[NSR] Corona Virus.
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Thunder Thief
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Sun Sep 06, 2020 12:57 am quote
Attila wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
Attila wrote:
There are other things you can die of, with Covid we no longer talk about AIDS but there is.
AIDS is no longer the death sentence it once was and while it is tragic the method of transmission more avoidable. COVID and AIDS is not really an apt comparison.
I beg to differ, a friend is a doctor in the infectious ward in my city hospital and tells me that due to the lockdown, the cases of other infectious diseases had drastically reduced but the recovery was worse .... Not only did they resumed but also increased!
So, as you see, people just thinking about covid neglect precautions for other diseases, it seems like they can't think they have more than one disease at a time ... curious.
Catching covid from grocery shopping is quite a bit different than having unprotected sexual intercourse or sharing a needle. You canít catch HIV (not AIDS) from breathing in air of ignorant maskless people. Zero comparison. Red flag for false equivalency.
Ossessionato
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Sun Sep 06, 2020 1:32 am quote
I understand that there is a cultural and above all a political problem, i leave this topic because of this.
End of my communications on the pandemic and its side effects.
Thunder Thief
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Joined: 04 Jun 2010
Posts: 2340
Location: in the blue ridge mountains of Virginia... on the trail of the lonesome pine..."
Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:10 am quote
if you consider science, a culture. Alrighty.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Sun Sep 06, 2020 3:17 am quote
froggieposition wrote:
if you consider science, a culture. Alrighty.
Yep. The point is that the method of transmission is very different. You don't need to do anything to catch Covid-19 beyond breathing or simply coming in to contact with it. HIV was not shutting down school and industry, airlines still were operational etc. It was really isolated to the gay and intravenous drug use community with some transmission via blood transfusions. Was it tragic, yes? Is it still? Yes but not the death sentence it was.
Thunder Thief
2010 GTS 300 Super & 2015 Kawasaki Versys 650 LT
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
Posts: 2340
Location: in the blue ridge mountains of Virginia... on the trail of the lonesome pine..."
Sun Sep 06, 2020 2:14 pm quote
Harbinger wrote:
froggieposition wrote:
if you consider science, a culture. Alrighty.
Yep. The point is that the method of transmission is very different. You don't need to do anything to catch Covid-19 beyond breathing or simply coming in to contact with it. HIV was not shutting down school and industry, airlines still were operational etc. It was really isolated to the gay and intravenous drug use community with some transmission via blood transfusions. Was it tragic, yes? Is it still? Yes but not the death sentence it was.
agreed. My uncle died of AIDS, the disease that happens AFTER contracting HIV (human immunodeficiency virus). Acquired immunodeficiency syndrome (AIDS) is a chronic, potentially life-threatening condition caused by the human immunodeficiency virus (HIV). With covid, you contract covid by basically existing and doing normal crap, ARDS is what happens after. (acute respiratory distress syndrome).

given HIV is direct contact transmission/blood transfer and the other you can acquire simply by existing near other humans... I am not sure how the comparison is even remotely valid other than both are viruses. Maybe you get freakier in supermarkets than other people. Gonna wash my produce much better now....
Addicted
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Sun Sep 06, 2020 9:18 pm quote
HIV / AIDS in the Western World was initially predominant in the gay community and IV drug users.
In Africa, it is a 99% heterosexual disease, mostly in poor communities and so the difference in social attitude towards the disease is fundamental.

In South Africa, the previous Health Minister actually pressured the big drug companies to allow the generic manufacture of combined 'cocktail' drugs in single tablets / capsules to avoid patients having to take multiple drugs to fight the disease. The cost of the generic medication is also a fraction of the cost that the original medications cost in the West.

In addition, every workplace bathroom has state sponsored condoms available for anyone to use. Sterile, disposable syringes with needles are freely available in drug stores and always have been. Sharing of needles is virtually unknown here, so that method of transmission is eliminated.
Molto Verboso
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Mon Sep 07, 2020 7:08 am quote
Fudmucker wrote:
HIV / AIDS in the Western World was initially predominant in the gay community and IV drug users.
In Africa, it is a 99% heterosexual disease, mostly in poor communities and so the difference in social attitude towards the disease is fundamental.

In South Africa, the previous Health Minister actually pressured the big drug companies to allow the generic manufacture of combined 'cocktail' drugs in single tablets / capsules to avoid patients having to take multiple drugs to fight the disease. The cost of the generic medication is also a fraction of the cost that the original medications cost in the West.

