Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:24 pm

Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
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Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
Joined: 18 Aug 2016
Posts: 422
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:24 pm linkquote
Whoohoo - welcome back. Stuck stuck in never ending lockdown here, so...

Entertain me!
Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:26 pm

Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3106

 
Ossessionato
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Posts: 3106

Tue Sep 14, 2021 9:26 pm linkquote
nicely done!
Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:52 pm

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Ossessionato
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Tue Sep 14, 2021 10:52 pm linkquote
qascooter wrote:
Right on CM22 - glad to see you back at it!
Makes two of us.
Quote:
This crank might run straight from the start, worth a try. The longer stroke cranks have bigger webs so the big end bearing doesn't lose diameter.
It's making wrong decisions that wastes the most time/money/energy, so....is there any point in saying try not to be hasty?
Nope.
That said - this one has all sorts of potential for public faceplant.
I'm not worried about learning how to machine stuff.
I'm a little worried about the carnage on the road to that learning...
Quote:
Whoohoo - welcome back. Stuck stuck in never ending lockdown here, so...

Entertain me!
Well - turn about fair play.
Maybe you can throw in some ideas on clamping/centering/leveling
I think I've figured out how to clamp the cases while assembled - perpendicular to the milling table - using part of my welding table as a fixture. (run-on but not a typo).
Table came with removable wings that are perfect 90's (theoretically).
I'll remove a wing - and clamp its base to the milling table.

Gotta figure out how to:
Get the deck surface perfectly level on the Y axis. Plan to use dial indicator and try to tap it in to place once clamped snug but not tight.
Get the case halves centered when I hog them out. Not so critical on the fly side - but on the inlet pad side - if I don't want to accidentally make this into a reed valve...

Have a coaxial indicator and an edge finder.
No idea really how to use them.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Missed this.
Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:06 am

Hooked
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Hooked
Bodgerific 150 Super, PX200(ish...), US 50 Special in progress
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Posts: 422
Location: Melbourne, Way Downunder
Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:06 am linkquote
Highly recommend you pull out the welder and build a jig.

They make life easy



This smallie on has been under the house for a while, so it's generating a nice patina. However, you can see it has multiple ways to bolt an engine case (or part thereof) into it, and 3 leveling screws (a.k.a. bolts through welded on nuts) set in a triangle through the base.

They allow it to be levelled, abut also clamped, and adjusted around the x plane till perfect.


"The jig is up..."


Triangle of jacking screws


Not fancy, but very effective

Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:24 am

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4009
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
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Wed Sep 15, 2021 4:24 am linkquote
Welcome back, CM2!

It's great to see you diving back in and basically lapping the likes of me on upping your welding, machining, and Fainting Couch Activation skills!

These sorts of posts get me more motivated than ever to take my game to the next level, as I pick up bits and pieces of technique to apply once I get the basic skills.

And for some further thoughts on fixing the Brass Bushing, just go check out the Bodgespotting thread.
Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:23 am

Ossessionato
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Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:23 am linkquote
Gt6MK3 wrote:


This smallie on has been under the house for a while, so it's generating a nice patina.
I agree - Ginch's patina is not so bad, but calling him small and keeping him under the house seems kinda harsh. Wondered where he'd been!
🙂


I think my welding table "wing" is going to make a nice stand with flexible clamping - but the addition of leveling bolts on 3 points could be a nice upgrade. Thanks for that. Pics to follow.

Assembled the cases this morning and see that if I want to "flow" the path from the crank to the Malossi's transfers - I need a little more meat still added on the clutch side


Arrows show areas for back fill. Want to optimize the ports in the cases (from the other side) to match the Malossi - and provide straight flow from inlet. Flow path in red

Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:05 pm

Hooked
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Hooked
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Wed Sep 15, 2021 6:05 pm linkquote
charlieman22 wrote:
Have a coaxial indicator and an edge finder.
No idea really how to use them.
¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Missed this.
Really good vid for the co-axial

Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:54 pm

Ossessionato
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Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 15, 2021 7:54 pm linkquote
Quote:
Really good vid for the co-axial
Good walk through.
Tks.

