Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:21 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:21 pm linkquote
After a few years without a viable 2stroke 2wheeled ride; I've recently acquired 2 new projects, and would like share along with all of you.
FINALLY its time for me to get back into this vintage Vespa game.

FIRST UP: 1958 VB1T
I purchased in May from the 2nd owner (or maybe 3rd as far as he knew). He had bought this Vespa in 1972, and rode around California Long Beach-Southbay area for 11 years; till a mechanical issue garaged the scooter in 1983 and it hasn't been running since. At that time he had given it to his daughter, whom intended to repair and ride it, but it was returned to him later in pieces missing pieces; and has been in storage till I became the new caretaker. The p.o. was a very kind man, who got teary-eyed when we finally struck a deal. He loved this Vespa, and I know it was true. He shared many stories of his scooter riding days at home in Argentina and here in USA. I had to give him my reassurance that I'd be a good caretaker, and would keep him in the loop when its back cruising the California streets.

The sheet metal is solid, no rot, no rust other than some surface rust. Speedo says 12k miles, and I believe that to be accurate. Needs a little straightening here and there, but nothing too serious. Missing some things like the matching engine case halves. GickSpeed already hooked me up!! Thanks man!!!

Here is the basic plan rundown. Stay tuned:
- strip down the 2 resprays to reveal the original silver paint. Its weathered/patina and beautiful to my eyes
- spot treatment on surface rust areas/tunnel as needed
- metal work sheetmetal to make it nice and straight no filler
- clay/cut/polish/preserve with Owatrol/wax it and leave paint OG
- cowls & fender have been stripped and resprayed by pre '72 owner., so they are not in OG silver. I'll work this out. I have a loose plan
- reuse ALL original parts when possible. From levers to rubber bits, I'll try to save em all. So far so good!
- update brakes for new stopping power
- update electrical to 12V
- update engine internals for more power! Working out plans with GickSpeed

I'm going in deep on the photos. You've been warned
This will be a slow project, and a fun one. This is my first early wide, and I'm glad to have a California bike, and a local bike. I'm pretty excited.
Thanks for following along.


as listed


at home


og badge looks to have never been removed and was painted around


12k miles
















lil surface rust pits peaking through the red all over


engine parts that came along for the ride. GickSpeed got me a set of matched cases, and we'll work out a plan to build a nice tuned rider

Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:45 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:45 pm linkquote
paint strip down
There are little surface rust pits peaking through all over the red paint, and the red respray was done over most everything-badges, floor runners, bolts... I could see the orignal factory paint peaking out in some various places, so I decided to take a chance and strip back the resprays to reveal the original paint. I wanted to do this for 2 reasons: to see how bad the surface rust pitting was, and to take a chance at seeing what condition the original paint was in. I know it can be risky on a 61 year old scoot, but for me it was worth the risk. I have always really like the weathered "rusty-within reason" look, and am overall happy with the results.

Body is original factory paint silver metallic. Fender and cowls turned out to not have any factory paint. Looks as if they were stripped back to bare metal and painted yellow; which is pretty worn out too. I'm diggin it the more I look at it.
I want the body to have a weathered worn-in look. While the engine/suspension will have a nice new clean look.

I used Paint Thinner, not any heavy duty stripper. It was slow, but did help me to keep control over not going throught too deep. You can see that some spots did reveal the factory primer. These spots were thin on the paint to begin with.






shiny and clean under the floor rails






thinner on a rag. little by little




almost there


done!


shiny under the cowl. weathered up top

Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:48 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:48 pm linkquote
Fenders and cowls stripped









Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:58 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 9:58 pm linkquote
Making my way through the vb1 bit by bit. tore down the front end for cleaning and rebuilding. I'm a neat clean freak! So everything will be spotless and fresh before going back together. I missed a few steps in the pics, so this is more for posterities sake.

I do love finding little fun things. The fork casting is stamped with a "17", which just happens to be the day of my birthday. Turning 40 this August 17, so that was a fun find since I thought of this as my early birthday present to myself.











Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:10 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:10 pm linkquote
Tearing down and cleaning the headset












gear shift and clutch cables






broke down!


strip down!


nice and clean. Good enough for now. Will get in there real good before reassembly. Clean freak!


throttle nice and brown. Gear side got a soak in Simple green which helped alot! Throttle side is perma-dyed brown LOL!

Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:18 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:18 pm linkquote
Horn removed. Screws wanted to strip. So I gave em a soak in PBblaster, ground down the slots deeper to better fit a flat head driver. 3 came out clean, one did get stripped. So I carefully ground down the head with my Dremel and a cut-off wheel attachment, removed horn; then turned out the last cut off screw with visegrips. All and all clean and simple. Nice factory paint under horn gasket which was basicly melted.




filed deeper slots with Dremel


horn out!




done!

Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:26 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:26 pm linkquote
The original taillight is an interesting thing. Its been hacked and cut to fit a different lens. Functional, but not so pretty.








lets go ahead and clean these up

Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:34 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:34 pm linkquote
I use these small food tubs for many different projects, from Vespas to painting. I'll save all of these and always have 10-20 saved up. Yogurt, cream cheese, sour cream, salsa, whatever you have in the kitchen! Helps for organizing parts when you disassemble, or whatever you can think of!

Pro tip for cleaning & soaking small parts: use 2 different size that fit one inside the other. Put small holes in the bottom of the 'inner' tub. Fill the larger one with cleaning solution of your choice, parts go in the smaller tub. Holes allow it to drain so you dont have to fish out each nut and bolt. Just grab the inner basket, fluid drains out bottom = cheap clean and easy tiny parts cleaner tub.










food for lizards tub works too!

Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:41 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:41 pm linkquote
I've had this bottle of Eastwood's Fast Etch for a looong time. Still works great!! Its phosphoric acid based, and has done a good job at safely removing rust on a few projects over the years. I've already used it on a few small bits fore the Wide, which I did not photograph. Here it is being used on the front spring. I did not get a before pic. For reference, the small seat spring is in the same condition as the suspension spring before treatment.


Eastwood Fast Etch


rust free after a short soak. Black zinc oxide coating looks neat.


after drying it has a nice dull black look

Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:44 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun Jun 30, 2019 10:44 pm linkquote
This all took place in a little over a month. Been meaning to put this post together for a while, but got distracted doing work!
Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:20 am

Hooked
P125x (4KW Hub Motor)
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 409
Location: Alexandria, VA
 
Hooked
P125x (4KW Hub Motor)
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 409
Location: Alexandria, VA
Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:20 am linkquote
Nice start. I like how you document what you are doing.
Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:47 am

Hooked
59" Allstate
Joined: 03 Aug 2018
Posts: 195
Location: TC Florida
 
Hooked
59" Allstate
Joined: 03 Aug 2018
Posts: 195
Location: TC Florida
Mon Jul 01, 2019 4:47 am linkquote
Nice job, I look forward to watching the progress. Keep us posted
Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:00 am

Molto Verboso
2018 GTS300 Super Sport - Donatello Vespace
Joined: 22 Dec 2012
Posts: 1463
Location: Toronto, Ontario Canada
 
Molto Verboso
2018 GTS300 Super Sport - Donatello Vespace
Joined: 22 Dec 2012
Posts: 1463
Location: Toronto, Ontario Canada
Mon Jul 01, 2019 5:00 am linkquote
Was there a motor? I can't recall seeing it in your pictures. Looks terrific!
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:12 am

Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62), 2008 Stella (Olive)
Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 2964
Location: Florence, OR
 
Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62), 2008 Stella (Olive)
Joined: 11 Jan 2006
Posts: 2964
Location: Florence, OR
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:12 am linkquote
Very nice GL! And thanks for the tip about the different size containers. I've always got a couple going in the garage sink. This will make things a bit easier!

Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:34 am

Hooked
'63 VBB2T - '76 Sprint V. - '86 PX200E (SOLD) - '18 300 GTS Super Notte
Joined: 26 Apr 2019
Posts: 407
Location: Belgium
 
Hooked
'63 VBB2T - '76 Sprint V. - '86 PX200E (SOLD) - '18 300 GTS Super Notte
Joined: 26 Apr 2019
Posts: 407
Location: Belgium
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:34 am linkquote
Great job man!

