Rebuilding a Spermy Vespa
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Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
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Mon May 11, 2020 12:19 pm quote
Sooooo much better.
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Mon May 11, 2020 3:37 pm quote
The Blue is looking great! Nice work
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Mon May 11, 2020 6:39 pm quote
provenance... lost
looks great, but you have destroyed the work of an artist ;)
Molto Verboso
08 GTS 250, 79 P200E, 62 Allstate
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Mon May 11, 2020 7:19 pm quote
Holy Peanuts Batman - that looks fantastic! Great job. But I'm with OopsClunkThud - the work of an artist is no more. But wait! It takes an artist to restore it to original, so, Mr. Artist - good job!

BTW, Chris was commenting on how you should've been with us on the North Fork to Mapleton to Sweet Creek to Canary, between the lakes, then back to the house. An awesome 60 mile loop through the hills and back roads put on by yours truly. You would've loved it!

20200507_124953_resized.jpg
Chris says - Where's Jeff?

20200507_150217_resized.jpg
Ruby, Feebs and B-62 say Where's Flo???

Molto Verboso
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Tue May 12, 2020 4:23 am quote
Scott looks like youre in Gods country there.
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Tue May 12, 2020 10:08 am quote
Well Oopsclunkthud, I agree with Linus who once said "Great art should never be mushed up?" but then Art, like Beauty, is in the eye of the beholder.

In my opinion, the spermys are neither Art nor Beauty so they have got to go, however I will be leaving one spermy in place to pay homage to the original artist.

mushed up art.jpg

Molto Verboso
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Tue May 12, 2020 12:26 pm quote
Wow Fatbear that is looking amazing! Like how you are taking your time and it just gets better with each update.

Dang qascooter the scenery looks amazing!
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Tue May 12, 2020 1:11 pm quote
Fatbear5 wrote:
...however I will be leaving one spermy in place to pay homage to the original artist.
that's fair :)
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Tue May 12, 2020 1:19 pm quote
What harm could one single sperm cause anyhow...
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Tue May 12, 2020 3:39 pm quote
What a gorgeous scoot under all that ... umm... "art".

Good on ya for taking the time.
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Wed May 13, 2020 12:30 pm quote
[/What harm could one single sperm cause anyhow... ]

Uh, whodatschrome... better not say that around my ex-girlfriend!
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Wed May 13, 2020 4:23 pm quote
Big day today!

I fired up Spermy for the first time in probably a decade and it started in fewer than half a dozen kicks and I'm happy with that. What I'm not happy about is the idle... there isn't any. The engine races badly and I haven't been able to slow it down. It looks like the throttle cable doesn't let the slide go all the way back so i backed off the adjuster all the way, and even removed the lock nut on the adjuster to give myself more cable length. The idle adjust screw doesn't do anything.

When I disconnect the throttle cable, the slide moves back a bit, but not much.

Here's the position of the slide in the idle position.

Any suggestions?

IMG_6277.jpg

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Wed May 13, 2020 4:52 pm quote
If the throttle cable has been ruled out as the reason, the slide isn't closing, I would loosen the screws that hold the carburetor down and see if that helps. Guessing, something is warped.
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Wed May 13, 2020 5:42 pm quote
^^^x2
Molto Verboso
08 GTS 250, 79 P200E, 62 Allstate
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Wed May 13, 2020 6:09 pm quote
I'm with Christopher and WhoDat. You might want to try taking the carb out and ensuring it works smoothly without being bolted down. Also, you can stretch the spring in the carb a bit to help it push it all the way home.

When you have it out, pull out the idle adjust screw also so it's not interfering.

And CONGRATULATIONS on getting it started!!!! Wooohoooo!
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Thu May 14, 2020 2:19 pm quote
Thanks guys. I swapped the carb slide with one from another unit and now Spermy is idling at a reasonable speed.

Now though I'm concerned that my autolube is not running properly. I have an air bubble in the oil line and it's not moving when the engine is running and I think it should probably should. I pulled the carb box and the oil pump shaft is engaged properly and the last time I looked, the oil channel was clear.

Any thoughts on where I should look next?

I'm running 2% premix until I get this resolved

air bubble won't move.JPG

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Thu May 14, 2020 8:26 pm quote
It might take a while to get that bubble to pass. I've never timed it, but maybe take a 10 mile ride to get it through?
Jet Eye Master
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Thu May 14, 2020 9:31 pm quote
Just put 1% in the tank until you're sure it's working. If it is working it will be 2% lean and with that and the increased compression from the extra oil it might do some damage.
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Sat May 16, 2020 8:52 am quote
Big day yesterday... I took my first ride on Spermy! It was just down the street and I didn't get out of second gear but it's a start. Next step is mounting new tires and shocks and then playing with the dreaded electrical system. I'm really feeling good that I got it running at all!

