Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:35 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:35 pm linkquote
Hi,

Oh I'm sure this has been beaten to death here but I am a pretty regular reader and haven't seen anything in the last year or so. Apologies if I've missed it!

I have a 2017 GTV.

So far.

Bitubo shocks front and rear
Remus Exhaust
Reveno clutch
Dr Pulley's

Some cosmetic changes however that does not apply here.

My question is what next? I'm looking at a Malossi kit but would appreciate some input from the experts here. I am looking for performance parts however not something that is more prone to breakdown.

Yes, I know I don't "need" it. I already have a bigger bike that goes faster. I just want to have the best GTV I can have built. Money isn't really an issue as I I don't think any of this stuff gets in to the crazy realm of spending. Way cheaper than cars.

Looking forward to a few ideas and some advice. I'm sure there are some newer products to market to consider. For instance I know the Renevo clutch is pretty new.

I'm not just looking for speed, things like brakes and lights are also welcome.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:47 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:47 pm linkquote
DIY nitrous kit?

Don't forget a drag chute. 8)
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:54 pm

Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
 
Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:54 pm linkquote
Chute?

Shoot!

A Top Fuel Vespa. Love the idea.

On a serious note, the Austrian Vespa tuners are hard core. Getting 30hp on a regular basis. Malossi 287 with head and special ground cam, Akro exhaust and some fine tuning for the injection.

These are serious scooters.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:55 pm

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:55 pm linkquote
you will love the Malossi kit, trust me! The bike will not be a rocket by any means but it will be great fun to ride for sure! I have the full kit and shocks and I love it!
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:58 pm

Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2667
Location: Lock Haven, PA
 
Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2667
Location: Lock Haven, PA
Wed Aug 22, 2018 12:58 pm linkquote
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:32 pm

Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
 
Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:32 pm linkquote
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?
.
I'll admit to liking performance tuning.

Considering the 125/187 Malossi upgrade there is no real threat to consider. Same with the Malossi 287 kit. Nothing radical is being changed, the parts quality even increases, as well as efficiency. Vespa motors are only very mildly tuned and they can handle more power. May be different with 2 stroke buzz bombs though, these can get outrageous quickly.

A performance engine should be able to reach 1hp per cubic inch, which is a most efficient displacement/power range. A 287cc has 17.5 cubic inch. 22 hp is not even close to its dangerous level. Even at 30 hp crankshaft, which is an enormous seat of the pants experience, we are still within a long life atmosphere, as nothing radical has changed. The biggest boost is displacement/compression, efficient fuel burning cylinder head, and better use of Fuel air management with cam/fuel injection mappings.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:51 pm

Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(41,000)Red Devil SH150i (3000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2960
Location: Orange Park Florida
 
Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(41,000)Red Devil SH150i (3000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2960
Location: Orange Park Florida
Wed Aug 22, 2018 1:51 pm linkquote
Larrytsg wrote:
When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now.
The Zero SR has a sport/eco button, I would never use eco.
The X-ADV has a sport/eco button, I would never use eco.
Zoom Zoom
Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:11 pm

Hooked
ET4
Joined: 12 Jun 2018
Posts: 268
Location: Southern California
 
Hooked
ET4
Joined: 12 Jun 2018
Posts: 268
Location: Southern California
Wed Aug 22, 2018 2:11 pm linkquote
Aren't Eco and Scooter synonymous?
Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:06 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Wed Aug 22, 2018 4:06 pm linkquote
MichaelG wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?
.
I'll admit to liking performance tuning.

Considering the 125/187 Malossi upgrade there is no real threat to consider. Same with the Malossi 287 kit. Nothing radical is being changed, the parts quality even increases, as well as efficiency. Vespa motors are only very mildly tuned and they can handle more power. May be different with 2 stroke buzz bombs though, these can get outrageous quickly.

A performance engine should be able to reach 1hp per cubic inch, which is a most efficient displacement/power range. A 287cc has 17.5 cubic inch. 22 hp is not even close to its dangerous level. Even at 30 hp crankshaft, which is an enormous seat of the pants experience, we are still within a long life atmosphere, as nothing radical has changed. The biggest boost is displacement/compression, efficient fuel burning cylinder head, and better use of Fuel air management with cam/fuel injection mappings.
Thanks MichaelG for the explanation. I'm probably looking at putting the kit in and glad to hear the reliability is there.

