FYI Pm tuning exhausts on ebay for cheap
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Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Wed Nov 06, 2019 9:52 am quote
I picked up a p series pm tuning pipe on ebay for 117 bux and he has a few more left. thought I would share since it is a pretty good deal for an expansion chamber
he has up and over, left hand 200 and 150 models.
Addicted
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
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Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Wed Nov 06, 2019 3:32 pm quote
vespa pm tuning
sellers name is Hudsonvalleymotorcycleparts

yeah that's the person,,, they have several versions for sale
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2058

Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:11 pm quote
Any of the 200cc ďup and overĒ pipes available?



*EDIT*
The link you have is for the 200cc "up and over" pipe (#PM21)! Yea, I just bought one!! Thank you Roliver!!! I guess i should have placed an "offer". Oh well, there's a happy seller and a happy buyer, so all is good! Now i just need to get a silencer for the pipe...or do i? Ha! This pipe is going on my Pink PK. Hopefully the stock 200 engine will work ok with an expansion chamber.

https://www.pmtuning.co.uk/vespa-px200e-up-over-expansion-chamber-exhaust

Last edited by whodatschrome on Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:31 pm; edited 1 time in total
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:16 pm quote
up and over
he has a couple left,, and does except offers.
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Wed Nov 06, 2019 4:48 pm quote
silencers
the PM tuning silencers are a bit pricey but they sell tons of options that are bolt on for two strokes that would work just fine and a heck of a lot cheaper
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Tue Feb 04, 2020 8:11 pm quote
I ended up getting one of the LH p150 exhausts from that guy for only $90 offer. He seems willing to sell them just give an offer.
https://www.ebay.com/itm/PM24-Tuning-Evolution-PX-125-150-L-H-Exhaust-PM24EV-Expansion-Chamber/332639790541?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2057872.m2749.l2649
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Tue Feb 04, 2020 8:37 pm quote
If
Anyone orders the pm tuning for the 200...he has one with the silencer as well its list a lot higher but if you offer low...he will counter if he does not like it
Ossessionato
05 Stella, '62 VBB, 76 Sprint V, 63 GL
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 2307
Location: Chicago. Well, Evanston, but that's almost Chicago
Tue Feb 04, 2020 8:59 pm quote
Well, I made an offer for one. We'll see what happens. I normally run box exhausts, but it'll be interesting to see how crazy the Frankensprint gets with one of those on it. I'll probably use one of my Prima/JL knockoff silencers to start, but maybe get something real if I decide I can stand it.
Ossessionato
05 Stella, '62 VBB, 76 Sprint V, 63 GL
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 2307
Location: Chicago. Well, Evanston, but that's almost Chicago
Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:24 am quote
He took my offer for the last PX leftie for $100, including free shipping. Let's see what shows up. Ebay says it's due to arrive on Monday.

Assuming the holes match up, I'll probably throw the can off one of my JL Knockoff's on it to get started, then go from there.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Wed Feb 05, 2020 12:54 pm quote
Mine arrives Friday. Not planning on using it anytime soon but for$90 I figured it was worth picking up for whenever I feel like messing with it. I'm not a fan of louder exhausts but it could be fun for a random scooter.
Hooked
2007 Stella 150
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 207
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:25 pm quote
Anybody know where I can find a dyno or know the rpm this pipe produces maximum torque?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Evolution-PX-125-150-L-H-Exhaust-PM24EV-Expansion-Chamber-Header-/332639790536
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2058

Wed Feb 05, 2020 5:47 pm quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Anybody know where I can find a dyno or know the rpm this pipe produces maximum torque?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Evolution-PX-125-150-L-H-Exhaust-PM24EV-Expansion-Chamber-Header-/332639790536
Let me ask you this...what sort of engine tune are you thinking about installing the pipe on? Because i think just about every single article about any box or performance pipes were on tuned engines. 99% of the time they were mounted on a 210 cylinder. The only other article that i've scene was the one in SCOOT QUARTERLY, and that was on the Stella engine. The main basis on that article was for those new 226 Vintage pipes that were released years ago.