In addition, every workplace bathroom has state sponsored condoms available for anyone to use. Sterile, disposable syringes with needles are freely available in drug stores and always have been. Sharing of needles is virtually unknown here, so that method of transmission is eliminated.
While no one country has all the answers wouldn't it be nice if we could take the so called "religious" BS out of heath care or the overtly racist backgrounds for some laws?
https://www.businessinsider.com/racist-origins-marijuana-prohibition-legalization-2018-2#:~:text=In%20the%20early%201900s%20an,be%20used%20more%20often%20too.
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 1:46 pm quote
American exercise trainer Jillian Michaels chronicles her Covid 19 affliction . . 37:47 podcast.

KF94 And KN95 mask testing videos.
Banned
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 2:51 pm quote
When will it decrease and we start to live as usual...
Molto Verboso
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:03 pm quote
Sex parties allowed but dancing at weddings banned in Queensland.

Screenshot_2020-09-09 Sex parties allowed under Queensland's COVID restrictions, but still no dancing at weddings.png

Moderaptor
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 4:36 pm quote
Kevin78 wrote:
When will it decrease and we start to live as usual...
We have to ask ourselves if we want to go back to the 'usual' that existed before.

I expect a lot of office workers who have stayed employed while working from home do NOT want EVER to go back to daily commuting.
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 5:44 pm quote
Sledge wrote:
Sex parties allowed but dancing at weddings banned in Queensland.
Clearly the Swinger community has been influential in getting the strict social distancing amended to include face masks, which makes it all more kinky...!

Child: "Mummy, who is my Daddy?"
Mum: "I really don't know, darling... he was wearing a mask at the time!"
jimc wrote:
Kevin78 wrote:
When will it decrease and we start to live as usual...
We have to ask ourselves if we want to go back to the 'usual' that existed before.

I expect a lot of office workers who have stayed employed while working from home do NOT want EVER to go back to daily commuting.
I have noticed that people are working anywhere these days. Our moderate climate means that well-ventilated sidewalk cafes and open air restaurant patios and porches are the most popular, because one can legally remove your mask when eating or drinking, thereby getting some respite from the claustrophobic cloth over your face. People meet their clients over coffee and only go into an office situation when confidentiality demands it.

Landlords in South Africa are finding that their office tenants are giving notice on as much as 60% of office area, creating a flooded buyers market. I know of 50% rental discounts for the balance of existing leases just to retain tenants in the buildings. Due to COVID, employers have been forced to adapt and many prefer the 'working from home' scenario as they now pay for predefined deliverables instead of time in office. Workers can work when it suits their specific timetables.

An architect friend who is in upmarket residential developments tells me that new homes are now being fully equipped with office level computer / entertainment networks and wifi in all rooms, including separate secure server rooms within the building development, UPS and on-site standby power generation.

New Normal is very different here these days...!

BTW, regulations here on weddings limit them to 50 guests in total, with everyone including the bride being required to wear masks throughout unless actually eating or drinking. Social distancing between tables is required. Bridal veils are being restyled to act as masks as part of the ensemble. No specific mention is made regarding whether the groom may still kiss the bride.
Molto Verboso
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 11:10 pm quote
Kevin78 wrote:
When will it decrease and we start to live as usual...
Define "usual".

When everybody (ok, about 70% of the population) is vaccinated it'll be as "usual" as it can be after all this. That ought to be a year and a few months from now if vaccine development and production goes as expected.

Best case -- if we do everything right, starting immediately (basically a replay of mid-March through April but with deficit-straining Federal support for individuals, businesses, and states, plus a crash PPE-production program and followed up with thorough test-trace-isolation) -- we get back to "normal but with masks and distancing" in 3 months, maybe 4. Schools and sports can re-start (think most of Australia). A slow but stable economic recovery begins. This is not a possible outcome under present political conditions.

Likely case -- as above but starting in February, combining Phase III vaccine trials with ring-vaccination around outbreak clusters after the shutdown -- we get back to "normal but with masks and distancing" in 6 months. Vaccination levels and low local prevalence allows some regions to end distancing requirements within a year. Economic recovery begins at the 6 month mark and accelerates through the end of the year. This is a possible outcome depending on how elections go in November.

Worst case -- just waiting for the vaccine -- it's a year and a few months of masks, distancing, and repeated waves of outbreaks and lockdowns grinding away at the economy. And a lot more dead people. This too is a possible outcome depending on how elections go in November.

