Valve Clearances. You can do it too!
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Hooked
2009 Piaggio mp3 500ie "Ephie"
Joined: 18 Apr 2012
Posts: 240
Location: Denver CO
Mon May 16, 2016 8:20 am quote
warning if you've got big hands:
Be really careful with the injector -- it's pretty easy to break the electrical connector on it. pretty costly break.

better to disconnect and remove it. just my experience.
Hooked
MP3 500
Joined: 24 Oct 2010
Posts: 264
Location: Columbus OH USA
Hooked
Fuoco 500ie - 2007, Benelli Adiva 150 - 2003
Joined: 08 Jan 2013
Posts: 396
Location: North West London,UK
Sun Oct 30, 2016 12:39 pm quote
I've adjusted my valves recently, its the third time I've done it and the first time I think that I've got everything spot on. I made up two little tools which hold the feeler gauge in the correct position one for the inlet valves and one for the exhaust valve.

I remove the tupperware, which I think gives you a better chance of getting the valves done correctly. But I tip my hat to people who can do it just through the access windows, I'd love to see somebody do it sometime as it seems to be a feat of great hand dexterity which is simply beyond me!

The one thing I've found is that I can remove the tupperware in about a quarter of the time now that it took me the first time, probably about half an hour to get it off.
Enthusiast
MP3 500
Joined: 01 Jun 2015
Posts: 72
Location: South Louisiana
Thu Jun 01, 2017 1:07 pm quote
MP3 Discussion -> Valve Clearances. You can do it too!
After reading and watching the videos, I still need to clarify one thing.

After lining up the mark in the TDC hole and the arrow on the sprocket that must line up with two dots on the casing, can you check and adjust all the valves, the intake and the exhaust, without any more turning of the motor, or is this just for the intake and you have to turn the motor one, or two more revolutions for the exhaust?

If you need to turn the motor after TDC for the exhaust how many revolutions?
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6176
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Thu Jun 01, 2017 2:03 pm quote
No more turning required. TDC compression stroke means all valves are closed.
Enthusiast
MP3 500
Joined: 01 Jun 2015
Posts: 72
Location: South Louisiana
Thu Jun 01, 2017 2:53 pm quote
Thanks
I have already adjusted the valves, but started thinking about that one step that I wasn't sure of.
Member
Piaggio mp3 500
Joined: 10 Oct 2020
Posts: 6
Location: Oklahoma
Sat Oct 10, 2020 6:38 pm quote
Having some trouble with 2009 mp3 500. Been running fine but started dying at stop, losing power, now not staying started. Only 3000 miles on scooter. I changed air filter, changed spark plugs which looked fouled. Now adjusting valves. I used .015 on the intake. The exhaust had a gap of .10. Put it back together. Not starting but just turning over. I saw this. Not sure where this goes. Any help appreciated.

[img][/img]

86DFEC7E-37F8-4B35-9CB6-AD5A783B07FB.jpeg

Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21681
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Sun Oct 11, 2020 2:16 am quote
looks like fuel injector plug that has been damaged
Addicted
2010 S50 Modified "Punkin"; 2003 ET4 150 "ISO"
Joined: 18 Feb 2017
Posts: 536
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Sun Oct 11, 2020 4:33 am quote
Greetings:

From Olestra in 2016:
Quote:
warning if you've got big hands:
Be really careful with the injector -- it's pretty easy to break the electrical connector on it. pretty costly break.

better to disconnect and remove it. just my experience.
Could this be what Old As Dirt is referring to?
Member
Piaggio mp3 500
Joined: 10 Oct 2020
Posts: 6
Location: Oklahoma
Sun Oct 11, 2020 5:20 pm quote
Wheelman-111 wrote:
Greetings:

From Olestra in 2016:
Quote:
warning if you've got big hands:
Be really careful with the injector -- it's pretty easy to break the electrical connector on it. pretty costly break.

better to disconnect and remove it. just my experience.
Could this be what Old As Dirt is referring to?
Yeah Iím looking for a new injector now for my 2009. I see that it broke. Anyone have any ideas where to purchase. I see ones for 2001-2008. Trying to fine one for my 2009
Hooked
2015 MP3 500 ie Business
Joined: 29 Oct 2019
Posts: 262
Location: Belgium
Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:23 am quote
Try https://www.easyparts.nl/

They carry everything and tend to have the best prices, and they ship worldwide.
Member
Piaggio mp3 500
Joined: 10 Oct 2020
Posts: 6
Location: Oklahoma
Tue Oct 13, 2020 3:42 am quote
sbaert wrote:
Try https://www.easyparts.nl/