Larrytsg I see your points but I'm sure we are looking at less than 5K here and I have a budget for at least that much. I don't have children, my wife will be fine and I don't plan on taking a lot to the grave. Really it is a pretty inexpensive hobby when compared to aviation or high end sports cars. So I consider myself lucky for not getting in to any of those things .

Any more tips or worth while additions are welcome. The Malossi kit form all I've read sounds like a good product.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:18 pm

Member
2017 GTS Super
Joined: 08 Jul 2018
Posts: 41
Location: Kalifornia
 
Member
2017 GTS Super
Joined: 08 Jul 2018
Posts: 41
Location: Kalifornia
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:18 pm linkquote
Toyota's "sport or eco" settings don't change the map or performance. They change the throttle response. Chevy is smart enough to put long travel throttles (eco mode) on their Vettes so folks don't loop them. Toyota offers a short travel option with the "sport" setting, perfect for folks who probably already have poor throttle control, kill the canary with electronics.

Harbinger - We are in a similar spot. Im new at Vespas but not to tuning. I spent a lot of time on the phone looking for a 17 GTS. Malossi kits were part of the conversation and I am thankful for the time that some of the greats in the industry spent with me enthusiastically discussing Vespas. Based I what I learned stage two of my bike will include a Malossi kit. If you want to go with Malossi and money is not an issue I say go for it. The parts are quality and the reliability is there unless you use the extra power all the time. Of course if you extend the rev limit and wring it out all the time...

Edit: If you are going to tune your bike our just plain run it hard. Change the oil, check the valves, bits and pieces, etc. more frequently.
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:49 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:49 pm linkquote
DucatiTerminator wrote:
Aren't Eco and Scooter synonymous?
Bingo!
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:58 pm

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Wed Aug 22, 2018 7:58 pm linkquote
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how is your post helpful? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:02 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
'07 LX150 (Sold), '17 GTS300, '16 BV350, '15 EN650, '09 FXDF
Joined: 26 Jul 2017
Posts: 5648
Location: Home of the Alamo
Wed Aug 22, 2018 8:02 pm linkquote
Budz wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how does your post help the OP? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
Have to agree with budz on this. Harbinger already conceded that price wasn't an issue here, so that only leaves him seeking performance and reliability...
Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:44 am

Ossessionato
2 - Many
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 3152
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
 
Ossessionato
2 - Many
Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 3152
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:44 am linkquote
Modding a scooter is a blast! Just remember that any time you start to mod a motor you are taking a chance on blowing it up. Bolt on performance parts are great...but they are rarely just "bolt on."

Now I'm not saying that it will certainly happen but sometimes it takes getting just one small thing a little wrong and you're toasted. I would never stop anyone...but I have been known to blow up a motor or two. Know what the risks are before starting!
Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:48 am

Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2667
Location: Lock Haven, PA
 
Ossessionato
1979 P200e
Joined: 18 Mar 2013
Posts: 2667
Location: Lock Haven, PA
Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:48 am linkquote
Budz wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how is your post helpful? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
Helpful? Not sure if I was trying to be helpful, just point out that I don't think (in my opinion) that modifications on the newer scoots get you all that much for the money you spend.

And you're right.... I don't have a modded scoot. I believe in the choice of three, I will always choose Reliability and Price, at the cost of Performance, because I just don't see the incremental increase in performance being worth the tradeoff in price (I'm on a budget) or reliability (I'd rather ride than wrench). At least the way I ride, extra performance is not getting me anything.

I'll apologize if I came off as a rude asshole (or some other flavor), but I don't think this forum was setup to have us all just agree with each other all the time. I think it's more of a place for us to be able to politely disagree with each other while respecting the idea that we can all have different opinions.
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:04 am

Hooked
Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 193
Location: pa
 
Hooked
Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 193
Location: pa
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:04 am linkquote
I would start with a J.costa or polini 9 roller as the next mod, then perhaps the malossi top end and fuel controller.
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:42 am

Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(41,000)Red Devil SH150i (3000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2960
Location: Orange Park Florida
 
Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(41,000)Red Devil SH150i (3000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2960
Location: Orange Park Florida
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:42 am linkquote
Budz wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how is your post helpful? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
How dare you doubt a post that starts with an Aviator Al quote
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:50 am

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:50 am linkquote
Larrytsg wrote:
Budz wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how is your post helpful? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
Helpful? Not sure if I was trying to be helpful, just point out that I don't think (in my opinion) that modifications on the newer scoots get you all that much for the money you spend.