Black swan case -- no vaccine is possible -- the US reaches herd immunity infection levels in eight years with 3.3 million dead of CoVID-19. Might be more if it overshoots, and will continue to be a problem indefinitely since children born after herd immunity is reached will still be susceptible to infection and will make up an increasing proportion of the population over time. Fortunately, this outcome is highly unlikely. CoVID-19 doesn't mutate in a way that precludes lasting immunity, and we know how to make the vaccines (but until we run the trials, we won't know how effective they are or whether they're safe in the long run).
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Tue Sep 08, 2020 11:29 pm quote
Y'all know Kevin78 is a spammer?

Meanwhile in Paradise, it's travelling through a covid denying church group.
Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:17 am quote
Erased.

Last edited by Attila on Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:26 am; edited 1 time in total
Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 7:44 am quote
Erased.

Last edited by Attila on Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:26 am; edited 1 time in total
Addicted
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 8:08 am quote
ndrstnd tht thr s cltrl nd bv ll pltcl prblm, lv ths tpc bcs f ths.
nd f my cmmnctns n th pndmc nd ts sd ffcts.
http://1.bp.blgspt.cm/-dtCWQfHGHg/VVmKwqnw8/_Q/rfHNh740w/s1600/Pncch.png
Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:25 am quote
tortoise wrote:
Attila wrote:
I understand that there is a cultural and above all a political problem, i leave this topic because of this.
End of my communications on the pandemic and its side effects.
OK... I was asked to continue providing news and I didn't want to but I did it on external request. I delete the two previous posts and I apologize to moderator tortoise that called me a liar.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:17 am quote
Attila wrote:
tortoise wrote:
Attila wrote:
I understand that there is a cultural and above all a political problem, i leave this topic because of this.
End of my communications on the pandemic and its side effects.
OK... I was asked to continue providing news and I didn't want to but I did it on external request. I delete the two previous posts and I apologize to moderator tortoise that called me a liar.
tortoise? a moderator? LMFAO! The red x's are not exactly badges of honour and you can ignore tortoise or dislike him if you want... but moderator? This is the internet and you can't take too much personally or you don't stand a chance. Tortoise for those that post once has the worst rating on here and you were what we call "trolled" by him. Letting him "win" is not the answer. Look a few of us disagreed with your analogy of HIV and COVID-19 and well sometimes adults don't agree on things. Having someone troll you with a Pinocchio graphic is something you should not let get to you.

Sure you said you were leaving the thread but we all change our minds from time to time, no big deal. When the trolls start winning is when a site/forum goes to complete shit.
Zombie Process
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:09 pm quote
Attila wrote:
OK... I was asked to continue providing news and I didn't want to but I did it on external request. I delete the two previous posts and I apologize to moderator tortoise that called me a liar.
He is not, and never will be, a moderator on MV.

He's lucky not to get a time-out for his behaviour.
Wed Sep 09, 2020 12:10 pm
tortoise has been ejected from this topic
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:26 pm quote
Well, Attila, I hope that clears things up for you.

Keep up with what you do.
Except the erasing posts thing, no need for that.

Cheers!

Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 5:54 pm quote
Itís comforting to know that should we all succumb to the ravages of Covid MV-Bot will still be here.

More human than human.
Molto Verboso
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:16 pm quote
znomit wrote:
Itís comforting to know that should we all succumb to the ravages of Covid MV-Bot will still be here.

More human than human.
Now I've got the White Zombie earworm.

Thanks!
Moderatus Rana
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:34 pm quote
znomit wrote:
Itís comforting to know that should we all succumb to the ravages of Covid MV-Bot will still be here.

More human than human.
Oh she is omnipresent and eternal. Captures moderators at her whim but always with logical reasons. The future of AI here today.
Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:06 pm quote
stickyfrog wrote:
znomit wrote:
Itís comforting to know that should we all succumb to the ravages of Covid MV-Bot will still be here.