They carry everything and tend to have the best prices, and they ship worldwide.
Thank you.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Neutrino MP3 492.7 AK, 2013 Moto Guzzi Norge
Joined: 29 Mar 2008
Posts: 21681
Location: Harriman, Tennessee, Tn
Wed Oct 14, 2020 4:38 am quote
blkelley777 wrote:
Wheelman-111 wrote:
Greetings:

From Olestra in 2016:
Quote:
warning if you've got big hands:
Be really careful with the injector -- it's pretty easy to break the electrical connector on it. pretty costly break.

better to disconnect and remove it. just my experience.
Could this be what Old As Dirt is referring to?
Yeah Iím looking for a new injector now for my 2009. I see that it broke. Anyone have any ideas where to purchase. I see ones for 2001-2008. Trying to fine one for my 2009
AF1 racing.com
Member
Piaggio mp3 500
Joined: 10 Oct 2020
Posts: 6
Location: Oklahoma
Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:40 am quote
old as dirt wrote:
blkelley777 wrote:
Wheelman-111 wrote:
Greetings:

From Olestra in 2016:
Quote:
warning if you've got big hands:
Be really careful with the injector -- it's pretty easy to break the electrical connector on it. pretty costly break.

better to disconnect and remove it. just my experience.
Could this be what Old As Dirt is referring to?
Yeah Iím looking for a new injector now for my 2009. I see that it broke. Anyone have any ideas where to purchase. I see ones for 2001-2008. Trying to fine one for my 2009
AF1 racing.com
Thanks. I ordered one
Enthusiast
Piaggio MP3 ie 400
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 94
Location: Sydney
Thu Oct 15, 2020 10:32 pm quote
Re: Valve Clearances. You can do it too!
mjm50cal wrote:
I used these topics as references along with the manual.
Successful Valve adjustment--no tupperware removed
Adjusting valves on MP3 500, how much plastic comes off?
Valves clearances..

As helpful as the above is, I felt it wasn't enough material for someone who has never done this before (like me). With the help of my neighbor Dan, we performed the valve checks without taking off the tupperware and documented the procedure. Thanks to the pioneers before me who helped make this possible.
This is of medium/hard difficulty in my estimation. Having someone to help you is a very good idea. Hand access is a big PITA and the main reason why you want the help.

TOOLS
Various metric wrenches and socket sets mostly with 8-10mm. Basically whatever it takes to get the 6) 10mm valve cover gaskets off and move cables out of your way for access.
The special adjustment wrenches found in the above links.
Large socket 27mm to fit and rotate driver pulley (variator).
Feeler gauges. Need .15mm, good to have .10, .15, and .20
NOTE on FEELER GAUGES: They do give you an exact dimension, but feel is a big part of the equation (hence the name). That is why it is best to have a variety so that you can FEEL what tight or loose feels like, especially if you are unfamiliar like I was. Amazing how fast you become adept at these tools by the completion of this project.
Standard and phillips screw driver.
A torque wrench is good.
A printout of the torque specs as referenced in the shop manual if you don't want to go by feel.
Work light and flashlight.
Patience and perseverance.

LET's GET STARTED
1) Place on centerstand

2) Remove left and right access panels near the pillion foot boards.

3) Remove the black plastic undercover [3) No.3 phillips screws]

4) Lift seat, remove contents in pet carrier and remove cover that is BEHIND battery compartment (2 phillips screws)
This is all the access you get, and small hands are an advantage.

5) Remove spark plus wires and label one with tape to differentiate them from each other. I marked the right one. Remove spark plugs and inspect them for wear and replace if necessary. I labeled spark plugs too.

6) There is a cable on the right side access port that is bolted down with a clamp and 8mm bolt. Unbolt it for easier access. I also unbolted and removed the fuel injector on top but it is not necessary. That was an attempt to extract the valve cover.

7) Unbolt and remove valve cover. Extract gasket from work zone as to not damage it. Valve cover will not leave work zone as it is too big. You will move the valve cover (VC) down to work on the upper(intake valves) and you will elevate the VC to work on the lower(exhaust valves).

Turn the variator nut so that the arrow on the cam sprocket is lined up with the timing mark as shown in the pic. These two actions are on opposite sides of the scoot and it is really difficult to line up by yourself and turn the variator nut at the same time.

9) Insert the .15 feeler gauge into the intake valve as shown in the pic.
Note on intake valve: They will become tight as mileage increases and will MOST LIKELY need to be adjusted looser over time.

