Non-running PX200 worth purchasing?
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Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Mon Oct 28, 2019 7:52 pm quote
Hi all!

First post. Super noob. Read the sticky on tips for buying a Vespa.

A little about me: Industrial designer, has replaced automotive headgaskets/done other horrible jobs. Not my first motorcycle.

So, I found a good looking PX200 for sale. 11k miles. Everything looks clean. Inside the carb, inside the tank, etc. No rust anywhere I can see. Minimal scratches on body.

The guy said he had it running last summer, but it doesnít start now.

Not knowing much Vespa, I quickly replaced the plug and battery with new ones Iíd brought. Added new gas. Kicked it over for probably 15 minutes. Wouldnít fire.

He wants $1,000.

Are there big trouble areas I should be looking for before I buy a non-running PX?

Any hypotheses on whatís wrong? CDI?

Is $1,000 too much? The cheapest runner Iíve found locally is $2,500

Thanks in advance!
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1128
Location: Staten Island, NY
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:03 pm quote
I paid 550 for my P200E non-running disassembled. almost all parts there but many needing replacing from rust. I would say $1000 is on the border of where I'd walk away from it if frame and other elements of it aren't in better shape. But, if its a simple fix thats a good price for something you can get running with little trouble. Albiet, I am way stingier than most here when it comes to buying these bikes. I spend more money on parts over time then up front on something in better condition. "the slow blade penetrates the shield" is my motto when spending money on these things.
Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1825

Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:09 pm quote
PX200 or just a P200? I don't think the PX200 was ever offered in the US.
Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:31 pm quote
Like I said, total Vespa noob. Must be a P200. Kick-start only. Blinkers as part of the front cowl (or whatever youíd call the front/leg shield on a scooter).

Brings up an interesting point though; is there a vin number on the engine? Should it match the vehicle vin, or is it particular to engines only?
Member
Stella 2T 150, Honda C70
Joined: 25 Sep 2019
Posts: 28
Location: Seattle
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:32 pm quote
That does not seem like a terrible price to me, especially for what they sell for in the PNW. I just paid the same for a running Stella, but it still needed about $300 in bits and pieces to make it roadworthy. I'd venture a reasonably solid P200 is worth more than a Stella.

Does it have a title? That's always a plus. For $1K with a title, I'd run, not walk, and pick it up.

Pull the plug and crank it over with the plug in the boot. Is there a spark?

Go borrow a compression tester from an O'Reillys and see if it has compression.

Are you sure you're getting fuel to the plug? Seems like a simple thing but the line could be clogged, especially if the carb was allowed to sit with gas in it. Also, make sure fuel tap is on. Been there more times than I should ever admit.

Could be lots of other things but generally checking for spark, compression and fuel will tell you a lot.

I'm in Seattle (Ballard) so if you do get it and want to split shipping on parts from ScooterWest or ScooterMercato, I'd be game. There are always a few more parts I can use.

Hal
Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:33 pm quote
swiss1939 wrote:
I spend more money on parts over time then up front on something in better condition. "the slow blade penetrates the shield" is my motto when spending money on these things.
Yeah, been there in the past and lost my hat. Thinking a Vespa is for the long haul, but still want to know Iím not going to go over the barrel.

Any thoughts on what to look for?

Thanks!
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1128
Location: Staten Island, NY
Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Mon Oct 28, 2019 8:46 pm quote
whereshaldo wrote:
That does not seem like a terrible price to me, especially for what they sell for in the PNW. I just paid the same for a running Stella, but it still needed about $300 in bits and pieces to make it roadworthy. I'd venture a reasonably solid P200 is worth more than a Stella.

Does it have a title? That's always a plus. For $1K with a title, I'd run, not walk, and pick it up.

Pull the plug and crank it over with the plug in the boot. Is there a spark?

Go borrow a compression tester from an O'Reillys and see if it has compression.