First Ride.JPG

Molto Verboso
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Sat May 16, 2020 8:54 am quote
Fatbear5 wrote:
Big day yesterday... I took my first ride on Spermy! It was just down the street and I didn't get out of second gear but it's a start. Next step is mounting new tires and shocks and then playing with the dreaded electrical system. I'm really feeling good that I got it running at all!
Trs cool! Ride safe!
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Sat May 16, 2020 11:07 am quote
Lookin' good! Be careful cruising around without protection. You'll want to slip something over your head...
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Sat May 16, 2020 11:26 am quote
Yeah, I know Whodatschrome. I have all the gear but didn't bother with it to run 50 yards up the street. When I really ride, I have a good full face helmet, real shoes and long pants.

Ya gotta remember that I grew up without any of that stuff. If you look at my avatar (1961) you'll see we didn't even bother those fancy things called mirrors.
bodgemaster
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Sat May 16, 2020 1:08 pm quote
Living the life, Fatbear!
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Sat May 16, 2020 1:42 pm quote
Fatbear5 wrote:
Yeah, I know Whodatschrome. I have all the gear but didn't bother with it to run 50 yards up the street. When I really ride, I have a good full face helmet, real shoes and long pants.

Ya gotta remember that I grew up without any of that stuff. If you look at my avatar (1961) you'll see we didn't even bother those fancy things called mirrors.
For just those really short juants i pretty much always put on at least a lightweight set of gloves, but i don't always put on the helmet or the rest of the safety gear. At those slow speeds it's pretty much the palm of the hands that will get injured first. At gymkhanas most people don't wear a helmet, but i like to for the only reason to set a good example.
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Sat May 16, 2020 1:53 pm quote
Well, I've never been accused of being smart or a good example so hopefully people will listen to you and not me.... Don't Try This at Home, Kids!
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Mon May 18, 2020 1:56 pm quote
Aw CRAP!

I just installed a new battery in Spermy, turned the ignition key and got a flash from the fuse holder and a "click" from "somewhere up front." It looks like something is shorting out but I haven't worked much with the electrical and I have no idea how you go about finding the short.

Any suggestions as to how I get started?
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Mon May 18, 2020 2:25 pm quote
autolube
Scoot is looking great. Nice job.

That bubble should move pretty quickly. My p2 at idle for reference. Hope this helps.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X4-Ai-xH1hI
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Mon May 18, 2020 2:48 pm quote
Perhaps one of the ignition wires under the headset have come loose and grounded out on the metal portion of the speedo housing?
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Mon May 18, 2020 3:16 pm quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Perhaps one of the ignition wires under the headset have come loose and grounded out on the metal portion of the speedo housing?
+1

Red ('hot' wire number 3) coming off of battery goes through the fuse and straight to the headset switch.

http://scooterhelp.com/electrics/wiring/VSX1T_Euro_after.pdf

Capture.PNG

Ossessionato
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Mon May 18, 2020 4:31 pm quote
In addition to the switch connection, whats the condition of the red wire at the junction box into the motor?

Were the stator wires in good shape when you had the motor apart? Ive had one short against the cases there before.
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Thu May 21, 2020 1:41 pm quote
Good call Whodatschrome. I pulled off the headset and found that a number of the wires were loosely connected so I cleaned all the contacts and made sure every connection was tight. The wires themselves were just jammed into the headset in a mass. They were all, shall I say it.... Haywire and I suspect that there may have been a Short in there someplace. In any case I rerouted several of them and now I'm not blowing fuses.

I still have to trace down issues like a non-working horn but at least the main problem is solved.

Thanks too to MJ Rally. The stator wires are good as I just had the unit rewired as part of the project. I checked them Just in Case, and they were good.
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Thu May 21, 2020 2:57 pm quote
I'm dealing with two different rust problems. I've been removing the rust under the floorboard with a wire wheel on a drill and in a lot of places there is still blue paint. I figure I'll wax those areas and forget about them. In other places I've had to get down to bare metal and I've gone over those areas with vinegar and a wire brush and then sprayed them with primer for now. I'm not going to paint the scooter so I'm going to try to find some blue spray paint that is at least close to the original. As qascooter pointed out, no one is going to see the underside of the floorboard unless I've run over them, and in that case it's doubtful that they would do a color match.

Is there a better way to deal with that rust than what I'm doing? I've been using vinegar and I have some navel jelly (which I haven't tried) but is there a spray that eliminates the rust and/or stops it from spreading? Once the rust is removed or stopped, how should I protect the area that is now rusty?

The other problem is the rust that forms in some of the seams. I could get in there with a Dremel and small wire wheel but does anyone have a better way?

IMG_6305.jpg

2020-05-21 14.06.59.jpg

Ossessionato
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Thu May 21, 2020 3:01 pm quote
Fatbear5 wrote:
Good call Whodatschrome. I pulled off the headset and found that a number of the wires were loosely connected so I cleaned all the contacts and made sure every connection was tight. The wires themselves were just jammed into the headset in a mass. They were all, shall I say it.... Haywire and I suspect that there may have been a Short in there someplace. In any case I rerouted several of them and now I'm not blowing fuses.

