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Addicted
2019 BV 350
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 545
Location: Honolulu, HI
Sun Apr 06, 2008 10:32 pm quote
Install pistons like these and you can open your seat as shown in the YouTube video. Photos and video from COMET of the Italian forum.
http://www.piaggiomp3isti.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=106&whichpage=3

http://it.youtube.com/watch?v=TiV9rE_WETc

200846212116_IMG_0807 copia.jpg

Member
'07 Piaggio MP3
Joined: 15 Mar 2008
Posts: 46
Location: Chino, CA
Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:27 am quote
That is a very cool idea!
Hooked
MP3 500
Joined: 09 Aug 2007
Posts: 114
Location: South Beach, FL
Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:57 am quote
That's awesome...Thanks for the weekend project!

To make life simpler - anyone read Italian and know what size/description of Piston that is? I assume they're drilled in?
Enthusiast
Once MP3 250, Now Fuoco 500.
Joined: 29 Jan 2008
Posts: 90
Location: Israel
Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:25 am quote
Great idea - I could use it to get rid of the cat who like my fuoco seat
Hooked
Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 269
Location: Central NJ
Tue Apr 15, 2008 4:19 am quote
Sweet!
Hooked
MP3 250, BMW R1150GS, F650GS, SACHS Madass
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 104
Location: Boston
Tue Apr 15, 2008 9:33 am quote
Pop Up Seat
Great idea. I wonder if one arm would do it vice three? I'm going to Home Depot and Lowes to see what I can find.
Hooked
Vino Classic & Black 500
Joined: 18 Jan 2008
Posts: 151
Location: Boston, MA
Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:12 am quote
this this site, they have pretty much everything you can think off... hell you build your own MP3 with the parts you find here.

www.mcmaster.com

search air spring
Hooked
Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 269
Location: Central NJ
Wed Apr 16, 2008 5:00 am quote
Good site. Thanks.

Try putting in "gas strut" as your search. You'll come up with an explanation of how it works and how to determine what size to get.
Addicted
MP3 500
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Posts: 556
Location: St. Augustine, Florida
Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:09 pm quote
So anyone have any data on the weight of the 500's seat?
Hooked
Roughhouse
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 162
Location: SoCal
Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:39 pm quote
Anyone complete this project yet?
Molto Verboso
MP3 250
Joined: 07 Jun 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: San Diego
Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:49 pm quote
I love nurses...But this one was Tuff....

louisefletcher.jpg

Hooked
Roughhouse
Joined: 15 Jul 2007
Posts: 162
Location: SoCal
Wed Apr 23, 2008 7:55 pm quote
I don't know that one...
Molto Verboso
MP3 250
Joined: 07 Jun 2007
Posts: 1135
Location: San Diego
Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:02 pm quote
She was no American Idol..I can tell you that...Well..Nurse Laura you look 2 be 19 so you probably didn't see the movie..

Last edited by ufo on Sun May 11, 2008 8:11 pm; edited 1 time in total
Ossessionato
Baart-less
Joined: 05 Mar 2006
Posts: 4499
Location: 5658'34.49"N x 11129'38.40"W
Wed Apr 23, 2008 8:28 pm quote
ufo wrote:
I love nurses...But this one was Tuff....
Louise Fletcher as Nurse Ratched from One Flew Over The Cuckoos Nest.

Dave
Member
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 14
Location: Singapore
Wed Apr 23, 2008 10:38 pm quote
You won't wanna meet this one:

Hooked
MP3
Joined: 28 Apr 2008
Posts: 105
Location: SAN DIEGO
Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:25 pm quote
Emtwo wrote:
So anyone have any data on the weight of the 500's seat?
The seat weighs approximately 5 lbs (with the seat cover stuffed inside it's compartment). I used my portable luggage scale to measure.

I have as SX Appeal Pak Rest Case w/Backrest on my seat, so it increases the total weight to 10 lbs.

I've been thinking hard about doing this modification myself.
Hooked
Joined: 20 Aug 2007
Posts: 269
Location: Central NJ
Mon Apr 28, 2008 3:40 pm quote
But you'll have to consider not just the weight of the seat but the total weight at angle as it is lifted up.

