De-restrict a LX50?
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Member
S50 / LXS 50/ GL 150
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
Location: Sweden
Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:24 pm quote
Andyt wrote:
Im in australia. Its a 17.5mm dellorto carb. i had read they had a 57 too but when i took the carb apart the main jet had 53 written on it. Maybe they derestrict the exhaust more severely here by having a larger resonator pipe or something
Most peculiar it was a 53. Eyers Rock isn't the coldest place nor is Melbourne so it must run even hotter than a 57 in here Sweden and mine smelled of plastic before i refitted it and got 60km/h (variator and 57-64 or 66 they weren't sure)
Maybe my dealer's full of shit. I prefer not getting my hands dirty on my "daily driver".. Doing that usually gets me into trouble and i end up with boxes of stuff that would be cool if it worked - instead of a daily driver.
Hence i pay for these retards to do it. They however insisted the service manual stated 57 for Sweden and recommendation for de-restricing was 64 or 66. But the guy wasn't sure what was fitted onto mine.

When I got the bike back it took me an hour to realize there was gasoline sprayed out from the exhaust. To tired to do the imperial math but it was between 1.2 and 1.4L/ 10km
That's more than a Volvo SUV and more than a Porsche 911.

They wouldn't help me out and I just got too tired to even think about it.
Spoke to a 15year old guy on a Swedish forum and he told me to check out how much I could do with the screw that sets the mixture.
I turned it not 0.5, not 1 but SEVEN revolutions counter clockwise.
Ended up doing around 0.4/10km and runs like a charm at 60km/h (on the speedometer that is)


From the photo I posted here of the genital looking pipe - I've been told by a couple of hot rod 15yr olds (who are the big clientel in Sweden and the ones who do the most de-restrictions and both these guys ride Gileras at 120km/h) that it generates as much air resistance as a plug does.
I've got a friend who's great with a blowtorch and has done exhausts in the past. Been looking to borrow a blowtorch now for two weeks.

I'd go easy on the jet not awoiding the same mistake the "wiz" at the shop did with mine with gasoline spraying from the exhaust and i don't think my compensation is a good one in the long run.
Haven't checked the sparkplug but it runs well so..
I had a piece of licorice before de restricting it and with the big jet i had a an even more licorice like sparkplug.


These engines are built built to last. Not much compression and a lot of tolerance. Piaggios old agenda from the 50s is still going on today.
The servicemanual states around 10:1 compression rate and compression is not the first thing to focus on.

Buy a pretty plain malossi 50cc cylinder and i'd bet you get twice the power.
I'm a bit concered with the legal matters regarding 50/70cc.
There is no Vespa 70S. In Sweden it would be a higher penalty than riding a Suzuki Hayabusa without a licence.

You buy a Vespa cause it's good looking, discreat.
You buy a Gilera or an Aprilia if you want to look like a Ninja turtle who's lost his shell and grown some more fingers.

It's a shame there's not nearly as many options for Vespa owners.

I usually look at http://www.sip-scootershop.com/ for parts.
There's an english company that builds and sells exhausts for LX scooters. Can't remember the name of the company at this time but i'll post it at request.
These are made for racing and that means racing with capital letters.
They look good but they probably sound like a ninja turtle looking for trouble with the law - and the fuel return and catalys is of course not something in use. It's just raw power matched for a cylinder.
But if you wanna go cowboy all the way that's the way to go.
Member
S50 / LXS 50/ GL 150
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
Location: Sweden
Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:34 pm quote
Re: 50cc scooter very fast
sts70004 wrote:
My hang gliding instructor had a 50cc honda scooter when he lived in Hawaii. He had it for about 2 days before he decided it needed more speed. He was telling me about it when we were workin on my variator. It went 30mph when he started, and it could do 80 by the time he was done. He got the compression ratio to 20:1... The Honda Engine that it had you could remove the head shims to increase the compression. I wonder if theres something similar you could do on the Vespa's 50cc engine, or if it would require milling the heads.
This is a great thought but with the prices on cylinder kits it a lot of work.
So much easier just buying a malossi 50cc and the bike will still match the "registration card"