The challenge with the inlet (big) side is multi fold.
- The area around the crank is not a full circle - so can't indicate off that. It also has the inlet pad bumping up also - so its out.
- The bronze bearing seat is all I have to use. It being an old set of cases - there are imperfections in the surface - that cause the indicator to jump around a bit. Tougher than a perfectly machined surface - but it will do.
- The cases flex (as Craig has previously noted from his experience - which I will have right after I need it...) when you clamp them. It will be quite a feet to get them level and square -

So I am practicing on that spare set of bodge cases that I abused with the welder.
Have a ways to go...

In the mean time - was also able to finish up the welding today.
Am not in a rush to mess with my inlet pad - that will get JB weld treatment this time around.
But there are some sensitive areas above it that need addressing to allow me to make the inlet larger.

Some pics below of the day's welding.
Tomorrow - I will likely start taking material away.
It will be a challenge...


Practice cases on deck - some criminally bad first attempts at machining - but these things were totaled somewhere in Vietnam before they came to me for practice.


Prepped for weld. Note the hole on the right - goes all the way through the cases. It is tapped and holds the stud that I ground into when I was opening up my inlet last time - see next.


Welded. This will extend the width of the case transfer ports - and allow me to grind freely to shape them for better flow (in theory). I'll make sense when you see the shape I plan to grind the transfer inlets


X marks the spot. I had ground through to the stud when previously shaping the inlet. So this needed to be addressed. My plan is to move this stud.


I ran a drill that was just slightly oversized into the stud hole from the back (the hole when all the way to the clutch and previously was an air leak issue). This gave me fresh metal to weld into.


Welded up, rough ground, and ready for final shaping.

Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:26 am

Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 4:26 am linkquote
That co-axial indicator is the business- I want one.

You should make your case mount fit a rotary table. Mill the pad easy.

Ps - the 10EE is about the right colour now. Anthracite or gun metal grey. Cerakote it ;P
Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:53 am

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 9:53 am linkquote
Pheas'
A rotary table would be a nice tool for the job. Excellent point.
I'm currently working without one...
Well - I was - until I woke up this morning and some guy down the street was selling a rotary table for a couple hundred bucks - 12" - made in Japan - "please just come pick this thing up".
Man - talk about falling in my lap.

I'm not sure if that will be any more precise than the large boring head I have.
It is pretty damn precise.

The biggest technical challenge is... I really have no clue what I'm doing.
The second biggest challenge is... the concentricity on this has to be super precise for a rotary pad. At the factory - they would have cut both the center bearing and the rotary without ever moving the cases off center - is my guess.

The clearance from the crank web to the rotary pad is supposed to be .05mm.
That is pretty damn tight tolerance.
Have some ideas - will work on it.

My rotary is a little beaten - but I'm not opposed to using some JB for this build.
It will wear with time and grit - but may be the smart play.

I thought Joe Casola's (Saints Cycle Works) fix was pretty smart - he still machined the pad - which surprised me. Seems the value of doing it this way would be getting perfect clearance when you insert the pad - but I'm sure there were reasons he chose to then machine.
It may be related to heat and warpage of the cases in that area.

In any event - I think the addition of a few tack welds would ensure permanence. May experiment with my test cases with this - but not until I am done prepping my existing cases.

Pictures of Joe's system below.








Joe's specs

Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:42 am

Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:42 am linkquote
Ahhh yes, you have a large boring head. That sounds like an insult!

Seems like you need that co-axial indicator then? How else would you centre the work?
Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:59 am

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
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Lucky
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Joined: 16 Jun 2011
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 11:59 am linkquote
Could you install a main bearing and then center against that, or is there too much play in the bearing for that? Or maybe just a dummy ring with an OD the same as a bearing and a precise ID?
Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:56 pm

Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 12:56 pm linkquote
chandlerman wrote:
Could you install a main bearing and then center against that, or is there too much play in the bearing for that? Or maybe just a dummy ring with an OD the same as a bearing and a precise ID?
That's what I was thinking. 'Cept I don't really understand the cases and what you are doing to them enough. The approach and pics from Casola show you could centre from the bearing insert. If that is out somehow then surely that needs to be sorted - and your best chance of finding the centre is still indicating from that surface. But CM22 is working from the other side atm?

