OP
Tue, 28 Aug 2018 10:36:25 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Tue, 28 Aug 2018 10:36:25 +0000 quote
This one looks awesome. Very similar to the smallframe kit he's been producing for a while now. A few shops are carrying it, SIP included apparently but I can't find it there. On his facebook page he's not saying a whole lot about it.... these pics are from fb and Duepercento mainly. Also a little video where he tries linking the front and rear brakes hydraulically - with a bit of success apparently.
Looks like I can't post the video, see if this works...
https://video-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t42.9040-2/38867461_248561745983513_2163277071676080128_n.mp4?_nc_cat=0&efg=eyJ2ZW5jb2RlX3RhZyI6InN2ZV9zZCJ9&oh=0d220397b1686ff6b04c9362def22af2&oe=5B854EE0

http://www.duepercento.com/product_info.php?products_id=5255 It's 510 euro.
Duepercento.com wrote:
Front brake disc set CRIMAZ for Vespa 180-200 Rally / Sprint / 125 GT / GTR / TS

P & P disc brake kit for Vespa Sprint, GT, GL, TS, Rally

Born to be mounted on the Vespa without replacing fork, fender and drum.

It mounts on the original fork and is compatible with all models Vespa Sprint, GT, GL, TS, Rally

200mm disc with perimeter fastening, hydraulic clamp with single-piston diam. 30 mm made from solid on floating support.

For correct operation, it is advisable to use the pump to be applied to the Crimaz handlebar












OP
Tue, 28 Aug 2018 21:48:04 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Tue, 28 Aug 2018 21:48:04 +0000 quote
Chatted with him a little last night on fb. I asked if he had done anything about the diving when under brakes.
Cristian Crimaz Mazelli wrote:
With spring and shock absorber improves.
If you want to improve so you have to put the disc to the rear wheel and do full braking.
Must be controlled by the pump on the right lever
This is referring to the linked two disc setup in the video. I asked if he had some way of balancing front and rear braking force and he said no.
Wed, 29 Aug 2018 05:43:50 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:12:19 +0000
Posts: 5794
Location: Indo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: Mon, 15 Jun 2009 15:12:19 +0000
Posts: 5794
Location: Indo
Wed, 29 Aug 2018 05:43:50 +0000 quote
many thanks Brother M, now i know how to make one for myself the diagram really help a lot

will think it over and cheer
OP
Wed, 29 Aug 2018 06:59:09 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Wed, 29 Aug 2018 06:59:09 +0000 quote
Keep me updated on your efforts E! Would love to see it!
Wed, 05 Sep 2018 09:08:45 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Wed, 05 Sep 2018 09:08:45 +0000 quote
Damn you, you know I've wanted a disc brake set-up on the Rally and now I'm going to have to look in to this and see if it is a simpler option. Sigh.
OP
Thu, 06 Sep 2018 02:47:50 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Thu, 06 Sep 2018 02:47:50 +0000 quote
AlanMac wrote:
Damn you, you know I've wanted a disc brake set-up on the Rally and now I'm going to have to look in to this and see if it is a simpler option. Sigh.
Well it is. You don't need to change the fork for a start... he assures us they are all bolt-on.
Sat, 08 Sep 2018 08:57:06 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Sat, 08 Sep 2018 08:57:06 +0000 quote
Sounds just too good to be true, but I am up for a plug and play always. Roll on December. Thanks for the info Michael.
Thu, 13 Sep 2018 15:01:35 +0000

Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
Joined: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 13:16:15 +0000
Posts: 478
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
 
Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
Joined: Thu, 18 Aug 2016 13:16:15 +0000
Posts: 478
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
Thu, 13 Sep 2018 15:01:35 +0000 quote
Apparently the attached sheet should have been in the box. I think it says I need to pull out the grease nipple and fir a rubber stopper (none in the box) in its place.

Anyone able to point to a good thread (with pictures for this slow learner) showing how to pull a Sprint/Super front hub apart and put it back together? And/or how to do the same with the spring (Pictures ditto...)

