Modern Vespa

I'm confused about some of the things I'm reading about the 2019 GTS 300's. In the US, will they all have the new HPE engines and LED lights?

According to the post by AF1 Racing in the thread below, MY2020 will be the first for the US. Looks like LEDs are standard for the HPEs:

Review on the new Vespa GTS 300 HPE

I'm not sure we got the Euro 4 engine in the US, which was detuned from the Euro 3, and lost horsepower. All the comparisons that rave about the big difference are comparing the new HyPE engine to the Euro 4. If you compare it to the NAFTA (US) market engine, it's not that much of a change. But it has been demonstrated that if you make the exhaust louder and decrease horsepower by 15%, many people will swear a bike is faster and more powerful, so most of the people in the US who ride the new GTS after hearing from Piaggio how much more powerful it is, will really notice a big difference.
One of the things about the new engine that is surprising is that they didn't change the valves. That was commonly considered the biggest weakness of the GTS engine, that the same head and valve size was used on the 125 and the 300. Most of the horsepower gains (approx. 75%) from the Malossi cylinder kits for the 300 are the result of bigger valves in the head, so I was surprised that Piaggio didn't go in that direction now that they've pretty much escaped from the 125cc LC leader engine.
It would be interesting to see how the new HyPE GTS performs against a 2011-2013 GTS300. I suspect that if you put them both on a scale, there will be some weight difference, and I'm not sure how much of that one more horsepower is sucked up by the Traction control and other systems not present in the early bike.
Keep in mind when you ride a Vespa with the "new" High Performance Engine that you are talking about a little more than one, uno, 1, O. N. E., horsepower increase in the US market. Aftermarket performance exhausts routinely produce more than that, and it will be interesting to see how many people who claim pipes don't make a noticeable difference, will jump on the "huge difference in performance" bandwagon when the new engine comes to the US.

I rode the new HPE GTS. My butt dyno told me there's no difference...

You need to go back and read the press release again, and again, and again... until you Believe.

Hahaha. I'll just trust my butt dyno. One of the things that Piaggio's good at, is marketing and press releases...

Well, that sort of dampens my desire for a new one.

Have a look at Vesapaforum.de. The Germans have been riding the HPE Vespas for a couple of months now. They are very enthusiastic about the performance increase. It is not Piaggio HyPE.

You might need an online translator. That's what I use.

I appreciate all the replies! I ordered a 2019, and had mixed feelings about the possibility that it would come with a new engine design. I typically prefer "tried and true", to being on the cutting edge.

I did not find the enthusiasm you mentioned. As they debated amongst themselves as to whether any of the data entered by posters was scientific. About the only solid scientific thing I found was "The Internet is a big spittoon" on one of the posts.

Of course I am old and may have missed a better thread.

Some comments from Vespaforum.de

Here is my first report. So my new GTS 300 Super HPE 2019 drives powerful and buttery soft. It also accelerates from the bottom with a lot of power and harmonious. Since rolling out smoothly as well as re-accelerating. The drive noise is subtle and the exhaust even bubbles something. Everything seems very coordinated and suitable. The LED light is bright and illuminates the road very well.
TheLast4V

the first long exit was on 200 kilometers of fun I can only confirm everything that there is to now feedback on the new hpe, everything is better than the old 300 engine of the gts. the first 130 kilometers from graz away i drove federal road (Wechselbundesstraße) and only 20 kilometers before vienna neustadt I am then on the highway. what can I say, just awesome and I can claim to say after 125000 kilometers total with 5 recent gts300 the old engine more than enough to know and to compare a comparison to the new. the first 130 kilometers went up and down many curves and then came the change (high mountain with ski area) which separates the federal states of styria and lower austria. the new hpe engine has so much more torque and a pleasure to turn on the throttle. power without end even on slopes where my old gts vespen are always broken. everything so supple and calm and with ease the new hpe motor overcomes all slopes
DJWolf

If you visit Vespaforum.de you will also find acceleration timings for old and HPE GTS300s, 0-50, 0-80, 50-80, etc. They show a big difference. Zirri has dyno tested the HPE, and reports that the HPE has significantly more power, but not as much as the old engine with the Malossi V4 cylinder/head kit.

I don't know if you've ridden the New Fly 125 3V and a Honda PCX 125 at some point or another. If you compare the specs for the 150cc models, Honda claims the PCX 150 makes one more horsepower than Piaggio says the Fly 150 3V makes. That one horse has got to be the world's biggest, most powerful horse.

Mike,
I think you're right, and there is probably a noticeable difference between the HyPE (typing that makes me smile) engine and the Euro 4. But in the US, we have Euro 3 bikes. If you compare an Euro 3 model to a Euro 4, you will also feel a difference. Piaggio made something a lot worse, then made it slightly better than it was before they it worse. So if you skip the one that was a lot worse, I don't think you are going to be as overwhelmed by the new motor.
Just out of curiosity, did this one guy on the internet notice the drop in performance between Euro 3 and Euro 4? I remember people who just bought one saying the loss of power wasn't that big of a deal, and now it's like they're riding a Hayabusa.