To anyone who does this mod, please take pics as you go along. Am sure many on this board will be interested.
Hooked
MP3
Joined: 28 Apr 2008
Posts: 105
Location: SAN DIEGO
Mon Apr 28, 2008 6:01 pm quote
You're right about angles.

What I did was open the seat and then hook the luggage scale to the locking loop of the seat and slowly lifted the seat from the lowest position with the luggage scale attaches to the highest point the seat attains.

The scale is capable of measuring maximum weight, so the maximum is recorded was 5 lbs.

Not exactly the best science, but it's better than nothing for now.
Hooked
Honda Ruckus - MP3 250 - Yamaha Morphous - Honda Elite 250
Joined: 24 May 2008
Posts: 289
Location: Bay Area
Sun May 25, 2008 9:12 pm quote
Has anyone found struts that work for our application? There are a couple of hood struts on ebay for about $40 shipped...
Hooked
mp3 500 919, CR500(s), American Foxhound
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 156
Location: Jersey
Mon May 26, 2008 8:42 am quote
HI!

Not so sure about how the center one will hold up when you cram an 18-pack in there and sit on the seat to make it latch tho
Hooked
Piaggio MP3/250
Joined: 23 Jul 2007
Posts: 456
Location: Columbia, Missouri USA!
Mon May 26, 2008 10:46 am quote
Cool ejection sheet mod!
Addicted
MP3 500
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Posts: 556
Location: St. Augustine, Florida
Mon May 26, 2008 10:49 am quote
Yeh, only no one seems to know where to get those particular gas springs. The shortest one I've been able to find without a special order is about 8-inches. Also, the under seat area is different for the 500, so that exact arrangement won't work for me.
Hooked
Vespa GTS 250 + Vespa SS 180
Joined: 07 Feb 2008
Posts: 293
Location: Rome - Italy
Tue Jun 17, 2008 3:00 pm quote
As written in the italian forum, you find them locally in Italy in a shop called LeroyMerlin.

Have to try this myself; hope the saddle of the GTS is lighter than the MP3 one, so that i can go with only 2 "shocks"...
Hooked
MP3 400
Joined: 30 May 2008
Posts: 100
Location: Alberta, Canada
Tue Jun 17, 2008 9:27 pm quote
Any idea how the hinge will hold up to the added pressure being pushed / forced upwards? or the wear and tear or the latch mechanism? Seems like more upwards force then either is accustomed to...?
Addicted
2019 BV 350
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 545
Location: Honolulu, HI
Mon Sep 01, 2008 4:20 pm quote
Here is an installation with just two pistons. Has anyone on our forum done this yet?

http://www.piaggiomp3isti.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=106&whichpage=4

20085515169_Immag097p.jpg

Member
MP3 500
Joined: 22 Aug 2008
Posts: 34
Location: pennsylvania
Tue Sep 02, 2008 7:40 am quote
What a neat idea! On the 500 a two piston system would have to be used since the battery cover completely fills the front end of the space precluding a center piston attachment.

Also a consideration for me would be the fact that my HJC modular helmet fits EXACTLY in one spot with one PRECISE orientation with NO room to spare in order to get the seat closed. Any hardware extending to the rear more that 6 inches back from the battery cover might prevent me from keeping my helmet there.
Hooked
Piaggio MP3 400
Joined: 08 Aug 2008
Posts: 383
Location: Concord, CA
Thu Sep 04, 2008 10:58 am quote
I went to mcmasters.com after speaking with Easy Lift. Of course clever person already posted mcmasters.com. I just didn't know what you called these things. Once you get to mcmasters.com you look under lift supports and there are a bunch to choose from. I ordered 2 of the 9.65" 15 lb of force steel gas springs. They told me that it was likely that I only needed one. But I ordered 2 for balance. They will be here on Monday.

Will let you know how it goes.

Dale
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21489
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Thu Sep 04, 2008 11:00 am quote
dccappy wrote:
I went to mcmasters.com after speaking with Easy Lift. Of course clever person already posted mcmasters.com. I just didn't know what you called these things. Once you get to mcmasters.com you look under lift supports and there are a bunch to choose from. I ordered 2 of the 9.65" 15 lb of force steel gas springs. They told me that it was likely that I only needed one. But I ordered 2 for balance. They will be here on Monday.

Will let you know how it goes.

