OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
Hi everyone!

First thank you to everyone for all the help I have received in the past. I really appreciate the communities willingness to help!

My buddy had a 1974 Vespa Super that unfortunately got it's body bent in a crash. He is okay by the way. Anyhoos, my buddy has offered me his gas tank. I have a vespa super 1966 that has the old style gas tank, not oil injected. Since my super actually has a P200 engine in it, I figured, why not have my scoot mix it's own oil. We already drilled a hole in the body for the oil spy glass and got everything lined up correctly. There is just one last annoying problem, it seems like the choke cable is getting pulled.

The choke cable in mine is in a different place (higher up) than his super. The piece of medal tubing (the part of the body) that the outer cable sits in is holding the cable out too far. When installing the gas tank, it pushes the cable away from it, making it not seated correctly, which in turn keeps the choke engaged.

To me it seems like there are two options, cut the metal tubing down to give it enough space or move the choke (drill another hole).

Has anyone down this before? Any advice?
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@cincycaddy avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
'65 Honda C100, '66 CM91, '79 P200E, '87 Honda Helix
Joined: UTC
Posts: 73
Location: Cincinnati, OH
 
Enthusiast
@cincycaddy avatar
'65 Honda C100, '66 CM91, '79 P200E, '87 Honda Helix
Joined: UTC
Posts: 73
Location: Cincinnati, OH
UTC quote
I would think moving the choke cable would be the easiest. You'll be doing a lot of trial and error leaving it where it is.
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
 
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
If you move it, you'll be cutting the old one off anyway. I'd try cutting it shorter first, probably using flex cable MacGyvered into it for better flexibility. I think you'd also need to shorten the choke knob shaft & figure a way to connect the flex cable both ends. Just make sure the friction clip is still on the shortened shaft w/ choke pulled.
UTC

Addicted
Rally 180, li150, P125, p200, p200, p200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 650
Location: Va
 
Addicted
Rally 180, li150, P125, p200, p200, p200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 650
Location: Va
UTC quote
A thought before you get too far....

Does that P2 lump still have the guts of its injector pump in it? Beyond that, I have often read that running the injector without it actually pumping oil will kill it. If you do have one, does it work?
OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
Davetopay wrote:
A thought before you get too far....

Does that P2 lump still have the guts of its injector pump in it? Beyond that, I have often read that running the injector without it actually pumping oil will kill it. If you do have one, does it work?
Thank you everyone, some good advice.

Voodoo, can I ask, what did you have in mind. Do you have a picture of flex line? Thanks!

Davetopay, good thinking! I have already made sure the pump works. I took the clutch off and made sure it had the washer. I did take it out for a ride, took the top end apart and found oil.

Thanks everyone!
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
 
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
By "flex" cable I mean the more flexible multi-strand cable like used for your throttle & gear shift, rather than the normal rigid single wire choke cable. . Or you could use bicycle cable.

As far as making the connections, the carb end should be easy, but at the knob end you'll need to get out your MacGyver skills. Drill a blind hole in the shaft tip a tad bigger than the cable & solder or epoxy it in?
UTC

Banned
Joined: UTC
Posts: 103
 
Banned
Joined: UTC
Posts: 103
UTC quote
My solution.
I've done this and used a manual automotive choke cable set-up. They are pretty cheap at your local auto parts store. I drilled a hole on the side, close to the cowl latch, and mounted it there. Pulls out to the side rather than towards the front. Has worked fine for decades and people don't even notice it there.
UTC

Lurker
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1
 
Lurker
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1
UTC quote
There is some information on scooterhelp.com about this being done to a VBA: http://scooterhelp.com/restorations/150.frame.html
UTC

Hooked
GS160
Joined: UTC
Posts: 308
Location: Åland
 
Hooked
GS160
Joined: UTC
Posts: 308
Location: Åland
UTC quote
I've not read the whole thread, I'm in a hurry but wanted to reply fgast before anyone cuts anything.

I had a PX tank in my GS frame.

Used a PX choke cable which is longer, got the cable more out of the way. Still a little finicky to put tank in body but it works.

Sight glass cut from the inside (glass of course removed from tank...), plugged with Champagne cork and then trimmed close to the oil tank.

You drive hundreds of miles or kms on a tank of 2T. Use a dip stick now and then.

Imo a pity to cut new holes in an old body.

The length of the fuel lever is different too, at least on PX vs GS. It has to be about right to get easily thru the hole.

Good luck with your installation!

Edit: Dang, saw you already holed the frame...

//J
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
 
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
If you cut it
you will lose the crimped section(red arrow) that keeps the cable outer in place. I had to fabricate a choke for a PHBL carb in a VB1 body, also tight to the tank. Here's what worked for me. The tube is replacement auto brake line and the clips are hardware store.

You could do the same to retain the cable outer, just Dremel or carefully hacksaw a slot about 1/3 of the way through, maybe a quarter inch from the new end & find a clip to fit. A fuel lever clip might work.

Tip: cut it a bit longer than your sketch, stick the cable approximately in place and dry fit the tank. If it all clears nicely, disassemble & proceed to the new slot or if not, now cut it shorter.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
goes in thru the original tap lever hole, no hole drilling needed
goes in thru the original tap lever hole, no hole drilling needed
same for a friction clip, so two places on mine
same for a friction clip, so two places on mine
tank has a tap valve w/ integral handle.
tank has a tap valve w/ integral handle.
OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
Thanks guys! I really really appreciate all your input!
@joep avatar
UTC

Hooked
05 PX, 80P200, 63Li150, to many others
Joined: UTC
Posts: 410
Location: New Orleans, LA
 
Hooked
@joep avatar
05 PX, 80P200, 63Li150, to many others
Joined: UTC
Posts: 410
Location: New Orleans, LA
UTC quote
I have done this on a 57 VNA. Don't cut the choke cable tube to move it. Just cut it off so its out of the way, grind down the front nub sticking out and fill the hole. Trying to move that tube will be a bigger pain in the ass than its worth. Trust me, I've tried it.

