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@mvtroiano avatar
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Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
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UTC quote
I tried the back flush on the rear brakes and the handle was still mushy. I tried a second time, no luck. I then tried to do a vacuum and no luck. I then tried to wind tape around the bleed screw 3 times and do another back flush, no luck. I need help asap!

If anyone local can help me today or tomorrow please call! 916-985-6473

Nothing is working.. this sucks!

Anyone local to Folsom.. I need help!
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@mvtroiano avatar
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Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
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UTC quote
Thanks to Honeybadger, driving out from Roseville, we got the job done. I was hoping this would have been as easy job, but not this time. I'll have the local shop replace the front brake fluid for me.

Any idea what size hose is the correct one to fit our bleeder valves?
@afishynado avatar
UTC

Hooked
MP3 250
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Location: Toronto
 
Hooked
@afishynado avatar
MP3 250
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Location: Toronto
UTC quote
Kudos to Honeybadger!

Looking at the timestamps, not only did he fix your problem, he got to your place and did it in under 3 hours!

We could all use a local Honeybadger.



Ps I could use a brake job too ... anyone?
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@mvtroiano avatar
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Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
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UTC quote
The hose that came closest was a 1/4 inch I.D. I looked at some self bleeding video's and I might look into getting some flexible 5/16 medical hose just so I can fit it over the bleeder and secure it with a zip tie.

I also contacted https://www.speedbleeder.com/ and asked if they had a unit that would fit our scoots.
OP
@mvtroiano avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Posts: 1211
Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
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Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
UTC quote
On the way home today I noticed that my rear brake lever was tight like it was when it was new. A bubble must have worked it's way through the pipe
@honeybadger avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
MP3 500 (2) MotoGuzzi California 1400
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Location: SF Bay/Roseville CA
 
Molto Verboso
@honeybadger avatar
MP3 500 (2) MotoGuzzi California 1400
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UTC quote
Glad to hear it. Brakes only get better after the microbubbles work out.

It's funny. I get sour looks when I let out micro bubbles....
Laughing emoticon
UTC

Hooked
MP3 400, 2008 build, purchased 2009 ex demo.
Joined: UTC
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Location: Orange, NSW, Australia
 
Hooked
MP3 400, 2008 build, purchased 2009 ex demo.
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Location: Orange, NSW, Australia
UTC quote
I also carried out a front and rear brake bleed together with the front suspension bleed about 6 months ago. I had to do the brakes as one lot of fluid had gone black and was the original fluid which had never been changed. My front suspension also would not hold its pressure.

I read all the instructions and bought the recommended vacuum/pressure pump plus another cheap device I had previously bought on eBay, just in case.

I did all the recommended tricks and "blowed" and "sucked" and had a terrible time.
Eventually with perseverance and several goes I achieved a good result.

My brakes are now firm and the front suspension no longer goes soft after standing for a couple of weeks and "tooting" at me when I start it.

It is do-able, and I would do it again, but it takes time and perseverance.
@wildblue avatar
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Hooked
Piaggio Liberty S 150 (Retired: Piaggio MP3 500)
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Location: Alabama
 
Hooked
@wildblue avatar
Piaggio Liberty S 150 (Retired: Piaggio MP3 500)
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Location: Alabama
UTC quote
mvtroiano wrote:
The hose that came closest was a 1/4 inch I.D. I looked at some self bleeding video's and I might look into getting some flexible 5/16 medical hose just so I can fit it over the bleeder and secure it with a zip tie.

I also contacted https://www.speedbleeder.com/ and asked if they had a unit that would fit our scoots.
I've been trying to pursue this speedbleeder avenue for some time as well. My problem is scheduling. I had intended to take the front and rear bleeder screws out to measure them on my last bleed and then leave them out while I ordered the bleeders, but with the pending move to Germany, I just needed to get the job done because I didn't know when the movers were going to be contracted to come (BIG thanks to ponydrvr for his help with that job).

OAD was even kind enough to send me a few photos a while back of the bleed nipples, but I still couldn't determine the diameter and pitch definitively enough to order replacements. If you happen to get an answer on this one, please be sure to post the sizes as this has come up before to no avail.
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Moderatus Rana
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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Moderatus Rana
@stickyfrog avatar
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UTC quote
Passing on a trick that ponydrvr helped me with. After bleeding the front brake they were still mushy no matter how many times I tried. He said to zip tie the break lever as far back as it would go and leave it for 24 hours. Worked like a champ.
OP
@mvtroiano avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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UTC quote
I had a local shop bleed the front brakes and totally replace the fluid. The bill was $71. I can do most maintenance, but bleeding brakes was always something I was a bit leery of doing.

