150cc-vs-300cc
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Lurker
Joined: 22 Jan 2020
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Location: wetside,WA
Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:55 pm quote
I'm looking into my first scooter. I've been legally riding and owning motorcycles since the 60's but no experience with scooters. Been focusing on Vespa's new 300cc models, but the price for the 150 variations is much cheaper. I need to be able to cruise at 55-60mph "without" the motor being wound up/maxed out. I won't be doing interstates rather just 2 lane hwys and some dirt roads. Will the 150's handle those pavement speeds on a regular basis w/o constantly stressing it and prematurely wearing it out? I'm retired so income is very limited for future major repairs especially those due to abuse.
Thanks,
joe
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Buddy Kick 125
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Location: Oregon City, OR
Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:27 pm quote
The top speed of the 150 Vespa on level ground is 55-60 mph. If you want to cruise at 55-60 with a bit of pep left, then that points you toward the 300 which will cruise all day at 60 or 70 mph. Also the 300 is water cooled, while the 150 is air cooled. That means the operating temperature of the 300 engine is much more uniformly controlled at speeds above 50 mph.[/u]
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2008 GTS250, 2009 S150, 2017 GTS300Super, 2006 GT200
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Wed Feb 05, 2020 4:45 pm quote
flotsam wrote:
I need to be able to cruise at 55-60mph "without" the motor being wound up/maxed out.
The 150 will be maxed out at 55-60. The 300 will do it with ease. The 300 is also more fun day to day and stop light to stop light. Vastly better acceleration than the 150.
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Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:24 pm quote
Thanks for the reply folks. You confirmed my suspicions.
Hooked
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Wed Feb 05, 2020 6:33 pm quote
On a 150, by GPS, you are lucky if you see 55 and you are going downhill if you see 60. Iíve heard that the Honda 150s are a bit faster than the Vespas, but not by much.
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2019 Primavera 150, 2019 Honda Super Cub 125, 2017 Honda Metropolitan, 1965 Honda Super Cub 50 C110
Joined: 15 Dec 2019
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Location: NE Ohio, USA
Wed Feb 05, 2020 7:08 pm quote
Happy with 150
I am happy with my Primavera 150 touring. I live in the country and am able to keep up with traffic on two lane country roads with no problems. When I drive into town, Ohio law lets me park up to 150ccís on the sidewalk. Very convenient.
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2019 Piaggio Liberty 150
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Location: Norfolk, VA
Wed Feb 05, 2020 7:36 pm quote
I have a Liberty 150 and I would recommend a 300 for your intended use.
Ossessionato
2015 GTS300, 1974 Primavera, 04 Ninja 250
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Wed Feb 05, 2020 9:00 pm quote
If you have any hills you definitely want the 300. Plus you will have much more reserve power and itís more fun, as noted.
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Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956 - Moto Guzzi Airone 250 Sport 1951
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 1:47 am quote
have a 155 (not Piaggio) but i come from larger scooters, but there is a different reason than yours; generally you buy small-sized scooters and go up to the big ones but there are those who then choose maximum simplicity and look for models for short routes to be used as an alternative to the car but complementary.
From my experiences i say it is better to start from a 300 (actual 272 cc) for the reasons that have already indicated you but you must also know that the wheels of the Vespa are small ... not too much but they prefer regular asphalt and not ground; also consider high-wheeled scooters, they are more manageable for many occasions.
Juan_ORhea wrote:
On a 150, by GPS, you are lucky if you see 55 and you are going downhill if you see 60. Iíve heard that the Honda 150s are a bit faster than the Vespas, but not by much.
Yes, even my scooter does not exceed 68 mph but only after a good throw, normally the 150 immediately get 62 mph or a little more; I wanted to clarify that it is not the extra speed that is sought on a larger vehicle but the power, with it you can carry more luggage and a passenger without suffering from going uphill.
The choice is yours, ciao and welcome to MV from Latina (Italy)

Last edited by Attila on Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:19 am; edited 1 time in total
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Honda CTX 700 DN Automatic Motorcycle
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:24 am quote
I previously had a Kymco people 150, which has larger wheels than a Vespa. But I still felt the need for more power, even though I only used it on secondary roads. It was WOT, (wide open throttle) for the bulk of the time. While I love the nimbleness of the 150, You are going to want the 300.
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:21 am quote
for me once you ride the 300 you will never really enjoy the 150 again. the only reason to get a 150 is if you cant physically handle the 300.
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2006 Vespa LX150, 2011 Honda PCX 125
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Location: Southern Utah
Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:26 am quote
jerryd wrote:
for me once you ride the 300 you will never really enjoy the 150 again. the only reason to get a 150 is if you cant physically handle the 300.
I think cost has a lot to do with it also.
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 5:49 am quote
Are you looking at buying new or used? If you are open to used, you can certainly find some very nice examples for a fraction of new prices. You just have to be careful. Another option I'd recommend would be the GTS250ie if going to the used route.
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:42 am quote
Juan_ORhea wrote:
On a 150, by GPS, you are lucky if you see 55 and you are going downhill if you see 60. Iíve heard that the Honda 150s are a bit faster than the Vespas, but not by much.
After decades of riding larger road bikes (HD, Goldwings, BMWs), when we decided to get a pair of smaller scooters, we chose the Honda PCX 150s. I was surprised at how capable they were for us. After break-in, they would do an honest 68mph wide open. The ride wasn't particularly pleasant at that speed, but quite decent at 55 to 60. Even better at 45 to 55mph. We both consistently topped 100mpg for fuel mileage; I think my lowest was 96mpg.