That PM pipe will put out different torque and HP depending upon an engine tune, so to say how it will perform out of the box on "X" engine might be hard to say.
Hooked
2007 Stella 150
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 207
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:14 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Anybody know where I can find a dyno or know the rpm this pipe produces maximum torque?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Evolution-PX-125-150-L-H-Exhaust-PM24EV-Expansion-Chamber-Header-/332639790536
Let me ask you this...what sort of engine tune are you thinking about installing the pipe on? Because i think just about every single article about any box or performance pipes were on tuned engines. 99% of the time they were mounted on a 210 cylinder. The only other article that i've scene was the one in SCOOT QUARTERLY, and that was on the Stella engine. The main basis on that article was for those new 226 Vintage pipes that were released years ago.

That PM pipe will put out different torque and HP depending upon an engine tune, so to say how it will perform out of the box on "X" engine might be hard to say.
The engine would be a Stella with a DR177 ported to run 7500 rpm max, cruising rpm at 60MPH will be 6000-6100 rpm according to an online calculator.

I was able to find a dyno comparison of a dozen or so chambered exhausts for my 79cc BBK. I was able to look at the chart and steer clear of the extremely peaky pipes that only had power from 10,500 to 11,000 rpm. I was able to pick out the pipe that was good in the 8500 rpm range the scooter travels at most of the time. When I put a chambered pipe on my 70cc BBK it was a huge change from the factory exhaust.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Thu Feb 06, 2020 4:51 pm quote
Day early. Comes with mounting hardware (haven't checked but assume it fits). No exhaust manifold to connect to stub, or silencer. Both available direct from pm tuning. Not bad for$90.

IMG_20200206_194421.jpg

Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:41 pm quote
?
So you didnt get the header? I know they dont all have the silencer but I thought they all had header too

Screenshot_20200206-223957_Chrome.jpg

Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 07, 2020 6:52 am quote
No header. it wasn't pictured in the listing. Just mounting hardware.
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:18 am quote
i am sorry to hear that
all the other ones were for the same price or at least around there and included the header. It never hurts to ask, he has thousands of parts, and it could very well be that it just got misplaced.
Hooked
2007 Stella 150
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 207
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Fri Feb 07, 2020 12:55 pm quote
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Exhaust-Evolution-PX-125-150-L-H-Exhaust-PM24EV-Expansion-Chamber-Header/332639790536?hash=item4d72e065c8:g:wRkAAOSw8gVX2VsK&redirect=mobile


He took my offer of $75.00 and he has more, for that price if I don't like the pipe maybe I can resell it later, or make a wall ornament out of it.
Hooked
2007 Stella 150
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 207
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:21 pm quote
chandlerman wrote:
He took my offer for the last PX leftie for $100, including free shipping. Let's see what shows up. Ebay says it's due to arrive on Monday.

Assuming the holes match up, I'll probably throw the can off one of my JL Knockoff's on it to get started, then go from there.
You'll have to let us know the outcome of trying to fit a JL knockoff.
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2058

Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:41 pm quote
Hey guys, make sure to look at all the ebays pics really close. If they don't have the head pipe, fasteners, or mounting brackets, it might be a HUGE headache for you if you can't find or fab those parts up!

Also, i don't know what he JL knockoff pipes use for the silencer, but all the JL's for Lambrettta's and largeframe Vespa's that i've both had and seen (including a Prima) have a completely different mounting system than the PM. The JL's are a slip on, while the PM use the fairly common 3 bolts pattern.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 07, 2020 5:46 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Hey guys, make sure to look at all the ebays pics really close. If they don't have the head pipe, fasteners, or mounting brackets, it might be a HUGE headache for you if you can't find or fab those parts up!

Also, i don't know what he JL knockoff pipes use for the silencer, but all the JL's for Lambrettta's and largeframe Vespa's that i've both had and seen (including a Prima) have a completely different mounting system than the PM. The JL's are a slip on, while the PM use the fairly common 3 bolts pattern.
I checked PM Tuning's website before I purchased as I could tell from photos it was not included.. they have the head pipe available. Although I dont know if they ship to USA. I will try at some point in the future.
https://www.pmtuning.co.uk/down-pipe-for-pm24ev

and yes the PM pipe that came uses the 3 bolt pattern for silencer.
Ossessionato
05 Stella, '62 VBB, 76 Sprint V, 63 GL
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 2307
Location: Chicago. Well, Evanston, but that's almost Chicago
Sat Feb 08, 2020 2:44 pm quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
You'll have to let us know the outcome of trying to fit a JL knockoff.
My exhaust came today. PM Tuning, new in original packaging with header and all mounting hardware.