Added note: I asked the guy if the front brake bleeding gave him any trouble. He told me it was a challenge. So I might leave the bleeding to the people who can do it.
@wildblue avatar
UTC

Hooked
Piaggio Liberty S 150 (Retired: Piaggio MP3 500)
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Hooked
@wildblue avatar
Piaggio Liberty S 150 (Retired: Piaggio MP3 500)
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UTC quote
stickyfrog wrote:
Passing on a trick that ponydrvr helped me with. After bleeding the front brake they were still mushy no matter how many times I tried. He said to zip tie the break lever as far back as it would go and leave it for 24 hours. Worked like a champ.
Ditto on this procedure--I used a thick band of velcro so the zip tie wouldn't bite into the rubber grips; but this helped stiffen up both my front and rear brake levers after changing the fluid to some silky clean new Agip DOT4. Ponydrvr has built up quite a reputation for smart-as-a-whip tips like these!
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
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2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
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UTC quote
Trick to bleeding the brakes, is to push the fluid up to the master cylinder from the caliper using a very large syringe
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@mvtroiano avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
MP3 500 'JAZZ'
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Location: Not on my MP3 ;( - Folsom, CA. -
 
Molto Verboso
@mvtroiano avatar
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UTC quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
Trick to bleeding the brakes, is to push the fluid up to the master cylinder from the caliper using a very large syringe
I did just that without much luck Maybe it's just me.
@stickyfrog avatar
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Moderatus Rana
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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Moderatus Rana
@stickyfrog avatar
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UTC quote
It is me too then. I did it multiple times from the bottom to top without much success.
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
@web-tech avatar
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UTC quote
mvtroiano wrote:
WEB-Tech wrote:
Trick to bleeding the brakes, is to push the fluid up to the master cylinder from the caliper using a very large syringe
I did just that without much luck Maybe it's just me.
But after you tried it you asked what size hose you needed to use, leading me to think your hose wasn't tight enough and letting air in.
There is not a more foolproof way to bleed the brakes.
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
@web-tech avatar
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UTC quote
stickyfrog wrote:
It is me too then. I did it multiple times from the bottom to top without much success.
Were you using a 60cc or 100cc syringe? Don't see how it can't work, this is the foolproof method auto shops have used for years for those hard to bleed systems that GM introduced in the late 90's.
@stickyfrog avatar
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Moderatus Rana
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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Moderatus Rana
@stickyfrog avatar
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UTC quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
stickyfrog wrote:
It is me too then. I did it multiple times from the bottom to top without much success.
Were you using a 60cc or 100cc syringe? Don't see how it can't work, this is the foolproof method auto shops have used for years for those hard to bleed systems that GM introduced in the late 90's.
I was using this which is just a fancy syringe. Next time I will try just a plain old syringe. 100cc ?

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
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UTC quote
That doesn't look big enough to hold all the fluid needed for a brake bleed. It has to hold enough fluid you can push it through in one shot.
@stickyfrog avatar
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Moderatus Rana
MP3 250 and 2 MP3 500s
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UTC quote
Yeah I think I wasted money on it. The idea is that it is a continuous feed from the bottle to the syringe to the brake line and it does do that but it is rather fiddly to use.
@alexb avatar
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2008 MP3-500
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Location: ANAHEIM CA USA
 
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@alexb avatar
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UTC quote
WEB-Tech wrote:
That doesn't look big enough to hold all the fluid needed for a brake bleed. It has to hold enough fluid you can push it through in one shot.
I used this 60mm one, although I imagine that any type of large syringe would work ok:
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
^ Dunno where I got the rubber end piece, to fit over the bleed nipple
@wildblue avatar
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Piaggio Liberty S 150 (Retired: Piaggio MP3 500)
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Hooked
@wildblue avatar
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UTC quote
ALEXB wrote:
^ Dunno where I got the rubber end piece, to fit over the bleed nipple
That seems to be the magic part of the equation--Pony and I drove all over Bloomington last week looking for this part to help with the rear bleed because I desperately didn't want to remove the rear tire to reach the rear bleeder nipple. Is this just a 90 degree rubber nipple with some hose clamps on it or are there some other parts inside the connector (snap fitting, etc.?) to help hold it on the bleeder?
@alexb avatar
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2008 MP3-500
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UTC quote
wildblue wrote:
...Is this just a 90 degree rubber nipple with some hose clamps on it or are there some other parts inside the connector (snap fitting, etc.?) to help hold it on the bleeder?
Yes, it's simply a 90-deg rubber fitting, to which I added a spring-hose-clamp on each end. The clamps are necessary to prevent the fitting from popping off under pressure.

