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@rb_prior avatar
UTC

Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
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Location: Central Ohio
 
Hooked
@rb_prior avatar
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
UTC quote
I have a 1963 Allstate and have recently installed a new Stoffi spring on the front fork. This Stoffi spring made a tremendous difference in the stability and handling of the bike on the rather good roads I currently ride. However, I trailered the Allstate up to my brothers (150 miles away) and had the chance to compare my ride with his on some very rough roads. His bike is a 1965 Vespa VBB with the standard spring and damper on the front fork. I must say that I was impressed with how well his bike handled on the rough roads we traveled. It was solid and never bottomed out. By contrast, my Allstate did not do well on these poor roads. It would bottom out and stability was not as good as the 1965 Vespa.

I then decided to replace the Allstate front fork with a VBB fork and found one. The VBB fork has the standard spring on it now. Should I replace this standard spring with my new Stoffi spring while I have both forks on the bench? Would it make the ride better or perhaps make it too firm on a VBB fork which has the damper as well. If the experts feel the standard spring will work just fine and there is no advantage to installing the Stoffi spring, then I will leave it alone. If, on the other hand, the Stoffi spring would enhance an already good ride, then I will install the Stoffi spring on the VBB fork. Thanks for your comments.
New Stoffi spring installed on 1963 Allstate.
New Stoffi spring installed on 1963 Allstate.
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@rb_prior avatar
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Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
 
Hooked
@rb_prior avatar
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
UTC quote
Here is an interesting article comparing linear and progressive springs.

http://automotivethinker.com/suspension/linear-vs-progressive-rate-springs/

I like my progressive Stoffi spring but according to this article, progressive springs are harder to dampen than linear springs. I believe the regular VBB spring is linear. Then again, SIP sells the Stoffi spring for the VBB.

http://www.scooter-speed.com/products.php?1692

I still have some studying to do but am inclined to put the Stoffi spring on the VBB fork before I install it. The Stoffi spring certainly improved my original Allstate ride and I would think it would do the same if installed on a dampened VBB fork.
@rowdyc avatar
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Molto Verboso
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
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Molto Verboso
@rowdyc avatar
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
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Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
UTC quote
I have a stoffi spring on my sprint and it stops the diving a lot. The front end is stiffer and there's not a lot of give when riding over bumps which becomes a shaky ride.

I also installed the sip performance shock using the original 50 year old shock on my GL. The shock also stops most of the diving but with a less shaky ride. The 60 psi sip shocks works fine I but don't have any experience with the 100 psi shock.

Good luck!


http://www.sipscootershop.com/en/products/shock+absorber+sip+performance+_78000fsm

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

http://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/products/shock+absorber+sip+performance+_78000fsl
@socalguy avatar
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bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
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Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
@socalguy avatar
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7041
Location: So Cal
UTC quote
Agree with rowdy... we have a Stoffi on one of our Supers. It controls brake dive much better than the standard spring. The ride is firmer though, which you may or may not like.
⬆️    About 3 years elapsed    ⬇️
UTC

Hooked
Joined: UTC
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Location: London
 
Hooked
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Location: London
UTC quote
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
@rowdyc avatar
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Molto Verboso
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
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Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
 
Molto Verboso
@rowdyc avatar
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
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Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
UTC quote
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
UTC

Hooked
1952 Allstate 1955 Allstate 1958 lambretta 1965 Allstate 1968 sprint
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Location: Central california
 
Hooked
1952 Allstate 1955 Allstate 1958 lambretta 1965 Allstate 1968 sprint
Joined: UTC
Posts: 495
Location: Central california
UTC quote
front fork
while i only have the stoffie spring on my 65 allstate, my guess would be the stoffie spring and a shock...I tlhink would be a big plus. scott
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Hooked
1952 Allstate 1955 Allstate 1958 lambretta 1965 Allstate 1968 sprint
Joined: UTC
Posts: 495
Location: Central california
 
Hooked
1952 Allstate 1955 Allstate 1958 lambretta 1965 Allstate 1968 sprint
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Posts: 495
Location: Central california
UTC quote
stoffie springs
by the way the stoffie springs can be purchased at Scooter Speed out of Azusa california. around the 45.00 dollar range.
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Hooked
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Location: London
 
Hooked
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Location: London
UTC quote
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
Only video I could find was to change the Shock to the SIP performance one but not the spring
@rowdyc avatar
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Molto Verboso
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
 
Molto Verboso
@rowdyc avatar
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
UTC quote
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
Only video I could find was to change the Shock to the SIP performance one but not the spring
http://scooterlounge.com/blog/2010/12/garage-time---allstate-front-spring.html
UTC

Hooked
Joined: UTC
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Location: London
 
Hooked
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Location: London
UTC quote
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
Only video I could find was to change the Shock to the SIP performance one but not the spring
http://scooterlounge.com/blog/2010/12/garage-time---allstate-front-spring.html
I'll be honest that looks too advanced for my skill level! Only just got the bike on the road after a 3 year restoration so might leave that for a while!
@rowdyc avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
 
Molto Verboso
@rowdyc avatar
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
UTC quote
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
Only video I could find was to change the Shock to the SIP performance one but not the spring
http://scooterlounge.com/blog/2010/12/garage-time---allstate-front-spring.html
I'll be honest that looks too advanced for my skill level! Only just got the bike on the road after a 3 year restoration so might leave that for a while!
It's really not that hard to replace. You may not need the to remove the axle like the the guy at scooterlounge did with the pogo suspension Allstate. I did not remove my axle but the stoffi spring was installed on a 10 inch Sprint. The hardest part with the Stoffi spring is compressing it down to install.

