Modern Vespa

I quote everything 100%. . Raw but true.

The Nissan battery is air-cooled as Bill dog mentioned. What was killing them at first was the hot areas like Arizona and South Florida. But the Prius battery is also air-cooled. My daughter's Prius battery failed at 228,000 miles. We had a rebuilt one installed and it is still going 2 years later. So I wonder how the Toyota batteries are different.

.. and back to the bikes

Very strange co-incidence: I was just whining about the lack of electric alternatives in the BMWs 'boxer lineup' style bikes.

I do remember the concept bike some years back, but I was not a huge fan of that as a whole.

Well, now it looks that once they've milked all out from EURO norm updates and the current boxer bikes (might take a while, agreed..), they've at least thought about alternatives:

https://electrek.co/2021/06/12/bmw-patent-reveals-upcoming-electric-motorcycle-could-make-history-as-an-industry-first/

The numbers are getting impressive - these are mostly due to the very smallest electric two-wheelers, but still.

"BNEF's latest estimates put 2020 electric two-wheeler sales at over 25 million. That's about 35% of sales globally, far ahead of passenger cars where EVs are still only around 5% of sales."

(BloombergNEF)

And yet electric cars are enormously popular in California. I can't go more than a block without spotting one going the other way. Teslas especially, but also Bolts, Leafs, Golfs, and of course my own Fiat 500e. And the people who drive them love them. Adore them. Wouldn't have anything else.

I guess Bill wasn't invited to the party.

I have driven an EV for something over 7 years now. I have owned 2 Nissan LEAFs. Both have been models of reliability, and have saved me quite a bit of money to boot. EV ownership has increased rapidly over the past several years in my area (Oregon, Washington). And Bill not withstanding, the battery has held up quite well. I understand it wouldn't like the 120 degree days in Phoenix, but what does?

An Internal Combustion Engine I guess.

Don't get me wrong I understand the increasing popularity of Electric Vehicles as those who go down that route rarely come back but the three factors that I mentioned earlier make the leap for me too big.

In the UK we have an issue with space. Property and land is expensive and therefore many of us don't have off road parking so for those living in high rises or apartments owning an EV just isn't practical.

Yes you can charge your car at the Supermarket just as long as everyone else isn't charging their car at the Supermarket.

This is going to take time.

Do you have a Fiat 500 Elettrica and I didn't know it? Do you know who the chief designer of that car is?
He is my brother-in-law ..!

Nope. I have the much earlier 500e (mine is a 2015, but I think they go back to 2013), which was only sold in California. It's one of the California Compliance Cars mandated by California regulations. They were essentially hand-built, using the Fiat 500 body and a lot of custom electronics.

It drives like someone dropped a V8 engine into a shitty Italian econobox. In other words, a whole lot of fun.

And lets face it it's probably a hell of a lot more reliable than the original.

Quite possibly. I've done absolutely nothing to it except change the tires (which it tends to burn through rather rapidly). No oil changes, no tune ups, no maintenance except tires.

I added his photo, he is a big fan of motorcycles ... modern and vintage.
The latest 500 E is a different thing (and also very expensive for a city car ..).

Maybe when you see him you could ask him to design another one as the design is 14 years old.

Yes it's the car that saved Fiat but it is getting a bit long in the tooth.

Jess, I'm curious - Who did the conversion work ? Was it an in house Fiat job or a sub contracting specialist ?

You aren't running a uranium cylinder warmer already?

I thought New Zealanders made their engines run with kiwifruit pulp.

GM are asking for a Billion Dollars from LG Chem to help with the cost of replacing the faulty batteries.

Ouch.

If you're an owner of an ageing Bolt, being offered a brand new battery is like winning the lottery.

My neighbor bought one of the very first. His sits at the end of his driveway rather than his garage, but they still drive it daily.

The new battery will have greater capacity and an brand new warranty. He's a little excited.

🤔

There is one issue though. No one knows when the new batteries will arrive.

News on battery standardization:

https://apple.news/AWLCeesUEToObflrxCrlQRg

Chris from CLE

Well, that is interesting and likely a good thing.

This looks good value at UKP2500.

https://electric.piaggio.com/en

Yuck - what a *horrible* website!

(pedant note, it's GBP, not UKP)

36 mph top speed and 53 mile range in the top model. They are really going to have to do better than this to get the attention of many of us.

I suspect that has a lot to do with your browser. It looks fine to me.

Agreed 💯

Pages like that make me leave and go elsewhere for info

I think I lasted about 90 seconds.

It's not good is it ?

Many of us, but not most of them.

That gets me to work and back for two weeks. Speed is good if it gets there in a hurry before hitting a limiter.

When the "Leccy" motorcycles and scooters match the range and performance of the gas powered one's it's always going to be a novelty or a compromise.

I'll project it will be between 5 and 10 years before they reach parity.

I really like the Zero but it's £20,000 for a 100 mile range. Na, A beaten up CG125 will go further.

It's all too new and definitely too soon.

Ouch!

I like it, the bike not website. It has a removable battery which is a lot more practical than the Elettrica and is competitively priced against the Piaggio Zip 50cc.

I really like the look of the Piaggio electric but wouldn't buy any electric scooter until they can get better range. Any figures they claim will be best case scenario. I know I'd forget to charge it and end up pushing it.

To be honest Bobo , being an Elettrica owner I'd say the published figures are correct or ere on the cautious side . And as for recharging do you often run out of charge on your phone ? If you do then owning an EV is not for you - most people don't seem to run out of battery life on their phones - EV ownership is a state of mind which becomes a habit .

I don't own an electric two-wheeler, but I do own an electric car. In 7 years I have never run out of charge on the road. In the same seven years, I have never run out of gas on a two-wheeler either.

I guess with a removable battery it's much easier to keep charged up. I don't have off street parking so would be easy enough to bring the battery in and charge it. Good theft deterrent too. 90 km just isn't far enough though. And yes I have run out of fuel a couple of times.

About the roadmaps towards electricity - Honda describes the common logic quite well in their roadmap pic.

Although Piaggio 1 and such are not catering well the needs of many members in this forum, they are a target hit to scooters' main kingdom.

Around here, the base model of Piaggio 1 is priced into the same category as the cheapest Yamaha 50cc ICE scoot - this means Piaggio is now about to sell some stuff instead of just providing curiosities for Vespa fans

In the meanwhile, they continue to make money with Aprilia Tuonos, ICE Vespas, Guzzi V85.... and apparently they've noticed too that at least in Europe good old street bikes stubbornly continue to sell, hence the 'revival of v10' in a rather interesting mix of 80's styling, a hint of Ducati's design and some Guzzisms...and who knows, mayby they even sell this one too, would do good for Guzzi brand.

Husqvarna e-pilen and e-scooter.
https://www.husqvarna-motorcycles.com/en-nz/models/e-mobility.html
https://electrek.co/2021/09/05/heres-the-first-up-close-look-at-husqvarnas-futuristic-electric-motorcycle-and-scooter/

Piaggio 1 is out. Three versions, six color combinatios and prices for Greece (prices include VAT)...

https://electric.piaggio.com/en

Piaggio 1
Top speed: 45km/h
Range: up to 55km in ECO, up to 43Km in Sport (WMTC cycle)
Price: 2690€

Piaggio 1+
Top speed: 45km/h
Range: up to 100km in ECO, up to 68Km in Sport (WMTC cycle)
Price: 3090€

Piaggio 1 Active
Top speed: 60km/h
Range: up to 85km in ECO, up to 66Km in Sport (WMTC cycle)
Price: 3290€