And you're right.... I don't have a modded scoot. I believe in the choice of three, I will always choose Reliability and Price, at the cost of Performance, because I just don't see the incremental increase in performance being worth the tradeoff in price (I'm on a budget) or reliability (I'd rather ride than wrench). At least the way I ride, extra performance is not getting me anything.

I'll apologize if I came off as a rude asshole (or some other flavor), but I don't think this forum was setup to have us all just agree with each other all the time. I think it's more of a place for us to be able to politely disagree with each other while respecting the idea that we can all have different opinions.
no apologies needed, I thought you had a different experience. My apologies if my reply was needlessly harsh
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:51 am

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Thu Aug 23, 2018 8:51 am linkquote
breaknwind wrote:
Budz wrote:
Larrytsg wrote:
Aviator Al used to say....

Performance, Reliability, Price, choose two, because you can only have two. And be careful which one you leave behind.

I don't see huge improvement from the original design. Most upgrades seem (to me) to be minor increases in performance for a lot more $$. A Malossi head/cylinder combo may very well be a big improvement, but at what cost to your wallet or reliability? And how much of that "improvement" will you be able to actually use as a rider? Will your 0-60 (0-100 north of the border) numbers be dramatically different, or not?

When it comes down to it, I wish that Vespa offered a "sport/eco" button like Toyota offers on a bunch of their cars now. My daughter owns a 2015 RAV4, and with the eco mode engaged, it's a bit of a dog but gets impressive gas mileage for an AWD. With the Sport mode engaged, it's quick off the line, as the throttle response is much improved. Feels like 2 different cars. I think a lot of scooterists might like that, and it's not mechanical at all, all eletronic, mapping the ECU and throttle response.
respectfully, how is your post helpful? Did you mod your bike? If you did, what was your experience? If you didn't what's the point of your post...
How dare you doubt a post that starts with an Aviator Al quote
LOL...I have trouble with authority...
Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:13 am

Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
 
Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:13 am linkquote
Thanks MichaelG for the explanation. I'm probably looking at putting the kit in and glad to hear the reliability is there.

Larrytsg I see your points but I'm sure we are looking at less than 5K here and I have a budget for at least that much. I don't have children, my wife will be fine and I don't plan on taking a lot to the grave. Really it is a pretty inexpensive hobby when compared to aviation or high end sports cars. So I consider myself lucky for not getting in to any of those things .

Any more tips or worth while additions are welcome. The Malossi kit form all I've read sounds like a good product.[/quote]

Great to hear.

Again, the Malossi 287 is not a radical performance kit. Not even the Malossi cam if you choose to go this direction. What works is the 287 kit, with the bigger 4 valve head, and even the Malossi cam is a plus. With this, and only if you go this route, then the Akro performance exhaust is a perfect match. Dyno testing by several Austrian tuners have all proven the Akro to be the best exhaust. For 30hp at the crankshaft though, you'll need a specially ground cam for this application, plus some modifications to the intake. So, the goal of 30hp may be a step too far for you. Still, even with these mods, the motor is still not a radical performer, meaning that longevity is in no way sacrificed.

Even here, this not a radical motor. Once a hotter cam is installed, with higher ramps and changed valve geometry along with higher lifting valve train do you enter the radical range, already leaning towards a race motor. This will bring with it higher RPM'S and this is when longevity will be reduced. The 287 kit with the 4v head and cam is still street style performance, and not a radical application.

My opinion, the 287 kit, with 4 valve head and the cam. The rocker springs are set up for the new cam, nothing needs to be changed. It's out of the box. Plus the Akro exhaust. If a taller gear is needed, I'll have to make an inquiry, as I'm not sure. This is the way to go. The scooter hauls!
Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:48 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:48 am linkquote
MichaelG wrote:
Thanks MichaelG for the explanation. I'm probably looking at putting the kit in and glad to hear the reliability is there.

Larrytsg I see your points but I'm sure we are looking at less than 5K here and I have a budget for at least that much. I don't have children, my wife will be fine and I don't plan on taking a lot to the grave. Really it is a pretty inexpensive hobby when compared to aviation or high end sports cars. So I consider myself lucky for not getting in to any of those things .

