bodywork - over my head
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Ossessionato
Joined: 22 Oct 2011
Posts: 4258
Location: Tega Cay, SC
Sun Jan 05, 2020 6:18 am quote
^^^I can understand your concern, but it this case as well as the last, I have light rusting going on, so there is already some pitting. And the guy I use really knows his stuff, it almost looks like a satin finish when he gets done with it, even in the rusty areas. Someday I may try media blasting and then a clear powder coat. But not on this Blue Badge - it's going back to the original color
Molto Verboso
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Sun Jan 05, 2020 9:20 am quote
Tierney wrote:
^^^I can understand your concern, but it this case as well as the last, I have light rusting going on, so there is already some pitting. And the guy I use really knows his stuff, it almost looks like a satin finish when he gets done with it, even in the rusty areas. Someday I may try media blasting and then a clear powder coat. But not on this Blue Badge - it's going back to the original color
You have light rusting going on and some pitting? This is in semi fresh paint, why do you figure this is happening? Is it maybe the salt water climate you're in?
Molto Verboso
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Sun Jan 05, 2020 6:36 pm quote
Going to price out sandblasting whatís left and have it epoxy primed , if itís not too expensive Iím going to go for it.
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 2079

Sun Jan 05, 2020 7:30 pm quote
With as much filler that's currently on the scooter, sandblasting might not be a wise choice. There's a good chance that the panels might get warped during the process. Another benefit to dipping it in acid is that it will remove all that rust that you still have hiding out inside the tunnel.

Before you go further with the project, it would be a good idea to make a plan on what you want your final product to look like. By doing that, you can make somewhat of an accurate budget. Ask yourself this, do you want it to look nice from 1', 2', 3', 10', 20', or 50' while it's dark outside? Are you just after shiny paint?...dent free?...shiny AND dent free?...or are you attached to this particular scooter for sentimental reasons? No, you don't need to answer that last question to anyone, but you should be at least asking that to yourself. It does seem very peculiar to pump a bunch of money into a bodge to me, since you could find a non-running (non-bodge) Vespa with a great frame that needs zero work for less money that what you will still need to put into this one. If you were to simply throw on one coat of filler on you scooter then rattle can paint it, then heck yes keep it.
Molto Verboso
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:04 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
With as much filler that's currently on the scooter, sandblasting might not be a wise choice. There's a good chance that the panels might get warped during the process. Another benefit to dipping it in acid is that it will remove all that rust that you still have hiding out inside the tunnel.

