Modern Vespa

I'm interested in hacking the tilt lock system, for reasons that I will explain later.

If I break the CAN connection between the tilt control unit and the ECU, do they do anything useful? Or do they just complain about errors?

My hope is that I can unlock the tilt and then break this connection, so the ECU will let the engine work normally regardless of what I do with the tilt lock. Is it possible?

the answer is already in the thread. when you break connection to tilt ecu bike will start but idle only.

I have the mechanical parts of tilt lock system off bike but tilt ecu is still needed as well as the sensors that the ecu locks at.

Got it. Thanks Jerryd for confirming what I thought I saw in your posts.

So here is the longer version, for anybody who is interested...
I'm doing a research project on the riding experience for tilting three wheel vehicles. One thing we are focusing on is the transition from tilt-locked low speed operation to unlocked leaning operation. We've got a couple vehicles to play with, including the MP3.

What we want to do is make it so we can manually lock and unlock the tilt. So we can play with riding it slowly in both modes, and experiment with when and how to switch modes, and how that feels.

Here is my current thought about how to accomplish this. I'd be very happy to hear your suggestions.

1.. Disconnect the tilt lock motor potentiometer, and connect a fixed resistor so the tilt controller always thinks the bike is tilt-unlocked and the ECU is happy and will let you ride.

2.. Disconnect the tilt motor power leads from the tilt controller.

3.. Install our own control unit and a handlebar switch. Our controller will drive the motor until the pot reaches 1v when the rider pushes the switch one way, and drive the motor until the pot reaches 4v when the rider pushes the switch the other way.

So what I hope we will have is:
- a bike where the Piaggio ECU is happy
- a separate working control system for the tilt lock.

What do you think? Any suggestions?

I will be following your progress. I think its very possible to achieve the goal you are after. I will say the titling ecu is simultaneously locking two systems. one hydro lock. and a second cable disc lock. only one style lock is really needed to drive around locked. so you have a few possible avenues to get the condition you are after. from the testing I did the ecu doesnt flag a code when the cable lock motor was disconnected. so you might be able to use diodes inline to the motor and turn that motor on without the tilting ecu knowing its happening.

and even easier is just manually operating the brake cable. no electronic trickery needed.

If the tilt lock is turned manual by the disc lock,the 2 locking shaft at the front suspensions will be removed.it will then allow the use of other aftermarket shocks as they do not comes will the mounting for the locking shafts.other brackets maybe needed to hold the front fenders.

Right, I could do a mechanical system with something like a brake lever actuating the tilt brake cable. It would be interesting to see how this feels without the suspension locks.

But.. I have all the parts laying around my shop to do the electronic hack. It's easy for me. The mechanical hack is certainly feasible, but I'd have to find a suitable brake or clutch lever, and adapt the cable to it... All do-able. But in this case I'll take the easier-for-me route, which also locks the suspension, and which has more tune-ability or potential for trying strategies for automated systems.

If the main intent is to circumvent the tilt lock system, wouldn't it have been a better and cheaper choice to have chosen a bike that doesn't have this system? Just sayin'.

Considering the lofty price tag of the MP3, I'd put that money towards a bigger bike vs. hacking and demoting a MP3.

My intent is *not* to defeat the tilt lock system. My intent is to make it manually controllable so I can lock and unlock at will. This is for a research project.

It may be Jerryd's intent to remove the tilt lock system, you could ask him about why he is making this choice, or he may have explained earlier in this thread.

Good luck when driving with a locked front end

I would not do more than roll it out of my garage with the tilt lock on. You hit even a small rock or pot hole and you're going over.

Wayne B

That's why ErikK should also consider trying the "disc lock" part without the hydraulic suspension locks.

It would make a major difference in handling and stability at low speeds if only the parallelogram, but not the suspension was locked.

Mind you, these guys seem to be looking for a reliable way of automating the locking/unlocking of all kinds of tilting three wheelers, not just tinkering about for fun.

Well I got the hack to work. I can now manually control the tilt lock. As y'all predicted, I wouldn't want to ride it far or fast when locked.

