Modern Vespa

So pardon me if this is a stupid or previously answered question(although I did search for it and came up empty). I am still what I consider relatively new at the scootering. And yes I have taken and passed the motorcycle safety class. I am definitely way more comfortable riding and taking the great advice I have gotten on this site, I feel I have improved my riding skills, and I do appreciate all the great input from all. I think I am ready to take on a passenger. My scooter is a 300 Vespa super so it can handle it, and I have a topbox providing a great backrest for my passenger. So my question is......how much different is the handling with someone on the back? I would appreciate any input and also any suggestions for an extra helmet for a passenger. Thanks


Larry

It all depends on passengers weight and size.And then there's inexperienced riders,real fun.Riders are an added responsibility and can be very fun.

This is the second recent thread that mentions the top case as a back-rest...
Scoot for riding twos up?

Even though the Piaggio OEM case and the Givi (optional) have a back-rest cushion, I personally always discouraged my pillion from leaning back against the topcase. Also there is a current thread regarding the sudden failure of a Vespa rack - albeit an ageing GT200.... GT200 owners--check your duckbill for cracks!

In NZ a noob rider is not permitted to carry a pillion until you have passed stage three of the graduated licence scheme some 18 months after gaining a learners permit. I think this is a good thing as the scooter handles differently and the natural riding position is somewhat compromised when riding 2-up.

Take your time and take care Larry...and these are not 'stupid questions'

The helmet is very much a matter of choice and fit for your regular pillion. A full face only has one down side and that is that the chin bar may bump the back of your helmet each time you decelerate. As the pillion is somewhat sheltered by your body, they have to constantly stare at the back of your lid or peer around over your shoulder to get a view - some prefer an open face helmet for these reasons. If you plan a lot of touring and budget is not a problem you could go with matching lids and an integrated comms system such a Nolan's N-com

My husband rides on back with me driving. We have a great time. Bad part is he sings in his helmet and thinks I can't hear it.

Edit: crappy spelling

Your scooter 300 engine should be plenty to handle you and a passenger. That said, taking another adds much in the way of responsibility as clearly should you crash both of you "may" be injured or killed. The experience of your Pillion Pal also comes into play as changes in your body position, lean and weight shifting should ideally be mirrored by your pal. If you lean left into a turn and that lean freaks out your passenger and they pull away to the right there will be a major change in where that bike goes as to where you had anticipated it would go.

I once had the experience taking my young very big nephew on his very first ride. We were just going around a nice quite neighborhood with nice streets and no traffic. Seemingly out of the blue when I heeled the scoot over into a right turn he put his big foot down for a split second and not a slide along foot but to the ground. It was a major jolt that took me by surprise and while my many years of riding experience, I like to think saved us from a spill this was exactly the type of event that leads to major road rash.

Experience only is aquired by doing the deed. Seemingly the less experience one has the higher the risk, the greater the danger. For your own saftey as well, it would be nice to start with either an experienced "pillion pal" or a fellow rider who is willing to help you learn how to be in control for a 2-up adventure.

I remember riding pillion myself with my brother back in High School and having a "close encounter" once when a car suddenly pulled out from a parking spot in front of us and once when a car crossed in front of us in the classic T-Bone. The first event was at fairly low speed and with the unplanned but coordinated movement of both rider and passenger we were able to "shoot the gap" and stop safley to then express some obscene gestures, tis better to be obscene and not heard.

The second event as I recall was at a much higher rate of speed that required to put the bike into a skidding slide where he/we could lay the bike down on it's left side and keep the bike between the car and us in a worse case scenario. As often happens in this type of crash the cager suddenly came to the conclusion he was causing a wreak and slammed on his brakes. Thus creating a small slot between the front of his car and the on-coming traffic. Suddenly releasing all brakes at this moment the bike snapped up-right was under control and again we "shot the gap" whizzing passed the front fender and on down the road.