Before you go further with the project, it would be a good idea to make a plan on what you want your final product to look like. By doing that, you can make somewhat of an accurate budget. Ask yourself this, do you want it to look nice from 1', 2', 3', 10', 20', or 50' while it's dark outside? Are you just after shiny paint?...dent free?...shiny AND dent free?...or are you attached to this particular scooter for sentimental reasons? No, you don't need to answer that last question to anyone, but you should be at least asking that to yourself. It does seem very peculiar to pump a bunch of money into a bodge to me, since you could find a non-running (non-bodge) Vespa with a great frame that needs zero work for less money that what you will still need to put into this one. If you were to simply throw on one coat of filler on you scooter then rattle can paint it, then heck yes keep it.
Itís a money pit yes I know, but yes I do want it to look good from a couple feet away on a sunny day. In all fairness I canít see this money pit soaking me for much more than what its gotten out of me, home stretch.
I donít have the option of an acid dip of any sort here so Iím doing whatís available. I will probably never sell this relic and ride it not very often at all, itís probably more of a personal vendetta to do my best to make it look like it once did before it was bodged. My only experience of riding a scooter at all was back in 2012 when my wife and I rented one to rip around Sicily, been to Italy 8 times and that one adventure has always been the best vacation we ever had and was my reason to buy this scooter. Iím 58 years old, owe nobody anything and Iím within 3-5 years of retirement and I canít stand not completing a task once I get started.
Addicted
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
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Location: california
Sun Jan 05, 2020 8:07 pm quote
Quote:
I will probably never sell this relic and ride it not very often at all, itís probably more of a personal vendetta to do my best to make it look like it once did before it was bodged. My only experience of riding a scooter at all was back in 2012 when my wife and I rented one to rip around Sicily, been to Italy 8 times and that one adventure has always been the best vacation we ever had and was my reason to buy this scooter. Iím 58 years old, owe nobody anything and Iím within 3-5 years of retirement and I canít stand not completing a task once I get started.
Awesome.
Blast it.
Coat it.
Paint it.
Enjoy it.
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:27 am quote
Thanks Charlieman , never give up
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:23 am quote
Well that didnít go the way I preferred, best price I got is $320 and thatís in 3 weeks. Got 3 quotes and 2 of the 3 places suggested I didnít get it sandblasted thinking it was too hard on the panels and suggested I finish stripping myself and bring it back for coat of epoxy.
Style Maven
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:11 am quote
nomadinsiam wrote:
Lynnb wrote:
pheasant plucker wrote:
Tierney wrote:
Notice I said media blasting, not sand blasting. And I use paint stripper on the headsets.
Yeah - the industrial strippers I use hit the headset with paint stripper. All the markings on my headset were under there. Do you have any pics of your bare headsets?
No there is no place here for media blasting , not a lot of stuff like that here, secluded city with the steel mill being the main industry.
When I had the sand blasting done years ago I don't even recall seeing the side cowlings and headset done, I only seen them after they were painted.
The guys here use a propane torch or oxy-acetlelene torch on low flame. I have done this as well, and it works great. Go over the painted surface back and forth until the paint bubbles and blisters off. The old bondo will also separate and fall off. Then go over it with a paint scraper. Finally, wire wheel and sand as necessary. The metal is quite thick, so as long as the heat isn't too intense and the flame isn't focused on one area for a long time, the metal will not warp or deform. The crap just comes right off. No need for toxic gel strippers.
If somebody is gonna blast it, they can do it lighter, faster and easier if you torch off as much paint and bondo as you can, then DA sand off as much more. Then they only need to get off a little paint and just get the bare metal clean w/ no heavy blasting anywhere. Should be cheaper too if you fill them in before they give you a price. All you need is a propane torch, a putty knife and a wire brush(even a hand one) like he says.



Now what should he do, good filler on the weld joints, sand them nice then prime OR prime the whole thing first?
bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5040
Location: So Cal
Mon Jan 06, 2020 12:17 pm quote
One more timeÖ

Thereís no reason to strip the whole bike to bare metal. In places where the paint is still decent - no cracking, peeling, flaking, bubbling, excessive bondo - scuff it and seal it.

But if youíre committed to getting every last square inch of old paint off, and you donít want to spend the money to get it blasted, just keep at it with your sander and some sanding blocks. Like Callum says itís therapeutic.

How much are they quoting you to shoot the epoxy?

Voodoo - Iíd prime it all first.
Style Maven
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 1:58 pm quote
+1 if it was mine AND if I knew that I had good stuff properly applied the FIRST time. But he seems committed and it IS the only way to DEBONDO the whole damn thing if that's where Lynn needs to go, I get that.

So torch it first, what do you think? Get a set of wire brush cup wheels for your angle grinder too if you like a good job and more new tools. That's what I always use, can't imagine a job like this without one.

REPEAT(last time Lynn, I promise )

Here again is taking it down TO top of the bare metal surface after max straightening BUT leaving the tuff paint in the lower areas if it adheres well after power wire brushing. DON'T use filler to "straighten" the sheet metal! Now just enuff fiberglas filler to level it, NOT a skim coat but several revisits w/ a little more after block sanding to get it "perfect". This poor leggy was well wrinkled and dinged up w/ lots of rattlecan added.





you can see I masked that old Piaggio emblem

almost done, sanding between primer coats, small marked area needs more filler

No delamination worries for me.
Molto Verboso
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Posts: 1376

Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:33 pm quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
One more timeÖ

Thereís no reason to strip the whole bike to bare metal. In places where the paint is still decent - no cracking, peeling, flaking, bubbling, excessive bondo - scuff it and seal it.

But if youíre committed to getting every last square inch of old paint off, and you donít want to spend the money to get it blasted, just keep at it with your sander and some sanding blocks. Like Callum says itís therapeutic.

How much are they quoting you to shoot the epoxy?

