when i was racing. For standard day in day out riding i will continue to use the standard split rims and high quality rubber tires.

Chances are if you go with an oversized tire, your engine (if stock or mildly tuned) won't have enough power in 4th gear to get up to a desired speed, so stock sized rim is best.

And for the most importand question!...
Red rims (and orange and yellow too) will look fantastic on a silver scooter. The only downfall with red tubeless is that if (when) you go to change tires, chances are you'll scratch and scuff the paint on the wheel where the tire bead sits, and then there's a good chance for a slow air leak.

I also have a siver PX150. I should snap some pics of different colored rims on it for you.
Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2521
Location: Lock Haven, PA
Tue Oct 08, 2019 5:27 am quote
SIP makes a set of standard steel split rims with tubes and SIP branded tires that's hard to beat on price. Got mine a few years ago from Rob Hodge, though he's not importing SIP into the states any longer.

Red wheels? Me likey!

Someday I may get a set of wire wheel covers with a red background for my white P200.
Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: 06 May 2016
Posts: 290
Location: Central Ohio
Tue Oct 08, 2019 7:06 am quote
I put two of these tubeless rim/tires from SIP on my 2005 PX150 and I love them. They came already mounted on the tubeless aluminum rim and all I had to do was mount them. They came with the mounting nuts and Nord-lock washers. I ordered them through Scooter Mercato. I just feel safer riding on tubeless tires.

https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/products/tyre+sip+perfromer+20+_30301010

IMG_2122.JPG
SIP tubeless rim/tire.

Tubeless Rims Tires 2.jpg
Tubeless rim/tire mounted.

Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Tue Oct 08, 2019 2:04 pm quote
Thanks - this is good stuff! Your answers leave me with another question.

The red rims come in 2.1" and 2.5". It looks like RB Prior got the 2.5". SIP's website says "rear" for the 2.5" but doesn't say anything like "rear" or "front" for the 2.1". I don't know what that "rear" in the description means since I assume front, rear and spare should be identical.

Can you guys explain this?

For what it's worth 6 years ago the awesome riders on MV gave me all the info I needed to go from stock to SIP road pipe and upgrade the jets accordingly so I have a little extra power that may be needed for the bigger rims but if that's not the case I'd rather err on the side of caution.
Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: 06 May 2016
Posts: 290
Location: Central Ohio
Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:25 pm quote
I checked my records and I got the 2.1 rims with mounted tires. The same rim/tire assembly went on both the front and back.

https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/products/tyre+sip+perfromer+20+_30303010
Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Tue Oct 08, 2019 3:47 pm quote
RB Prior wrote:
I checked my records and I got the 2.1 rims with mounted tires. The same rim/tire assembly went on both the front and back.

https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/products/tyre+sip+perfromer+20+_30303010
Ok great - thanks so much for double checking that!
Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Tue Oct 08, 2019 5:21 pm quote
I just placed the order. They are out of stock so it will be a while. I'll be sure to post pics of the red on silver once they're on. Thanks so much for all the help!
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Tue Oct 08, 2019 10:09 pm quote
Piglet wrote:
I just placed the order. They are out of stock so it will be a while. I'll be sure to post pics of the red on silver once they're on. Thanks so much for all the help!
Just as well since I've heard from a few people here that the SIP branded tires aren't on the same level as some of the larger name brand tires.
Molto Verboso
2005 PX150 In a Love-Hate Relationship with a 2-Stroke Vespa Since 2007
Joined: 01 Sep 2007
Posts: 1813

Wed Oct 09, 2019 4:22 pm quote
By design, the rear tire on a PX comes very close to the clutch cover. If you go with an oversized tire, make sure it doesnít make contact.

BTW, Iíve done over 22K miles on split rim tubed tires without ever blowing one out using major name-brand tires. Been through 3 sets now. Just mind the assembly, rotation, and pressure.
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:55 pm quote
Through photoshop magic, hereís a silver PX150 with the stock grey rims.

DA4DBACF-D517-4E06-8047-45EAD5115B12.jpeg

Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:56 pm quote
With yellow rims...

52AB82CA-27DF-4C79-9433-B19E65263FA9.jpeg

Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:57 pm quote
Orange rim...

747436C0-2341-419C-8F61-1DF3D9456E68.jpeg

Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Wed Oct 09, 2019 5:59 pm quote
Red rim...

CBAE5595-600C-444F-97DD-FE26F52F4D00.jpeg

Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Wed Oct 09, 2019 6:00 pm quote
And a black...

EA3B3EC5-C34D-407D-B966-745ED8139932.jpeg

Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Wed Oct 09, 2019 7:12 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Red rim...
Love it!!! And the hay and tractor are a nice touch too that I donít have
Hooked
GTV250, PX150 & LX50
Joined: 11 May 2010
Posts: 331
Location: Virginia
Thu Oct 24, 2019 5:45 pm quote
Package from SIP today
SIP also sent a 25th anniversary book entirely in German
It is a fantastic resource and so is this forum. Thanks MVers for your able assistance as always!