One thing that is interesting about this semi-new engine is how much of a departure it is from how Piaggio usually develops product. It's not in any of the Piaggio 300cc models. In the past, it seemed like they tried to work things out in the Piaggio lineup first, then put them into the Vespa bodies. So if it doesn't work out like they hope.... have you priced the difference between ESS components and the same component for a non-ESS bike lately? Of course, that only matters if it breaks.

DJ Wolf has several GTS300s and GTS300vs, and he usually grabs every new model the moment it appears in the shops, so he would certainly be comparing the HPE to the latest pre-HPE. TheLast4V has only been a member for a year and I don't know his riding history, but I'm pretty sure he was riding a 2017 model before his HPE.

I had herd about a small decrease in power to meet Euro emission guidelines, but have no experience with it. I have two GTS300s, 2015 and 2018. I think they both have the new camshaft. They are both kitted with V4 cylinders and heads, and I can't detect any difference in power. Before them I had a 250.

My 2015 model has the ESS suspension, but it makes little difference. I have never experienced handlebar wobble on any of my Vespas.

A couple of horsepower either way really isn't a big deal at all. Piaggio aren't trying to make the most powerful Vespa ever they're trying to maintain the current (perfectly sufficient) levels of performance while meeting the ever tightening emissions laws.

The HPE meets Euro 5 and still drives fine, that in itself is something of an achievement. Cars are already on Euro 6 and it will hit motorcycles in a year or two. Toyota has been forced to increase their 1330cc engine to 1500cc to maintain current power and driveability. We may see a 330cc Vespa along the way, but don't expect it to be any faster! And don't whine when it isn't!

Why didn't Piaggio change the valve sizes? They had no reason to want to. They're making scooters for the streets of Milan not the bankings of Monza.

I'm on the German forum Mike is talking about. The reports are positive about the new motor.

Plus, the guys reporting are all Austrians. They are all Vespa freaks and excellent tuners. If they write the new motor is better....I'll believe them any day.

A fellow in Germany just bought his new one, was at the dealership while it was being unwrapped, fresh from the factory.

Also....the price has not gone up!! At least from this particular dealer.

Just another note. These guys (at last some of them) are the world leaders in tuning Vespa GTS300s. They typically get 30 hp out of their engines, and they really know what they are talking about. I would believe them before I believe any mutterings on this forum (no offence, guys, I love you all).

Aw, shucks, what a nice thing to wake up to on a Saturday morning!

I love you too, man.

Forgive me for my lack of knowledge: what does HPE mean? Does it mean it does not have a Quasar engine anymore.

It's a revised QUASAR named HPE (High Performance Engine). Piaggio has a great marketing department...

Again, you prefer to knock on the new 300 Vespa.

Surely, advertising is important for all companies that wish to sell.

Just, you have nothing to offer otherwise, but prefer to negate what you fell is propaganda.

In Austria, the guys are liking the new motor, Read, Austrians are freak Vespa tuners. They're very good!

Also, the new one has reached Germany. We like it so far.

That's your opinion. Do you know my background?? My father and I been working with Piaggio for 25+ years. I have a different opinion when it comes to them and their BS. I rode the new GTS, I had it for a week and NO, I haven't felt what they advertise compared to the old one...

As for the Germans, I don't really care what they say. Who declared them the best in the world??

Well, no I am not aware of your background. I am however aware of your presence and your opinions here are more than suspect.

I have no grievance personally with any country. Just in your case as a Greek, I can understand your scorn.

But we do not vote for politics here, we vote for VESPA.

I have infos that state clearly the new is a hit.

Also, info that clearly state you are fairly alone,

Sorry, I vote Vespa.

And again, that's your opinion. I don't have to agree with anyone. How's that make my opinions suspect??

Personally, I didn't feel it and that's it...

Germans say it's better?? Good for them...

I suggest now to give the benefit of the doubt.

Possibly sir, your translation to English perhaps does not come across well. Indeed, this is an international problem. Mostly though, we can get along in a peaceful manner.

Not agreeing with anyone, is certainly not a positive option.

I'd suggest, you then not buy a new Vespa, but perhaps, with your family experience, develop a new one that suits your taste.

does it matter so much if the performance upgrades are something you can really feel or detect, though?

as someone who was thinking of buying a new non-HPE GTS this year, I decided to wait for the HPE JUST for the supposed longer service interval, revised CVT belt system and full LED. I dont care at all about performance gains.

so lets get away from feelings and impressions. Here are some figures reported by TheLast4V on Vespaforum.de.