Thanks for the idea of locking only the tilt and leaving the suspensions unlocked. I may try that too, we'll see.

Probably nobody else in the world wants to do this... But if you are interested let me know and I'll post some notes on what I did.

In addition to what I wrote before, I also had to bypass the tilt caliper switch and the hydraulic pressure switch before the beeping would stop.

Man is that tilt lock system over-engineered! They have fail-safes on top of fail-safes. I guess being the first of its kind they wanted to be super safe.

Speaking of which... those front parallelogram arms are massive! As is the steel steer tube. Again I think they over-engineered it since it was a new thing.

You haven't owned it long have you?? Lock the front end and push is over a 2 or 3 inch deep pot hole. Make sure you are ready to keep the thing up or it may go over on you.
Not a good idea.

To ErikK
Well done. I too would like to do this hack on my Piaggio mp3 250 ie.
Any information on how you did it and what parts you used would be greatly appreciated.

I am not encouraging you to either: do it or not do it, but my point is that if you remove the tilt lock system, then you will have an expensive scooter to maintain, which is better to get a two wheeler scooter. Just a thought if it did not cross your mind,

Good luck and safe riding.

Thanks. My problem is that the ecu is not supplying power to the tilt motor.Everything else is working as it should. All sensors ok and working so I want to see if I could bypass the ecu and power the motor separately using micro switches or the potentiometer to control the run. ErikK has done this and I would appreciate any help from anyone who has done this.

change the ecu they arent that expensive secondhand

edit. misunderstood your last question so I remove answer.

just to update my own thread my scooter runs fabulous without titl lock system on the bike and I am very happy with how nice it drives. the 480lb mp3 500

Thanks Maksor, Do you have a suitable one for sale. I bought one here but it proved to be a dud. Completely dead.

no only a new one but google at boonstra parts

Thanks Maksor again. Will do.

I am no expert but I believe the pressure switch is only an output to the horn circuit. It is open on pressure, closed on zero. When I was away from home I disconnected the harness from the aluminum and plastic switch (which was the leak) to stop the horn noise on start and ran it for several days. I don't think the ECU had a clue. The seat, wiper and wheel sensors look like inputs and need to be dealt with. There is also an input from the engine ECU, probably for the RPM.

It seems that the new 300 from yamaha locks the front like mp3 but do not lock on the front suspension.

Please somebody's help me how can i deactivate tilt lock system from ecu on my mp3 125cc injection, i buy this bike without parts from tilt lock and previosly hacked ecu. Hes work good some days but after 5km he put bike in check mode and after that i must to remove + from battery and put it back for next 5km when he make this story again 😩

Man, it's been a couple years and I can barely remember parts of what I did. I left the tilt ECU in place and just fooled it by disconnecting some sensors and disconnecting the tilt lock motor.

Maybe all the lights were out at one time but a tilt light has come back on. The bike rides fine though, it's not stuck in idle.

My 'manual tilt lock' hack eventually failed so now the MP3 has no tilt lock at all. It's fine to ride it, but just a bit tricky to get off and get it on the centerstand. Not too bad.

The research project is over and the MP3 mostly just sits around. If anybody wants to make me an offer on it let me know. It's rideable as is and I've got almost all the parts to return it to stock.

How did the research project turn out, you ask? We built at least 4 prototypes of different leaning 3-wheel vehicles, from scratch. We also hacked the MP3, a Honda Gyro, and some other stuff. It was a lot of fun. You can see where we were headed, here:
https://nimbusev.com/

Sorry I can't tell you more about deleting the whole system. On a modern computer controlled bike that's probably a complicated job. If you have a carbureted bike or maybe could get an ecu off some bike that has the same engine but no tilt system, it might be do-able that way.

I have a detailed thread on how to eliminate the tilt lock system. saves 20.5 pounds and drives better without it.

Great, I'm sure CTAH4E will be interested.

Yes im werry intersted becouse i have buyed mp3 without this functions

this is the thread that details how I did it. been driving the bike five years now without the tilt lock system.

I cant foud details, please tell me how

post is sept 1 2019 on page 1.