Quattrini 244
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Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:04 am quote
Anyone gone down the rabbit hole building one of these? I'm looking to start on my Rally and considering taking the motor from my Stella for the Rally and building a large displacement tourer for the Stella. I've been digging around the internet and not finding anything convincing thus far. There's a thread here that went dark back in '16, but nothing much after that
Member
P200e
Joined: 29 Jul 2018
Posts: 36
Location: Orange , Ca
Sun Dec 01, 2019 11:29 am quote
Yes , i love it ! Top quality for sure tons of power and in my set up a dream to drive . Of course matched up to the rest of your components.
My friend in germany has a english version of his website give it a try .
Vespmoto.com
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 7121
Location: Victoria, Australia
Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:59 am quote
Will this be a reed motor build? I recall FMP saying that a rotary was much too restrictive to allow it's full potential. It'll be a cool project, looking forward to your build!
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Tue Dec 03, 2019 8:29 pm quote
Definitely reed valve. Looking to use new Malossi cases
Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, 50s in progress
Joined: 18 Aug 2016
Posts: 265
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:00 am quote
Which crank are you planning if you go reed?
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:49 am quote
I'm at the pondering stage at the moment. A lot going on this time of year with work and the holidays. Definitely will be going with longer rod. Had the the opportunity to speak with fellow member who's running this set-up and he tells me it's a very impressive set-up.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 7121
Location: Victoria, Australia
Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:39 pm quote
I bought a Kingwelle crank for a (future) project, however it's big dollars! I've been recommended to this guy, calls himself Cosmoto lml-lambretta torino by an Italian mate who bought from him. He does mostly Lambretta and other 2 stroke (despite the LML bit) but also Vespa from time to time. And maybe 25% cheaper than Kingwelle but still with the option for longer rods and heavier webs.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:58 pm quote
I hear you. Considering building with new cases and going Quattrini, saving a couple $100 bucks on the crank, IDK? I've been digging around and the Kingwelle seems choice. I'm also looking at brakes and a lowered fork and shock mount and shocks. Where does it end?
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 7121
Location: Victoria, Australia
Wed Dec 04, 2019 10:16 pm quote
I guess the only thing I'll say about that is that the import duties and taxes made an expensive crank really expensive, and if it's an equal quality product then it's a win win. Until you put that list together and total the costs (which I try to avoid because I know it'll scare me off! ) then you can at least start with the best of everything.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Thu Dec 05, 2019 4:36 pm quote
I need to start a shopping list and see where it takes me. The motor in the Stella was built using Rally cases and I'm planning to keep the motor that's in the Rally intact in the event I ever decide to sell the bike. Building the stock motor for the Rally will eat a hole in my wallet, and considering the Stella would be a much safer bike at speed, why not put a little more money in a Quattrini for the Stella and put the 221 in the Rally? Winner winner, chicken dinner? The Stella runs very good with the 221, but it would be totally sweet with a Quattrini 260
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1201
Location: Staten Island, NY
Addicted
GL, PK, PE200, Rustbadge
Joined: 24 Apr 2012
Posts: 716
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 7121
Location: Victoria, Australia
Thu Dec 05, 2019 5:59 pm quote
The Quattrini makes more power than the Pinasco 251. I suspect that later on there will be better, aftermarket cylinders to suit the 251 cases. But for now the Q + Malossi case (with it's better gas routing around - rather than through - the crank) is going to be the quicker motor by a decent margin. And cheaper.
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Thu Dec 05, 2019 6:45 pm quote
I've been all over the net studying, and I concur. There's a guy in Germany, vespmoto.de who has an interesting site and numerous vids on YouTube. He also has a comprehensive build sheet listed as well. I corresponded with him several years back when I was looking to build the motor that's in the Stella now. Always good to get various perspectives from folks versed in building production qty hot rod motors. He's obviously still around and follows the latest/greatest trends. The motor that's in the Stella is a Polossi 221. Polini 221 aluminum cylinder and head, Malossi piston, long rod crank, Variable ignition, BGM clutch, stock gears built in Rally cases and running a old TaffSpeed lefty. I should have ripped the wiring out of the bike and went with a Vespa wiring set-up, but labored through trying to figure out how to make the wiring work with the ignition. No easy feat. Hodge thankfully came to the rescue and John Gick got it sorted. I bought the last Stella to leave Scooterworks, stripped it down to the frame and sold off everything but the frame, wiring, fork and brakes. Bought the bike to have a perfect paint, unmolested chassis. It runs and rides like a P should have. I'm wanting to do a restomod with my Rally now, and thinking the motor in the Stella would be good for that bike, and something that will cruise a little harder would make the Stella that much better.
Molto Verboso
1980 P200E project, 2005 Stella Mal 177 MKIII in pieces
Joined: 20 Jul 2018
Posts: 1201
Location: Staten Island, NY
Thu Dec 05, 2019 10:15 pm quote
Ginch wrote:
The Quattrini makes more power than the Pinasco 251. I suspect that later on there will be better, aftermarket cylinders to suit the 251 cases. But for now the Q + Malossi case (with it's better gas routing around - rather than through - the crank) is going to be the quicker motor by a decent margin. And cheaper.
I didn't realize they would be cheaper, but I figured as a result of newness and lack of parts options with the pinasco 251 that it hasn't yet been examined enough to push it to the limit power potential yet. Awesome idea and looking forward to hearing about the results of this build!