Voodoo - Iíd prime it all first.
When the guy said 3 weeks and gave me the price I pretty much had my mind made up to ask no more questions about breakdown of prices.
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 3:40 pm quote
Voodoo you're too funny
Ok so I think I got my share of therapy in, I feel so much better.

I'm going to leave the under fender as Voodoo suggested, I think its pretty solid so I 'll just scuff it for primer. I now pretty much just have to concentrate on the little crevices. I think a good round of 8o grit on the da sander is called for as a final step before priming to make for a good bite surface???

Ya I know I'm a stubborn shit.

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bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
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Location: So Cal
Mon Jan 06, 2020 4:24 pm quote
There you go.
Style Maven
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:33 pm quote


Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:41 pm quote
First thing tomorrow I gotta see if I can get the area de-dusted, man what a mess.
Looks like I may have to buy the epoxy primer in the gallon , no quarts came in. Itís Nason 421-10 , a Direct to metal primer.
Will I be able to use this first to apply on metal, do the body filler and then reapply , basically will I be able to use this primer and not have to get anything else? Well other than urethane paint.
Style Maven
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 6:45 pm quote
Yep,
1) prime,
2)block sand,
3)patch,
4)block sand again

and keep going back to 1) again until you are
all HAPPY!
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 7:16 pm quote
Wow - Get em Lynn!
Addicted
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 871
Location: california
Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:29 pm quote
Impressed and a little jealous.
The chassis looks to be in great shape.
Looks like someone stitched in a central rear seam- and did a damn good job.
By taking it to metal - you now know - you have a fully solid body.

Forget sanding therapy - you will be running the shop vac for a day. Might as well just vacuum a large area - set a chair in the middle - put the dusty stuff on your right - and just vacuum everything that is in the garage and set it off to the left. Wipe down the shelves - and put it away. Place will be twice as clean as when you started.

🙂

Project looks great - and you have some good advisors on this thing.
Enjoying.
Hooked
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:38 pm quote
NICE WORK!!!!
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 8:56 pm quote
V oodoo wrote:
Yep,
1) prime,
2)block sand,
3)patch,
4)block sand again

and keep going back to 1) again until you are
all HAPPY!
Thanks Voodoo , really what I meant is can I use the same type primer all the way to pre base coat?
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:02 pm quote
charlieman22 wrote:
Impressed and a little jealous.
The chassis looks to be in great shape.
Looks like someone stitched in a central rear seam- and did a damn good job.
By taking it to metal - you now know - you have a fully solid body.

Forget sanding therapy - you will be running the shop vac for a day. Might as well just vacuum a large area - set a chair in the middle - put the dusty stuff on your right - and just vacuum everything that is in the garage and set it off to the left. Wipe down the shelves - and put it away. Place will be twice as clean as when you started.

🙂

Project looks great - and you have some good advisors on this thing.
Enjoying.
Lol ya I know Iím going to be busy, even my wifeís car on the other part of the garage got some dust from the duct work.
I had the Vespa stripped back in 2012 when I first got it and first learned about bodges, I had learned at that time all the things that were just plain wrong and changing the floor and brake system is the last of it. I still got a bit more crevice sanding to do but from what my mentors have been saying is really I need only to smooth out the paint and hit it with some primer.
Molto Verboso
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Posts: 1376

Mon Jan 06, 2020 9:04 pm quote
GeekLion wrote:
NICE WORK!!!!
Thanks GeekLion and also Scott.
Molto Verboso
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 10:47 pm quote
Right. All that hyming and hawing when all you had to do was strip the effer.
Style Maven
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Mon Jan 06, 2020 11:06 pm quote
hem or haw?
Lynnb wrote:
V oodoo wrote:
Yep,
1) prime,
2)block sand,
3)patch,
4)block sand again

and keep going back to 1) again until you are
all HAPPY!
Thanks Voodoo , really what I meant is can I use the same type primer all the way to pre base coat?
Or get the proper German stuff, Siemens X334N112 Special Deluxe Between Bare Metal Primer and Pre Base Coat stuff, but it's over 340 euros a liter now. It IS special, so well worth it IMO!