Any more tips or worth while additions are welcome. The Malossi kit form all I've read sounds like a good product.

Great to hear.

Again, the Malossi 287 is not a radical performance kit. Not even the Malossi cam if you choose to go this direction. What works is the 287 kit, with the bigger 4 valve head, and even the Malossi cam is a plus. With this, and only if you go this route, then the Akro performance exhaust is a perfect match. Dyno testing by several Austrian tuners have all proven the Akro to be the best exhaust. For 30hp at the crankshaft though, you'll need a specially ground cam for this application, plus some modifications to the intake. So, the goal of 30hp may be a step too far for you. Still, even with these mods, the motor is still not a radical performer, meaning that longevity is in no way sacrificed.

Even here, this not a radical motor. Once a hotter cam is installed, with higher ramps and changed valve geometry along with higher lifting valve train do you enter the radical range, already leaning towards a race motor. This will bring with it higher RPM'S and this is when longevity will be reduced. The 287 kit with the 4v head and cam is still street style performance, and not a radical application.

My opinion, the 287 kit, with 4 valve head and the cam. The rocker springs are set up for the new cam, nothing needs to be changed. It's out of the box. Plus the Akro exhaust. If a taller gear is needed, I'll have to make an inquiry, as I'm not sure. This is the way to go. The scooter hauls![/quote]

Thanks!

I'm going to be keeping the Remus exhaust, I've grown attached to it and the dealer recommended it. I trust your opinion but also trust Lou at Vespa here. I was thinking Akro but seeing as how I already dropped $800 on Remus it wins. I said money isn't really the key factor here but I'm not insanely rich enough to throw away 8 bills. Plus I love the growl of it and performance is good. Only downside is it didn't come with a sticker for my top case .

Lou if you read this and have a Remus sticker.. cough it up!

Thanks MichaelG you gave me some thinking to do and a little homework.
Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:55 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:55 am linkquote
Lou, from Vespa West Toronto is going to look in to ordering the parts. I'll let you guys know what we're going with but I should have the engine mod done this fall. Looking forward to it.
Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:29 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Buddy Kick 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 12812
Location: Oregon City, OR
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Buddy Kick 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 12812
Location: Oregon City, OR
Sat Aug 25, 2018 10:29 am linkquote
Harbinger wrote:
Only downside is it (Remus exhaust) didn't come with a sticker for my top case .

Lou if you read this and have a Remus sticker.. cough it up!
https://irockdecals.com/remus-exhaust-decal-sticker/?msclkid=1245f6714cf819ecb58badf0d3969f07&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=irockdecals&utm_term=4580359283906273&utm_content=Ad%20group%20%231
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:14 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:14 pm linkquote
Dooglas wrote:
Harbinger wrote:
Only downside is it (Remus exhaust) didn't come with a sticker for my top case .

Lou if you read this and have a Remus sticker.. cough it up!
https://irockdecals.com/remus-exhaust-decal-sticker/?msclkid=1245f6714cf819ecb58badf0d3969f07&utm_source=bing&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=irockdecals&utm_term=4580359283906273&utm_content=Ad%20group%20%231
Thanks!
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:15 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:15 pm linkquote
Oops sorry meant to add. I'll have the upgrades done in a week or so. Can't wait!
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:39 pm

Ossessionato
2018 Vespa GTS 300 ABS- Bianco
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 2159
Location: E. KY
 
Ossessionato
2018 Vespa GTS 300 ABS- Bianco
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 2159
Location: E. KY
Sat Aug 25, 2018 12:39 pm linkquote
In recent years I have been adding LED light strips to my LP area, some wired into stop others into tail function. Lots of places to buy them and since your in a big hurry maybe not go Chinese? I don't pay extra for specialized application lights as the cheap ones do the job just fine.
Have you looked at high performance H-4 halogen bulbs? I use the Phillips bulbs that remain long hours of service but much brighter-called Extreme whatever. Consult a chart that has service life to avoid the short lived ultra bright crap thats blinding us on the highway.
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:26 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:26 am linkquote
I'm interested in seeing how the Reveno clutch and Dr Pulleys will work with the Malossi kit. I don't think anyone here has the combo as the clutch is pretty new to market. Even with a stock motor (Remus exhaust sans baffle) the difference is noticeable. Glad I already invested in the shock upgrade front and rear (Bitubo) as I do find I feel more planted at speed.