Last edited by pheasant plucker on Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:07 pm; edited 1 time in total
Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:03 pm

Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 1:03 pm linkquote
And what's with the loctite and JB weld? Surely if you are gonna bother machining the pad you build it up with the tig and machine it down? I feel like I have seen that done before somewhere…
Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:40 pm

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Ossessionato
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 8:40 pm linkquote
Quote:
chandlerman wrote:
Could you install a main bearing and then center against that, or is there too much play in the bearing for that? Or maybe just a dummy ring with an OD the same as a bearing and a precise ID?
pheasant plucker wrote:
That's what I was thinking. 'Cept I don't really understand the cases and what you are doing to them enough. The approach and pics from Casola show you could centre from the bearing insert. If that is out somehow then surely that needs to be sorted - and your best chance of finding the centre is still indicating from that surface. But CM22 is working from the other side atm?
Unfortunately, the bearing itself has too much play in it to hit the .05mm clearance between crank and inlet pad. Have to be much tighter on center.

I have a coaxial indicator - and use it. The issue is - the center bronze bushing has so many grooves and scars that there is likely .05 to .1 of "TIR' or total run out that the indicator will pick up. .1mm gents - thats the thickness of a human hair, an RCH is rumored to be .12
That video that Craig posted where the needle just sits perfectly - was done on a smooth surfaced inner diameter.

My point here is, the clearance our little motors run on is .05, or half the thickness of that hair. That is some precision stuff.

The boring bar method of cutting the pad is tough - because even if one nails center on the cases - you are left guessing on the bar length adjustment - or repeatedly trial fitting - for the crank to pad clearance.
However - the rotary table that Pheas' proposed brings the digital read out back in to play.
One can "zero out" the reading on the center - then move the tool an exact digital amount.
I still think I will need some kind of dummy crank to drop in to check clearances - but a plan is hatching.

[/quote]


(Practice Cases)
Basic set up will look something like this.
Rotary table was a steel (Japanese made - nice), but requires smaller T nuts and hardware.
They will arrive Sunday...

Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:46 pm

Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
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Thu Sep 16, 2021 10:46 pm linkquote
Yeah boi… looking good! Nice score. Still gonna have to find the centre and surely the best bet is indicating off the insert surface. Using the rotary table you can take your time and assess the surface being indicated - only count the un-trashed areas. I'm assuming you can get away with this surface being rough because of the seals?

I wondered if using an old crank to make a centering tool, checking tool, and even cutting tool would work? Wouldn't be impossible to slot in a 1/2" piece of HSS sitting 0.05 proud (would recess the slot so enough tool was exposed for clearance). Could even hold it in with bolts (which would mean you could potentially adjust the cut depth. One problem would be that such a tool centered by a bearing would be locked in the x and y axis - would have to lower it on the z axis to make the cut. And also probably have the cutting edge below the crank - otherwise would have to be <0.05 to fit at all.

Is there no boring tool that you can fine tune the cut diameter out there? Could make such a tool from an old crank I bet. Cut some dove-tail ways into it that a tool holder slots into. Use some thread to move the tool on the ways. Washer and bolt to lock the holder in place.
Fri Sep 17, 2021 3:54 am

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
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Lucky
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Fri Sep 17, 2021 3:54 am linkquote
charlieman22 wrote:
Unfortunately, the bearing itself has too much play in it to hit the .05mm clearance between crank and inlet pad. Have to be much tighter on center.
That's the problem I was thinking you could solve by installing something (bearing or bushing inside the bushing) with a Known Good/Smooth inner surface to align the cases to center them.

Past that, I'm back to my seat in the Peanut Gallery
Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:10 am

Ossessionato
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Ossessionato
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Fri Sep 17, 2021 8:10 am linkquote
pheasant plucker wrote:
Yeah boi… looking good! Nice score. Still gonna have to find the centre and surely the best bet is indicating off the insert surface. Using the rotary table you can take your time and assess the surface being indicated - only count the un-trashed areas. I'm assuming you can get away with this surface being rough because of the seals?

I wondered if using an old crank to make a centering tool, checking tool, and even cutting tool would work? Wouldn't be impossible to slot in a 1/2" piece of HSS sitting 0.05 proud (would recess the slot so enough tool was exposed for clearance). Could even hold it in with bolts (which would mean you could potentially adjust the cut depth. One problem would be that such a tool centered by a bearing would be locked in the x and y axis - would have to lower it on the z axis to make the cut. And also probably have the cutting edge below the crank - otherwise would have to be <0.05 to fit at all.