My mechanic at my local dealer - who due to the current state of the market all of a sudden spent 45minutes on the phone (guess he had a call from the boss cause there were so many complaints)

Anyway the mechanic swears the service manual states "Around 10:1"

But Piaggios Vespa engines are built to last for 40 years..
Must be some old agenda from the 50's that's still the bill of quality when they build a bike that says Vespa.
Together with Leonardo da Vinci, Ferrari and pizza it's the pride and national symbol so my guess is they are very concerned not to get a bad rep for a italian made gentlemens scooter with a bearing the Vespa name.
Member
S50 / LXS 50/ GL 150
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
Location: Sweden
Thu Nov 20, 2008 11:08 pm quote
Look what i found
http://www.scooterwest.com/item_detail/Workshop-manual-LX50/69/

Still no sportexhausts.. some tell me removing the air restriction will make no difference but cutting the blindpipe will.
Another guy who's done a lot of work on scooters (every single one except piaggio) sayed it made very little diffence cutting the blindpipe on a yamaha.
The expansion chamber in the exhaust was still too small he sayed.

https://www.pmtuning.co.uk this company a dealer claimed manufactured racing exhausts but they didn't come cheap.

Anybody got a Vespa LXS 50 (S50 in Europe) like me?

Haven't looked at the CDI unit since I usually find time after four o'clock (living in Sweden this means it's pitch black in november). Unfortunately no garage.

In the LX50 there is a plug in the port of the pipe but there's not supposed to be one in the LXS/S 50 according to the dealer.
Anybody checked on that?

I hate working outside in the dark at 2 degrees celsius.
Member
S50 / LXS 50/ GL 150
Joined: 13 Oct 2008
Posts: 34
Location: Sweden
Sun Nov 30, 2008 11:32 pm quote
Anyone tried cutting their exhaust open and having a look?

I wish I had a blowcutter.

I get the feeling they have one restrictiondesign where they put with a big chunk of crap inside the expansion chamber just to slow you down.


I want my sleeper.
Enthusiast
2003 ET4
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 96
Location: Chicago
Sun Apr 05, 2009 7:11 pm quote
I dunno if anyone has seen this page, but it outlines derestricting a 50cc engine. Not a vespa, but it looks as though some of these steps can apply.

http://www.sc-ooter.50megs.com/derestriction.htm
Ossessionato
'09 S50, '79 V50
Joined: 09 Mar 2009
Posts: 2105
Location: Heidelberg, Germany
Mon Apr 06, 2009 4:06 am quote
Re: Look what i found
hudman wrote:
Anybody got a Vespa LXS 50 (S50 in Europe) like me?

Me! I have a 2T S50, and am following this thread with great interest. I don't necessarily want to hot-rod the scooter at the moment (70cc cylinders and big-bore exhausts are out, currently) but what I would really like to do is de-restrict the bike so it's just a normal, non-strangled 50cc Vespa, and see how it goes. If it can do around 70 kph (instead of 49 now ) then I will be satisfied.

I just need to know exactly what to do before taking my new ride apart (or getting the dealer to do it)
Molto Verboso
Joined: 30 Nov 2007
Posts: 1031

Wed Apr 08, 2009 12:57 am quote
Euro3 machines have a 53 as standard, youll want anything from a 60 to a 64 once derestricted, try a 60 but do a plug chop and check its ok...
Enthusiast
2003 ET4
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 96
Location: Chicago
Wed Apr 08, 2009 4:01 pm quote
Does anyone know what size jet to go with if i'm derestricting an lx50 4t from North America?
Molto Verboso
63 GL 150, 05 Typhoon, 09 Beo 200
Joined: 20 Jan 2007
Posts: 1482
Location: Grand Pothole Rapids, Michigan
Wed Apr 08, 2009 11:26 pm quote
2T Typhoon in the US, had a 60 that was stock...no restriction CDI, and the only restrictor was a round brass colored holy disk between the carb and the air box
It went 41-43mph stock....
Andyt wrote:
Im in australia. Its a 17.5mm dellorto carb. i had read they had a 57 too but when i took the carb apart the main jet had 53 written on it. Maybe they derestrict the exhaust more severely here by having a larger resonator pipe or something
Enthusiast
2003 ET4
Joined: 26 Jun 2008
Posts: 96
Location: Chicago
Fri Apr 10, 2009 4:42 am quote
Ok, so I took my lx50 to my dealer to inquire about de-restricting and the guy told me that US 4t lx50's are not restricted. I kind of believe it because everyone else tends to get their scoots to around 65 km/h after derestricting.