I tried fitting the silencer off a Scoot[Redacted] JL Knockoff that came with a motor I bought, and it damn near fit. I'd need to dremel maybe a millimeter off a couple of the mounting holes on the pipe to make it fit. I could get the bolts in and threaded, bu they were slightly angled and started to bind up after a couple turns.

Once the weather improves a bit, I'll do something with it, but for now, it's going to gather dust. Either way, not bad at all for $100.

IMG_20200208_145627.jpg

IMG_20200208_150050.jpg

Hooked
58 VB1T, 68 SS180, 81 100 Sport
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 275
Location: Long Beach, CA
Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:10 am quote
I hopped on the PM Tuning bandwagon and grabbed one of these pipes for a P200 project. $95 + tax. Should arrive end of week, early next week. Stay tuned! Pun fully intended.
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2058

Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:15 am quote
Hey Roliver,

THANK YOU for hooking us all up with your find!!
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:39 am quote
Yes thanks! I also just picked up his last p200 lh. Just cause!
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:51 am quote
very welcome
for the sake of it, he also has one Lambretta PM tuning pipe on there as well. Considering the price of Lambretta parts these days its a good grab also, and again I'm sure he would take considerably less than he is asking at the moment.
Hooked
58 VB1T, 68 SS180, 81 100 Sport
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 275
Location: Long Beach, CA
Mon Feb 10, 2020 12:25 pm quote
yeah man Big thanks Roliver1972!
Hooked
2007 Stella 150
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 207
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:09 am quote
My PM24EV came with mounting hardware, a surprise for me and the seller apparently. I asked and was told there wasnít any. Came with the original instructions also. Talks about resetting, drilling the air filter and moving the center stand spring out of the way. Iíll scan them in at work and post them up here in case anyone wants them.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Thu Feb 13, 2020 6:56 pm quote
My p200 pipe came today. Just the exhaust header no mounting hardware this one. I see they have a pipe to cylinder mounting hardware for the pm24ev but none listed for the pm20ev. Anyone know if it's the same hardware? Does it just take the pipe locking hardware or does it also get a shim or packer as well? This is the full mounting kit for the pm24, which they sell just the barrel mounting bracket by itself.. if it's the same as fit p200 I'll just buy this kit for the p200 pipe. Cause I already have the mounting kit for the p150 pipe.

https://www.pmtuning.co.uk/pm24ev-replacement-fitting-kit

I'll get a chance tomorrow to mock up the p200 barrel with this header and see if the p150 mounting bracket works with it to confirm if they are the same.

IMG_20200213_213759.jpg

Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2058

Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:43 pm quote
swiss1939 wrote:
My p200 pipe came today. Just the exhaust header no mounting hardware this one. I see they have a pipe to cylinder mounting hardware for the pm24ev but none listed for the pm20ev. Anyone know if it's the same hardware? Does it just take the pipe locking hardware or does it also get a shim or packer as well? This is the full mounting kit for the pm24, which they sell just the barrel mounting bracket by itself.. if it's the same as fit p200 I'll just buy this kit for the p200 pipe. Cause I already have the mounting kit for the p150 pipe.

https://www.pmtuning.co.uk/pm24ev-replacement-fitting-kit

I'll get a chance tomorrow to mock up the p200 barrel with this header and see if the p150 mounting bracket works with it to confirm if they are the same.
I donít know on the PMís, but on the Prima left hand exhausts (knock off of the JL left), the main body was the same between the large and small block Pís. When I bought a Prima, it came with both a 150 and 200 downtube and the swingarm mounting bracket was the exact same.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 7:35 am quote
Compared the p150 to p200 pipes. They are basically the same pipe in form factor and footprint, but the pm20ev for p200 has an ID at the header connection point of 47.15mm whereas the pm24ev for 125/150 engines has an ID at the same point of ~44.6mm. the pm20 header doesn't fit in the pm24 pipe and the pm24 cylinder mounting clamp is too small for the pm20 header. I'm sure I can find a similar clamp with correct diameter for the pm20 at local hardware store. Just need the silencers and pipe to frame hardware for the pm20.

IMG_20200214_102307.jpg
Pm24ev on left. Pm20ev on right. Pm20 header in middle

Ossessionato
05 Stella, '62 VBB, 76 Sprint V, 63 GL
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 2307
Location: Chicago. Well, Evanston, but that's almost Chicago
Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:01 am quote
speaking of the silencers...

I see basically three options, the PM Tuning actual silencer, a SIP silencer, and a SIP Performance silencer.