Is there no boring tool that you can fine tune the cut diameter out there? Could make such a tool from an old crank I bet. Cut some dove-tail ways into it that a tool holder slots into. Use some thread to move the tool on the ways. Washer and bolt to lock the holder in place.
There are about 4 pages in this thread with a half crank as a tool - turned into a cutting head.
The beauty of machining is - there isn't a "right way - there are lots of solutions to achieving the outcome.
For time being I am focused on the end mill solution.
I have a crank that I intend to take put on the lathe and ever so slightly - but precisely turn down the shaft on - so I can use it as a test. May keep it as a whole - so I can fit the case halves together and assure its fully aligned when testing.
Soon to be back to more pictures and less verbiage.
Quote:
That's the problem I was thinking you could solve by installing something (bearing or bushing inside the bushing) with a Known Good/Smooth inner surface to align the cases to center them.
That's a good idea - hadn't thought of it. Bearing wont work for play I think - but Perhaps I could turn an insert that could give me a smooth surface. Thanks!
Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:55 pm

Molto Verboso
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Fri Sep 17, 2021 1:55 pm linkquote
charlieman22 wrote:
There are about 4 pages in this thread with a half crank as a tool - turned into a cutting head.
Ahhh lol. I remember now… (it was a while ago) and then you got that fancy boring tool. Classic.
Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:19 pm

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Ossessionato
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Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:19 pm linkquote
Getting everything on center is a challenge.
Without making a meal of this - the simple math works like this.
Once the rotary table is centered - the table has to stay put.
So while I can use the tools discussed above to try and center the cases - I have to try and move the cases by hand.
See if you can move a case .05mm - in 4 different directions.

So I decided to make a tool to center the cases.
But to do that - I needed to get the new (old) lathe up and running.
That took some time - but was well worth it.

The lathe is just an incredible tool.
It's power and accuracy is the real deal.
Though I have never used a lathe in my life - I managed to fabricate the tool I had in mind.


I fabricated this center plug on the left from a block of aluminum as seen on the right.


The plug is a precision fit to the bronze bearing seat. Plug is perfectly round - and I can really see how abused/out of round my bronze bushing seat is.


The collet holder is a precision fit to the centering plug. This will fit into the milling machine's spindle and center the case. Think I will be able to do some nice precision work with this. Will find out soon.

Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:25 pm

Hooked
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Hooked
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Sun Sep 19, 2021 11:25 pm linkquote
Nicely done.
Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:37 am

Lucky
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Lucky
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Mon Sep 20, 2021 4:37 am linkquote
That is damn cool, CM. Truly next-level work right there.
Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:08 am

Molto Verboso
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 2:08 am linkquote
Nice one. On the EE? Finish looks mint - jealous. Should work a treat. Know the runout of your mill?
Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 pm

Ossessionato
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 8:29 pm linkquote
Quote:
Nice one. On the EE? Finish looks mint - jealous. Should work a treat. Know the runout of your mill?
Well - the lathe is close to zero - the mill has about .0015" or .04mm - which is more than I would like. That is increased when I put a tool in - to as much as double depending on the tool quality.
I think the issue is some light galling on the inside of the spindle taper.
Looking into what it would take to have that re-ground (they do it on-site).

Ran test tonight on the test cases fly side. They have to be spindled out to 98.5mm to allow the 64mm crank to fit. This is probably the easiest of the machining processes - but still takes time to get fully level and set up. Pleased with the outcome and ready to try it on my actual cases.

Next couple days will show how well I am able to control the machines - and get some results that will allow me to build. The brass bearing seats and the clutch side case are the toughest.



Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:32 pm

Molto Verboso
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:32 pm linkquote
Awesome. We need some video! And before and after shots. Please. =)
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:36 pm

Ossessionato
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:36 pm linkquote
It's coming - and will get out of the weeds a bit and into some more interesting execution.
You might have noticed - this case half was cut with a boring bar - nice thick one - rather than the rotary table.

I haven't been pleased with the surface finish I have managed with the end mills and the rotary table - so I have come up with another method.
This was a quick pass - but it still has acceptable surface finish on the cut.
I can slow down my feed for the final - to get a little nicer surface.

Should have some fun stuff to share by the weekend.
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:38 pm

Hooked
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Hooked
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:38 pm linkquote
Noice!

