180SS- Jumping into the unobtanium world
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Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:08 am quote
I purchased frame only 1968 180SS. I understand because of part availability it will be a multi-year project in order to source original parts, so I would like to know my options while I wait patiently.

I already know it would have been easier to just buy a complete one, but I am going to save a piece of history, rather than ride off into the sunset so bear with me, but feel free to tear into my ill-advised project as well, I don't mind. I have a high level of comfort with Vespa as well as auto restorations, so I am looking forward to a fun project. OK- housekeeping aside, here is my rough plan: get the scoot put together roughly with whatever will "work" until I can source the missing parts.

I have a Bajaj VBB with an lml reed motor which I plan to use. What parts can be made to work, and what parts will flat out not fit? I know I can source cowls and fender, I *think* the lml will fit in the engine bay but I am not sure what else will carry over, or can be modified to fit- looking for guidance.

If you have read this far, thank you The fork seems to be my biggest issue (finding one) has anyone had one fabricated, or a different model modified to fit? I KNOW this has been done in Asia at some point, but I would like to hear from those who have created a workaround for the original.

Thank you in advance for you help on this, I promise to keep you posted on the progress.

Far left.jpg



Last edited by dsnyder586 on Mon Apr 12, 2021 1:28 pm; edited 1 time in total
Hooked
Joined: 08 Sep 2011
Posts: 369

Sun Apr 04, 2021 9:44 am quote
Wow. That's a doozie.

LML engine should drop right in, but is it setup for 8" or 10" wheels?

I presume you know that the SS180 shares many of the same parts as the GS160. GS parts are more readily available and most have been reproduced.

I think Scooterwest sells a repro GS fork. You may be able to modify it for the SS (different locking and stops).

The front swingarm assembly is definitely unobtanium, but a guy in Germany JUST started reproducing them. He's only selling on Facebook AFAIK, so go join the "VESPA 160 GS (VSB1T)" group. I don't know how many he produced.

Good luck!
Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 562
Location: San Francisco, CA
Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:14 am quote
Scooterwest has GS forks. But just the fork. The fork link and hub, no.

https://www.scooterwest.com/fork-gs-160-late-w-narrow-lock-modify-to-fit-early-gs-160-079387.html

They would need a lot of modification, though. It looks like the tube on the SS is longer, the stops are different.

Here's a video comparing GS160 and SS180 forks.
Probably easier to find it complete than the parts. There might be a shop that has one.

or possible to use a Rally/Sprint fork.

That poor frame! it has some major welding work done on the main channel. probably fixable.
Addicted
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '66 Allstate SF, '65 VBB, '66 180SS
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Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:39 am quote
To me, what makes the SS so nice is the motor.
Hooked
1978 P150X; 1982 P200e
Joined: 18 Jul 2010
Posts: 476
Location: Toronto
Sun Apr 04, 2021 2:41 pm quote
Trying to resurrect that SS frame is definitely honourable. The downside of your approach will be the cost of sourcing every part. And I mean everything (you only have a frame). You might want to consider a SS project that is more complete?

With regards to your engine question, yes you can fit an engine from another model. I put a P series engine into my SS (we can't all be as lucky as Moto to find a project with all parts, original engine included).

V.
Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 562
Location: San Francisco, CA
Sun Apr 04, 2021 4:00 pm quote
The ideal would be to find a Super Sport that is complete but has a wrecked frame. :)

I had a rally like that. It was all complete, but with rust damage.
Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 4800
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Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:22 pm quote
Tough sledding. I will be watching and wishing you luck!
Molto Verboso
Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
Joined: 16 Apr 2011
Posts: 1674
Location: Siam
Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:29 pm quote
SIP sells a fork, swing arm, brake drum/hub, and bearings that is a compete set. It is for a GS160 but could be modified to fit an SS180.

If you have money and time, then do it all original and find an engine (GS160 is much easier to find) and as many original parts as possible. An LML VBB engine does not do it justice. Maybe use that engine to ride it until you can find the right one.

