Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:19 am

Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
 
Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
Fri Mar 26, 2021 3:19 am linkquote
SubEtherBASS wrote:
Jack221 wrote:
And that faster opens the transfers earlier letting more fuel in, so it increases the power and runs cooler.
Hmmmm.... i shal consider that though
I considered that & realised that at times (goin hard in the twisties) that it ALREADY uses up to 10lt/100km.... fuel tank is already too small, so using more fuel may not be a good idea
Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:26 pm

Enthusiast
VBA
Joined: 12 Mar 2018
Posts: 94
Location: Texas
 
Enthusiast
VBA
Joined: 12 Mar 2018
Posts: 94
Location: Texas
Fri Mar 26, 2021 1:26 pm linkquote
SubEtherBASS wrote:
I considered that & realised that at times (goin hard in the twisties) that it ALREADY uses up to 10lt/100km.... fuel tank is already too small, so using more fuel may not be a good idea
Calculating...Calculating...Calculating

Holy crap, in american that is like 24 MPG.

Are you sure that you do not have a fuel leak somewhere? (I'm mostly kidding).

Using BSFC (0.55) and assuming you are keeping it pinned at peak HP, you would burn about 5L/hr (1.3 gal/hr). That means you would be averaging a speed of only 50 kph (31mph).

Anyway, BSFC is barely science and I am just jealous of those twisties you get to go on.

Back to crank shafts
I went down the Mazzy rabbit hole, but failed to disclose that their may be other crankshaft makers out there. Wanted to clarify they were not the only ones.

Also after posting, I saw that Scooter Center has what appears to be the Mazzy AMT-132 Race, although they do not call it by that model number.

And another Mazzy note, they recommend a max 1600g flywheel.

But my flywheel is 2350g on a Mazzy and no issues, but I am fixing this soon.
Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:12 am

Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
 
Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
Mon Mar 29, 2021 5:12 am linkquote
Captcha wrote:
SubEtherBASS wrote:
I considered that & realised that at times (goin hard in the twisties) that it ALREADY uses up to 10lt/100km.... fuel tank is already too small, so using more fuel may not be a good idea
Calculating...Calculating...Calculating

Holy crap, in american that is like 24 MPG.

Are you sure that you do not have a fuel leak somewhere? (I'm mostly kidding).

Using BSFC (0.55) and assuming you are keeping it pinned at peak HP, you would burn about 5L/hr (1.3 gal/hr). That means you would be averaging a speed of only 50 kph (31mph).

Anyway, BSFC is barely science and I am just jealous of those twisties you get to go on.

Back to crank shafts
I went down the Mazzy rabbit hole, but failed to disclose that their may be other crankshaft makers out there. Wanted to clarify they were not the only ones.

Also after posting, I saw that Scooter Center has what appears to be the Mazzy AMT-132 Race, although they do not call it by that model number.

And another Mazzy note, they recommend a max 1600g flywheel.

But my flywheel is 2350g on a Mazzy and no issues, but I am fixing this soon.
yip, when knobbin it a tank o fuel doesn't last long!

The scooter center one sure looks like AMT-132 RACE, cheers.

I spotted this GLADIO gem tonight... it sure loooks damn sexy... just not 100% sure if it is for the VBC1.... ohh, & there is the "Italian Factor" in relation to shipping (and if it actually happens).
https://www.emporiodelloscooter.com/catalogue-albero-motore-gladio-essesse-vespa-125-150-166-177-anticipato-vnb-vba-vbb-sprint-sprint-v-ts-gtr-gl-.2.48.74.gp.41684.uw



Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:28 pm

Enthusiast
VBA
Joined: 12 Mar 2018
Posts: 94
Location: Texas
 
Enthusiast
VBA
Joined: 12 Mar 2018
Posts: 94
Location: Texas
Mon Mar 29, 2021 12:28 pm linkquote
Wow, you just sent me on a chase throwing Gladio in there. I had to whip out my VPN to Italy. Below are my thoughts.

Gladio
My opinion is that Gladio is an invention of Emporio Dello Scooter and is a re-branded Mazzy AMT 132 Race. I couldn't find anything about Gladio other than their website. The pictures of the Gladio also look very similar to a 132 Race. It might be worth an ask via Emporio Dello's Facebook for the intake timing. Maybe they grind the intake open more in their shop.

SIP parts numbers suck
The SIP 45131000 I think is the Mazzy AMT-132 Race, but painted black.
The SIP 45135100 I think is the Mazzy AMT-135 (PX ignition), but not cross reference as a AMT-135.

Intake Timing
SubEtherBASS wrote:
BUT it appears that Part no.: 45131000 is the ONLY option, as it suits the VespaTronic that is on the motor (& i'm considering going back to points!)
valve timing: 118/​6 post TDC

the problem with Part no.: 45135100 is that is it for PX ignition, which I'm not running
valve timing: 120/​10 post TDC
modified for PX igniton
I think the intake timing on AMT-132 Race and AMT-135 are going to be the same. I have a hard time believing a manufacturer would create 2 different clutch sides of the crank when one design and internal part number would work.

As for intake duration, my guess is that it is 120 degrees and starts 6-10 ATDC. I found via VespaTime them measuring a AMT-135 of having 205mm closed intake (reverses out to 120 of open duration). Pic from their site down below.

All roads seem to point to a AMT-132 Race, but with a different name slapped on it. Ultimately you will probably have to grind off the crank however much more duration you want.

I saw Pinasco has something for the VBB motor, but I didn't go down the rabbit hole.


Side by Side of the 2 cranks. I had to rotate one to try and get the same angle. The pictures are not quite the same size and taken from the distance/angle, so you can't quite draw a straight line across.


Mazzucchelli AMT-135 measurement and picture from Vespa Time.

Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:49 am

Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
 
Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
Mon Jun 07, 2021 2:49 am linkquote
Well I finally did it.... shipping was far quicker than expected & everything I ordered was received (stoopidly I didn't order bearings, as was going to get them locally, only to find out the don't have any stock & was way too much for them anyway!)
Speedy now has a NEW CRANK (or 2, just in case)...
Yip, the GLADIO won the day.... ohh soo shiny

Now i just gotta get my butt into gear & fit the damn thing





Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:39 am

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x 2), 74 Primavera (x 2), 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5920
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x 2), 74 Primavera (x 2), 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 5920
Location: So Cal
Mon Jun 07, 2021 7:39 am linkquote
So gladio for you.
Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:00 am

Ossessionato
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 2511

 
Ossessionato
1963 VBB2T
Joined: 07 Nov 2012
Posts: 2511

Mon Jun 07, 2021 8:00 am linkquote
Wow which round are we on , job weld on hand , let the games begin. You going to have better luck this tim I hope.
Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:27 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 8080
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and new to 2018, '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: 30 Nov 2011
Posts: 8080
Location: Victoria, Australia
Mon Jun 07, 2021 6:27 pm linkquote
Great news!
Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:16 am

Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
 
Ossessionato
2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: 26 May 2013
Posts: 4045
Location: That bushfire place
Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:16 am linkquote
Ginch wrote:
Great news!
Cheers, but I may have to fork out $$$ to get Goetz to build it for me, as I simply don't have the time (ie. it will be another year till I get it done & i wannna ride! )
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