J/K, I would risk it, but check w/ supplier or Mr SCG because I live in the fast lane and I take crazy chances ALL the time.
Molto Verboso
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Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Tue Jan 07, 2020 8:12 am quote
Re: hem or haw?
V oodoo wrote:
Lynnb wrote:
V oodoo wrote:
Yep,
1) prime,
2)block sand,
3)patch,
4)block sand again

and keep going back to 1) again until you are
all HAPPY!
Thanks Voodoo , really what I meant is can I use the same type primer all the way to pre base coat?
Or get the proper German stuff, Siemens X334N112 Special Deluxe Between Bare Metal Primer and Pre Base Coat stuff, but it's over 340 euros a liter now. It IS special, so well worth it IMO!

J/K, I would risk it, but check w/ supplier or Mr SCG because I live in the fast lane and I take crazy chances ALL the time.
340 euros, ? No that aint going to happen.
bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5040
Location: So Cal
Tue Jan 07, 2020 10:11 am quote
OK hereís the skinny on primer.

You basically have two choices in 2K: Epoxy or polyurethane.

Epoxy is like a non-porous glue. Itís hard, strong, not as brittle as polyester and slightly less likely to crack. It sticks like a mofo to almost anything and is resistant to virtually all chemicals. Most epoxy primers arenít meant to be used as ďfillersĒ as epoxy is hard to sand when it dries, but most can be sanded. In fact you need to scuff any primer if you donít apply another coat over it within the time window the manufacturer allows for a chemical bond.

Urethane primers are essentially the same stuff as body filler. They come in a lot of different grades and formulas. Theyíre generally not as sticky or as hard as epoxy. Some urethane primers are less water permeable than others, but as a general rule, urethane is not as moisture resistant as epoxy. Polyurethane primer dries relatively soft and is easy to sand. You can actually use it like a filler to ďbuild upĒ the surface, then sand it back to get rid of minor imperfections.

So... ideally youíd use an epoxy primer on the bare metal FIRST to seal everything. Itís your foundation. Then you apply whatever other fillers or other coatings you need on top of that.

The Nason 421-10 you mentioned is a urethane primer. Itís a good product but I donít know if Iíd put filler over it. If youíre going to use it, you might as well put filler directly on the metal areas youíre working on, then shoot a coupe of coats of the Nason over the whole scoot. Just know itís not going to give you the same protection an epoxy will.

The product choices can get frustrating. Thereís no single right way and a lot of variables. Thatís why painters usually stick to a ďsystemď once they find one that works for them.

Hope this helps.
Molto Verboso
One or two fun scoots....nothing too precious
Joined: 17 Jul 2013
Posts: 1247
Location: UK (South East)
Tue Jan 07, 2020 11:31 am quote
Good info Mr. SoCal. Without intending to hijack this thread, I have a PX200 frame which has been media blasted to bare metal, then etch primed by the blaster. Does etch primer map to either the epoxy or urethane primers or is it a 3rd variety?

The floor (top/visible side) has some pitting from surface rust that was removed by the blasting. Would I apply urethane primer on top of the etch primer, so building it up to cover the pitting? Is it better to skim the pitted area with proper body filler, then sand back?
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Tue Jan 07, 2020 12:56 pm quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
OK hereís the skinny on primer.

You basically have two choices in 2K: Epoxy or polyurethane.

Epoxy is like a non-porous glue. Itís hard, strong, not as brittle as polyester and slightly less likely to crack. It sticks like a mofo to almost anything and is resistant to virtually all chemicals. Most epoxy primers arenít meant to be used as ďfillersĒ as epoxy is hard to sand when it dries, but most can be sanded. In fact you need to scuff any primer if you donít apply another coat over it within the time window the manufacturer allows for a chemical bond.

Urethane primers are essentially the same stuff as body filler. They come in a lot of different grades and formulas. Theyíre generally not as sticky or as hard as epoxy. Some urethane primers are less water permeable than others, but as a general rule, urethane is not as moisture resistant as epoxy. Polyurethane primer dries relatively soft and is easy to sand. You can actually use it like a filler to ďbuild upĒ the surface, then sand it back to get rid of minor imperfections.

So... ideally youíd use an epoxy primer on the bare metal FIRST to seal everything. Itís your foundation. Then you apply whatever other fillers or other coatings you need on top of that.