Point is, both events could have ended in a crash. The first probably would have resulted in nothing more than scratches and road rash on all involved. The second could have been the same but had quite the potential to result in a fatal finally either from sliding under the car at fault or ending up in the on-coming traffic. So yes, riding two up adds many more control issues and the life you loose may be someone other than you with all the resulting guilt should you survive, that said, it is great fun to ride with your love or your friend or both and it is way cool 8) when all goes right.

Talk to your pillion before the ride. Bumping helmets is normal at first and best ignored.
No pointing! It's a natural movement, but you probably can't see it anyway and it upsets the balance of the Vespa.
On a GTS, the pillion's feet are probably where you want to put yours, when you stop. Practise before you set off.
Adjust your mirrors. I sit further forward when we're riding two-up.
Someone once said here that the best pillion sits like a bag of potatoes (search for that expression to find at least one other thread). Works for me.
Sitting on a Vespa is less comfortable for the pillion than the rider, because of the wide body. Stop early and let him or her stretch.

That is sooooooooo cute I can just imagine it. Awwww

BTW, is he not a good singer?

My husband gave up riding the scooter. He took the MSF course, passed it, and bought his helmet. But he doesn't like that the scooter has no clutch control which he feels makes it harder to control. Now I'm thinking of asking if he'd be my pillion rider.

I spend my last holiday in Italy driving around with my wife on the back of my 250 GTS .
She's always very scared and afraid in traffic so I take special care to avoid busy situations and hectic traffic.
Also I keep the speed down when she's on the back. Maximum will be about 80 km/h (50 mi/h)
We got our self a cheap headset, (wired mic's and earphone and battery powered) that helps a lot with the communication and the over all feel she has the ability to have a say in what happens.

Like also mentioned the with of the Vespa's back end makes it a less comfortable ride for your duo, especially if they are smaller then average.
I have extended the footrests for the duo, to give her more space to re position her feet when she needs.

Other then that I can say that my wife does not ride a bike her self and she has no feeling or understanding of the "leaning in to a corner concept". But even then she is a good duo, she sits right behind me and besides the occasional bad timing of her "resitting" her self in the middle of a corner I have no problem in her being on the back.
I event think my Vespa handle's better with a duo on it..the extra weight gives it a nice and smooth feeling.. 8)

Riding double is a great way to have a romantic time together.
As previously mentioned, the handling will be a touch more sluggish with the added weight.
I find that my scooter does not like to get much above 60mph with a rider.
But is is nice to have my honey so close to me.

Oh some extra thoughts:
If you intend to ride a lot with a duo on the back you might want to invest in a sock upgrade on the backside.
To start with you can set the pre-load of the original back shocks to maximum, but with to fairly normal weighted people on it found that the back end can get bumpy.
I upgrade the front already with a malossi shock and I intend to get the back upgraded when I find the room in my bank account.

Why did I first think this was fashion advice?

Don't fret the pillion thing. One adapts very quickly to the differences in response. The scooter can handle it - even a 150. It can be fun, especial with one's honey back there. I tell them to hold me tight and move as I move. In fact I tell them that quite a lot.

I now have over 300 miles on my new 300GTV. More then half of it is my wife on the back. I have ordered the rear foot peg extensions and I know that will really improve our ride. I am not sure how to adjust the rear shock, but when I hit my 600 mile service I will have the dealer adjust for me. I would like to know more about the non stock shocks mentioned on various threads, and if they really improve ride.

thanks for all the advice and I will surely start this out very carefully. I remember myself riding on the back of a friends motorcycle back in college and my shifting of position did almost create a fall so the second rider does concern me but I see so many on two-wheelers with a rider that it is something I want to try.

moral of the lesson, don't ride with a singing husband... it can make or break your day, lol

A few observations.

Passenger putting hands on your shoulders is not good. I feel it throws your balance off, so keeps those hands around the drivers waist or grab bar.


The passengers feet will hit your legs when you put your feet down for a stop.


