Slow crank then slower crank, new batt, slowest crank,dead
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Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:52 pm quote
Please help...
I thought my battery was dying, as I rode the last two days the starting cranking seemed slower than usual, we went on a ride yesterday and I shut the scooter off 4 times, the final time it barely turned over then started.
Luckily I had a new battery at the ready, filled it , charged it and put it in today ( I checked it with the multi meter and it read 12.88volts )
STILL a VERY slow turn over and now no turnover no cranky no nuttin.

BTW I checked the old Battery and it is at 12.38 still good AFAIK.

I checked the WIKI and it mentioned the started relay but nothing about a bad starter motor, my gut says starter motor.....
any words of wisdom???
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 38407
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 4:58 pm quote
Check the battery negative to frame (and starter) connection at each end - assuming you have checked the starter relay contacts are clean, and the positive contacts are good.

A faulty starter is certainly possible, but is hugely unlikely compared to more simple wiring thingies as above.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:04 pm quote
Thanks Jim, and Now to FIND all of those things that you said...

this is going to take more than one beer...

starter relay would look like?? a small cube? any certain location or color??
Ossessionato
'07 GTS-250ie - sold and gone
Joined: 23 Aug 2007
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Location: the Queen City of the West, aka Porkopolis
Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:09 pm quote
The starter relay is in the engine compartment, on the right side. Tan in color, IIRC.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:10 pm quote
IM off to the garage.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:25 pm quote
I checked the relay, the wires were tight but i pushed them on even tighter, the tabs were not corroded.

was I supposed to look INSIDE the tan box, is that possible?

no crank this time just "tic/toc" from the relay
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 38407
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Fri Jul 02, 2010 5:57 pm quote
That could either be a dud contact inside the relay, or a duff frame connection to the starter motor - both about equally likely. Yes, the relay can be prised open, and is very cheap to replace if you screw up.
Petty Tyrant
GTS250 GTS300 MP3 500
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 29653
Location: Bay Area, California
Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:21 am quote
Before you open up the starter relay, give it a few taps with the handle of a screwdriver. Once is maintenance and twice is abuse, so I figure three ought to do it.

Also, check the engine grounding strap. They've been known to come loose. It's a thick-ish wire that bolts down to the top left side of the engine, between the ECU and the transmission housing.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:23 am quote
Thanks Jim
I will keep at it, the relay seems shiny and new looking, the plate clicks back and forth as I hit the start button.

may I ask where should I look for the frame connection?
my first instinct would be to start following wires from the battery box.

cheers
Petty Tyrant
GTS250 GTS300 MP3 500
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 29653
Location: Bay Area, California
Sat Jul 03, 2010 5:46 am quote
mogeewogee wrote:
may I ask where should I look for the frame connection?
my first instinct would be to start following wires from the battery box.
See my post right above yours.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:21 am quote
ok Jess,
I see the wire , it bolts into the base of the starter motor, near the air filter , right?


it is tight. I can follow the hot lead down to the starter where it goes into a boot right under the ecu, that one has some back and forth play but I don't want to wiggle it too much lest I break of a tab or something.

OK no nore garage for the next 9 hrs for me,
I'm off to deliver Ice Luges to partiers all around the greater Boston area....LOL july 3rd traffic here I come.

scooter not starting sucks! Having advice from MV...priceless
cheers for now
Petty Tyrant
GTS250 GTS300 MP3 500
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 29653
Location: Bay Area, California
Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:26 am quote
mogeewogee wrote:
ok Jess,
I see the wire , it bolts into the base of the starter motor, near the air filter , right?
Yep. It's worth unbolting, cleaning off the terminal and mating surface, and then rebolting.

Bummer to hear this isn't working, but I'm sure the problem will reveal itself shortly.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Sat Jul 03, 2010 6:41 am quote
I'm wondering if I should unclamp and remove the big air intake in order to get to the scene of the crime...
ok off to Boston, sh*t.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Sun Jul 04, 2010 6:37 am quote
Just to make certain that we are on the right page...
My Battery did not go dead. I think that rules out alot of the loose wire and bad connection stuff, right?

The starter simply slowed down and turned more and more slowly until now nothing.

the battery is still good, the relay clicks open and closed ( is that good?)
ok now I am going round checking the connections.

Perhaps this is a good time to instal the YSS shocks, moto amore muffler bearing and swap out the pirellis for the K66LT's.( although I had planned on running the pirellis until late august....
Petty Tyrant
GTS250 GTS300 MP3 500
Joined: 11 Oct 2005
Posts: 29653
Location: Bay Area, California
Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:35 am quote
Still sounds like a connection issue somewhere. The relay opening and closing is a good sign, but by itself it doesn't guarantee power delivery. The relay acts as a gate for the current that drives the crank, but you need to check that your connections from the battery to the relay and from the relay to the starter are all good as well.
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Sun Jul 04, 2010 8:10 am quote
OK Thanks, will do monday AM at the hairy buttcrack of dawn.
( sorry, Tony Orlando)

Cheers and Happy 4th!
Beer Fairy
GTS-"Cannonball Bettie" Member Iron Butt Association
Joined: 12 May 2008
Posts: 851
Location: Seacoast New Hampshire USA
Tue Jul 06, 2010 9:03 am quote
UPDATE:
I took the starter motor out and was told to "bench test it"
so I hooked it up to my battery with the jumpercables and it spins just fine, I'm not sure how fast or slow it is supposed to spin...

I think the starter relay is good, I may get another one just to make sure.

The beat goes on....
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