@ginch avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
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Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@ginch avatar
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
UTC quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
Peer review? Pffft. Don't look at me. I'm just egging you on.
ROFL emoticon ROFL emoticon
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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UTC quote
Dr Frankenstein is in the house.
Peer review - polite euphemism for when jack tells one of us we did something wrong.
🙂

Sticking with the medical analogies - my welding is now like getting your face repaired by the ER dr. Will it hold up? Sure it will. Would you recommend it to a loved one? Not so much.

So:
After playing with the lean effect in the garage with the first iteration - Discovered that I was getting a lot of push rather then steer out of the sidecar wheel. See pic below - green arrow.

To increase steer and diminish push - I need to do two things.
1. Move the side care wheel back a little relative to the scoot - getting the wheel to more closely align with the scoot rear tire. In Hack world - they call this "lead".
2. Lower the rear mount point - to decrease the lever effect from the rear pivot when the bike leans.

This should create more push at the front of the sidecar wheel - and less at the rear: which = steering.

So I ripped down the frame - and reconfigured the mounting brackets in a more robust format now that I know what my targets are.
I am keeping some flexibility in the design - the mounting brackets themselves will be replaceable. This means a bit of extra work creating mounts that are sturdy but will allow me to bolt in and out of.
For the front mount - I started with a rectangular piece of tubing - and of course, the angle grinder...
For the front mount - I started with a rectangular piece of tubing - and of course, the angle grinder...
cut up a few more bits and bobs
cut up a few more bits and bobs
stir and add heat
stir and add heat
placed but not yet connected.  will allow mount tubing to be bolted on and off.
placed but not yet connected. will allow mount tubing to be bolted on and off.
Fabbed new rear mount.  Strong enough to hang the whole bike from this.  Used square tubing to allow modification later... more to come on that front.
Fabbed new rear mount. Strong enough to hang the whole bike from this. Used square tubing to allow modification later... more to come on that front.
Back to square one again - bike flipped and ready for new fitment.  Will fab temporary frame and this time - it will be capable of a test ride...  If the motor works - and the gear box works - and the new wiring harness with blinkers is ok...
Back to square one again - bike flipped and ready for new fitment. Will fab temporary frame and this time - it will be capable of a test ride... If the motor works - and the gear box works - and the new wiring harness with blinkers is ok...
The push effect I was referring to - green arrow shows direction of wheel being pushed when bike leans right.
The push effect I was referring to - green arrow shows direction of wheel being pushed when bike leans right.
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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UTC quote
That is looking awfully good and your fab skills are admirable. You seem to be a fast learner and you have a good eye.

I think you may be on to something here and believe there could be a HUGE market for the frame only, as shown above. I would LOVE to get the wholesale Indo franchise, but Ebeth would be better suited and besides, he's actually there.

Get some kinda price figured out and hit me up? Eyelashes emoticon
of course I would recommend quality hardwood
of course I would recommend quality hardwood
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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UTC quote
That one caused a chuckle.
Crafty photo shop work my friend.
You are the first to identify the significant commercial opportunity that this build holds. (Not everyone has an eye for it)

🙂

Thanks for the laugh.
Good way to start a day.
@socalguy avatar
UTC

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7157
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
@socalguy avatar
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
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Location: So Cal
UTC quote
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Dang chaz, that looks like one of the girders on the Verrazano Bridge. Have you weighed this structure yet?
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Location: Staten Island, NY
 
Ossessionato
@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
I was wondering the same thing! You might have to tune the engine further to compensate for all the new framing! J/k it's impressive!
@qascooter avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4297
Location: Florence, OR
 
Ossessionato
@qascooter avatar
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
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Location: Florence, OR
UTC quote
Hey Voodoo - I think you were inspired by watching too many Gilligan's Island reruns! Ha! I'm digging this framework. It's quite the awesome setup. The Professor would be proud...
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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UTC quote
Ha! Indeed.
Engineers thought this would work too...
https://youtu.be/tS_Dgb8GGi4?t=159

The tail section with Verrazano attachment is about 8lbs all in from seat to pivot point. Floor board front mount is about 3lbs.
So it's not zero in total.