Go back to that wrecked super and cut the section out where its choke tube is. Take that, and grind off the excess metal. Drill your new hole where you want to put the choke, then insert freshly cleaned up tube from super, weld in place from inside the body. You will see that the back of the tube inside the body has a little flange on it that's tack welded to the interior for the frame. You want to get back to that, clean up the excess metal around that flange.

Mine looks perfect, like it was always there.

As for the oil, take the plastic sight glass off. Cut the tip off with a dremel, then cut the rest of the shaft off. Use marine grade epoxy and glue the tip to the base making a "cap" and just use a dip stick from now on. The bottom of the oil cap on top of the tank has a little hole, I glued a fibreglass rod to it. Works like a charm.
@scooterraton avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2 - Many
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3164
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
 
Ossessionato
@scooterraton avatar
2 - Many
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3164
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
UTC quote
I had a GL with oil injection. Just used a piece of 3" PVC inside the left cowl. 4 holes for U bolts and one for oil line. Let me see if I can find photo. I have that thing totally disassembled right now.
@scooterraton avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
2 - Many
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3164
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
 
Ossessionato
@scooterraton avatar
2 - Many
Joined: UTC
Posts: 3164
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
UTC quote
Here go
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
Joined: UTC
Posts: 6391
Location: Tega Cay, SC
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Joined: UTC
Posts: 6391
Location: Tega Cay, SC
UTC quote
agree with JoeP, don't cut any holes. Do the setup as Joe suggested or SRatton's . Once you cut it, is is hard to weld up and make it look good again. I rarely looked at the sight glass to check the oil and the dipstick idea sounds pretty good to me. good luck.
@socalguy avatar
UTC

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7041
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
@socalguy avatar
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7041
Location: So Cal
UTC quote
ScooterRaton wrote:
Here go
That is nicely done.
@mr10 avatar
UTC

Hooked
150 GLx, Rally 200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 256
Location: Netherlands
 
Hooked
@mr10 avatar
150 GLx, Rally 200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 256
Location: Netherlands
UTC quote
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Did this is on a GLx once, but I didn't have to move the choke.
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
 
Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9485
Location: seattle/athens
UTC quote
Sigh emoticon S.Raton's way is damn good idea if you don't already have a tank and haven't already successfully done the sight gauge hole and it is on topic & excellent to know, just not likely what OP is asking for.

Moving the choke or using a car choke could be necessary ultimately, but I think careful work can get the best solution w/ no unnecessary cutting, drilling or welding to get the result mr10 got.

Waiting to see what Chopper comes up with.
⬆️    About 4 months elapsed    ⬇️
OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
Everyone has great ideas thanks so much. Well I actually tried to shorten the metal tube the choke is in. That worked for a while, however, the gas tank already dramatized the metal tube and it broke off! I ended up moving the choke with Matthews help! He was able to make something similar to what voodoo has out of a large bolt. It works really well. [/img]
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
Here's another
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@vintage_red_matthew avatar
UTC

MV Santa
GTS250, 1975 VBC, 1980 P200E cutdown
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4723
Location: Sedgwick, Kansas
 
MV Santa
@vintage_red_matthew avatar
GTS250, 1975 VBC, 1980 P200E cutdown
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4723
Location: Sedgwick, Kansas
UTC quote
The secret to that bolt is that it's not drilled the same diameter all the way through. I first drilled it through with a 1/8 inch bit then enlarged it to 1/4 inch on each end. About 1/2 inch deep on the back end to let the cable recess into and most of the rest of the way through on the front for the choke knob shaft to fit into. It uses the original cable. You can see where I cut a slot with an abrasive wheel to accept a clip for friction so the choke return spring in the carb doesn't pull the choke closed. It does work well, doesn't it?
UTC

Banned
Joined: UTC
Posts: 103
 
Banned
Joined: UTC
Posts: 103
UTC quote
vintage red matthew wrote:
The secret to that bolt is that it's not drilled the same diameter all the way through. I first drilled it through with a 1/8 inch bit then enlarged it to 1/4 inch on each end. About 1/2 inch deep on the back end to let the cable recess into and most of the rest of the way through on the front for the choke knob shaft to fit into. It uses the original cable. You can see where I cut a slot with an abrasive wheel to accept a clip for friction so the choke return spring in the carb doesn't pull the choke closed. It does work well, doesn't it?
SO much more work for yourself. You could have bought a pre-made manual car choke assembly. You would have only had to drill one hole and it actually looks almost exactly like the stock Vespa choke.
OP
@chopper1966 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
 
Enthusiast
@chopper1966 avatar
Super 1966
Joined: UTC
Posts: 67
Location: Louisville KY
UTC quote
It wasn't much work, more creative and cheaper than anything. He had it done in only a few mins. Just drill with a press twice and cut a slit. It works really well! Excellent job Matthew!
DoubleGood Design banner

Modern Vespa is the premier site for modern Vespa and Piaggio scooters. Vespa GTS300, GTS250, GTV, GT200, LX150, LXS, ET4, ET2, MP3, Fuoco, Elettrica and more.

Buy Me A Coffee
 

Shop on Amazon with Modern Vespa

Modern Vespa is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, an affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to amazon.com


All Content Copyright 2005-2024 by Modern Vespa.
All Rights Reserved.


[ Time: 0.0494s ][ Queries: 4 (0.0205s) ][ Debug on ][ 309 ][ Thing One ]