Looks nice!
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:34 am

Hooked
P125x (4KW Hub Motor)
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 409
Location: Alexandria, VA
 
Hooked
P125x (4KW Hub Motor)
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 409
Location: Alexandria, VA
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:34 am linkquote
Soul Surfer wrote:
Was there a motor? I can't recall seeing it in your pictures. Looks terrific!
1st post, last photo.
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:37 am

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:37 am linkquote
Thanks everyone! I'll do my best to document my progress for history's sake, as well as my own

Soul Surfer - this project came with a box of engine parts, but was missing some key things like the clutch side half of the casing. There is a pic up there somewhere. I got ahold of Jon GickSpeed here on MV, and he hooked me up with a set of matching cases and a pair of NOS swingarm mount bolts. He has been very helpful! We'll build out with a new topend/carb and gearing too. That will come later when I have a bag of money saved up
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:44 am

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Mon Jul 01, 2019 7:44 am linkquote
Engine Bits

Swingarm is original to this scoot. 2 case halves came to me via Jon GickSpeed. These should clean up nicely. Thanks Jon!



Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:21 am

Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 1411
Location: California
 
Molto Verboso
Vespa
Joined: 19 Jun 2007
Posts: 1411
Location: California
Mon Jul 01, 2019 8:21 am linkquote
outstaning GeeK Lion! I'll be watching
Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:13 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 5779
Location: Indo
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
a not so normal vbb2 '64, a weirdo vbx '86, a not so normal pts100 '82 and a yellow sunshine '74 sprint
Joined: 15 Jun 2009
Posts: 5779
Location: Indo
Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:13 am linkquote
+1 i am all eyes
Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:57 am

Hooked
Vespa
Joined: 25 May 2016
Posts: 470
Location: US
 
Hooked
Vespa
Joined: 25 May 2016
Posts: 470
Location: US
Mon Jul 01, 2019 10:57 am linkquote
love it. I have a VB1 project sitting in the garage for a couple of years already. Need to get on it.
⬆️    About 3 years elapsed between posts    ⬇️
Sat May 07, 2022 4:32 pm

Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
 
Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
Sat May 07, 2022 4:32 pm linkquote
Know this is an old thread and kinda died off. Just wondering if you ever finished this VB1T. I have one that I've shelved and need to get started on. Lol
Sat May 07, 2022 9:21 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sat May 07, 2022 9:21 pm linkquote
thanks for the interest. Yes, its true this thread died; but the project is not dead...yet. I've still go this on the shelf, with some extra added parts and goodies since the last long ago update.So, some added time; but a bit of added benefit when it finally gets finished. An out of state move, along with a whole bunch of other sheeeet; put this on the back burner along with many other things. it will get going again one of these dayz

vmxwinn: I'd love to see what your working with! Maybe it will motivate me to get going again
Sun May 08, 2022 11:35 am

Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

 
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

Sun May 08, 2022 11:35 am linkquote
GeekLion, I somehow missed this thread of yours! This will be VERY helpful for me when it comes time to reassemble the headset in my P200 powered 1958 VB1T. My rusty scooter was in pieces when I bought it so I have no idea what is or isn't there...and if it is there, how it's even supposed to be oriented.

I'm highly motivated to progress further on getting that 200 block completely situated in my VB1T, but I just found out that i'll be indisposed for probably 2 more months before I can continue work on it.
Sun May 08, 2022 11:58 am

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Sun May 08, 2022 11:58 am linkquote
whodatschrome wrote:
GeekLion, I somehow missed this thread of yours! This will be VERY helpful for me when it comes time to reassemble the headset in my P200 powered 1958 VB1T. My rusty scooter was in pieces when I bought it so I have no idea what is or isn't there...and if it is there, how it's even supposed to be oriented.

I'm highly motivated to progress further on getting that 200 block completely situated in my VB1T, but I just found out that i'll be indisposed for probably 2 more months before I can continue work on it.
Oh yeah man, You gotta heel that foot before diving in deep. I'm really glad this thread popped back up top, as its a good reminder of yet another project of mine; and I'm glad it can offer some help. Mine will end up with a tuned original engine, rather than an LF conversion. I've got P2 lumps for just about everything else. If you have questions on your build, hit me up; all my parts are easily accessible.
Sun May 08, 2022 2:56 pm

Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
 
Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
Sun May 08, 2022 2:56 pm linkquote
GeekLion, so you are going to hop up the stock VB1 motor? Curious as to what is your plans.
Sun May 08, 2022 3:03 pm

Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
 
Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
Sun May 08, 2022 3:03 pm linkquote
GeekLion wrote:
thanks for the interest. Yes, its true this thread died; but the project is not dead...yet. I've still go this on the shelf, with some extra added parts and goodies since the last long ago update.So, some added time; but a bit of added benefit when it finally gets finished. An out of state move, along with a whole bunch of other sheeeet; put this on the back burner along with many other things. it will get going again one of these dayz

vmxwinn: I'd love to see what your working with! Maybe it will motivate me to get going again
Here's what I need to start working on. I've been side tracked building other bikes and life. Lol.

https://modernvespa.com/forum/post2455244?highlight=#2455244

Here's a KTM I just finished so I could give Jr my Husky as he has grown into it.