Sidecar rig re-engineer should shave equivelent amount - so net weight should be at or lower then prior.
Failing that - rider can lose 5lbs.

Half the added weight is below the center line of the wheels.
Does that matter? I have no idea - but it sounds good.

The square structure off the back mount from that picture will likely be chopped off just above the flat - leaving a square female hook up point - similar to a trailer hitch. I can then finesse a prettier rear mount that is removable/adjustable.

For the time being - I am moving to the ugly but strong portion of the build - so I can quickly get out and test ride - with a little luck by end of weekend.
Following that - I can get out the tube bender and make a bunch of sexy curvy parts to replace the ugly rectangular stuff I am doing now.
@lynnb avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
1963 VBB2T
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Ossessionato
@lynnb avatar
1963 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Wow this is really looking good, and it definately will float.
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Location: Staten Island, NY
 
Ossessionato
@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
SoCalGuy wrote:
Dang chaz, that looks like one of the girders on the Verrazano Bridge. Have you weighed this structure yet?
I think so cal was referring to this.. drove over today after dropping friends off at JFK.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
UTC

Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4605
Location: London UK
 
Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
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UTC quote
Nice to see some of the finest shed engineering in action.

One thought. With the back point lower than the front and the resultant steering effect on the sidecar wheel; what happens when you brake? Will it need a super hard adjustable front shock or just going to be exciting?
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
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UTC quote
Spent all this time trying to go faster.
Brake?
I suspect I will get some push to the left as weight is transferred - pendulum effect of side car levering on bike.
Have tried to get rid of any/all play so its predictable/ controllable.
Looseness in joints would definitely be my enemy.

Inventing a lot of this on the fly - hard to think through it all.
Welcome the questions,
Curious - what issue(s) do you think might arise?
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@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
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UTC quote
Iteration II is done - and she's strong enough to ride.
Not so pretty - but good step forward on structure.

Unfortunately - some neanderthal has stripped the scoot of all cables, wires, and levers, and had the motor torn down to bare aluminum cases...
Did I mention the shims?
This is a lota change - not least of which - I guess I am gonna have to balance it myself when I ride...
Hmmm.

Anyhoo - making an effort to put the bare minimum bits on so I can test ride.
And when I say bare min - things like the rear brake will likely not make the cut.
I will however, double check the cotter pin.

Just have to feed all those cables back through, and re-assemble the head set, and adjust the cables, and check the carb jetting, and...
Prepped and ready for the final two welds.
Prepped and ready for the final two welds.
Test frame iteration II - all ready to roll
Test frame iteration II - all ready to roll
UTC

Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4605
Location: London UK
 
Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
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UTC quote
charlieman22 wrote:
Inventing a lot of this on the fly - hard to think through it all.
Welcome the questions,
Curious - what issue(s) do you think might arise?
I don't think it will be an issue but as long as the shocks are stiff the effect will be minimised. The only way to know is the test ride. With the re-built engine and new everything else there will be a lot going on. Jetting and running in is going to make this quite a challenge. Be sure to video it for amusement/evidence/post mortem etc.
@harbinger avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2023 Arancia Impulsivo Vespa GTS300 HPE , 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
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Posts: 8508
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@harbinger avatar
2023 Arancia Impulsivo Vespa GTS300 HPE , 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8508
Location: Toronto
UTC quote
Jack221 wrote:
charlieman22 wrote:
Inventing a lot of this on the fly - hard to think through it all.
Welcome the questions,
Curious - what issue(s) do you think might arise?
I don't think it will be an issue but as long as the shocks are stiff the effect will be minimised. The only way to know is the test ride. With the re-built engine and new everything else there will be a lot going on. Jetting and running in is going to make this quite a challenge. Be sure to video it for amusement/evidence/post mortem etc.
Yep and please do keep us updated, this is a fun thread. Jack221 is right you'll have a lot going on when you take the scoot out.