I promise to sprinkle this thread with install photo's in return (f I can figure out how to route the brake hose)

Craig


Grease fitting out, rubber bung in?

⬆️    About 2y elapsed between posts    ⬇️
Fri, 16 Oct 2020 14:36:25 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Fri, 16 Oct 2020 14:36:25 +0000 quote
Craig,

Did you get this on OK and was it a winner???

Thanks, hope lock down is over quickly for you guys in Melbourne.
Fri, 16 Oct 2020 20:46:41 +0000

Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
 
Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
Fri, 16 Oct 2020 20:46:41 +0000 quote
I've put one of these on my 125 t.s. It works very well but of course the front does dive under braking so you have to be careful.

When I fitted the kit I also replaced the spring with a stiffer one, the damper with a BGM PRO Sport, I also replaced all the bearings, the spring attachment and other bits of hardware.

Add to that a brake lever/master cylinder combo and the brake hose, then things are getting close to the PK fork conversion price, which is probably what I would do next time for a tuned oldie.

To fit the kit and to do anything to the hub, axel or the caliper, once the kit is fitted, you have to remove the disc from the hub by removing the 5 torx head screws. So you need a good quality torx screwdriver. There are no instructions, so no torque settings, you need to tighten everything as much as you think and I used locktight on everything with a thread. The kit fits straight onto the exisitng forks with no drilling or welding, so you can easily revert back to the original brakes.

I fitted mine during the christmas holiday 2019 and have only had one problem since. The screw holding the caliper bracket came loose inside the hub after a very serious emergency stop. So of course everything has to be removed to get to it.

Finally, you have to learn how to bleed brakes, bear in mind that brake fluid is hygroscopic so it attracts moisture, I learnt the hardway that it isn't a job for a rainy day....

Pete
OP
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 00:52:37 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 00:52:37 +0000 quote
Alan, he hasn't ridden it much. I did have a 10 minute ride and the brakes worked very well. As PeteB notes though, you need a good shock and spring - people are saying that the SIP shock and stock spring are a good combination. Something about a stiff spring not allowing the shock to work to it's full capacity.

I don't have it on mine obviously, but I did just buy the new Crimaz master cylinder - version 2, and it's a lovely thing. Very discreet with a built in reservoir.







Sat, 17 Oct 2020 05:25:39 +0000

Banned
3:5
Joined: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:38:46 +0000
Posts: 8741
Location: San Francisco
 
Banned
3:5
Joined: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:38:46 +0000
Posts: 8741
Location: San Francisco
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 05:25:39 +0000 quote
that is super clean!
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 07:15:19 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 07:15:19 +0000 quote
Ginch wrote:
I don't have it on mine obviously, but I did just buy the new Crimaz master cylinder - version 2, and it's a lovely thing. Very discreet with a built in reservoir.
Which bike is that one?? It looks weirdly unblemished

Thanks for the update. Might have to lug a set or two back with me when I can enter Australia once more. One for the Rally and one for the Sprint. Seems the easiest solution for adding a Disc set-up. Keep your phone on
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 07:20:52 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 07:20:52 +0000 quote
PeteB wrote:
.. things are getting close to the PK fork conversion price, which is probably what I would do next time for a tuned oldie.

To fit the kit and to do anything to the hub, axel or the caliper, once the kit is fitted, you have to remove the disc from the hub by removing the 5 torx head screws. So you need a good quality torx screwdriver. There are no instructions, so no torque settings, you need to tighten everything as much as you think and I used locktight on everything with a thread. The kit fits straight onto the exisitng forks with no drilling or welding, so you can easily revert back to the original brakes.

I fitted mine during the christmas holiday 2019 and have only had one problem since. The screw holding the caliper bracket came loose inside the hub after a very serious emergency stop. So of course everything has to be removed to get to it.

Finally, you have to learn how to bleed brakes, bear in mind that brake fluid is hygroscopic so it attracts moisture, I learnt the hardway that it isn't a job for a rainy day....