The Stoffi spring is not needed if you use a SIP performance shock. It is just too stiff to compress when hitting bumps. The old spring will work great with SIP performance shock.
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Hooked
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Location: London
 
Hooked
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Posts: 128
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UTC quote
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
rowdyc wrote:
Ant1985 wrote:
How easy is it to change the front spring and Shock? can this be done by anyone? Do you have to take the mudguard off etc?
Shock easy, stock spring easy, stoffi spring harder but doable.
Yes, anyone that can turn a wrench.
No
Fyi... youtube
Only video I could find was to change the Shock to the SIP performance one but not the spring
http://scooterlounge.com/blog/2010/12/garage-time---allstate-front-spring.html
I'll be honest that looks too advanced for my skill level! Only just got the bike on the road after a 3 year restoration so might leave that for a while!
It's really not that hard to replace. You may not need the to remove the axle like the the guy at scooterlounge did with the pogo suspension Allstate. I did not remove my axle but the stoffi spring was installed on a 10 inch Sprint. The hardest part with the Stoffi spring is compressing it down to install.

The Stoffi spring is not needed if you use a SIP performance shock. It is just too stiff to compress when hitting bumps. The old spring will work great with SIP performance shock.
It is a new standard spring anyway so I might just go with the SIP performance shock then if that will work well and eliminate the cray nose dive when braking - 60psi or 100psi? anyone tried both?
OP
@rb_prior avatar
UTC

Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
 
Hooked
@rb_prior avatar
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
UTC quote
When I was restoring my 1963 Allstate, I found working on the front fork and spring to be the most difficult. But with persistence it is doable. I first replaced my original spring with a new Stoffi spring. This made a big difference in the ride and handling properties. Then, I decided to add the damper which required getting a new swing arm and modifying the original fork. I have posted on this forum exactly what I did during this project. It was worth the effort. I learned a lot of tricks to pull off this upgrade to the Allstate front fork successfully. I did take the front fork out to make it easier to work on. I also learned not to use Indian forks, springs, swing arms, or parts in general. Use as much of the original equipment as possible. Safety is paramount when dealing with the front fork.
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Hooked
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Location: London
 
Hooked
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Posts: 128
Location: London
UTC quote
RB Prior wrote:
When I was restoring my 1963 Allstate, I found working on the front fork and spring to be the most difficult. But with persistence it is doable. I first replaced my original spring with a new Stoffi spring. This made a big difference in the ride and handling properties. Then, I decided to add the damper which required getting a new swing arm and modifying the original fork. I have posted on this forum exactly what I did during this project. It was worth the effort. I learned a lot of tricks to pull off this upgrade to the Allstate front fork successfully. I did take the front fork out to make it easier to work on. I also learned not to use Indian forks, springs, swing arms, or parts in general. Use as much of the original equipment as possible. Safety is paramount when dealing with the front fork.
I Read your post on how you did it and was very impressed. Luckily my VBB already has the front shock and it looks easy to bolt in and out so I might give that a go.
OP
@rb_prior avatar
UTC

Hooked
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
 
Hooked
@rb_prior avatar
1963 Allstate, 2005 Vespa PX150, 2001 Harley 95 ci Dyna
Joined: UTC
Posts: 320
Location: Central Ohio
UTC quote
If you decide to install a Stoffi spring, make sure you get the right length. The Stoffi spring comes in different lengths. With the correct length spring, very little compression is needed for the installation. First screw in the top of the spring the anchor plate so the threaded part on the anchor is below the top of the spring. Then screw the bottom of the spring on to the anchor plate that is fixed to the swing arm. It only takes a turn or so to attach the spring at this point. Once attached at the bottom on the swing arm, raise up the spring to the upper bracket on the fork. A little help with a hammer will force the spring up into the upper bracket. Then with a little screw driver and small hammer you can tap and unscrew the upper anchor plate that is within the spring. The anchor plate will unscrew and the threaded part will protrude through the hole in the upper bracket on the fork. Continue until the anchor plate is up as far as it will go. Then put a lock washer and nut on the threaded part of the anchor plate which is protruding through the upper bracket and tighten down. That is it. All this can be done with the fork and fender installed on the bike. Just lay it over so you can easily work on the spring installation.
@rowdyc avatar
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Molto Verboso
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
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Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
 
Molto Verboso
@rowdyc avatar
GL, PK, PE200 with hack, Sears Rust Badge
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1345
Location: Deep in the heart of Texas
UTC quote
Ant1985 wrote:
It is a new standard spring anyway so I might just go with the SIP performance shock then if that will work well and eliminate the cray nose dive when braking - 60psi or 100psi? anyone tried both?
Since it's a new standard spring try the SIP shock first and if it is not what you're looking for try the Stoffi spring. The shock is a very quick and easy install as you can see.
The 60psi works well for me and it seems that it works for others. https://modernvespa.com/forum/topic138611.2 The 100 psi maybe stiffer but I have not heard of any experience at all.
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