The frame looks like itís in great condition.

Last edited by nomadinsiam on Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:40 pm; edited 1 time in total
Molto Verboso
Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
Joined: 16 Apr 2011
Posts: 1674
Location: Siam
Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:34 pm quote
[/url] https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/product/steering-column_62180000[url]

Hereís the SIP link.[/url]

[/img]

68D8878D-2273-4EFF-B98A-3C99ACB31AF3.jpeg

Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Mon Apr 05, 2021 7:42 am quote
Hmm a little pricey but complete...

I am definitely going to put an original motor in there at some point, but I DO want to ride it as well until I do.

First order of business is to have the frame checked out and any repairs completed. I would prefer a used SS fork, but I am glad to know there is a repop available at least.
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Mon Apr 05, 2021 1:38 pm quote
Off to the frame straightener!

1. Straighten frame
2. Correct prior weld job on tunnel
3. attach new horn cover

Then back home for me to penal beat until it's right.

f44e38c4c01deffd81372bbfd0464d4466ae355d-1.jpg

Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
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Mon Apr 05, 2021 3:04 pm quote
Looks like the steering column might not be a repop, but a reconditioned original. That would explain why it's it's so expensive.

SIP also sells this, which it bills as a universal fork mod (with a lot of your own modification).

https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/product/adapter-steering-column-zip-quartz-et2-steering-column-in-vespa-frame-top_13399331

This could work! The fork stops and position of the fender bolts are a bit different, but could definitely be modified.

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Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:15 pm quote
That is really cool, thank you!! I'll do this while looking for an original
Molto Verboso
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 1580
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Mon Apr 05, 2021 5:46 pm quote
BFA306 motor, that would move an SS along nicely.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8650
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 06, 2021 1:54 am quote
drop that motor in, snap in a rally fork and head set and cruise that shit till you collect all your parts.

otherwise you wind up like me with a grip of tin that you can't put in the wind because they're all taken apart or half finished projects.

go nuts hombre. it's your bike.

just don't call it an SS180 till it's got all the right bits.
(i'll allow for a pass on the fork, but not the motor or headset)

-g
Hooked
1966 Sprint 150 & px200 and a shed full o shit
Joined: 15 Aug 2016
Posts: 132
Location: New Zealand
Tue Apr 06, 2021 5:00 am quote
dsnyder586 wrote:
That is really cool, thank you!! I'll do this while looking for an original
Someone here will nab the body only?
https://www.trademe.co.nz/a/motors/motorbikes/motorbikes/scooters/listing/3043772502?member_hash=956385118efdded6d254e65f34ffa923706681e1944ddb0a3c&tm=email&et=46&mt=6C379C20-293A-45E8-9B2C-70FD8A3BACB5&bof=N90blTW7
Addicted
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Tue Apr 06, 2021 5:10 am quote
your heart is in the right place. simply not practical to piece together.

only good advice. hang and wait for wrecked or rusted complete bike to complete the project.
Molto Verboso
Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
Joined: 16 Apr 2011
Posts: 1674
Location: Siam
Tue Apr 06, 2021 6:55 am quote
That is a very weird bike. That engine needs to be in its rightful home.
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Tue Apr 06, 2021 7:24 am quote
Thanks Greasy, I was hoping you would chime in. This is exactly what I intend to do- get the frame right, get it up and running, then over time replace the parts and bring it back to its rightful original condition. I have no intention of buying another scoot to tear down and part out. Anybody got a rally fork assembly they want to part with?
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:51 am quote
Can someone take a picture of their ROUND SS180 headset? I want to make sure I get the correct one and all the pics are from the front I can find.
Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 562
Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu Apr 08, 2021 10:42 am quote
Here's one. It looks like the same headset that was on all American bikes in the 1970s, minus the chrome ring.

http://vesparestoration.blogspot.com/2007/09/diamond-in-rough.html

And what looks like a later one, with the chrome ring and hex badge. Almost a Rally.

https://www.flickr.com/photos/pjchmiel/3748702601/in/photostream/

speedo+close-1.jpg

right+side+view+nice.jpg

left+front+side.jpg

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Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:41 pm quote
Ok- so smaller clamshell with ONE hole for an indicator light, correct?
Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
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Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:25 pm quote
dsnyder586 wrote:
Ok- so smaller clamshell with ONE hole for an indicator light, correct?
Looks like it. The same headset that the 1974 Rally in the US had. Just the high beam indicator, but no ignition key.