I again a measurement (but this time by hand and without video) of 0-108 km / h according to speedometer (0-100 km / h according to GPS) performed and my old speedometer measurements in GPS converted. The values are:

Vespa GTS 300 HPE 2019
0 - 56 km / h according to speedo (0-50 km / h according to GPS): 2.9 s
0 - 87 km / h according to speedo (0-80 km / h according to GPS): 6.4 s
0-108 km / h according to speedo (0-100 km / h according to GPS): 11.3 s

Compared to the old engine (according to "manhole cover")

Vespa GTS 300

0 - 50 km / h (GPS): 3.3 s
0 - 80 km / h (GPS): 8.0 s
0 -100 km / h (GPS) 14.0 s

Vespa itself speaks of a 18% increase in HPE torque. In fact, I also have almost 18% better acceleration values.

It is now objectively and technically confirmed that the new GTS 300 HPE engine has not only achieved noticeable performance gains on paper, but also in practice, which has had a positive effect on performance in every driving situation.

Are you going to take delivery in time to deliver the Easter eggs

I sent Piaggio a note formally requesting data on how many Grade A Large Brown Easter Eggs would fit under the seat of a new mint green HPE. No word yet and fingers crossed on pre-easter delivery date.

But they will melt there!

Mike, thanks for posting those numbers.

Horsepower is not important, it's the torque level that makes the machine move, and guys are reporting good things in Germany and Austria about the new GTS 300.

This and the info from MicahelG adds more positive light to the reviews I read from Vespa.de. Not being a regular on that forum I don't know who is experienced and who is just guessing. I now know the guys you are talking about and I have read some amazing things they have done with a Vespa.

I also respect SaFiS knowledge and opinion of Vespa marketing. His statements reflect the reality of all marketing.

Guess I will leave my order for a red one alone for he moment.

Luckily it appears to be a......

I have trouble knocking the new GTS 300 HPE. This is an improved scooter.

The motor offers 12% more horsepower.

The motor offers 18% more torque !!

This is not peanuts.

These numbers are about the difference between a LX 125, and an LX 187 Malossi kitted scooter.

These two have completely different attitudes and performance numbers.

18% more torque...this alone is something to be happy about. This will get you up that hill much easier than before.

EDIT: I just watched a 10 minute YouTube video from a major motorcycle magazine, an Austrian had a closer look and a drive test on the Riviera, Italian side. Nice. But the author really praised the new Vespa.

Cleaner, quieter, no test was done about gas mileage, but the's enthused about the motor. Lots of changes made there. he thinks the Vespa feels even more civil, yet quicker and more responsive when rolling the power on.

Essentially, he says the new one just made an already great product even better.

I'd buy one. Heck, I'm seriously thinking about it. Just I'm keeping my ET 4.

If you took me out of an Austrian winter for a junket on the Riviera, I think I could sing the praises of anything up to and including a visit to the dentist's office, for 10 minutes at least.

Seriously though, time will tell what the engine's assets are - new owners will be quick to praise, because they just paid a lot of money (and everyone's own kids are the smartest, cutest, etc.), and non-owners just have to wait until the tuning community has had a chance to dyno a few of these bikes and get back to us.

Well, that sort of dampens my desire for a new one.[/quote]

I'm happy to have a new 2018 waiting for decent Cleveland weather. There was nothing wrong with the 2018 & 2019 engines until the HPE came out. Of course it's better but I don't want to play the waiting game for new technology and upgraded versions.

Everything I've read about the HPE engine in the GTS is positive. Scooterlabs tested one and found it to be more powerful. Several sites have said the head and valves are new too. Personally, I haven't seen any design specs for it yet but I'll be interested to see how they got the extra power.

And, as has been said above...torque is way more important than HP in engines like this. Torque is the power the engine produces. HP is how fast it can produce that power. Folks get confused and concentrate on horsepower alone believing more horsepower is the answer to everything. But it's no good having loads of horsepower if the engine doesn't produce a decent amount of torque. The HPE engine has a big increase in torque, plus another 1.8hp on top of that so that's the reason the new model goes so well. If anyone has ridden one and hasn't noticed the difference it's because the new engine was probably still very tight and hadn't reached it's run in mileage.

OK, here we go with somewhat negative points.

Hot off the press; the HPE User Manual states, 1st main inspection at 12,000 miles. Valve adjustment.

Reality, 6,000 miles. Costs $400 at current exchange rates.

We seem to think since the entire valve train is newly designed, Piaggio wants to have a closer look. Hence the shorter interval.

This is brand new info from Austria, Vespa GTS crazy folks there.

the HPE service manual we looked up for a potential customer yesterday had it at 10000 km intervals (6k miles),

starting at 6k miles, then every 6k miles after, 110 minutes is the flat rate time on the complete service.

things do get revised all the time, so best to always consult your dealer you bought it from for the latest tech info.

do also keep in mind, for most scooter owners that would take 3+ years to get that kind of mileage. The avg is closer to 1k miles /year it seems.

Besides engine and LED changes I noticed a new honeycomb pattern radiator grille. Are they interchangeable with older/current slat style?