I can't imagine a Vespa hack will be that hard to pilot but maybe run with a little ballast in the car the first few times. Yes it will pull on acceleration/deceleration and slow way down for right hand turns unless you want to all of a sudden have 2 wheel physics come in to play.
@pheasant_plucker avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
bare metal cafe racer
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Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
 
Molto Verboso
@pheasant_plucker avatar
bare metal cafe racer
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UTC quote
It's not like it didn't pull left when you braked before all this right? And if the nose dips on braking that won't cause any additional issue if you are braking in a straight line right? Won't it just minimize the effect of your system by 'leveling' the mounting points a little? So if you were somehow braking hard while turning (not a position you want to find yourself in and guessing all kinds of other issues will be going down) the side car won't help you turn.

Bet you could figure a disc brake on the sidecar too... See- there's your peer review (aka egging you on).

Or the Arduino-controlled electric motor side car boost system!
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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UTC quote
D Day
Well - it's here.
Its hard to believe it was last August this all started.
Insightfully - I posted the picture below of Keif - tho I don't think I realized at the time just how accurate the caption was.
Everything seamed fine!

What followed:
- Shoe horned an EFL transmission and new xmas tree in to an old set of bodge 150 cases.
- That took me down a road of grinding, polishing and shimming
- At which point I started opening up the inlet
- and porting the cylinder
- and time certing the bad cylinder stud hole
- which lead to 8mm studs all around
- and some kinda custom base packer
- and a few more shims
- and a new 24/24 carb
- and a fast flow tap
- and of course some quick ratio throttle spindles
- and then I thought - I know! I should re-design my side car and learn how to weld.

For the love of god - next time I post a picture of Keith - will one of you please sound the warning bell before all this goes down?

Which leaves us :"here" - where I have a totally untested - un aligned sidecar with an unproven concept for leaning - connected to a scooter with a totally untested motor that has a totally untested transmission with what I think were the right calculations for gear ratios - but I dunno - cause it's totally untested.

What could possibly go wrong?
(editors note: no animals were injured during the shooting of this movie - tho one needed a good cleaning afterwards).

https://youtu.be/j_NBTz2iGUA
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
There was an incident along the way
There was an incident along the way
@hibbert avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1757
Location: California
 
Molto Verboso
@hibbert avatar
Vespa
Joined: UTC
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Location: California
UTC quote
Oh shucks fer reals
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
Joined: UTC
Posts: 7086
Location: Tega Cay, SC
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
Joined: UTC
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Location: Tega Cay, SC
UTC quote
oh man, I loved the video, But that scoot is the t*ts, you should be proud.
@qascooter avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4297
Location: Florence, OR
 
Ossessionato
@qascooter avatar
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
Joined: UTC
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Location: Florence, OR
UTC quote
Holy crap man - that thing is BAD-ASS!!!! Clap emoticon Clap emoticon Clap emoticon Clap emoticon Clap emoticon
@gt6mk3 avatar
UTC

Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
Joined: UTC
Posts: 478
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
 
Hooked
@gt6mk3 avatar
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
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Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
UTC quote
Rover needs to learn to lean into the turns...

Totally agree with the comment at the end of the video.

Nice one! 👍

C.

(Video could possibly have been improved if you were chasing scantily dressed, buxom young ladies, with Yakety Sax laid over the audio.)
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
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Location: california
UTC quote
Quote:
Rover needs to learn to lean into the turns...
Haha! Indeed.

Pulled in to driveway feeling proud.
Took off helmet and gloves and threw them in the empty bucket next to me.
Wait! Where is the dog?
Oh sh*t.