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Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu Apr 08, 2021 3:35 pm quote
These might be not so hard to find. They were also used on Moto Guzzi, and maybe other Italian bikes.

Here's one one ebay for $43.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Moto-Guzzi-Italian-CEV-tail-light-mount-w-New-after-market-light-1970-vintage/265116007569?hash=item3dba253c91:g:wQwAAOSwGqZgbiUi

There are NOS lenses and repro ones, too.

Bar Italia has a repro for $20.
http://www.baritaliaclassics.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1302

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Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Thu Apr 08, 2021 4:48 pm quote
Ok- did the 68 with the round headlight have a tuna can or the other taillight?
bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x 2), 74 Primavera (x 2), 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5772
Location: So Cal
Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:00 pm quote
A US-market 1968 wouldíve had the tuna can tail light.

The brackets arenít hard to find as they were also used on P series scoots, but the round housings and lenses are scarce. The reproductions are close but slightly different from the originals. Havenít seen any NOS lenses for sale.

Last edited by SoCalGuy on Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Thu Apr 08, 2021 5:04 pm quote
Thanks!

On the hunt for a rally headset now.
Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 562
Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu Apr 08, 2021 6:09 pm quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
A US-market 1968 wouldíve had the tuna can tail light.

The brackets arenít hard to find as they were also used on P series scoots, but the round housings and lenses are scarce. The reproductions are close but slightly different from the originals. Havenít seen any NOS lenses for sale.
Is it this one? There were so many styles from that era.

The lens looks like CEV 127. There are a few of those NOS if you search.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/TAIL-LIGHT-OSSA-PIONEER-175-NOS-TAILLIGHT-OSSA-ENDURO-175-CEV-PILOT-OSSA-PARTS-/184374776913

s-l1600-1.jpg

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bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x 2), 74 Primavera (x 2), 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5772
Location: So Cal
Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:03 pm quote
Yep, thatís the one. Only $245.
Style Maven
74 50s x3 78 P200 x2 84 Cosa PK50XL2 58 AllState 68 Sprint 80 50special '66(?) Super125
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Location: seattle/athens
Thu Apr 08, 2021 7:56 pm quote
I have an original one of those complete and in in good condition from my 125 Super of the same year. It can be yours for the price of shipping PLUS what I'm paying FridayMatinee for a few bits he has to spare that I kinda want, less than a hundred bucks??? PM me...
Quote:
On the hunt for a rally headset now.
I think I may have you covered here too. Will check.


and remember...

The vintage vespa world is nothing but a massive scam.

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Style Maven
74 50s x3 78 P200 x2 84 Cosa PK50XL2 58 AllState 68 Sprint 80 50special '66(?) Super125
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Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:09 pm quote
I also have a DANDY all original never split lo mile Rally 180 motor available that still runs well, and you could use until you round up the right one if you want to ride it around anytime soon with at least some of that 180 style!

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Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
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Thu Apr 08, 2021 11:12 pm quote
V oodoo wrote:
I also have a DANDY all original never split lo mile Rally 180 motor available that still runs well, and you could use until you round up the right one if you want to ride it around anytime soon with at least some of that 180 style! 8)
This is amazing. :scoot:
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:18 am quote
PM Sent!
Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX
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Location: Hustletown, TX
Fri Apr 09, 2021 9:50 am quote
good god Terry...

That Rally 180 motor is gold.
Tuna can taillight too!
Enthusiast
Vespa 125 VMA, Vespa SS 180
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Posts: 74
Location: Minneapolis, MN
Fri Apr 09, 2021 12:47 pm quote
I think this is the headset you need. Can anyone confirm? I picked it up for $150 a few years ago. In the spirit of the thread, if you want it, it's yours for the $150 + shipping.