More human than human.
Oh she is omnipresent and eternal. Captures moderators at her whim but always with logical reasons. The future of AI here today.
I don't know you but I can tell you that I have learned to appreciate your comments, again my apologies for the disturbances I continue to cause ...
However, here in Italy there is a small increase in infections but they are controlled by health facilities that are less busy compared to the initial phase; we do more swab checks and serological tests and the infected subjects at home are better controlled.
The Zeneca-Oxford vaccine caused a severe allergic reaction (severe spinal cord infection) in only one in 50,000 volunteers, but that was enough to stop the tests. The comments are that they will investigate the cause before starting the vaccine, that's right.Here the schools will open on October 24th but with many doubts, perhaps a part with distance learning will remain but only those who can do it; a lot of caution in this ... our little ones are our future.
This is what I had to say.
Addicted
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 10:16 pm quote
kshansen wrote:
While no one country has all the answers wouldn't it be nice if we could take the so called "religious" BS out of heath care or the overtly racist backgrounds for some laws?
https://www.businessinsider.com/racist-origins-marijuana-prohibition-legalization-2018-2#:~:text=In%20the%20early%201900s%20an,be%20used%20more%20often%20too.
A recent Constitutional Court verdict in South Africa opened the way for personal use of cannabis. There is draft legislation in the pipeline but it is far from good as it does not address the possible use of cannabis/hemp products on a broader scale. Also, while personal cannabis production is legalised, the possession, distribution and sale of seed is not mentioned (at present).

From my information gleaned from two 'expert' cannabis growers with decades of under the radar cultivation, producing quality high-THC material for recreational use is rather difficult, as the best THC comes from unpollinated flowers on female plants. Apparently, one stray male plant in the cannabis patch can ruin all the fun from your current crop.

The controlled commercial production of cannabis for pharmaceutical purposes as well as nutritional, textile and insulation materials is not yet addressed. I am told that South Africa produces some very good cannabis and certain sub-species are native to the region. This could offer very good employment opportunities for individual farmers in rural communities to earn a living with very little capital investment and no irrigation required. It would also be a great tax source.

You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:23 pm quote
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
Ossessionato
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:48 am quote
znomit wrote:
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
In Italy you would have already had an honorary degree in medicine.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:42 am quote
znomit wrote:
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
Is that how New Zealand has done so well?
I'm in.
Thunder Thief
2010 GTS 300 Super & 2015 Kawasaki Versys 650 LT
Joined: 04 Jun 2010
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Location: in the blue ridge mountains of Virginia... on the trail of the lonesome pine..."
Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:26 am quote
znomit wrote:
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
I have noticed a solid dose of rum and pizza has magical repealing virus properties as well.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:37 am quote
froggieposition wrote:
znomit wrote:
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
I have noticed a solid dose of rum and pizza has magical repealing virus properties as well.
I'm aboard with that, Amy! That's my favorite prophylactic as well.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 9:55 am quote
Silver Streak wrote:
froggieposition wrote:
znomit wrote:
Fudmucker wrote:
You never know, perhaps the effective treatment of COVID 19 will come from the plant the tobacco industry hates with a passion!
I'm conducting a scientific study using daily doses of beer and potato chips. So far I'm 100% Covid free, and my family too.
I have noticed a solid dose of rum and pizza has magical repealing virus properties as well.
I'm aboard with that, Amy! That's my favorite prophylactic as well.
Iím more of an Amarone and pizza guy followed by some Grand Marnier with a chocolate truffle or 2 . But hey as long as we all do our part to battle this pandemic. I also find long rides help especially if you try to scrub away those chicken strips.
Hooked
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 10:47 am quote
Los Angeles has basically killed Halloween due to covid19:
https://abc7.com/halloween-2020-coronavirus-covid-19-los-angeles/6416043/

I'm predicting Thanksgiving will be killed as well. Hopefully Christmas survives?
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:52 pm quote
tonyc wrote:
I'm predicting Thanksgiving will be killed as well.
I don't usually have strangers knocking on my door at Thanksgiving.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 3:57 pm quote
Ahhhh, all along people have been pointing the finger at bats and pangolins.

Turns out it was the Turkeys.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:24 pm quote
So, on the heels of the Sturgis debacle, they're going ahead with the annual charity Harley meet in northern Wisconsin. They're expecting 40+K riders. Guessing they'll be crowded together without masks.

Ironically, the event is in support of the Muscular Dystrophy Association, which has pulled it's sponsorship for the year.
Ossessionato
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:56 pm quote
fledermaus wrote:
So, on the heels of the Sturgis debacle, they're going ahead with the annual charity Harley meet in northern Wisconsin. They're expecting 40+K riders. Guessing they'll be crowded together without masks.