Mon May 09, 2022 11:01 am

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Mon May 09, 2022 11:01 am linkquote
vmxwinn wrote:
GeekLion, so you are going to hop up the stock VB1 motor? Curious as to what is your plans.
Yes I intend to keep the original motor, with a tuned build. I havn't yet made the final plan, but there are now numerous options for widebody engine tuning. Pinasco or Nagy make kits, there are others. Been a min since I dove in deep to see whats 'best'. I just want it to be able to ride with traffic, and keep up; without going all hacky-cutty-bangy to get a P-lump in there. My example is fairly untouched as far as the condition of the frame; so I think it would be nice to keep it as OG as possible.
Mon May 09, 2022 1:05 pm

Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

 
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

Mon May 09, 2022 1:05 pm linkquote
vmxwinn wrote:
Here's what I need to start working on. I've been side tracked building other bikes and life. Lol.

https://modernvespa.com/forum/post2455244?highlight=#2455244

Here's a KTM I just finished so I could give Jr my Husky as he has grown into it.
2005 450 or 525 EXC?
Mon May 09, 2022 2:09 pm

Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

 
Ossessionato
Joined: 26 Oct 2015
Posts: 3539

Mon May 09, 2022 2:09 pm linkquote
GeekLion wrote:
Yes I intend to keep the original motor, with a tuned build. I havn't yet made the final plan, but there are now numerous options for widebody engine tuning. Pinasco or Nagy make kits, there are others. Been a min since I dove in deep to see whats 'best'. I just want it to be able to ride with traffic, and keep up; without going all hacky-cutty-bangy to get a P-lump in there. My example is fairly untouched as far as the condition of the frame; so I think it would be nice to keep it as OG as possible.
I can tell you from my "partial" (I say partial only because I'm still part way of trying to make it fit) experience of trying to fit a P200 engine in my VB1T that it isn't even close to being an optimal option for an engine swap. PX150's cases and cylinder are dimensionally smaller at a few critical areas, making it much easier to fit. But with the performance cylinder options that are currently available to fit on a VB1T engine, then it seems like a largeframe engine swap could be an obsolete option. The only reason I'm doing a 200 swap is because I had a spare one on the shelf (and not a VB1T engine), AND my frame is rusty enough that i won't cause WW3 by cutting it up to make it fit.
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 pm

Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
 
Molto Verboso
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
Posts: 1352
Location: PNW from LBC
Mon May 09, 2022 8:03 pm linkquote
whodatschrome wrote:
I can tell you from my "partial" (I say partial only because I'm still part way of trying to make it fit) experience of trying to fit a P200 engine in my VB1T that it isn't even close to being an optimal option for an engine swap. PX150's cases and cylinder are dimensionally smaller at a few critical areas, making it much easier to fit. But with the performance cylinder options that are currently available to fit on a VB1T engine, then it seems like a largeframe engine swap could be an obsolete option. The only reason I'm doing a 200 swap is because I had a spare one on the shelf (and not a VB1T engine), AND my frame is rusty enough that i won't cause WW3 by cutting it up to make it fit.
Yeah man, I would absolutley love the idea of a Big Bore fire breathing beast under the cowls of a VB1! I just think its case by case basis, as the early frames are harder to find. If mine was more trashed, I'd have gone for a lump swap in a heartbeat; cuz the widebody stuff aint cheap. Took me over 2 years to track down the proper set of engine cases.

My VB1 was purchased from the original owner, so I am the second owner. The OG brought it over from Spain in the early 60's, and rode it around SoCal for many years; then the typical story takes place - mechanical trouble-tried to fix it - went in to storage half taken apart, some parts were lost over the years; till it emerged and was added to my collection. One of these day's I'll do it justice.
Mon May 09, 2022 9:18 pm

Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
 
Member
Vespa VB1T
Joined: 01 Mar 2021
Posts: 11
Location: Danville Ca
Mon May 09, 2022 9:18 pm linkquote
whodatschrome wrote:
2005 450 or 525 EXC?
Good eye. It's a 450. Only just finished it a couple of weeks ago so i haven't had that much time in the saddle yet. Power is nice and smooth but might want to make it a 520. Lol
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