IMG_7764.JPG

Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2526
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Fri Oct 25, 2019 1:18 pm quote
For what it's worth, I've tried the FA Italia, and SIP tubeless rims and eventually went with Pinasco split tubeless rims on all of my bikes. They're beefy, light and easy to install tire on without destroying the rims and considering they're anodized, the finish has held up well.

IMG_4613.jpeg

IMG_4608.jpeg

Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1448
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Oct 25, 2019 2:14 pm quote
I'm not a fan of the sip performer tires. I do like their price, but for my road conditions (pot holes and rubble) they wear extremely fast. I've barely used them for two months and already worn halfway out on back tire. My thread on this is here

http://modernvespa.com/forum/post2335287#2335287

My next tires I plan on trying out are heidenau k62s
https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/products/tyre+heidenau+k62+_89110000
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1448
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Oct 25, 2019 2:33 pm quote
Also, regarding sip tubeless colored rims... The paint scratches off when removing and installing tires regularly from the studs, especially on the back tire on my frame where it's so difficult to remove and install without taking spare off. Even with the spare off, I gotta deflate the tire to remove or install because it won't fit between frame and wheel hub. So be prepared to not have clean painted rims for long. I got the black rims cause I like the look over other colors or chrome.. every time I remove the rim I gotta use a sharpie to color in scratches.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2526
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:43 am quote
I ran the Michelin Sports, then the S1s for years. My new go to tire is Heidenau's K61. I reside in a 4 season region and have never had issues with these in the rain or riding where wet leaves on on the roadway. Straight line stability is fantastic and they stick in a corner very well. Best scoot tire to date. They also seem to work well as it gets colder out.
Enthusiast
Molested & Abused 2003 Stella 2T
Joined: 12 Sep 2015
Posts: 89
Location: Madtown
Sat Oct 26, 2019 3:00 pm quote
I run zippy 1s for summer and zippy 3s for fall/winter. Great tires.
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Sat Oct 26, 2019 8:41 pm quote
I ran the Heidenau's K61 for a season. I didnít like the tire at all. It was noisy and vibrated when riding on the highway (Similar effects as mounting mud tires on a pickup truck). It wasnít an issue riding inner city though. They also didnít have as much wet weather traction that the Zippy 1ís that I normally use. I did like them on the gravel roads though. I also used the Heidenau rain/race compound tires for wet days on the race track. I had excellent results with them there, but since they are so gummy soft they would be worn out in probably less than 500 miles if you used them to commute on.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2526
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Sun Oct 27, 2019 10:10 am quote
whodatschrome wrote:
I ran the Heidenau's K61 for a season. I didnít like the tire at all. It was noisy and vibrated when riding on the highway (Similar effects as mounting mud tires on a pickup truck). It wasnít an issue riding inner city though. They also didnít have as much wet weather traction that the Zippy 1ís that I normally use. I did like them on the gravel roads though. I also used the Heidenau rain/race compound tires for wet days on the race track. I had excellent results with them there, but since they are so gummy soft they would be worn out in probably less than 500 miles if you used them to commute on.
Interesting. I reside in a rural setting where you have to ride for miles to get anywhere. I find myself on a lot of country lanes and heavily traveled highways where you need to get with it to keep from from getting run over. I prefer my tires a bit overinflated from recommended pressures which seems create more direct stability in handling, especially the turn-in and exit out of corners. My bikes are sprung stiffer than most and are running urethane bushings and Al's frame stabilizers, so the glove box door buzz can get a bit maddening. I've not had an out of balance feel with regards to the bars wobbling or the suspension dribbling. I am running these on lighter tubeless rims as well. IDK, Hmmm?
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1977

Sun Oct 27, 2019 11:29 am quote
Willie B wrote:
whodatschrome wrote:
I ran the Heidenau's K61 for a season. I didnít like the tire at all. It was noisy and vibrated when riding on the highway (Similar effects as mounting mud tires on a pickup truck). It wasnít an issue riding inner city though. They also didnít have as much wet weather traction that the Zippy 1ís that I normally use. I did like them on the gravel roads though. I also used the Heidenau rain/race compound tires for wet days on the race track. I had excellent results with them there, but since they are so gummy soft they would be worn out in probably less than 500 miles if you used them to commute on.
Interesting. I reside in a rural setting where you have to ride for miles to get anywhere. I find myself on a lot of country lanes and heavily traveled highways where you need to get with it to keep from from getting run over. I prefer my tires a bit overinflated from recommended pressures which seems create more direct stability in handling, especially the turn-in and exit out of corners. My bikes are sprung stiffer than most and are running urethane bushings and Al's frame stabilizers, so the glove box door buzz can get a bit maddening. I've not had an out of balance feel with regards to the bars wobbling or the suspension dribbling. I am running these on lighter tubeless rims as well. IDK, Hmmm?
It sounds like we both live in similar settings Willie. I didn't get any handling quirks from the K61's at all. It was just the agressive tread pattern that made the tire loud and caused the vibration. It would be the exact same if guy (or gal) were to remove their highway tread tires on their pickup truck and then mounted on some mud tires. There would be nothing wrong with the tire, it's just the way that it works. Some people could care less about the noise or vibration, but it bothered me. It mad it feel like my crank was out of balance at highway speed. The Zippy 1's also have a lower rolling resistance, so i had a bit more torque with them, not a lot, but it was something that i did notice. With the Heide "rain/race" compound, i could really feel the loss of horsepower with those tires. But that's for racing in the rain, and you wouldn't be reaching the same speeds as you would be in the dry anyhow.