I still have to trace down issues like a non-working horn but at least the main problem is solved.

Thanks too to MJ Rally. The stator wires are good as I just had the unit rewired as part of the project. I checked them Just in Case, and they were good.
Nice one getting the short sorted. Maybe check the horn button switch? That's the easiest place to start. It's just one screw to remove the cover so that you can peek behind it.
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Thu May 21, 2020 3:23 pm quote
CLR could be a good option for dealing with that rust as it would preserve the paint and the rust is not that heavy.
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Sat May 23, 2020 2:07 pm quote
Ok, I'm dealing with the rust... now it's back to electrical problems.

When I installed a new battery and turned on the ignition, the tail light came on as did the neutral light and the turn signals worked... but the brake light didn't. I figured that it was a faulty brake pedal switch but before I started tearing into the pedal assembly, I checked to make sure that both elements of the bulb worked. They did. I reinstalled the bulb I checked again and this time when I turned on the ignition key, the tail light didn't work... but the brake light did! Also, with the key in the Accessory position, the tail light comes on (although it's very dim) and the brake light does not work.

I haven't run into this before. Anyone have any suggestions?
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Sat May 23, 2020 5:16 pm quote
Ive had good luck with Evaporust. Non toxic too.
Molto Verboso
1963 VBB2T
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Sun May 24, 2020 7:52 am quote
Nice to see you got Spermy out for a quick ride and the electrical shorts sorted out, brake switch shouldn't be too hard to sort out. Maybe just start by shorting the brake switch wires and see if it lites up. I would remove that centre stand and get right in there into all the support creases. Once you get it down to metal maybe that etchant primer would be a good candidate. Voodoo has all kinds of tricks for this sort of thing but unfortunately he hasn't been around.
P.S. like the Avatar.
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Mon May 25, 2020 12:36 pm quote
Thank you Lynnb but the tail light is working properly with both the foot brake and the hand brake so the switches seem to be good. It is the tail light that I can't get to work. I checked the two contact points in the socket and I have 12 volts coming to the contact point that lights the brake filament but nothing coming to the other contact point which presumably lights the tail light. I confirmed that the connections in the junction box under the horncast are solid and I opened up the headset but I don't see any loose wires there. I was a little surprised to see that there is no wire connected to terminal 2... is that normal for a 1980 P200?

What really confuses me is that when I first hooked up the battery and turned on the ignition, the tail light came on and the brake light didn't work. Now the opposite is true.

I don't know what to check next. Any ideas??

Contacts 1-5.jpg
Contacts 1-5

Contacts 6-8.jpg
Contacts 6-8

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Tue May 26, 2020 2:49 pm quote
SOMEBODY'S SCREWING WITH ME!... and I don't know how they're doing it!

I'm still having trouble with my tail light/brake light. To reiterate, last week I installed a new battery and when I turned on the ignition, the tail light came on as did the neutral light and the turn signals worked... but the brake light didn't. I checked to make sure that both filaments of the bulb worked but when I reinstalled the bulb and I turned on the ignition key, the tail light no longer worked... but the brake light did! Also, with the key in the Accessory position, the tail light came on (although it's very dim) and the brake light did not work.

This afternoon, I disassembled the taillight unit to check for loose connection or frayed wires and when everything looked good, I put the bulb back and turned on the ignition. Now the tail light comes on (again) but the brake light doesn't work (again). WTF????

The taillight assembly and the junction box look good however I am still curious about the fact that there is no wire coming off the #2 terminal in the ignition switch. (See my last post)

It's as if somewhere, somehow, power is being switched from one terminal to the other and back again to light alternating filaments. Is that possible? Has anyone else run into this problem? How can I fix this?

Help!

Tail light.jpg

Juntion box.jpg

Bulb GG1157.jpg

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Tue May 26, 2020 5:55 pm quote
Fatbear5 wrote:
I'm dealing with two different rust problems. I've been removing the rust under the floorboard with a wire wheel on a drill and in a lot of places there is still blue paint. I figure I'll wax those areas and forget about them. In other places I've had to get down to bare metal and I've gone over those areas with vinegar and a wire brush and then sprayed them with primer for now. I'm not going to paint the scooter so I'm going to try to find some blue spray paint that is at least close to the original. As qascooter pointed out, no one is going to see the underside of the floorboard unless I've run over them, and in that case it's doubtful that they would do a color match.

Is there a better way to deal with that rust than what I'm doing? I've been using vinegar and I have some navel jelly (which I haven't tried) but is there a spray that eliminates the rust and/or stops it from spreading? Once the rust is removed or stopped, how should I protect the area that is now rusty?

The other problem is the rust that forms in some of the seams. I could get in there with a Dremel and small wire wheel but does anyone have a better way?
See the cable sheath at the top left of the picture all worn and split? see if you can see any cables that run through it as they may be worn bare and shorting on the chassis. Might have nothing to do with your problem but something to check.
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