Your stopping distance will be way longer.


You will need to change your rear shock to the firmest setting.


Your passenger will soon want their own scooter.

very very true budler., plus i notice that if the passenger is an experienced rider himself, its difficult to balance because he tends to control the scooter by leaning his body left or right thereby upsetting the balance.

We began riding two up on the GTS 250 about two weeks ago, and only less than six months into riding full-time, we love it!

I am much much bigger than she is ... wider, slightly taller ... she is long and slim. The first day out was a practice run in the neighborhood (not a lot of traffic, side streets, so on) ... Keeping the throttle very steady and on our straight away, she clung to me like we were heading into a haunted house.

The second and third time found me increasing the speed and taking us out for a "longer" ride -- meaning, more than 15 minutes.

We discussed risks and that no matter what, no questions asked, if she were to feel uncomfortable or unsafe at any time, she'd be empowered to tell me to stop, and ... no questions asked, I'd rearrange. As a newer full-timer I am not much of a risk taker, but to get the bike up to 50 might feel for her like 120 ...

After our first three days she found "her spot" on the bike. She knows where and when to hold and learned fast to enjoy the scenery.

We are coming off a four day weekend and have likely driven more than 100 miles in three days, and ... as the weekend began (on Wednesday night), we went and bought a communication system for the helmets. I cannot tell you how much more fun and enjoyable it is to be able to talk normally and hear what we're saying and experiencing ...

For me: My shoulders and lower back are sore. I was as nervous as her the first three days and my body reacted to those nerves. Two weeks in and last night we went for a late night ride for ... um ... carrot cake and coffee. A 5 minute spin in the area took us about 45 minutes ... why? Because it was a gorgeous night in Pasadena and we didn't want to get off the bike. It was a wonderful and romantic little date and on the way home we sang 80's tunes, out of tune until we got the bike parked.

Advice: Go slow. Don't take risks alone. What you think you can handle, your partner may not -- be mindful and respectful. Check in when you are tired. If you don't think you can handle the ride, you likely can't ... rest it out. Go places you'd been that you're just dying to share with your partner, get your camera/ phone ready.

Advice: If you aren't already in love and don't want to be, consider remaining solo

My daughter rides behind me a good bit. Things I have noticed.

1) There is a learning curve for the passenger. Goose is awesome and totally neutral - my sister has ridden a couple of times and she is stiff and the scoot handles like crap.

2) Even with an awesome passenger your lines sort of wallow wider than you expect in the twisties at first and it takes longer to stop. I only notice it for about the first 15 minutes at this point, but it bears mentioning

3) Someone here told me to work out some signals for long rides. One tap on the shoulder means stop the next time we are someplace with drinks/toilets. Two taps mean stop as soon as it is safe. Three taps means stop NOW. We stop more often (every hour to hour and a half) to stretch our legs, cause you are folded up pretty tightly. Even so, we have still used the two first signals several times.

4) Wouldn't think it would be a problem on a Vespa, but when you stop at a light your passenger will doubtless stretch legs/feet/ankles. Make sure you ALWAYS are steady on two feet. I have to slide forward to have two feet on the ground, and a couple of times I have been tippy-toed and Goose has stretched and we almost went over.

Have fun! I have soooo enjoyed touring with my daughter

From the 2013 Memphis Kings Dead Elvis VI Scooter Rally this past spring in Memphis Tenn.

He is a good singer. We went for a group ride and he had no problem riding on the back with his lady driving. Maybe the selling point is being right up behind you. I think since my husband assumed I couldn't hear him since he couldn't hear me unless I turned my head and yelled. Lol. We were riding some great twisty roads in the fall on the east coast, sun setting, and he was just looking around enjoying himself. It was so cute.

Changing the preloading on your Vespa is really simple, and your GTV tool kit comes with the wrench you need to make the adjustment.

Thanks for the video. I made the changes and will go out later today and see how it does.