I will look in to bulbs after I give my bank account some breathing room. I actually don't do a lot of night riding outside of the downtown core which is lit up like a Christmas tree with all the condos and restaurants etc. For longer night runs it's almost always the C650GT anyway.

My wife REALLY wants to get her license and ride. Of course that means she will use the Vespa as the BMW is way to big for her or really any new rider. So there is going to be one middle aged woman with a fully kited out (and stickered) Vespa in Toronto next year wearing an orange Gringo helmet. Not a common sight I would think.
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:53 am

Hooked
Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 193
Location: pa
 
Hooked
Joined: 23 Mar 2009
Posts: 193
Location: pa
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:53 am linkquote
Have you looked into the J.costa variator?

It will provide better performance with no loss of top end than the dr pulleys.
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:59 am

Hooked
carnaby 125
Joined: 24 Oct 2017
Posts: 144
Location: uk
 
Hooked
carnaby 125
Joined: 24 Oct 2017
Posts: 144
Location: uk
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:59 am linkquote
cylinder head Malossi Maxi 4V 15-25% performance increase

from what I read
Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:13 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:13 am linkquote
ukguy2k wrote:
cylinder head Malossi Maxi 4V 15-25% performance increase

from what I read
Yeah, that's about the performance increase I'm looking for and inline with what Malossi states.

Deathshead the Dr Pulleys are already in as is the new clutch. I've had the scoot at 85 mph on the speedo with room left on the throttle. In a strong headwind it can still hit about 80. Vespa speedo speeds though so there is that.

I'm not looking for that much top end performance as there really isn't anywhere around here I can go that fast without risking a ticket. It doesn't mean I won't do it but just have to be aware. What I'm really looking for is acceleration and throttle response.
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:32 pm

Hooked
2009 Vespa GTV 250ie
Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 377
Location: Talent, Oregon
 
Hooked
2009 Vespa GTV 250ie
Joined: 15 Oct 2008
Posts: 377
Location: Talent, Oregon
Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:32 pm linkquote
Re: Engine/Scoot Upgrade Advice
Harbinger wrote:
Hi,

Oh I'm sure this has been beaten to death here but I am a pretty regular reader and haven't seen anything in the last year or so. Apologies if I've missed it!

I have a 2017 GTV.

So far.

Bitubo shocks front and rear
Remus Exhaust
Reveno clutch
Dr Pulley's

Some cosmetic changes however that does not apply here.

My question is what next? I'm looking at a Malossi kit but would appreciate some input from the experts here. I am looking for performance parts however not something that is more prone to breakdown.

Yes, I know I don't "need" it. I already have a bigger bike that goes faster. I just want to have the best GTV I can have built. Money isn't really an issue as I I don't think any of this stuff gets in to the crazy realm of spending. Way cheaper than cars.

Looking forward to a few ideas and some advice. I'm sure there are some newer products to market to consider. For instance I know the Renevo clutch is pretty new.

I'm not just looking for speed, things like brakes and lights are also welcome.
I think you've got most of the mechanical upgrades covered. But your GTV sounds so cool --- that the only thing I can think of as a worthy upgrade ---

Is a seriously cool Italian leather racing-style jacket to wear while you're riding it!


this jacket looks fast standing still!


or for more of a classic look, this might work too

Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:52 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Tue Aug 28, 2018 9:52 am linkquote
Thanks MiguelATF I have to admit that Dainese jacket is pretty sweet. However if I brought another riding jacket home my wife have a fit as I already have 4.

Pretty expensive too, I was looking at a few last year and $800 would be the starting point if I remember correctly.
Sat Sep 15, 2018 7:37 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sat Sep 15, 2018 7:37 am linkquote
Vespa is at the Dealer, Malossi kit is at the dealer. Excitement awaits.

Still waiting on one part though and I leave for vacation soon so I may not get to take it out for a spin until Oct 1st. Told Lou at the dealership that he's more than welcome to give it a good break in while I'm gone...
Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:38 am

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Sat Sep 15, 2018 10:38 am linkquote
Harbinger wrote:
Vespa is at the Dealer, Malossi kit is at the dealer. Excitement awaits.