Are you sure you're getting fuel to the plug? Seems like a simple thing but the line could be clogged, especially if the carb was allowed to sit with gas in it. Also, make sure fuel tap is on. Been there more times than I should ever admit.

Could be lots of other things but generally checking for spark, compression and fuel will tell you a lot.

I'm in Seattle (Ballard) so if you do get it and want to split shipping on parts from ScooterWest or ScooterMercato, I'd be game. There are always a few more parts I can use.

Hal
Wanted to check spark via the plug, but had a hard time checking while he was kick-starting.

Itís possible the fuel wasnít getting to the plug, but with the air cleaner off, it was definitely misting out the top.

Good call on the compression tester.

What should the compression be?
Molto Verboso
One or two fun scoots....nothing too precious
Joined: 17 Jul 2013
Posts: 1216
Location: UK (South East)
Mon Oct 28, 2019 10:47 pm quote
At $1000, and with it being a P200 in good condition, I would take a punt on the starting issue being something relatively simple and cheap to fix. If you can get the price down, it would be a bargain in the UK, but I realise that means very little in the US.

That price would be quite a bit higher in the UK, the appeal being that it's an early rust and damage free P series and it's a 200.
Addicted
GL, PK, PE200, Rusty Bluebadge
Joined: 24 Apr 2012
Posts: 702
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:06 am quote
How about some pictures of the scoot?

A non running p200 for $1k is a great deal. If the frame is straight and the floor and tunnel is not rusted through I would get it. Best vintage vespa for new owners.

You will actually have to open the carb and clean or at least spray the jets out if you want to try to start it. Today's gas are not made for these carbs to sit for a long period of time. If the clutch plates are dry from sitting the scoot will not move if you get it started but that is another simple fix. Pressure testing is irrelevant right now. Other things are required before that thing runs again.

These are very simple machines and if you have the mechanical experience this will not be a problem. Just don't make it complicated. Get it, clean carb, and go from there to indicate your next step to running. This forum can walk you through fixing anything on that scoot.

But again, where are the pics!!??

Good luck!
Member
Vespa P125X, Stella 2T
Joined: 15 Jul 2019
Posts: 13
Location: Pocatello ID
Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:46 am quote
I have been looking just for a P200 engine for around that price. Getting a complete scooter would be great.
Ossessionato
1980 P200E, 1974 Primavera, 04 Ninja 250
Joined: 04 Apr 2013
Posts: 3990
Location: San Diego, CA
Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:31 am quote
Iíd do it, the fix wonít be that hard so long as the engine isnít locked up.
Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2479
Location: Lock Haven, PA
Tue Oct 29, 2019 9:07 am quote
Use Greasy's pricing tip:

If a P200 is worth x dollars

If it doesn't run it's worth half that amount

If it doesn't have a title it's worth half again

If it's being sold as a complete scooter but in pieces in a box, it's worth half again.

So the strikes against a scooter really do add up
Member
Stella 2T 150, Honda C70
Joined: 25 Sep 2019
Posts: 28
Location: Seattle
Tue Oct 29, 2019 11:01 am quote
@meteredair if you aren't going to buy it can you at least PM me the contact for who has it? I'm interested if you're not.

hal
Ossessionato
Joined: 22 Oct 2011
Posts: 4045
Location: Tega Cay, SC
Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:36 pm quote
I think Greasy's was Price of runner = X
Not running = half of X or X/2
All there but in pieces half again or X/4
Title plays into it, but there are ways to obtain one legally without too much trouble.
Ossessionato
Joined: 22 Oct 2011
Posts: 4045
Location: Tega Cay, SC
Tue Oct 29, 2019 6:42 pm quote
Got off track a little, sorry. Meteredair, 1k for a P200 is a good price. These scoots are fairly simple machines, fairly easy to figure out any problems and people here to help. Grab it.
Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:15 pm quote
Thanks everyone for the tips! Iím working out a time to go pick it up this week.

As I kinda expected, you all arenít too worried as long as it kicks over.