I generally get between 65 to 70 km/h already. Does anyone else know about US lx50s not being restricted?
Lurker
Vespa ET2
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 3
Location: Poland
Thu Jul 30, 2009 11:10 pm quote
Well hi there from Poland,



Piaggio restricts their 50cc scooters following way:

1. exhaust:
a. just on the beginning of the exhaust pipe, after cylinder there is a small funnel like piece of metal. cut it out or lever out with a small crowbar.
b. the piece of metal pipe welded to the exhaust - blind gut - cut it out about 2-3cm above joining to the main pipe, hammer to close, and weld tight

2. variator: there is a vario ring between variator plates, remove it.

3. golden plate between carburator and air filter, remove air filter, and air filter box, carefully remove it. watch out that dirt doesn't get inside of the carbo.

4. derestricted Dellorto 17,5 PHVA carburator jet setup: main jet 60-65, idle jet 34 (mine was 32), change needle from A22 to A7 (more conical).

AFAIK there is no CDI restriction on Vespa scooters.

These are things I have done on my scoot. Technically the same engine as LX 50, LXS 50, S50.

Enjoy.

Lurker
2006 LX-50
Joined: 10 Jul 2009
Posts: 3
Location: Chicago
Thu Aug 06, 2009 12:09 pm quote
Not sure, but I think it might vary depending on year of scooter etc. But, I'm no expert or mechanic either. From the manual from Piaggio (UK) published in 2006, it states 3 things are required

1. Make a 3mm deep cut with a hacksaw in the position shown. Then fill the slot with silicon. (CDI)
2. Remove the spacer washer between the front pulley halves. (Variator)
3. Fit carburettor main jet size #78. Part number CM 142103

The restriction is the same on all 50cc four stroke models including the LX 50 4t, Fly 50 4t
and Zip 50 4t (China).
The main restriction on the 50 cc four stroke engine is electronic. There is no restriction in
the exhaust pipe.

My question is does the fuel/air filter need to be adjusted once the jet is changed. How is this done?

Secondly, I'm trying to remove the transmission cover. Does the kickstart and sector gears need to be removed to take off the transmission cover? The manual states the sector gear is spring load, so I prefer not to mess with it if I don't have to.
Lurker
Vespa ET2
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 3
Location: Poland
Fri Aug 07, 2009 10:46 am quote
Quote:
My question is does the fuel/air filter need to be adjusted once the jet is changed. How is this done?

Secondly, I'm trying to remove the transmission cover. Does the kickstart and sector gears need to be removed to take off the transmission cover? The manual states the sector gear is spring load, so I prefer not to mess with it if I don't have to.
1. Fitting bigger jet always require adjusting other components: air filter is most important in them. Look for some restriction in air supply other wise You may be requiired to made additional hole in the air filter box (before the filter). Just go through all steps to adjust a carburateur.

2. You don't need to remove kickstarter lever before removing the transmissioncover. Remove 2 main screws holding the air filter to the engine block. Then unscrew all 13 screws around the cover. The cover sits very tight. You may help yourself to remove it by gently taping the cover with plastic or rubber hammer.
To unscrew the variator fan you need either a special tool from Buzzetti or Piaggio. It looks like this:
[img]http://www.easyparts.nl/partpics/01385580_hi.jpg♦[/img] You can get it at e.g. http://easyparts.nl/

Some manuals say you can unscrew the disc by the means of pneumatic key but it may do harm your crankshaft. I have seen damaged crankshafts from using pneumatic key.
So unscrew, remove the fan disc, remove the ring, put back again. Use new screw, secure it with Loctite or similiar screw lock (You don't want the screw to fly around inside your transmission cover and tighten in 2 steps with torque control key - 40-44nM (if I remember clearly).
Re-assembly. Enjoy.