Are you running a stationary fly cutter/boring bar, or controlling the movement with cnc? (or have you figured out the dark art of centering on a rotary table?).
Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:59 pm

Ossessionato
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Ossessionato
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Tue Sep 21, 2021 9:59 pm linkquote
I managed to get the rotary table sorted - and it would have been fine for the fly side - but I wanted a smoother finish for the clutch side/inlet pad.

Editors note: the irony here is that this set of cases should have been made into reed valve/ and the spare set which I have stored away have a perfect rotary on them.


No matter. Rotary table is there if I need it - but I am using a 3" boring head with 3/4" boring bar. Think I can get there with this.
No CNC as of yet. Milling machine was CNC from factory - but I got it for "free" because its computer had died.
Put a DRO on it to get accuracy, attached my kids scalextric race track DC power supply to move the servos, and hooked up some manual controls.

For super fine feeding - I turn the belted drive cogs by hand. It's quite a site...



Wed Sep 22, 2021 7:31 pm

Ossessionato
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Ossessionato
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Wed Sep 22, 2021 7:31 pm linkquote
Excellent work. Running KITT manually eh? I don't think David Hasselhoff ever drove kit manually, except when the crazy stunts happened, which, looks like is about to happen in your garage
Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:44 pm

Ossessionato
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Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:44 pm linkquote
Ok - to help untangle the spaghetti at the wall of this project:
- Fly side cases need to be spindled out to 98.5mm to accept the large webs of a 64mm crank.
- Clutch side's bronze (copper?) bearing seat is thrashed and out of round
- Clutch side needs a groove cut for the p200 crank lip
- Inlet pad has seen better days - have considered ignoring it, patching with JB weld, or welding and machining.
- Then have to deck the surface for cylinder - as I have extended
- Bore the skirt area for the cylinder - because I burned through with some welding and there has been so much heat that its best to make it true again.
- And of course - port the damn thing to match the cylinder.

The bearing seat and pad are the two most technically challenging.
I've spoken to a number of people. What I am hearing is:
When you weld up the pad - the narrow bridge at the inlet warps.

That's likely why Joe Casola is bonding in a part - rather then welding up the pad.
I am putting it last on the list - as I want to have my mojo working by the time I get there.
Kinda an all or nothing finish.

As for the bearing seat - couldn't find anyone who has don it.
Shot a note to Safis - he said no - but that he had damaged one while welding in the reinforcement plate.

Gave that a thought for a moment and decided not to do any more welding.
Kidding!!
What thread do you think you're reading anyway??

If Safis came loose when he was welding in the reinforcement plate - then maybe what I should do is... weld in a reinforcement plate!
(I know - its just how my mind works. There is nothing you can do about it. Ask my wife.)_

Below is an update in pics.


Took measures - its out of round - so my bearing is being pinched but not held 360 degrees.
My suspicion is, the bearing oscillates leading to the crank failure.


Sketch of the bearing seat. It's been beaten out of shape in width - to the point of being wider than the bearing.


I cut a few slots for leverage so I could beat the seat out when the cases got hot - then got on to the reinforcement


Tried to use Safis' template - but ended up just making my own. Put tape in and marked a line around it - using light underneath to help me see.


I put that on foam core, and cut it out. Then used fine sandpaper to taper it and fit it.


Then I created an aluminum one from that - and taper and fit it, scuffing up the cases where the weld would go


Out came the welder. I'm a little out of practice - started getting better as I went. A bit of cracking in a few spots if you look close. That is likely due to not enough filler rod - I was using thin stuff and couldn't feed quick enough. I will go bac


Oh - and Safis - THANKS! Welding up the cases was the perfect way to heat soak before removing seat.

Mon Sep 27, 2021 2:00 am

Molto Verboso
bare metal cafe racer
Joined: 01 Sep 2017
Posts: 1334
Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
 
Molto Verboso
bare metal cafe racer
Joined: 01 Sep 2017
Posts: 1334
Location: Aotearoa (New Zealand)
Mon Sep 27, 2021 2:00 am linkquote
My brain hurts on your behalf.

Wish I could tig aluminum.
Looking awesome.
Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:21 am

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4009
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4009
Location: Nashville
Mon Sep 27, 2021 6:21 am linkquote
Amazing work there all around. I LOVE the combo of welding in the reinforcement (something I need to build skillz for) and using the excess heat to get that bushing out. That's genius!
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:37 am

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
 
Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:37 am linkquote
pheasant plucker wrote:
My brain hurts on your behalf.