If I could not find the fitting, then I'd simply subsitute a piece of Rubber Vacuum line (with clamps on ends, again).
@sscheitel avatar
UTC

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DOT Certified? (Sold)MP3 250 (Now)MP3 400 Midnite Blue
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Location: Long Island, New York
 
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@sscheitel avatar
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UTC quote
brake job...
I felt that I must speak up regarding the bleeding of my brakes. After stripping one of the screws that hold the cover on to the front right master cylinder I decided rather than tap and rethread I would simply get a new one.

Simply enough, no? Well.....NO!

I had absolutely no problem taking the old lever/MC off and getting the new one on...I thought to myself...WOW piece of cake.

Then came the bleeding. I started, like many others, with reverse bleed...syringe, tubing, 7/16 wrench....got the whole master cylinder filled from the nipple...closed her up. Soft, mushy, long travel...NO GOOD

Next I figured, ok...lets do it the old fashion way. PITA but if the other didn't work...this much work. ok....grip lever, open valve, close valve, release lever, repeat...did this 7-8x. Closed it up...worse!

ok...read the boards...someone mentioned..OH you MUST have a mityvac to bleed the brakes on the MP3....ROADTRIP...mityvac, check....hooked it up....I vac'ed the heck out of it. Same deal...soft, mushy. long travel.

W-T-F !!

So I just sat back and thought to myself...ok dual calipers, one lever..OH...I got it! I got some clear tubing...used a T from the mityvac kit and tee'd a tube to BOTH nipples...and then from the T I had the hose in a bottle filled half way with brake fluid....making sure that the tube was below the liquid. This way I didn't have to worry about back pressure air getting in the lines.

I then opened up both valves...and filled MC and pulled the lever...filled the MC and pulled the lever....I did this about 5x

Closed it up and it was about 75% better...I had brakes....soft and mushy...but I did have brakes.

So then what I did is zip-tied the brake lever all the way and left it for 24-30 hours. I came back and BINGO! Rock solid, little travel, no mush, stiff !!!

This method of zip tying was so effective that I zip tied the rear level just for good measure.

Now I don't know where I went wrong and where I went right...but in the end....I feel that it must be zip tied for at lease 24 hours to get all of the air out of the lines.
@alexb avatar
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2008 MP3-500
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@alexb avatar
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UTC quote
Re: brake job...
sscheitel wrote:
...Now I don't know where I went wrong and where I went right...but in the end....I feel that it must be zip tied for at lease 24 hours to get all of the air out of the lines.
You probably had an air bubble at the uppermost fitting which connects to the master cylinder ...To eliminate it, it's common to Slightly Loosen the Bolt that attaches the hose at that point, while reverse-bleeding, to allow the air to escape; then re-tighten the bolt.

Your zip-tie method is similar to that frequently done with the (foot pedal operated) brakes on goldwings ...in which a Weight (I use a paint can) is hung from the pedal overnight ...for whatever reason, that eliminates the final bubble of air from the master cylinder, as no other method can.
@web-tech avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8951
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@web-tech avatar
2008 MP3 500, 2013 BV350, 2020 Vespa Sei Giorni, 2008 Vespa S150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8951
Location: Ashburn, Va. Home to the Internet
UTC quote
wildblue wrote:
ALEXB wrote:
^ Dunno where I got the rubber end piece, to fit over the bleed nipple
That seems to be the magic part of the equation--Pony and I drove all over Bloomington last week looking for this part to help with the rear bleed because I desperately didn't want to remove the rear tire to reach the rear bleeder nipple. Is this just a 90 degree rubber nipple with some hose clamps on it or are there some other parts inside the connector (snap fitting, etc.?) to help hold it on the bleeder?
The Mighty Vac kit comes with those rubber 90° pieces.
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