Still waiting on one part though and I leave for vacation soon so I may not get to take it out for a spin until Oct 1st. Told Lou at the dealership that he's more than welcome to give it a good break in while I'm gone...
Follow break in instructions and keep an eye on the thermostat, mine leaked and I replaced it other than that it's fun ride
Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:51 am

Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
 
Molto Verboso
GTS 300 Super ABS/ASR (sold), BV 350 ABS/ASR (crashed)
Joined: 07 Jun 2014
Posts: 1137
Location: Washington DC
Sun Sep 16, 2018 7:51 am linkquote
interesting point about the Akra. I am about to buy an aftermarket exhaust for my bike (it has the Malossi kit). I like the Remus because it is a smaller diameter pipe and hopefully there will be interference with the suspension preload. But it seems that the Akra is a better fit with the Malossi kit...
Sun Sep 16, 2018 8:16 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sun Sep 16, 2018 8:16 am linkquote
Budz wrote:
interesting point about the Akra. I am about to buy an aftermarket exhaust for my bike (it has the Malossi kit). I like the Remus because it is a smaller diameter pipe and hopefully there will be interference with the suspension preload. But it seems that the Akra is a better fit with the Malossi kit...
Yeah but I've already invested on the Remus exhaust so it stays. I don't think I'd see enough of a performance increase with the Akra to warrant the removal of the $800 Remus. Next spend on the Vespa after this is winter tires.
Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:30 am

Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
 
Hooked
ET4 187
Joined: 14 Mar 2017
Posts: 324
Location: Germany
Tue Sep 18, 2018 12:30 am linkquote
I reported earlier that an Austrian Vespa tuner has done extensive testing with his own Malossi kitted 300. The Remus was 2.5hp down compared to the Akro! In this case, almost 10%! The motor made 30hp at the rear wheel with the Akro.
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:57 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:57 am linkquote
MichaelG wrote:
I reported earlier that an Austrian Vespa tuner has done extensive testing with his own Malossi kitted 300. The Remus was 2.5hp down compared to the Akro! In this case, almost 10%! The motor made 30hp at the rear wheel with the Akro.
Bummer then on my having the Remus. However I think that would also depend upon exactly which is exhaust they tested with, would it not? I'm not going to be racing though so can live with a wee decrease in performance. If I really feel the need to go over 100 mph I have the BMW that does it without really breaking a sweat.

I'm not saying I won't try an Akro but there may be a few upgrades I'd like to do before that. Mind you there really isn't much left after this that isn't cosmetic. Maybe brakes but I actually find the Piaggio stock pretty good.

Ok the horn for sure but I consider that not a performance upgrade per se. Why the bleep Piaggio puts such a wussy horn in all their entire Vespa line is beyond me. Are the other Piaggio bikes as lacking on beep beep department? My BMW horn actually sounds like a horn without being obnoxious.
Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:03 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2021 Vespa GTS300 HPE Racing 60's, 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: 21 May 2017
Posts: 8389
Location: Toronto
Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:03 am linkquote
Not saying I did this.... but let's just say it can do 150 kph with room left on the throttle It's also possible there was somebody else out on a sports bike that maybe feels a little less manly after backing down from a Vespa with a skirt on....

Anyway still breaking it in and will be for a bit yet. The initial acceleration I think we can tweak a bit by playing with the weights but the top end is definitely improved. The Force Master 2 is set to the third mapping and the Remus seems to be performing just fine.
Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:17 am

Ossessionato
Triumph Bonneville 2022, Triumph Street Scrambler 2018 (sold), Suzuki VanVan200 (sold), 2015 Sprint 125 (sold)
Joined: 12 Apr 2015
Posts: 2864
Location: Finland
 
Ossessionato
Triumph Bonneville 2022, Triumph Street Scrambler 2018 (sold), Suzuki VanVan200 (sold), 2015 Sprint 125 (sold)
Joined: 12 Apr 2015
Posts: 2864
Location: Finland
Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:17 am linkquote
Harbinger wrote:
Not saying I did this.... but let's just say it can do 150 kph with room left on the throttle It's also possible there was somebody else out on a sports bike that maybe feels a little less manly after backing down from a Vespa with a skirt on....

Anyway still breaking it in and will be for a bit yet. The initial acceleration I think we can tweak a bit by playing with the weights but the top end is definitely improved. The Force Master 2 is set to the third mapping and the Remus seems to be performing just fine.
150 kph...jeez! All you'll need is to add some wings and the thing will fly...
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