Simple tire science shows that if you run too high of an air pressure, you will have a smaller contact patch to the ground. That means you will have less traction in all circumstances. But you should be getting less rolling resistance, which should boost both your power and fuel economy...and at the same time the tire would most likely wear out sooner too.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2526
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Sun Oct 27, 2019 7:09 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Willie B wrote:
whodatschrome wrote:
I ran the Heidenau's K61 for a season. I didnít like the tire at all. It was noisy and vibrated when riding on the highway (Similar effects as mounting mud tires on a pickup truck). It wasnít an issue riding inner city though. They also didnít have as much wet weather traction that the Zippy 1ís that I normally use. I did like them on the gravel roads though. I also used the Heidenau rain/race compound tires for wet days on the race track. I had excellent results with them there, but since they are so gummy soft they would be worn out in probably less than 500 miles if you used them to commute on.
Interesting. I reside in a rural setting where you have to ride for miles to get anywhere. I find myself on a lot of country lanes and heavily traveled highways where you need to get with it to keep from from getting run over. I prefer my tires a bit overinflated from recommended pressures which seems create more direct stability in handling, especially the turn-in and exit out of corners. My bikes are sprung stiffer than most and are running urethane bushings and Al's frame stabilizers, so the glove box door buzz can get a bit maddening. I've not had an out of balance feel with regards to the bars wobbling or the suspension dribbling. I am running these on lighter tubeless rims as well. IDK, Hmmm?
It sounds like we both live in similar settings Willie. I didn't get any handling quirks from the K61's at all. It was just the agressive tread pattern that made the tire loud and caused the vibration. It would be the exact same if guy (or gal) were to remove their highway tread tires on their pickup truck and then mounted on some mud tires. There would be nothing wrong with the tire, it's just the way that it works. Some people could care less about the noise or vibration, but it bothered me. It mad it feel like my crank was out of balance at highway speed. The Zippy 1's also have a lower rolling resistance, so i had a bit more torque with them, not a lot, but it was something that i did notice. With the Heide "rain/race" compound, i could really feel the loss of horsepower with those tires. But that's for racing in the rain, and you wouldn't be reaching the same speeds as you would be in the dry anyhow.

Simple tire science shows that if you run too high of an air pressure, you will have a smaller contact patch to the ground. That means you will have less traction in all circumstances. But you should be getting less rolling resistance, which should boost both your power and fuel economy...and at the same time the tire would most likely wear out sooner too.
I think you're onto something. Many are concerned with tire wear. I could care less as long as I feel secure with the way the bike handles, and I probably ride differently than most. Mine doesn't seem as if truck tires are fitted, but these bikes are pretty crude, especially at speed. They rattle, the glove box door and front fender buzz at high RPMs and they clunk when you shift. The front also dives hard under hard braking. My GTS will run circles around a P, but running 70+ MPH on 10 inch wheels is a hoot. A good running stock P200 will run 57 MPH, maybe 61 down a hill and most owners aren't going to run one that hard. City Grips or Zippys are great for a boulevard cruiser, especially one with softer valved/sprung or worn out shocks. After thinking about the OP query, unless he's going to kit his bike and ride it like an idiot, I concur he would probably be better served running the Zippys. K61s are stickier and the sidewalls are stiffer, which will wear quicker and compromise ride quality. Tubeless rims are lighter which equates to better performance and improved handling and braking considering less unsprung weight, and much safer with regards to blowouts and rapid flats with the tire coming off the rim. For this reason, running tubeless rims is probably one of the simplest/sanest performance mods for a well sorted stock bike. Good luck with your decision and keep us in the loop with which direction you decide to go.
Scooting the Ozarks is a scooter rally held in Eureka Springs, Arkansas offering riders scenic twisty rides, poker run, and more.   Vespa Wasp Pin Badges   Cool Ass scooter seat cover
Post Reply    Forum -> Not-So-Modern
[ Time: 0.1662s ][ Queries: 26 (0.0472s) ][ Debug on ]