Gloves and helmet back on.
Retrace ride.
Half way, see SUV with family of 3 heading my way.
Recall passing it earlier on my ride.
Like Scorsese movie, slow motion as we pass ea. other, them looking at me. Me looking at them.
Mother in passenger seat, mouth agape, looking horrified.
Child with face pressed to glass expressionless.
Father driving with squinting stare at me - not looking amused - mouths "its back there" as he vigorously uses his thumb to point over shoulder repeatedly.
We pass - as I wave a thank you to the family who's Sunday seems to have been shattered.

And around the corner - lies Montana.
No skid marks or stuffing missing.
But a little greasy.
Spent 30 minutes with rug shampoo cleaning before I could take second ride.

Thanks for all the nice comments gents!
Always fun to post a vid of the work when things go well.
Lots of tuning work to do - then build out of the final frame.
But generally speaking - seems really promising and fun to ride.
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
 
Ossessionato
@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
That was impressive. You and pp doing God's work. I wouldn't personally have a hack but if I did, your leaner would be what I would do!
@lynnb avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
1963 VBB2T
Joined: UTC
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Ossessionato
@lynnb avatar
1963 VBB2T
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UTC quote
OMG my eyes are still watering from watching that video , I laughed and laughed and laughed, too friggin funny, you're my Hero.


Then the narrative afterward, this is a fantastic story.
@birdsnest avatar
UTC

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VMA VSX - o9c vbc vmb
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Location: Hustletown, TX
 
Not So Moderator
@birdsnest avatar
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UTC quote
What a helluva project. So fun to watch and learn and laugh. Well done. Can't wait to see this finished product.
@pheasant_plucker avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
bare metal cafe racer
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1379
Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
 
Molto Verboso
@pheasant_plucker avatar
bare metal cafe racer
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UTC quote
Only have one question...

Why do you you have a stuffed dog???

Oh and also... so does it work??? Looks like it... but how does it feel?
@ginch avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@ginch avatar
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
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Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
UTC quote
That looks like so much fun!! The comment from the crew on set was indeed very precise and to the point, and entirely correct!
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@v_oodoo avatar
UTC

Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '87 PK125XL '92 PK50XLS Plurimatic - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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UTC quote
Hat respectfully doffed! Clap emoticon
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Posts: 4109
Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
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UTC quote
Gracious you guys - thanks.
Given that its been a year almost to the day
Lemme pass a few accolades back
'Cause this project would be waiting for a lifetime achievement award if it weren't for y'all's input.