Dale
Dale please post pics along the way during the install and everything thanks
Member
2009 MP3 500
Joined: 15 Aug 2008
Posts: 11
Location: Upland, CA
Thu Sep 04, 2008 3:26 pm quote
I worked for mcmaster for 13 years. They do have everything you will ever need, if you know enough about mechanics to know what you need (I however do not).
Member
79 Shovelhead 99 Speed Triple 01 Dual Sport 07 LXV
Joined: 05 Jul 2008
Posts: 5
Location: Dallas Tx
Fri Sep 05, 2008 3:24 pm quote
Very interesting indeed.
Hooked
Piaggio MP3 400
Joined: 08 Aug 2008
Posts: 383
Location: Concord, CA
Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:38 pm quote
Update
I have installed onto my 250 two pistons with 15 lbs of force each. When I release the latch nothing happens. I still need to lift the seat to about 8 inches above the top of the bike and from there it lifts on its own. The placement of the pistons is like the picture of the bike with 2 which looks like a 500. The bike with the pop-up is a 400.

You have to be careful in the placement of the piston as if the angle is too much you will not be able to close the seat. So to get a picture of that you need to think if the seat is too close to the handle bars then the angle is too great. The angle needs to be less than 90 degrees when measuring from the right hand side facing you to the piston. You could move it down further on the bike but then when you attach the piston to the seat it gets in the way more. Even if you did that I do not believe you will get the lift you need to open fully on its own. I think the only way to do this is with a 3rd piston. There needs to be enough lift until the other 2 pistons can do their thing.

I cannot tell from the video or the picture the placement on the bike of the middle piston. I can see where it is on the seat. Also I would be interested to know what is under the seat exactly? I am assuming it is the gas tank and I am not all fired up to put screws there. I am not all that confident putting screws in the wall of the nose of the storage compartment.

I need to think a bit as to what to do next. Suggestions are welcome.

Dale
Enthusiast
MP3 400
Joined: 08 Jul 2008
Posts: 62
Location: Tremont, Illinois
Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:06 am quote
I was wondering if anyone has considered a torsion spring at the hinge? Similar to what one might find on a quality clipboard but in reverse ... pressing against the spring to close the lid. Just a thought. It might have enough push to get the pistons actuated.
Hooked
MP3 500
Joined: 11 Jun 2008
Posts: 218
Location: West Chester, PA
Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:04 am quote
I can't wait to implement this mod. I mean, it's just so hard lifting the seat up when I want something. I can't believe Piaggio designed it that way...

Ossessionato
2009 BV500
Joined: 04 Aug 2008
Posts: 2087
Location: Austin, TX
Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:12 am quote
One picture says it all!

Enthusiast
MP3 400
Joined: 08 Jul 2008
Posts: 62
Location: Tremont, Illinois
Tue Sep 09, 2008 10:04 am quote
Tsk, Tsk ... One must acknowledge the engineering challenge to appreciate why NASA invented a pressurized pen to work in space and the USSR just used a pencil.
Hooked
Puch SRA150, MP3 400, Moto Guzzi 750 Nevada, BMW K75S
Joined: 22 Jul 2008
Posts: 264
Location: Glendale AZ (was Albury NSW)
Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:25 pm quote
Re: Update
dccappy wrote:
I need to think a bit as to what to do next. Suggestions are welcome.

Dale
Can you provide photos of:

1) Your hardware

2) Your installation.

The trick is to have the fixed frame mount (the one on the bodywork) as low as possible on the bodywork, while the mounts on the seat should be as high as possible.

I'll clarify.

When I say "as high as possible on the seat frame" I am referring to when the seat is closed. You need to choose this mounting point on the seat so that the strut is as close to closed as possible when the seat is down - this gives it maximum lift.

When viewed from the side, if the seat was transparent, the front mount, fixed to the bodywork, must be lower than the rear mount, fixed to the underside of the seat. This angulation is necessary to get the lifting motion working. The greater the angle you can achieve in the closed position, the better the seat will open.

If you need a drawing, say so.

Cheers

Trevor G

PS You should also be able to buy struts with a much greater lifting force, but the chief thing is the angulation when closed.
Hooked
Piaggio MP3 400
Joined: 08 Aug 2008
Posts: 383
Location: Concord, CA
Wed Sep 10, 2008 8:02 am quote
I will post photos and all items used with their parts numbers when I finish. I want it to work before posting.