Further questions are welcome.

Al
Lurker
Vespa ET2
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 3
Location: Poland
Sat Aug 08, 2009 12:11 am quote
I have found good manual in English about carburateur tuning:

http://justkdx.dirtrider.net/printcarbtuning.html

Cheers,

Alex
Lurker
Joined: 26 Aug 2009
Posts: 1
Location: UK
Wed Aug 26, 2009 7:15 am quote
I have a Vespa Lx 50 2 stroke de-restricted goes around 42 mph which is not fast enough.Thinking about getting a 70cc kit and variator would hope it would go 55 mph then anyone added a 70 cc kit and variator and if so how fast does your bike go.

Thanks
Banned
PX
Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Posts: 109
Location: London
Thu Nov 26, 2009 2:07 am quote
I also have a Lx50 2T have to say, i have a rant! I'm still running it in and yesterday i removed the variator ring!
Sorry i didn't do it earlier because the engine was revving it's guts out to reach 30mph! now the engine is spinning slower at 30mph. I'm not really interested in de-restricting as such, just want to look after it.

Variator ring - not very good for running in!!!

How can they expect anyone to ride at 20mph
Lurker
Joined: 17 Mar 2010
Posts: 4

Wed Mar 17, 2010 5:16 pm quote
Does anybody know if the CDI mod applies to a 06 Piaggio Fly 50 with the lx50 4t engine? If it does which wire gets cut?
Member
TX50 50cc 4V
Joined: 21 Jun 2010
Posts: 5
Location: Netherlands
Tue Jun 29, 2010 3:24 am quote
4t 4v
carters2 wrote:
Does anybody know if the CDI mod applies to a 06 Piaggio Fly 50 with the lx50 4t engine? If it does which wire gets cut?
Is your engine the 4-valve type? My Lx50 4t 4v has a totaly different CDI than the one shown here. My CDI is separate from the HV coil, and it has a more connections, as temperature sensors and carburattor solenoid control.
So, if yor LX50 is like mine, no way you can use the cutting methode as described here. And no, I don't know how to derestrict it
Lurker
LX50
Joined: 15 Jan 2011
Posts: 1
Location: Phoenix
Sat Jan 15, 2011 5:56 pm quote
How To Derestrict LX50
For all those who have been derestricted...How did you make the front pulley stay while loosening the bolt to get to the variator??? I tried using one of those wrap wrench thing, but didn't work for me. Any tricks?
Scooter Pimp
--------'89 Vespa PX125------- -----'76 Vespa Primavera----- -------'99 Vespa ET4 125------
Joined: 22 Sep 2010
Posts: 2762
Location: Stoke on Trent - Staffordshire - England
Sun Jan 16, 2011 2:18 pm quote
Re: How To Derestrict LX50
Motochi wrote:
For all those who have been derestricted...How did you make the front pulley stay while loosening the bolt to get to the variator??? I tried using one of those wrap wrench thing, but didn't work for me. Any tricks?
.

To remove the washer on the variator - carefully lock the teeth of it with a longish strong screwdriver so the handle touches the floor and locks the variator from moving

Fabio

.
Moderaptor
2xGP800, Fuoco, X9 500 Evo, The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug), 'Olive' (GT200) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 31140
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Sun Jan 16, 2011 3:07 pm quote
I thought the US ones weren't restricted. (and I do note the age of the original post...)
Banned
PX
Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Posts: 109
Location: London
Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:42 am quote
Finally got around to playing with the carb today, ordered a 56main jet and put it in: runs far too rich! The engine bogs at 3/4 throttle. Am i supposed to change the needle aswell?

I really dont understand why it won't run without the airfilter even when i is this rich.

Main jet was 53 now 56
Needle a22
Pilot 51

Removed the exhaust and found no restrictions. Although i did bung a pipe which goes the drivebelt box: junk!
Banned
PX
Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Posts: 109
Location: London
Wed Mar 09, 2011 8:19 am quote
cheekythomas wrote:
If its a 2t then youll need to remove the exhaust restriction, then fit a larger main jet to stop it running lean, then remove the variator washer.