The Nason 421-10 you mentioned is a urethane primer. Itís a good product but I donít know if Iíd put filler over it. If youíre going to use it, you might as well put filler directly on the metal areas youíre working on, then shoot a coupe of coats of the Nason over the whole scoot. Just know itís not going to give you the same protection an epoxy will.

The product choices can get frustrating. Thereís no single right way and a lot of variables. Thatís why painters usually stick to a ďsystemď once they find one that works for them.

Hope this helps.
Thanks SoCalGuy for yet another learning lesson.

The tech data sheet for the Nason 421-10 says:
APPLICATION SUBSTRATES
Properly treated bare steel, aluminum, and fiberglass
Thoroughly sanded, painted surfaces
Note: For the ultimate corrosion protection prime bare metal areas with Ful-Poxyģ 491-10ô
DTM Epoxy Primer/Sealer, SelectPrimeô 2K 491-55ô Chrome-Free Etch Primer or other
locally permitted Nasonģ etch primer or epoxy primer.

I would imagine the 491-10 is the epoxy part of what you're referring to as a first coat and then the Nason 421-10 as the build up sandable primer.

In my city right at this moment I can only get the Nason 421-10 in a Gallon and can also get the Nason 491-10 in a quart.
So 421-10 with the activator alone would be $200 plus tax and then I would have to also get a quart of the 491-10 and activator probably $100 plus.

I really didn't mind putting out the $200 for the Nason 421-10 DTM but that was before I found out it still needs an added epoxy, the gallon is about 3 quarts more than I need.

When I went to get the prices for blasting and epoxy the guy showed me the Nason 491-10 he would have used.

My buddy that unfortuneatly lived far away from me builds bikes from scratch and was the person that told me about the Nason 421-10 that he uses, he does as you said makes a gas tank, applies a skim of filler and semi finishes with the 421-10 prime on the filler , but also today I confirmed he sprays the tank and also other bare metal parts with the primer and then base coats them.

Question when you say it won't get the same epoxy protection, do you mean if it gets wet from getting caught in the rain or perhaps from sitting pirdy in a garage ? This will very unlikely be ridden like the rest of the guys ( and girls ) ride theirs, its more of a show piece riding on sunny days not very often.
bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5040
Location: So Cal
Tue Jan 07, 2020 1:38 pm quote
Quote:
Does etch primer map to either the epoxy or urethane primers or is it a 3rd variety?
Safest bet is to ask the blaster exactly what they used, but etch primers are usually urethanes with an acid added.
Quote:
Would I apply urethane primer on top of the etch primer, so building it up to cover the pitting? Is it better to skim the pitted area with proper body filler, then sand back?
Depends how bad the pitting is, but in my experience, itís almost always better to use filler and sand it back. Even so-called ďhi buildĒ primers only fill so much. Piling on a lot of thick layers of primer isnít a great technique.

Depending what the rest of the scoot looks like, Iíd probably sand the pitted areas with 180 to give the etch primer tooth, apply filler where needed, block sand the filler to get everything straight, sand the whole scoot with 320-400, seal it, then paint.
bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5040
Location: So Cal
Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:27 pm quote
Quote:
Question when you say it won't get the same epoxy protection, do you mean if it gets wet from getting caught in the rain or perhaps from sitting pirdy in a garage ? This will very unlikely be ridden like the rest of the guys ( and girls ) ride theirs, its more of a show piece riding on sunny days not very often.
We donít have serious corrosion problems here in San Diego ... current temp 72į, 28% humidity ... so canít really speak from personal experience. My guess is that if your scooterís garaged and kept dry, the primer isnít going to make a serious difference. One cowl on my yellow scoot has epoxy primer under it, the other has urethane. I doubt anyone could tell which is which.

Too bad you canít get a qt. of the 421-10 and save some money. Itís your call. Iíd say go with whateverís easiest and suits your budget. No wrong choice.
Style Maven
74 50s x3 78 P200 84 Cosa 58 AllState 68 Sprint 80 50special '66(?) Super125 + projects
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Location: seattle/athens
Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:35 pm quote
That Siemens business was a joke, but DAMN, good paint is expensive!
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Tue Jan 07, 2020 2:50 pm quote
V oodoo wrote:
That Siemens business was a joke, but DAMN, good paint is expensive!
Ok , you know where the corner is.
Addicted
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Tue Jan 07, 2020 3:48 pm quote
Por-15 have a decent metal prep package. Includes a phosphate coat. Think itís a degreaser/cleaner that etches, (very powerful) followed by phosphate coat (not as powerful as the industrial dip version) and finally corrosion protecting primer (unsure what type).