I know exactly what you mean about the angle. But the pistons on the sides lay flat when the seat is closed. So when the latch releases the pistons are still flat (horizontal) and thus their force has no effect in lifting (vertical motion) the seat. That is why you need a third piston in the middle to achieve the angle the other 2 pistons need to do their job. I can set the third piston lower in the seat storage compartment so that when the seat closes it will not be flat and will want to open as soon as the latch is released. With all that in mind you still need to be aware of how much room the third piston takes up. I still need to be able to stow my helmet under the seat (modular doesn't fit in the trunk).

I will be calling McMasters after this post to discuss the amount of force needed for the 3rd piston. I think 15 lbs of force for the 2 side pistons is just fine. But I think I may need more than that for the third middle piston. I want the lift to practically jump so the seat doesn't have time to relatch but I still want to be able to close the seat. The 2 side pistons should prevent the seat from launching due to the force of the middle piston.

So having written all of this of course leads me to another possibility which is you may need only the piston in the middle of the seat compartment and not the 2 on the sides. Since I have already installed the 2 pistons on the sides I will leave them.

Thank you for your post. It is always good to bounce ideas off one another and to get input from wiser, more experienced minds.

Dale
Hooked
Puch SRA150, MP3 400, Moto Guzzi 750 Nevada, BMW K75S
Joined: 22 Jul 2008
Posts: 264
Location: Glendale AZ (was Albury NSW)
Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:07 am quote
dccappy wrote:
I know exactly what you mean about the angle. But the pistons on the sides lay flat when the seat is closed.
And from looking at the pic at the top of this thread:

1) The brackets on the seat should be reversed so that the leverage point is higher, not lower as positioned in the pic. How is yours mounted?

2) The lower mounts should be somewhat to the rear of the seat hinge to aid leverage - 1 to 2" to the rear of the seat hinge, at least.

All the best

Trevor G
Hooked
Piaggio MP3 400
Joined: 08 Aug 2008
Posts: 383
Location: Concord, CA
Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:06 am quote
Got it to work - but.... Isn't there always a but. The gas springs that I ordered from McMasters came yesterday. I positioned one bracket low in the seat compartment and the appropriate height on the seat. It didn't work. It wouldn't close - the compartment that houses the gas charged stuff was a lot longer than the rod. So when I tried to close it the rod wasn't long enough to handle the angle (less than 90 degrees). I had just assumed that the springs would be the same compartment to rod ratio as the 2 I ordered before (even though this one was longer). My husband ran down to AutoZone and found a couple of gas springs where the rod was nearly the length of the gas compartment. We used the brackets that were installed already just for testing purposes (the new springs are ball mounts but they fit on the eyelet brackets). The gas springs from Auto Zone have a lot more force than the ones I ordered from McMasters so I was a little worried that the brackets I had installed wouldn't hold in place because of the great force. The brackets held and the seat popped right up.

So the but parts. I think the force on the middle spring is too great. The latch that holds the seat is very tight. Since I still don't have my black key (a bummer story) I have to release the latch through the pet carrier. When I release the latch I have to push it pretty hard so I am not sure that the remote key will have what it takes to release the latch. When I push the seat back down you really have to make sure it latches as it just wants to come back up. As an adult I was able to give it a good shove and get it latched. But my 10 year old could not. All of this makes me think the force is too great. What I need is the same types of gas springs that are on the sides of my seat with different ends. I can get different forces on those springs and thus choose one that is the least amount of force but works.

Now having written all of that you wouldn't think that I was happy with it. I am very happy. Without the remote key I have to release manually with one hand and try to pull the seat up with the other - PITA. Now I don't have to. It is much easier. As I don't have the remote key I cannot verify that it will release the latch that way (it is pretty tight). I am just being a perfectionist. If you want pictures of what I have done so far I will take them. But I consider this unfinished as I want to get the right gas springs.

Dale
Addicted
MP3 500
Joined: 17 Mar 2008
Posts: 556
Location: St. Augustine, Florida
Sun Sep 14, 2008 8:46 am quote
We need pictures!!!

Oh, and part numbers too
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