Rowdyc that's cool. I avoid fb so I didn't realize they got one already.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 7121
Location: Victoria, Australia
Fri Dec 06, 2019 12:21 am quote
Cheaper because the 251 has a number of specific parts...pretty good value but if you're after max power then atm the Q is probably it.

On the GSF they've been testing various combinations of the 251 and so far it hasn't really lived up to the advertising. With some porting tweaks and other exhausts they've so far maxed out at just 30 ish. Pinasco says 30 with rotary and their exhaust and si28. GSF gets 24 with that setup.
Enthusiast
too many
Joined: 16 May 2012
Posts: 61
Location: Norway
Fri Dec 06, 2019 1:46 am quote
Hi!

I'm running a M244 in my SS180...

I would recomend it with a SI26/26 VRX from Pinasco.
-that along with a SIP road and 64/24 gearing i did 134km/h according to my calibrated SIP speedo...

And that was with a fully loaded PAV41 trailer behind!

Uphil it made 110km/t in third...


Then I fit a PWK28 carb (opened inlet) and a Pipedesign Silentbox3, but I find that not nearly as nice as with the SI carb...

Next step is either Kingwelle 64 crank and proper reeds, or new casings and return to SI carb...

I would go for SI....
Ossessionato
'09 250 GTSie '75 Rally 200 '79 P200 '09 Stella 221
Joined: 13 May 2012
Posts: 2430
Location: Midway, Kentucky
Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:03 am quote
Wow, 80.4 mph pulling a trailer is pretty impressive. Several Vids on the net of same bike eclipsing 85+ mph/143 kmph, and makes it look pretty easy. He rolls on and reaches top speed approaching a bend in the road. I'm guessing there was a little more there. Acceleration appears constant and linear. Approaching 90mph on 10" wheels is moving. 80.4 on an oldie w/trailer in tow is insane. I've ridden several older bikes including the Rally, and the fronts don't seem to be near as predictable at speed, especially when braking hard. I'm not a huge fan of totally braking with the rear and fronts seem to dive so. I'm hoping you're running a tubeless set-up w/modded suspension?
Enthusiast
too many
Joined: 16 May 2012
Posts: 61
Location: Norway
Fri Dec 06, 2019 3:21 am quote
Willie B wrote:
Wow, 80.4 mph pulling a trailer is pretty impressive. Several Vids on the net of same bike eclipsing 85+ mph/143 kmph, and makes it look pretty easy. He rolls on and reaches top speed approaching a bend in the road. I'm guessing there was a little more there. Acceleration appears constant and linear. Approaching 90mph on 10" wheels is moving. 80.4 on an oldie w/trailer in tow is insane. I've ridden several older bikes including the Rally, and the fronts don't seem to be near as predictable at speed, especially when braking hard. I'm not a huge fan of totally braking with the rear and fronts seem to dive so. I'm hoping you're running a tubeless set-up w/modded suspension?
He he, yes, it is fairly "interesting" to ride...

But my SS180 is built for high speed long touring...
-record is 900km in 13 hours. (through/over Norwegian mountains...)
Most of it is changed, but kept original paint...

Running on tubeless and proper suspension from BGM.
-that said, the SS180-fork sucks no matter what you do to it, so considering a modified PKXL2 fork....

But regarding engine, another aspect of going for the SI carb is less noise...
Induction noise is very present, and with reeds it would be even worse...

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