Price-wise, the Hondas are significantly less $$ than the Vespa 150s. Good underseat storage (my modular helmet would fit under the seat of the PCX). Excellent acceleration off the line. Better fuel mileage.

After 5 years with the PCX, I was looking for a bit more top speed... for the occasions we wanted to get on the Interstate for a few exits. That led me to the Vespa GTS. For a bit over a year, we were able to compare my GTS 250 to my wife's PCX... the PCX was faster off the line, but the GTS would catch it by 30mph and then pull away. The first thing I added to the GTS was a top case, since the underseat storage was puny compared to the PCX.

After a year of those two scoots, my wife chose a Yamaha Xmax, as she was not a fan of the riding position on the Vespa. Even though I am taller, her legs are longer, and the Xmax is a good fit for her. It also out-performs my GTS on every parameter (except my preference for the Vespa riding position): top speed, acceleration (off the line or any roll-on speed), underseat storage, two-up comfort, braking, and fuel mileage. All that said, I would still pick a Vespa GTS if I were looking to update my ride.

Nothing bad to say about the 150s, Honda or Vespa. If your riding style isn't going to be regular highway cruising, they are a lot of fun and easy to move around. The GTS is a significantly larger and heavier bike than the 150s, but that extra size and horsepower make the GTS more comfortable and capable for occasional highway riding.

Good luck with your decisions.
Hooked
'13 Buddy 125 Seafoam
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 10:15 am quote
Scarabeo500ie wrote:
Are you looking at buying new or used? If you are open to used, you can certainly find some very nice examples for a fraction of new prices. You just have to be careful. Another option I'd recommend would be the GTS250ie if going to the used route.
^^^this...go used 300 with low mileage and oem parts
Hooked
Joined: 14 Aug 2019
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Location: Bermuda
Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:00 pm quote
Captain Jim wrote:
Juan_ORhea wrote:
On a 150, by GPS, you are lucky if you see 55 and you are going downhill if you see 60. Iíve heard that the Honda 150s are a bit faster than the Vespas, but not by much.
After decades of riding larger road bikes (HD, Goldwings, BMWs), when we decided to get a pair of smaller scooters, we chose the Honda PCX 150s. I was surprised at how capable they were for us. After break-in, they would do an honest 68mph wide open.
Impressive. Doesnít make me like my Vespa 150 any less, but I hadnít realized the Hondas were THAT much faster. Thank you for elucidating.
Hooked
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 12:08 pm quote
utahusker wrote:
jerryd wrote:
for me once you ride the 300 you will never really enjoy the 150 again. the only reason to get a 150 is if you cant physically handle the 300.
I think cost has a lot to do with it also.
Road type, or really amount of time spent at top speed, has a lot to do with it too. Last fall on a few nice days I drove a 150 into NYC from the burbs, which is about 25 miles each way and involves a bit of urban highway driving where the speed limit is, briefly, as high as 55. But in reality with NYC congestion, much of the trip was stop-and-go, and I found myself driving less than five minutes on the whole trip at top speed. I wasnít perturbed by any other vehicles traveling a bit faster.