I would also advise removing the EGR pipework and blocking off the valve to prevent it melting from increased gas flow.
I have a 2t and can verify: there no restricter in the exhaust, the 53 main jet already bogs slightly at WOT and there is no EGR valve. (UK)
Member
2008 LX 50 4T 2V
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:06 pm quote
LX 50
So, I'm sure everyone with the LX50 2 Valve engine has read the Piaggio 50cc 4 Stroke Restriction document. Today I finally wanted to see if this applies to US scooters. I removed the cover on the side of the transmission to gain access to the variator/clutch/belt. Their is no spacer in the front pulley halves. I assumed that this would be the case considering the Vespa USA website states 39mph and I've done around 40mph on flat ground. So, I'm sure everyone is wondering about the CDI and carb jet. I removed the bowl from the carb to find a 75 main jet, which is not the unrestricted size of 78. So, on that note. I have another CDI coming and a 78 jet. Finding the 78 jet won't work with the part # in the bulletin. You have to do a search for a Keihin CVK carb jet via the jet chart from keihin usa's website. This number is 99101 393 with the jet size being a 78. The CDI cut I haven't done, because I haven't gotten the larger jet yet. I bet that the CDI is limiting the rpms, just due to the fact that the motor really doesn't even sound like it revs at all. To confirm that the CDI cut actually does something, I plan on getting a Tiny Tac to see the before and after. I'll post an update when I get all this stuff, which should be in about 2 weeks.
Banned
PX
Joined: 23 Nov 2009
Posts: 109
Location: London
Wed Mar 09, 2011 11:03 pm quote
Hitting an ignition rev limiter is very noticable when the engine plumets and the exhaust has no sound. Feeling for a lean mixture at WOT is less conclusive on these small engines unless the engine either can't reach the top of its powerband or bogs, due to overfueling caused by a main jet that is too big.
Member
2008 LX 50 4T 2V
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:45 pm quote
I'm not %100 sure that the restriction is a 'rev limiter' as it may be a different ignition curve, possibly with the advance of the timing or something along those lines, but also a little bit more peak RPM. Timing advance would merit a larger main jet to keep the engine cool. I'll just have to wait and see when I get the parts. I'm getting the second CDI, just so I have the original if for some reason nothing happens or it ruins the CDI? Who knows. I've yet to find someone who has actually done what the document says.

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Member
2008 LX 50 4T 2V
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Sun Mar 20, 2011 1:28 pm quote
so, no ring in the variator. i got the second CDI and cut it where indicated. there was no change in the rpm's. i'm waiting on the arrival of the 78 jet to see if that gives the bike a little more oomph.
Molto Verboso
Yamaha TMAX 500 / Vespa 50 Special '71 / Vespa LX 50 4-stroke / Vespa 150 Sprint V '78 / Vespa GTS 250ie 'Vintage Red'
Joined: 20 May 2008
Posts: 1327
Location: Netherlands, Europe
Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:11 pm quote
Please keep this post clear on the diffence for 2- and 4-stroke derestricting

On my 4 stroke just 2 things that could done: CDI cut and remove variator ring.

'Make a saw cut at 22 mm. from the bottom, 3 mm deep.'

Also see: how do you derestrict am et4?

derestrict.jpg

Member
2008 LX 50 4T 2V
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Sun Mar 20, 2011 2:56 pm quote
the united states didn't get the 2 stroke lx50. the 4 stroke lx50 in the usa does not have a ring in the variator or any type of ignition restriction. if you read the tech document...it says that you should upget to a 78 jet. my us lx50 had a 75 jet in it. so, on that note. in the usa, i think the only restriction is a smaller jet...most likely to lower emissions. leaners cleaner ... richers quicker.
Member
vespa lx50
Joined: 26 Sep 2010
Posts: 5
Location: SCS
Fri Apr 29, 2011 11:37 am quote
szmwpqvz wrote:
the united states didn't get the 2 stroke lx50. the 4 stroke lx50 in the usa does not have a ring in the variator or any type of ignition restriction. if you read the tech document...it says that you should upget to a 78 jet. my us lx50 had a 75 jet in it. so, on that note. in the usa, i think the only restriction is a smaller jet...most likely to lower emissions. leaners cleaner ... richers quicker.
did u upgrade to the 78? and if u did, what is the difference
Member
2008 LX 50 4T 2V
Joined: 09 Mar 2011
Posts: 6
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Sun May 01, 2011 7:44 am quote
LX 50 Conclusion.
So...
Bought the extra CDI, cut it where indicated, no change. Monitored the rpms with a tach. Top speed was the same.