Can anyone speak to both noise level and performance impact of any of them?
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 10:08 am quote
chandlerman wrote:
speaking of the silencers...

I see basically three options, the PM Tuning actual silencer, a SIP silencer, and a SIP Performance silencer.

Can anyone speak to both noise level and performance impact of any of them?
I didn't even think about the option for non PM tuning silencers! I am really curious which ones that fit on same exhaust end are the quietest. I would be more likely to keep one of these pipes on my scooter if there are relatively quieter options for silencers.

So now that you mentioned it, SIP also sells the mounting bracket, springs, etc.
Ossessionato
05 Stella, '62 VBB, 76 Sprint V, 63 GL
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 2307
Location: Chicago. Well, Evanston, but that's almost Chicago
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:40 pm quote
The SIP silencers claim to have the same mounting configuration. That may even be true.

Given that the cost is something like:
- Standard SIP -- $75
- PM Tuning -- $110
- SIP Performance -- $140

I'd prefer to have some information before I blindly commit to anything.

I'm in a similar situation where I'd like something quieter than the noise levels I associate with my JL Knockoff's.
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:49 pm quote
chandlerman wrote:
Given that the cost is something like:
- Standard SIP -- $75
- PM Tuning -- $110
- SIP Performance -- $140
Can you post links to the ones you quoted above? I just want to make sure I'm looking at the same ones you are.

BTW, You bought the 125/150 version right? You have a JL knockoff the same style? Can you test your JL knockoff exhaust manifold pipe to see if it fits in the PM tuning exhaust and it leaves the pipe to mount to frame in correct spot? I see there is a JL Manifold listed on SIP for cheaper than the PM tuning manifold. If it fits, I might just get the JL manifold and a SIP silencer if the SIP one is quieter!

https://sip-scootershop.com/en/products/exhaust+manifold+jl+for+sip_20584000
Enthusiast
vespa p200
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 71
Location: Bakersfield
Fri Feb 14, 2020 1:56 pm quote
there are many options outside of scooter world as well.
There are some dirt bike and other two stroke silencers that can work as well. Just want to make sure that the diameter of the opening is the same, and that it can be mounted, in some cases drilling holes may be required. I have used Toomey silencers, before with great results, and also one designed for an aprilla. The length of the canister reduces the sound, but also has an effect on performance of the exhaust. Not a tremendous amount but it does. I picked up a pm tuning silencer from the same guy that sells the pipes for 35. he has other types as well.

doesn't hurt to look around for options.

exsl9005rs01.jpg
54.00 bux

Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:08 pm quote
Tyga Performance Silencer
Interesting.. I'll try to look around for other options. I wonder when FMP is going to hit up the internet with a silencer comparison test?! I want some dB measurements on all the options.

BTW.. this is the silencer info I got from PM tuning website:

The bolt spacing is PCD 54.5mm
Baffle tube OD 25mm
Gasket for face of mounting surface is 76mm

That Tyga Silencer you just posted I found says the PCD mounting bolt spacing is 44mm and the silencer inlet is 26.5mm. Doesn't line up in terms of mounting, but it has a larger opening into the silencer than the baffle tube coming from exhaust, so there could be the possibility of mounting that.. if the plates line up and you can drill holes to match.

Maybe we can collect all possible options for silencers here.

Tyga EXSL-0003 schematic below
http://tyga-performance.com/product_info.php?products_id=512

tyga-EXSL-0003.jpg



Last edited by swiss1939 on Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:23 pm; edited 1 time in total
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:18 pm quote
Scooter & Service Silencer
Not sure what the mounting hole layout is, but here is another potential option.. Scooter & Service silencer 99 euro + shipping. Shorter but fatter than the Tyga with 85mm total diameter, 250mm length.
https://www.scooter-and-service.de/shop/vespa-shop/motorteile/auspuff/104/enddaempfer-scooter-service-newline?c=155#

Last edited by swiss1939 on Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:22 pm; edited 1 time in total
Molto Verboso
1980 P125X, 1980 P200E , 2005 Stella 177
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1540
Location: Staten Island, NY
Fri Feb 14, 2020 2:22 pm quote
SIP Performance NG Silencer
And here is the SIP one I think Chandlerman was talking about..
https://sip-scootershop.com/en/products/silencer+sip+performance+ng_20006ca

270mm total length
25mm ID
3xM6 studs 53mm spacing (need to drill new holes into the mounting plate)
70mm mounting plate
$72
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