Earlier this week on a relatively nice winter day I rode a much bigger, non-Vespa scooter in. Same story, just a few minutes at speeds over 50, and a lot of stop-and-go. But having to endure the hassle of handling a much larger, heavier scooter in NYC without being able to enjoy the benefit of the higher speeds means that I wonít be doing it again - the 150 is the better tool for the job.
Hooked
2020 GTS HPE 300, 2013 GTS 300ie
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Location: San Diego
Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:01 pm quote
My first scoot was a Buddy 170i. Because San Diego is crazy, we have several regular city roads (not highways) that can be up to 55 MPH. My 168 ccs came way too close, since I had to do about 60 MPH in the 55 to not get killed. I feel much safer on my GTS 300 and I love the ABS and traction control, as they are doing so much construction around here I am constantly riding through dirt and gravel. I feel much safer on my larger scooter
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Bashan 150, CF Moto Fashion 250
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:12 pm quote
A Yamaha SMax is a compromise. According to good sources here it will do a little over 70 mph and I have seen year old models advertised for under $3500.
Hooked
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Thu Feb 06, 2020 9:05 pm quote
Back to the original question. A 150 will not do what you want it to do under the parameters you laid out. It will go fast but you will do more maintenance as a result. As an owner of both a 150 and a 300 (and a 200 and 250) I can tell you ďfrom the horses mouthĒ that thereís a world of difference at highway speed. The larger bikes take it in stride and the smaller one is pushing the limits. At those limits youíll get more oil blow by which will lead to lots of oil filling the airbox. Get a bike that suits your intended use rather than one that will leave you wishing youíd gone bigger.
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 6:41 am quote
jerryd wrote:
for me once you ride the 300 you will never really enjoy the 150 again. the only reason to get a 150 is if you cant physically handle the 300.
I agree for the type of riding described in this thread. But disagree for downtown urban riding where you never get close to top speed. I find it just as fun to ride downtown on my LX as my GT - a little less oomph, but smaller and more nimble.
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 9:04 am quote
Re: 150cc-vs-300cc
flotsam wrote:
I'm looking into my first scooter. I've been legally riding and owning motorcycles since the 60's but no experience with scooters. Been focusing on Vespa's new 300cc models, but the price for the 150 variations is much cheaper. I need to be able to cruise at 55-60mph "without" the motor being wound up/maxed out. I won't be doing interstates rather just 2 lane hwys and some dirt roads. Will the 150's handle those pavement speeds on a regular basis w/o constantly stressing it and prematurely wearing it out? I'm retired so income is very limited for future major repairs especially those due to abuse.
Thanks,
joe
i looked at this first post again. Welcome to this forum, Joe. It sounds like our two-wheel life journey may have been similar. We have owned 27 bikes over the decades (got my first motorcycle in 1967). As I could feel a deteriorating hip making me less nimble, I went from a full dress Harley Ultra to a BMW R1100RT, and then to a V-Strom. I considered that V-Strom my "little bike."



When it got to a point that it was too painful to toss a leg over that relatively tall V-Strom, I thought I was done riding. My wife suggested we get a couple scooters. That's how those 150 Honda PCXes came about. I credit those small scoots with keeping us riding... so easy and so much fun!

Since getting the GTS 250, I have ridden more in the past two years than the previous 10. Like you, I am retired... we are not doing the cross-country kind of riding we used to do, but we haul these scoots around and ride in some great places at the best times.

Whether you get the 150 or the 300 (or consider a used GTS250), I hope you get the kind of enjoyment out of it that many of us here feel. I thought a small scoot would be "less" of a riding experience than a large motorcycle. I thought I would miss shifting. I was wrong. Since getting a new hip last year, I can once again toss a leg over a motorcycle. I have ridden several in the last 6 months... just because I can. But, I have no desire to go back to a motorcycle - this Vespa does everything I want from a bike... and I don't have so much into it that I feel guilty if it sits for a week or more while I am busy with other stuff. I put a Corbin seat on it, added a Laminar Lip to the windshield, a top case, and some other accessories to make it comfortable and convenient for any length ride.

This thing just makes me smile!



Apologies if this is duplicating info already posted, but it feels like Joe may be on the edge of an important decision. I wish someone would have told me how much fun these small scoots can be (although there were times I probably would not have listened ).
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 10:37 am quote
I decided not long ago to go from 2 vintage to 1, and while figuring out what to get I tried an LX150 out. I know in San Diego, hills are a real thing and so I took it to one I know well. It lost speed the whole way up (45MPH limit, but big hill). I knew right then that I couldn't go from a P200 to an LX150.

A little later I got some time to try the new 2020 HPE GTS300, and that was an eye opener. Freeway speeds with no drama. I ended up with a 2015, which meets all my expectations for hill power and freeway power. If you have hills, try out what you are considering on a hill you know well.
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 11:04 am quote
It's not the size it's how you use it.
I still want Vespa 50 special me.
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 12:26 pm quote
... you are a hard and pure Vespa rider ...
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Fri Feb 07, 2020 12:34 pm quote
@flotsam
I too would suggest the 300 if you are after a trad Vespa. Or the BV350 if you are open to a bigger wheel, more modern scoot. The BV is a very capable bike, and a better bike, overall, IMHO. But it is not a Vespa.

The 150 is the biggest engine in the small-frame Vespa line up. Besides the much more 50 -60 mph ability, the larger frame of the 300 will be welcome at those speeds.

I really get what you mean about a bike that will do 50 or 60 mph easily, without feeling as though it is at its limit. GTS 300 no question.
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'13 Buddy 125 Seafoam
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Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:22 pm quote
pcx150 or a 250+cc...how far are you going typically?...is the range suitable for an electric scooter/motorcycle?
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