To Greasy - who asked in the first post on my thread: 1- have you ever ridden anything motorized with two wheels? 2- have you ever operated a sidecar? 3- why sidecar? Thanks brother. I appreciate the "for the love of all things wholly" skepticism - and the barn-find startup advice you gave me on the side - even tho you knew it was a bodge.
To Rowdyc you challenged me outa the gate - but encyclopedic when it comes to model specificity. Learned a lot from your posts - respect.
To SoCal: who's answered more questions than anyone knows - frequently, on the phone while I was holding it with blue gloves leaning over the motor in total frustration. That was some bail out 911... Repeatedly. Thanks!
To Jack: ( and qascoot) who convinced me that I could tackle a motor tune - and that 1mm of grinding makes a difference - seriously - I followed qascoots P200 build and thought they were joking when Jack was trying to convince him to go grind another .5mm. Then he did. Jack - you are insolent and occasionally just plain rude - but your knowledge of 2strokes is amazing - as is your willingness to share your knowledge (one sip at a time of course 🙂 )
To whodat: who had mercy on me during my first clutch upgrade - and sent me a custom spacer at his own cost - out of the blue - that put me back on the road when I was in over my head - bringing a week of frustration to an instant end.
To PP - who can find just about anything on the internet at half the price - has a jewelers eye for design/finishes, and seems to know where all the instructions to the German shit that doesn't come with instructions is.
To ebeth who tried to help me track down the original manufacturer of the side car in Indonesia. I know we didn't find them on first go - but we still have time!
To Safis - who occasionally weighs in with some point of knowledge like I went to the local expert shop and the guy actually took the time to tell me exactly how to do it myself. Without the advice, I'd still be trying to organize the rubik's cube of gears I bought and figure out how to fit the damn xmas tree in.
To Hibbert - who showed up at my garage and helped me lift the parts in to place. Sorry about the meltdown on return!
To Swiss - the purveyor of that critical FMP video segment you know you've seen but can't remember where - at just the right time - and of course some bizarre South African music vids.
To Voodoo - who is the chief practical engineer on this and all projects - and the Christopher Kringle of critical spare parts when anyone is in need - including - apparently - entire scooter chassis. Your camel hair coat is a fitting outfit for purveyor of sage advice sir.
To Craig - who provide understated essential advice about how to fill and bleed a front disc brake system - reverse with a large syringe - in minutes rather then days - had I just bothered to listen - and also gave practical and somewhat unexpected diving lesson free of charge.
To Lynnb - who decided to cut his entire floor board off - none of us really understand why - just as I was tackling this - which somehow uncomplicated the process for me - made me braver to get the welder out.
And of course - to Ginch - who - when done yelling at me about how not to post descriptions that were too long under my photos - was the one that suggested the leaner concept in the first place - which I had never even heard of - from his expertise at finding cool shit in every dark corner of the internet and elevating it for us to consider. Thanks brother! Long way to go - but this thing is just down right fun to ride.

TLDR - Seriously, this would be a 10 year project without you guys - so anyone who enjoyed the video should consider it was only possible due to y'all's input and from all the other NSMV threads.

Thanks!

Oh - and when done here - there is the 60MPH+ VBA electric Im gonna need for my heard (with a sidecar of course).

🙂

-CM
Google mapped my house - the day I brought my first Vespa home.  Must have been inside getting cup of jo!
Google mapped my house - the day I brought my first Vespa home. Must have been inside getting cup of jo!
@ginch avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@ginch avatar
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
UTC quote
Ha ha! Brilliant stuff. I love the way you lure us all in and take us along for the ride.
UTC

Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4605
Location: London UK
 
Jet Eye Master
PX221 MHR, O tuned PX200, PX125 and some motorbikes
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4605
Location: London UK
UTC quote
It works! truly awesome
@pheasant_plucker avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
bare metal cafe racer
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1379
Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
 
Molto Verboso
@pheasant_plucker avatar
bare metal cafe racer
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1379
Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
UTC quote
charlieman22 wrote:
Google mapped my house - the day I brought my first Vespa home. Must have been inside getting cup of jo!
omg - what were the chances? too funny.

That or... perhaps the government is watching you...

Probably triggered some alerts with your google search terms so they sent some agents to check you out...

"Seriously boss, he really did buy an orange bodge Vespa with a sidecar... it's not some code words for WMDs"
⚠️ Last edited by pheasant plucker on UTC; edited 2 times
@koenig_blues avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5802
Location: Indo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@koenig_blues avatar
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5802
Location: Indo
UTC quote
Top job Brother CM and yes, i am still laugh watching the vid.. Its epic and funny, bow wheres the smile and cheer
UTC

parallelogramerist
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5256
 
parallelogramerist
Joined: UTC
Posts: 5256
UTC quote
I finally got to watch the video just now, and minute 1:07 sums it up! (i couldn't see the video on my laptop, only my phone).

This has got to be one of the most (if not most) entertaining build threads here on MV. And not just because it's some outlandish build, but because it's also super technical as well. I've rode a Stella hack setup for a few minutes just in a parking lot, and turning was definitely a challenge, but with a tilting hack, that looks just WAY more natural (safer too) to make turns. The icing on the cake is the Google Maps pic of your scoot being delivered. Great job Charlie.