@whereshaldo

Once I get it running, we should get together for a ride.
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1128
Location: Staten Island, NY
Tue Oct 29, 2019 7:18 pm quote
we expect pictures and a thread to follow your progress!
Member
Stella 2T 150, Honda C70
Joined: 25 Sep 2019
Posts: 28
Location: Seattle
Tue Oct 29, 2019 8:04 pm quote
@meteredair

I'll come drink and watch while you scrape your knuckles.
Hooked
'63 VBB2T - '18 300 GTS Super Notte
Joined: 26 Apr 2019
Posts: 250
Location: Belgium
Wed Oct 30, 2019 12:15 am quote
Like others said, post the pics! And a vin...
1k for a p200 is a good price, but also depends where youíre at..
Just for information: I paid double of that, just for the engine (but it was completely rebuild off course).
These engines are getting rare these days by the way.
If the engine is not locked, I would certainly go for it!
Member
Joined: 28 Oct 2019
Posts: 6
Location: Seattle, WA
Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:03 pm quote
Well, it was definitely worth it. Titled and trucked home for less than $1250.

Itís a Ď79, by the way.

Cleaned it up, reset the carb via this tutorial:

[url] http://www.vespamaintenance.com/fuel/carbtune/[/url]

and it started right up!

Front brake is non-existent.

Bogging some, but Ok to drive around the neighborhood. Seems fun! Canít wait to get a new battery and carb kit.

Suggestions on which kit to buy and the best place to learn about rebuilding it?

6ABFA285-4B7A-425F-AEAE-53DB41F83D34.jpeg
Thanks, u-haul.

CFCF790F-095F-4DAD-8CE5-B33299C9F6C3.jpeg
Pretty clean

14A636A7-AD7A-49BA-BC9C-0B8E04E1A4F2.jpeg
Removed all the extra chrome

Molto Verboso
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 1825

Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:19 pm quote
Congratulations on getting the P! Non-existant front brakes can be quite common on a P. The are a few things that cost little to nothing that might make them work better. Second is that it might need a new front brake cable, but first i would remove the brake hub and lube the brake shoe and linkage pivots. Then skuff up the brake drum with some sandpaper. Something around an 80 grit would work well. I would also brake the glaze on the brake shoes themselves (if there is still a lining on them) with the 80 grit as well (don't breath the dust). Then slap it all back together. If that doesn't work, then replace the brake shoes. If that doesn't work, convert to a disc brake and be done with weak brakes forever.

I'd also remove that chrome exhaust pipe extension. Not because of looks, but because it will probably mess with your jetting.
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1128
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:25 pm quote
That's a great deal with simple fix. Good condition.

YouTube @thatscooterthing and @mista freakmoped are the best video resources for these. That scooter thing has multiple videos going through engine rebuilds over and over again. Fmp has great single topic videos that you will find useful.

Last edited by swiss1939 on Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:41 pm; edited 1 time in total
Member
Stella 2T 150, Honda C70
Joined: 25 Sep 2019
Posts: 28
Location: Seattle
Fri Nov 01, 2019 4:28 pm quote
Where are you in Seattle, I wanna come see it!
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 7300
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Fri Nov 01, 2019 7:19 pm quote
congrats. good score!

just as an aside on the scooter maths. there can be some variables.

like if a bike is cheap-- such as this one, you can't really employ the full equation on it. stuff that's complete and hovering in the 1K range is more wheeler dealer territory. like maybe knock off 30-40% if it doesn't run

hard rules:
-anything in boxes or partially disassembled is worth half. end of.
-no compression, same as above
-no tags, tags out, no plate, no title knock off 3-500 all day, every day
-never look at something at night
-always be willing to walk away

because i'm in CA the tags/title thing is a rough go. bikes with tags out just a year could easily be several hundred dollars add that to the transfer/title fee and you could be looking at 6~7 on the back end of that "smokin" deal.

basically any bike that's about a G is probably worth close to that give or take a few hundy so long as it's complete and not blowed apart or wrecked.

-g
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