Wish I could tig aluminum.
Looking awesome.
Tks.
Not my prettiest weld - but cast aluminum is a bear.
The impurity's make it tough - all that oil has soaked in - and of course they don't cast with 100% premium virgin aluminum...
All the stuff rises up to the surface.
That's what the dull pitted stuff is.
I will grind it back a little to take that surface off, then wash it back and forth with the torch to ensure no cracks and really good penetration everywhere.

My plan is to fabricate a new bearing seat - then do the final pass with the welder to ensure penetration and remove any cracking that I can identify during clean up.
That'l get the cases back up to super temp to press in the new seat.
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:53 am

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
 
Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:53 am linkquote
chandlerman wrote:
Amazing work there all around. I LOVE the combo of welding in the reinforcement (something I need to build skillz for) and using the excess heat to get that bushing out. That's genius!
Tks.
The TIG welding just takes a lot of practice - and a ton of patience.
But once nice thing is - you can see what your doing - really clearly - which I can't say the same for MIG welding all the time.
It's addictive.
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:53 am

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 5317
Location: Hustletown, TX
 
Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 5317
Location: Hustletown, TX
Mon Sep 27, 2021 7:53 am linkquote
mad scientist

Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:46 pm

Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
 
Ossessionato
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: 26 Jan 2019
Posts: 2476
Location: california
Mon Sep 27, 2021 10:46 pm linkquote
Ok - some progress. - at least on the test cases.
Think I am going to be able to do a nice job on the bearing seat.

Mine are all kinda out of round.
What I hadn't counted on - 'cause I'm naive - is the the aluminum cases have also been beaten out of round.

Why this matters: I have two options for fitting the bearing seat after I fabricate it.
- I can press it in to a heated case as per original
- or I can use some loctite - like Joe did on his inlet pad fix. It's new fangled and strong.

I was thinking loctite, but then realized the issue would just reoccur as the bushing received the same forces and nothing was supporting it.
Basically - the aluminum was oblong from a life of abuse.

So this is what I did:
(NOTE - this is all on the practice cases - bless their heart - that have given their lives so others can live).


First I machined the cases - oversizing the hole by about .125mm. Just enough to clean up the oval shape and make it round again. (this is actually an action shot from a vid)


Once done - hole was nice and clean - measured within .001mm in all directions. So much nicer to work with.


Then I just had to turn this hunk of bronze into one of those rings you see on the table


Little lathing


Double check my size. Was targeting 66.3
Not too shabby.


Ready for install. Note - its a little thick on the ID... My plan is to insert it - then cut it and the pad at the same time - ensuring concentricity of the crank to the pad. Should let me get it right down to .05mm clearance. That will be done on the


Heated the cases - and pressed it in with the mill. I took the time to measure the ID of the aluminum before and after heating. It expanded from 66.20 to 66.30, or .1mm. This will be my target interference, perhaps a hair over.

Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:03 am

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6145
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6145
Location: So Cal
Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:03 am linkquote
"Some progress"? ... holy crap CM, stop being modest, that's cutting edge stuff (pun intended). How many machine shops out there fabricate and install new main bearing races? This is huge progress. Nice work!
Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:17 am

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 5317
Location: Hustletown, TX
 
Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 5317
Location: Hustletown, TX
Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:17 am linkquote
I repeat...
Birdsnest wrote:
mad scientist

Just crazy.
Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:27 am

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4009
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4009
Location: Nashville
Tue Sep 28, 2021 5:27 am linkquote
This little sub-thread is soooooo good.

Not only is CM2 advancing the state of the art for restoring and improving cases, but also calling out things that we generally don't consider, like the fact that the piston and bearings pounding on the cases will eventually warp the whole damn thing.

I'm lovin' it
Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:00 am

Hooked
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 104
Location: northern New York
 
Hooked
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 104
Location: northern New York
Tue Sep 28, 2021 10:00 am linkquote
This gives me flashbacks to measuring case bores and main bearings on the VW type 4 I recently built.

I wonder how many people just shove the roller bearing in the case without measuring, though I get the feeling that these engines tolerate a lot.

I like your work.
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