Pete
Thanks Pete, I like the locktight and torx screwdriver tips. 8) Definitely some points to consider when comparing the Disc options. Cheers
OP
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 11:23:22 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 11:23:22 +0000 quote
oopsclunkthud wrote:
that is super clean!
Isn't it? And it fits!! My only grumble (and it's small) is that the outlet for the hydraulic line is from the bottom rather than the side. So less chance to keep it hidden, but still nice.
AlanMac wrote:
Ginch wrote:
I don't have it on mine obviously, but I did just buy the new Crimaz master cylinder - version 2, and it's a lovely thing. Very discreet with a built in reservoir.
Which bike is that one?? It looks weirdly unblemished

Thanks for the update. Might have to lug a set or two back with me when I can enter Australia once more. One for the Rally and one for the Sprint. Seems the easiest solution for adding a Disc set-up. Keep your phone on
That's the Blue Badge smallframe, courtesy of Terry, Owen and Patrick!
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 13:19:33 +0000

Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: Sat, 02 Nov 2019 20:44:07 +0000
Posts: 3507
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
 
Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: Sat, 02 Nov 2019 20:44:07 +0000
Posts: 3507
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 13:19:33 +0000 quote
I'd like to see a linked setup with drum rear. Maybe have a hydraulic cylinder that mounts underneath and pulls on the rear drum cable?
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 14:47:27 +0000

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 14:47:27 +0000 quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
I'd like to see a linked setup with drum rear. Maybe have a hydraulic cylinder that mounts underneath and pulls on the rear drum cable?
I was looking at playing with a hydraulic clutch and lever.

You could do a rear brake the same way, but you'd have to figure out how to connect the master cylinder to the brake pedal. I have thoughts, basically mount it to the side of the tunnel like the brake light switch, but nothing solid until I get one to look at and can figure out how what you would need to chop off and then add mounting bolts.
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 15:14:15 +0000

Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
 
Molto Verboso
'74 Rally, '72 Sprint
Joined: Fri, 31 May 2013 00:21:55 +0000
Posts: 1147
Location: Melbourne, London, Durham NC
Sat, 17 Oct 2020 15:14:15 +0000 quote
Ginch wrote:
That's the Blue Badge smallframe, courtesy of Terry, Owen and Patrick!
How close to being on the road is it. Will you make the not-the Mille, not that I'm sure you'd want to ride a smallframe that far?

We will have moved back down under by this time next year all things being well with the world once more. Kind of wish we had of bitten the bullet and headed to Perth at the first inkling of this

Would have been plenty of time to get 'Alice's' Sprint sorted I suspect.
OP
Sun, 18 Oct 2020 00:45:05 +0000

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: Thu, 01 Dec 2011 00:47:42 +0000
Posts: 8375
Location: Victoria, Australia
Sun, 18 Oct 2020 00:45:05 +0000 quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
I'd like to see a linked setup with drum rear. Maybe have a hydraulic cylinder that mounts underneath and pulls on the rear drum cable?
chandlerman wrote:
You could do a rear brake the same way, but you'd have to figure out how to connect the master cylinder to the brake pedal. I have thoughts, basically mount it to the side of the tunnel like the brake light switch, but nothing solid until I get one to look at and can figure out how what you would need to chop off and then add mounting bolts.
Crimaz did try that, it was a couple of years ago so I assume he thought there was not much call for it. Uses discs both ends. His method was... kinda crude you might say, but he said it worked well. Just run both calipers off the same master cylinder, no biasing or anything. Or rear only via the pedal. There's a video here -
Cristian Crimaz Mazelli wrote:
Sneak peek.
Front disc rally rally Largeframe rear disc disco p & p pump, the result is amazing.
In the rear drum remain the original jaws operated by the standard pedal.
The right handlebar lever operates both pliers simultaneously

https://www.facebook.com/cristian.mazelli/posts/2288084504540331
AlanMac wrote:
How close to being on the road is it. Will you make the not-the Mille, not that I'm sure you'd want to ride a smallframe that far?
I'm still hoping it will possible. Numbers are looking good atm. Just a matter of having time to run it in and deal with any issues that might come up. "Alice's Sprint". Good one!
⬆️    About 1y elapsed between posts    ⬇️
Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:15:40 +0000

Lurker
Vespa Rally 180 (221)
Joined: Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:11:35 +0000
Posts: 3
Location: Malmö, Sweden
 
Lurker
Vespa Rally 180 (221)
Joined: Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:11:35 +0000
Posts: 3
Location: Malmö, Sweden
Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:15:40 +0000 quote
Hi! I just mounted the Crimaz front disc brake to my rally but I’m not sure where the brake hose is supposed to go. Through the fork like the old wire?





Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:48:29 +0000

Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
 
Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:48:29 +0000 quote
I put the hose of mine then straight up through the fork tube, you should be able to see from the image.



Sun, 01 Aug 2021 17:05:05 +0000

Lurker
Vespa Rally 180 (221)
Joined: Sun, 01 Aug 2021 15:11:35 +0000
Posts: 3
Location: Malmö, Sweden
 
Lurker
Vespa Rally 180 (221)
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Location: Malmö, Sweden
Sun, 01 Aug 2021 17:05:05 +0000 quote
Thanks! It seems like the most logical way. Got confused by the not so great technical manual.
Fri, 06 Aug 2021 06:23:16 +0000

Molto Verboso
Scattered remnants of (two!) 1974 Rallys
Joined: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 05:05:38 +0000
Posts: 1845
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Molto Verboso
Scattered remnants of (two!) 1974 Rallys
Joined: Fri, 31 Jul 2009 05:05:38 +0000
Posts: 1845
Location: San Francisco, CA
Fri, 06 Aug 2021 06:23:16 +0000 quote
Such an elegant design. I love how low key the master cylinder is.
Sat, 07 Aug 2021 22:39:21 +0000

Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: Tue, 19 Jun 2007 22:11:49 +0000
Posts: 1519
Location: California
 
Molto Verboso
Vespa
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Posts: 1519
Location: California
Sat, 07 Aug 2021 22:39:21 +0000 quote
outstanding PeteB now I want.
Sun, 08 Aug 2021 10:42:21 +0000

Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
 
Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
Sun, 08 Aug 2021 10:42:21 +0000 quote
The only thing I would like to do is change the master cylinder for the more discreet one that Ginch has fitted.
Sun, 08 Aug 2021 13:29:24 +0000

Molto Verboso
One or two fun scoots....nothing too precious
Joined: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 13:26:21 +0000
Posts: 1955
Location: UK (South East)
 
Molto Verboso
One or two fun scoots....nothing too precious
Joined: Wed, 17 Jul 2013 13:26:21 +0000
Posts: 1955
Location: UK (South East)
Sun, 08 Aug 2021 13:29:24 +0000 quote
Hello Pete, which front shock have you used and have you reduced the 'dive'? I'd like to beef up my Super's front end (it's 10"), but feel that the suspension is it's biggest weakness rather than the drum brake
Mon, 09 Aug 2021 16:40:18 +0000

Member
Vespa 125TS
Joined: Tue, 24 Dec 2019 17:42:32 +0000
Posts: 14
Location: UK
 
Member
Vespa 125TS
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Posts: 14
Location: UK
Mon, 09 Aug 2021 16:40:18 +0000 quote
I fitted a stiffer spring and the BGM PRO Sport adjustable damper

I took the opportunity to replace all the bearings and other small bits of hardware

seems a lot better
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 06:39:48 +0000

Lurker
Vespa Rally 180 (221)
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Location: Malmö, Sweden
 
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Vespa Rally 180 (221)
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Location: Malmö, Sweden
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 06:39:48 +0000 quote
Hey! Thanks for the help. Everything is mounted and seemingly ok but the brake pads are always “on”. I talket to Crimaz and he told me the need to be run in for 500 km wich I find odd. The disc gets really hot after only five minutes of riding.