Removed transmission side cover to find no variator ring.

Removed carb to find a 75 main jet, ordered the Piaggio jet right from the UK via http://www.vespaspares.co.uk/. Took forever to come and was lots of $ for a jet.

Installed the 78 main jet, not any more top end, maybe just a VERY small amount of extra power on acceleration.

Final install was a Malossi air filter. I ordered the correct air filter from ebay uk. http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/VESPA-LX-50-4-STROKE-MALOSSI-DOUBLE-RED-AIR-FILTER-/290540408969?pt=UK_Motorcycle_Parts&hash=item43a58ed089#ht_1579wt_907

The air filter is the Double Red, which is not the same as sold by some US dist. for the et2. The filter still has some solid foam like the stock filter.

After the filter and jet, an increase of a mere 3 mph top end was gained, with some VERY slight increase on accel. My top speed was 47mph while on completely level ground going through the Liberty Tunnels in Pittsburgh as indicated by the speedometer. After the filter and jet...50mph.


The 50cc debate will forever rage on. I personally ride on due to the fact i do not need an M class license in PA. As for the REAL riding experience. Pittsburgh has LOTS of hills. You can expect 15/20mph up MOST hills. Level ground the scooter is perfectly fine for around any city. Hope this answers some questions from other 50cc LX owners.
Lurker
Vespa LX 50
Joined: 04 May 2011
Posts: 2
Location: California
Wed May 04, 2011 3:12 pm quote
New LX 50 owner
Picked up a used 2008 Vespa LX 50 here in California and was looking to derestrict it. So glad to have found this site and want to give a big thanks to SQMWPQVZ for doing all that to test. Plenty of hills where I live so I was hoping to derestrict the scooter to gain some umph. Guess I can save my money now.

Used to ride a gas motorized bicycle and get strange looks. Now hopefully people won't think I'm riding a lawn mower around!!!
Hooked
2014 Vespa 300, 2013 Zero S, 2015 Yama FZ-07
Joined: 29 Jun 2011
Posts: 319

Tue Jul 12, 2011 9:22 pm quote
Another alternative to making the 50 faster is to buy a 100 (94cc) Aprilia Scarabeo or the Honda Elite. My Scarabeo goes 50 mph and gets 100 mpg. At 194 pounds it is easy to maneuver and the 16-in tires make it very stable, too. A new 2009 Beo 100 sells for under $2000. A Sportcity 125 is about the same price. I think 100 cc or thereabouts is the perfect size for in town. I loved my Sportcity 50 too but as you are saying, I found it a little slow with hills or even headwinds in town. Not so with the 100. I wish the Vespa 125 was available in the US. That seems like a great size for those of us who like the smaller scooters.
Lurker
Joined: 18 Mar 2012
Posts: 1

Sun Mar 18, 2012 11:09 am quote
Vespa LX50 4V variator
Hey, I was wondering if someone could give me a guide hopefully with pictures on how to remove the variator ring on a 4 stroke. Having some problems acsessing all the bolts on the variator cover.
Lurker
Vespa S50 2009
Joined: 03 Apr 2012
Posts: 1
Location: Montreal
Tue Apr 03, 2012 3:40 pm quote
S50 restriction
Hey guys, I have a 2009 S50 and I was wondering if this applies to me also, will this remove the the annoying speed limit?

http://modernvespa.com/pix/uploads/piaggio_tech_manuals_dragged_103.pdf

Thank you

Adriano
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