Ironically, the event is in support of the Muscular Dystrophy Association, which has pulled it's sponsorship for the year.
Sturgis, now categorized as a super-spreader event, the unmasked/no-physical-distancing RNC at the White House, the recent Trump Rallies, and now the HD event has a high probability of killing off voters. So have college parties and private parties. I understand stupid. I don't understand ignorance and belligerence.

So frustrating, especially for all of us that have been diligently wearing masks, washing hands and physical distancing for a 1/2 year to solve a problem that should have only taken a month. Sheesh!

Miguel
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 7:36 pm quote
Miguel wrote:
Sturgis, now categorized as a super-spreader event, the unmasked/no-physical-distancing RNC at the White House, the recent Trump Rallies, and now the HD event has a high probability of killing off voters. So have college parties and private parties. I understand stupid. I don't understand ignorance and belligerence.

So frustrating, especially for all of us that have been diligently wearing masks, washing hands and physical distancing for a 1/2 year to solve a problem that should have only taken a month. Sheesh!

Miguel
My sentiments exactly.

I had the biggest scare of my life this year when I had to be evacuated from my apartment (Quincy, CA) because of fire danger. The evac center was the local high school, but some of the people weren't wearing masks and there was very little social distancing. And they didn't have any oxygen concentrators for those of us on o2 24/7. They told me the hospital was taking people with medical conditions but when I got there, they also didn't have concentrators for "non-patients." I did tell one nurse that if she waited long enough, some of us needing oxygen would become patients almost immediately after our portable tanks ran out. She didn't see the humor in that - not that I was looking for a laugh.

Then my friend, a Highway Patrol captain, said I could come stay with her and her husband 45 miles away from the fire. I headed straight there. Her and her hubby weren't wearing masks and tried to convince me I had nothing to worry about. When I asked how often they got tested, she said never. She also said they were moving to Sacto and would be busy doing that while I stayed there and the new tenant wouldn't be arriving for a week. I slept on an air mattress that night and got up to a house full of their friends and co-workers helping them clean, pack and move - none of them wearing masks.

I was relieved when I had the place to myself later that day, but then a cleaning crew came in (also friends of theirs) the next day and again, no masks in sight. What the friggin' hell! I had no place else to go so I just tried to stay away from everyone else. I was there 6 days with the last 3 alone when my friend called to tell me the fire had reached another area where some of her cop friends lived and told them they could come to this house too.

The next morning they lifted the evac order for my neighborhood and I headed home. I knew the smoke in the area was bad, but figured it was safer than being around more people who thought masks were optional around a 70-year old with lung disease. I got home and heard a news report that Quincy, CA was the most toxic air quality in the whole nation. I think it was at #1 or 2 for several days.

I spent the last 3 days in a hotel in Reno because the power company decided to shut the electricity off for 10 or 12 counties up here because of more fire danger. I worried about the cost of such a trip and the danger of being around a lot of people that might not be taking COVID-19 seriously, but I didn't have a lot of choices left. But everywhere in the hotel it was mask-required and middle of the week was very small occupancy, even for a popular resort-casino (Silver Legacy). And the price for my room was half what I thought it would be, including the mobility scooter they let me use. It was a relatively safe excursion, but I am relieved to be home again and the smoke has eased up considerably, although I couldn't see the sun at all during the last 40 miles of my drive home.

Now I just have to sweat out the next couple weeks to see if I develop any symptoms. I've had to go to more extreme lengths to avoid infection than I should have if everyone just had the common sense and decency to think of more than personal comfort and vanity. It doesn't help when political leaders and people of influence don't set good examples. Consequently, many of us with age and health conditions against us live in fear for our lives.
Hooked
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Thu Sep 10, 2020 8:24 pm quote
Miguel wrote:
So frustrating, especially for all of us that have been diligently wearing masks, washing hands and physical distancing for a 1/2 year to solve a problem that should have only taken a month. Sheesh!
And also for parents... All I want is for my kids to go back to school so they can get their learnin' on and play with the chess club, have their music lessons etc. That's a noble goal right? That should've been freaking unpolitical.

Having family that experienced SARS first hand, I stocked up on masks and alcohol (disinfectant) end of February while everyone else was still going out to buffets. I've been tested at least twice a month since May. It's September and US is one of the last countries on this planet to return back to work/school.

Mock the Chinese all you want, but they've been back to work, rebuilding their economy and fighting America since MAY. MAY !@~(*&$#

Last edited by tonyc on Fri Sep 11, 2020 8:16 am; edited 1 time in total
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