I have aired the system at my best. Any suggestions on what to do? Thanks
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:15:32 +0000

Addicted
2010 gts 300 super. 09 MP3 500 lite
Joined: Tue, 02 Apr 2013 12:44:02 +0000
Posts: 954
Location: tampa
 
Addicted
2010 gts 300 super. 09 MP3 500 lite
Joined: Tue, 02 Apr 2013 12:44:02 +0000
Posts: 954
Location: tampa
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:15:32 +0000 quote
Sibbarpvespisti wrote:
Hey! Thanks for the help. Everything is mounted and seemingly ok but the brake pads are always “on”. I talket to Crimaz and he told me the need to be run in for 500 km wich I find odd. The disc gets really hot after only five minutes of riding.

I have aired the system at my best. Any suggestions on what to do? Thanks
your problem resides at the master cylinder.

when your hand moves lever the fluid cant move backwards. pressure is created which pushes pads into disc. when lever is at rest the fluid is able to move backwards back into the master reservoir. first thing to check is to be sure lever is not allowing the cylinder to return to rest position. simple to remove lever to see if drag disappears. if drag is still present the problem resides in the master itself.


I just had this very problem when I purchase ebay masters for my helix project. I eliminated foot brake by converting rear cable brake to hydro. I wanted the masters to match. the ebay masters did not allow fluid to return in the rest position. I had huge brake drag problems. in my case they wouldnt drag immediately. the more you drove it the more they dragged. eventually locking the brake entirely. had to carry bleed wrench around on rides till I figured out where the heck the problem was. problem was solved by switching to factory yamaha masters. the return hole is very small and very close to first seal. I didnt want to spend the time removing guts of cylinders to modify.

side note: the drum brake converted to hydro is very powerful. very pleased with conversion. can lock rear brake from 40mph with ease. you will have to match master cylinder size to slave cylinder size properly. there are numerous sizes at both ends.
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:50:13 +0000

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 13:50:13 +0000 quote
I actually looked at doing a hydraulic conversion for the clutch on my GL project this way.

JerryD, I know you said you did it for a Helix, but how much pain/work/trouble was it to do the basic install and setup?
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:22:10 +0000

Addicted
2010 gts 300 super. 09 MP3 500 lite
Joined: Tue, 02 Apr 2013 12:44:02 +0000
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Addicted
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Thu, 12 Aug 2021 14:22:10 +0000 quote
my info is useless as far as how hard it would be on a vespa. it was easy mod on the helix. re-used ,reshaped original cable bracket for mount. ordered correct length line. my main point was how good drum brakes are when hydro operated. if I ever find an early vespa worth owning I was planning to convert both drums to hydro . its inexpensive compared to disc brake conversion.. drum brakes work far better than people give them credit for. they just basically suck when cable operated. there isnt proper leverage. drum brakes are also known to not work well if water gets into drum when raining. wasnt an issue on the helix. still has great power in the rain the few times I had to drive in it.

I could data on cylinder sizes. but if you plan to operate both front and rear with one lever all that changes as well.
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:16:59 +0000

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 08 Stella (for now)
Joined: Thu, 16 Jun 2011 14:59:35 +0000
Posts: 8436
Location: Nashville
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:16:59 +0000 quote
That makes sense. I was thinking you'd converted a fully cabled rear brake to hydraulic.

I agree that drum brakes are under-rated. I can lock up the rear wheel of every scoot I own, and they're all drums, even with an R70/120 11" wheel on my GL for added grippiness.

The front brakes, though, it's as much a problem of the spring+damper suspension causing the front end to shudder under hard braking as the weakness of the drum. I've never ridden a PX with a proper shock & a drum to know how that feels, but for hard braking, my Stella is definitely the best of all my bikes because of the modern suspension and front disc.

I guess it's time to start saving for a PK fork
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:33:42 +0000

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Banned
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Joined: Fri, 12 Jan 2007 02:38:46 +0000
Posts: 8741
Location: San Francisco
Thu, 12 Aug 2021 16:33:42 +0000 quote
chandlerman wrote:
I guess it's time to start saving for a PK fork
I could let mine go maybe, I've been wanting to switch to a Zip/ET4 fork.
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