Next step is to add dual axis pivoting coffee cup holders to both sides of the scooter?
⚠️ Last edited by whodatschrome on UTC; edited 1 time
@ginch avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@ginch avatar
74 Super, 75 Super, PX project, LML off-roader and '66 Blue Badge Smallframe
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8696
Location: Victoria, Australia
UTC quote
whodatschrome wrote:
Next step is to add dual axis pivoting coffee cup holders to both sides the scooter?
It's not a GT300!!!

Laughing emoticon
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
UTC quote
Thanks gents.
Now turning my focus to tuning in.
Gonna need some help.

Will get out and ride a bit today - am sure will learn a lot + & - on sidecar performance.

Meanwhile, jetting a big question.
Have watched Hibbert's thread - he has similar set up but with aluminum vs my iron cyl.

Old cyl was on 50/160 idle. (up from 48/160 where I soft seized thrashing in hills).
160AC/BE3/128. Ran well.
20/20 carb.

Now with 24/24 carb.
swapped to 138 main.
Fairly significant 4 stroking down low.

Have 120 AC I plan to swap on before I take out today.
Would it make sense to match where Hibbert is with idle - or stick with the 160's
(48/50/55)?

Jack - any thoughts here?
Test frame got a foot pad added - allows me to keep bike upright when stopped - without risk of toppling over on sidecar (in theory)
Test frame got a foot pad added - allows me to keep bike upright when stopped - without risk of toppling over on sidecar (in theory)
In practice - works nicely - as long as I can train myself to use it.
In practice - works nicely - as long as I can train myself to use it.
@harbinger avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
2023 Arancia Impulsivo Vespa GTS300 HPE , 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8508
Location: Toronto
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@harbinger avatar
2023 Arancia Impulsivo Vespa GTS300 HPE , 2022 BMW R1250GSA 40th Anniversary, 2019 Ural Gear Up
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8508
Location: Toronto
UTC quote
Looks awesome! Absolutely love the colour. The Ural dealer had one done in about the same orange last I was there and that was amazing looking as well.

Sorry can't help you much with tuning but can help/answer any questions about piloting a hack.

Little safety advice... first time you fly the chair not on purpose just roll off the throttle gently, it'll drop back down. Slow way down on right hand turns until you get the hang of it. The Vespa I imagine is pretty light comparatively though and shouldn't be too hard to manhandle.

I'm not joking, the Ural dealer has had MANY "I've ridden for years" guys try to drive a new rig home and wreck less than 10 minutes away.
OP
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
UTC quote
Harbinger - thanks for the good words
I love the color too - tho its not for everyone.
I plan to loose the silver and change that to an off white.
Go full bodge creamsicle with this one - embrace it's history.

I had the hack mounted traditionally before - meaning rigid.
Now - it's set up on pivot points - allowing the scoot to lean.
Check out this vid - you will get the idea.
It was my first test: https://youtu.be/j_NBTz2iGUA

Jack - more on jetting.
I should note - my 50/160 is boggy on the stand off of throttle - and my idle seems to be all over the place. I keep reaching down and lowering it.
As I type - I am thinking I need to double check the damn spring is on the screw 'cause it keeps changing.

See above for lay out and jetting questions.
Off to go see the paint shop and learn how to ride this thing!
Thanks!
-CM
⚠️ Last edited by charlieman22 on UTC; edited 1 time
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
 
Ossessionato
@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
Impressive. Love the foot rest. That hack looks fun!
@hibbert avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1757
Location: California
 
Molto Verboso
@hibbert avatar
Vespa
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1757
Location: California
UTC quote
wow so impressed Chuck. Never even thought of the swivel at stop awesome!

Is there some kind of quick locking in case you need to get off the scooter how does that work?

Do what Jack221 says for the jetting. For now don't put too much focus on the pilot unless you can't run it but find where 2nd is unridable on the the main jet WOT and then come down. At that point you'll be able to start cleaning things up. You have a different air filter system with the Polini.
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