Havenít used this system - just the degreaser/etch and phosphate parts of it.

Since you are pretty much stripped - Iíd recommend hitting it all with the degreaser/etcher and phosphate. Get that phophate into the seams and places you canít get to. Iíd then run Penetrol into those seams and through the tunnels.

Cheap and easy way to ensure no rust starting out, and give a decent level of protection moving forward.
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:33 am quote
pheasant plucker wrote:
Por-15 have a decent metal prep package. Includes a phosphate coat. Think itís a degreaser/cleaner that etches, (very powerful) followed by phosphate coat (not as powerful as the industrial dip version) and finally corrosion protecting primer (unsure what type).

Havenít used this system - just the degreaser/etch and phosphate parts of it.

Since you are pretty much stripped - Iíd recommend hitting it all with the degreaser/etcher and phosphate. Get that phophate into the seams and places you canít get to. Iíd then run Penetrol into those seams and through the tunnels.

Cheap and easy way to ensure no rust starting out, and give a decent level of protection moving forward.
Thanks for the suggestion, I think I'm just going to dtm prime and do the bodywork. Slowly cleaning up , my 12 hour work shifts really get in the way of progress.
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Sat Jan 11, 2020 1:34 am quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
Yes, Spray Max 2K epoxy in the activated cans is a good product. It has a nice fan pattern and sprays very nicely. The cans are expensive though ... ~ $20 each here. Youíll need least 4 to cover the scoot.
SoCalGuy I ordered 4 cans of the Spray Max 2K epoxy. Whatís going to be the law on applying the 2K primer over the epoxy? Will I have to wait and sand it if itís sandable or can I spray the 2K right after I spray the epoxy, whatís your experience with the Spray Max? Also will I be able to use any 2K primer?
Thanks
bodgemaster
1963 GL, 1976 Super (x 2), 1974 Primavera (x 2), 2006 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5040
Location: So Cal
Sat Jan 11, 2020 6:14 am quote
The TDS for the Spray Max epoxy says:

ďIf the 2K epoxy primer-filler is topcoated after more than 1 day, it must be sanded first. 2K UP products: Before topcoating with a 2K filler and/or 2K spray fillers, a drying time of 12 h at room temperature or 30 minutes at 140į F (60į C) needs to be respected.Ē

https://download.kwasny.com/datasheets/TMB-3680032_(US)EN.pdf

Follow the directions and youíll be fine.
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Sat Jan 11, 2020 11:34 am quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
The TDS for the Spray Max epoxy says:

ďIf the 2K epoxy primer-filler is topcoated after more than 1 day, it must be sanded first. 2K UP products: Before topcoating with a 2K filler and/or 2K spray fillers, a drying time of 12 h at room temperature or 30 minutes at 140į F (60į C) needs to be respected.Ē

https://download.kwasny.com/datasheets/TMB-3680032_(US)EN.pdf

Follow the directions and youíll be fine.
Thanks SoCalGuy, I seem to be terrible at finding these TDS's. I was thinking that this and other Epoxy primers were non sandable and were only meant to provide a solid surface for the 2k primers and then the 2k primers were meant to me sanded and or body filler applied. I bought 4 cans because I was thinking once I wet sanded all the other parts with that good base coat on them that I would then give them an epoxy coat for a good base that the paint wouldn't react to. Then again perhaps finishing all parts with the coat of the 2k primer may do the same thing for the base coat.
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 1376

Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:07 am quote
Finally got all the welding done and the frame epoxied last nite. After applying the epoxy I noticed I had quite a few pin sized holes where the welding was done so I got a small stiff brush and jabbed the epoxy into the holes from both sides, worked well. The Spray Max data sheet says wait 12 hours before applying 2k filler and seeing as I did this last nite I will have to wait a bit before applying the body filler.
Thanks again guys for the guidance.

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Honda elite
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 755
Location: California
Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:17 am quote
Looking great Lynnb you might want to mask the rear brake post so the pedal fits when your done
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