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Addicted
1981 P200E / 1979 P200E / 1974 Rally 200
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 562
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri Apr 09, 2021 2:57 pm quote
That's the one! This thread is so inspiring.

It looks like Piaggio put the same headsets on all US bikes for a few years.

This, I believe, bc of DOT regulations requiring motorcycles to have batteries and sealed-beam headlights, and this CEV model was DOT approved.

On the SS, looks like it had the underside covers, which are amazingly still being produced.

And the switch looks like this one, with the kill button, used on the DC model of SS180 and Rally.

In the photos I found, there were two types of speedo faces, I guess corresponding to whether the horn cover has square or hex badge.

Harley-CEV-NOS-6-volt-headlight-headlamp-Aermacchi-_57.jpg

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Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Fri Apr 09, 2021 3:20 pm quote
Love this!

The scoot is going to be white (considering chrome cowls/ mudguard MAYBE)

Which color for the speedo- black or white face?

Langolson, thank you for your generosity- I have a line on one now, but will hit you up if that falls through.

Still pining for a fork tho
Addicted
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
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Fri Apr 09, 2021 4:25 pm quote
dsnyder586 wrote:
Love this!

The scoot is going to be white (considering chrome cowls/ mudguard MAYBE)

Which color for the speedo- black or white face?

Langolson, thank you for your generosity- I have a line on one now, but will hit you up if that falls through.

Still pining for a fork tho
dsnyder586 wrote:
Love this!

The scoot is going to be white (considering chrome cowls/ mudguard MAYBE)

Which color for the speedo- black or white face?

Langolson, thank you for your generosity- I have a line on one now, but will hit you up if that falls through.

Still pining for a fork tho
I'm so glad to see You are getting this going, D! And look at this... the extremely reliable and generous Modern Vespa community, flying in with the assist! So proud of our MV community. 20+ years in storage, 20+ years in a barn before that, and now - finally making some progress toward getting on the road! Nice work

To clarify some questions about your build:
Your frame is a late '67, US spec; same as the "official" '68 US spec w/ round headlight - BUT, one major difference - your's has the earlier Square horncast badge. Where as the "official" 68 US spec frame has the Hex badge.

"officially speaking", the US spec round headlight SS180 was not released until '68; which at that time would have had the hexagon badge as all Vespas made the logo change at that time. There was some crossover and running changes in late '67, so there are some instances of the '67 frame being combined with the Round US headlight/tunacan taillight. Your '67 frame is one of these crossover/running scooters.

For your build to be correct as factory spec, it should have:
1. round headlight usa headset, CEV 10973 chrome ring, 1-gem, No-key
* all usa headsets were not the same, but did use the same size headlight Lango's headseat above is correct.
2. white face speedo w/ square piaggio logo
3. switch as shown above with kill switch
4. tuna can taillight, like Voodoo's (that is a score - jeez!! very kind V)
5. no battery
5. white paint
6. 4 screw horncast mount, not 3
I think that is most of the important '67 usa specific stuff. If I think of anything else, I'll let you know. Good luck!!

Oh hey, if anyone else has en extra Tunacan light floating around and need some extra space, GL needs ones too
Member
1968 VBB150
Joined: 04 Nov 2015
Posts: 39
Location: OC
Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:56 pm quote
Ok, does this look correct?

From Scooter Mercado, two piece horn cast- should I expect to do a bit of massaging to get it to fit correctly? Also, does anyone have side measurements top and bottom so I can see if I need to trim?

Horn 1.jpg

Horn 2.jpg

Addicted
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '66 Allstate SF, '65 VBB, '66 180SS
Joined: 27 Mar 2013
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Location: S.Salem, NY
Mon Apr 12, 2021 1:36 pm quote
That is mis-matched.. the lower section should continue the hard lines of the upper.
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