10) Attempt to install a .20 feeler gauge if loose or a .10 if you cannot fit a .15 feeler gauge.
PERSONAL OUTCOME: Intake valves were ever so slightly tight at .15 and I made no adjustments on them.

11) Adjust valves if necessary by taking the special adjustment tool (tappet wrench I think)(the 8mm and the straight blade adjustment center). Loosen the nut (shown in picture) with the wrench while the straight blade adjustment portion is inserted in the center of the wrench and loosen (ccw) or tighten (cw) the straight blade to make the necessary adjustment. The increments we are talking are very little so the amount of turn will most likely be around an 16th-8th of a turn. WHILE you are making this adjustment you are CONSTANTLY removing and reinserting the .15 feeler gauge as that is what you are basing your final adjustment on. Tighten adjustment nut, and as you do it you want to keep the straight blade center adjustment portion of the tool from moving as this will change your adjustment. Do a final check with the .15 feeler gauge and repeat on the other intake valve.

12) The exhaust valves are exactly the same as the intakes in how you adjust them.
NOTE on exhaust valves: They tend to get loose with mileage and will MOST LIKELY need to be tightened.
PERSONAL OUTCOME: The bottom two valves were too loose (.20), and needed to be tightened.
The feeler gauge is easiest if inserted from the bottom.

13) You are pretty much done. Reassemble scoot in the opposite order you unassembled it.

14) Start up and test drive, check for leaks.
Thanks for this. I got limited mechanical knowledge, but what is this procedure for? why do it? thanks,
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3041
Location: East Anglia, a dryer region of the UK than Israel
Fri Oct 16, 2020 1:13 am quote
Checking and if required, adjusting the valve clearances is essential to keeping your engine running correctly and to prevent damage to the engine. It also maintains the correct engine power output and good fuel economy. Not doing it can lead to roadside breakdowns, poor running, poor power and fuel economy, and huge dealer expense if you cannot correct the problems yourself. Even diy'ing it can cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars/pounds to fix.
Enthusiast
Piaggio MP3 ie 400
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 94
Location: Sydney
Fri Oct 16, 2020 2:19 pm quote
Stromrider wrote:
Checking and if required, adjusting the valve clearances is essential to keeping your engine running correctly and to prevent damage to the engine. It also maintains the correct engine power output and good fuel economy. Not doing it can lead to roadside breakdowns, poor running, poor power and fuel economy, and huge dealer expense if you cannot correct the problems yourself. Even diy'ing it can cost hundreds and hundreds of dollars/pounds to fix.
Thanks for your reply, so when do you know you have to do it, my scooter has nearly 45,500 kilo now, I did the major service (drive belt, rollers, steering bearings, etc... ) a month or so ago and done at a dealership. I changed the spark plug about 8 months ago.

I have an issue now, see the link:
http://modernvespa.com/forum/post2434563#2434563

could this be an indication to do it?

thanks for your comments,
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 38990
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Fri Oct 16, 2020 5:40 pm quote
Absolutely check the valve clearances. This may not be the actual problem you are experiencing, but it very well could be - and you're just pissing in the wind if you keep trying other solutions without first checking the valve clearances - which you should be doing at regular intervals anyway.
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3041
Location: East Anglia, a dryer region of the UK than Israel
Sat Oct 17, 2020 12:51 am quote
As jim says, it could very likely be you have a tight valve/s. A bike with a tight valve/s will usually start ok (the clearance on the valve is sufficient). But as the bike heats up the valve gap closes up and can even hold the valve open slightly. This causes the engine to stall. Check the clearances at the specified times and mileage laid down in your owners manual. Hope too that you haven't damaged the engine by not checking the clearances! Good luck!
Enthusiast
Piaggio MP3 ie 400
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 94
Location: Sydney
Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:48 pm quote
jimc wrote:
Absolutely check the valve clearances. This may not be the actual problem you are experiencing, but it very well could be - and you're just pissing in the wind if you keep trying other solutions without first checking the valve clearances - which you should be doing at regular intervals anyway.
Thank you,
Enthusiast
Piaggio MP3 ie 400
Joined: 01 Jul 2017
Posts: 94
Location: Sydney
Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:48 pm quote
Stromrider wrote:
As jim says, it could very likely be you have a tight valve/s. A bike with a tight valve/s will usually start ok (the clearance on the valve is sufficient). But as the bike heats up the valve gap closes up and can even hold the valve open slightly. This causes the engine to stall. Check the clearances at the specified times and mileage laid down in your owners manual. Hope too that you haven't damaged the engine by not checking the clearances! Good luck!
Thank you
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