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UTC quote
roadster wrote:
possibly a knock from a fall
Erm...might have happened once or twice...
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2019 MP3 hpe 500 sport Advanced " Missy "
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UTC quote
jerryd wrote:
that makes it even worse for you.
Actually, you give us the Impression that you always want to be right
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2010 gts 300 super. 09 MP3 500 lite
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UTC quote
only when I am right. its rotten advice to say welding this header is a good idea.
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2019 MP3 hpe 500 sport Advanced " Missy "
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2019 MP3 hpe 500 sport Advanced " Missy "
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UTC quote
jerryd wrote:
only when I am right. its rotten advice to say welding this header is a good idea.
Yeah, but you and others who will remain nameless at this point in time take everything too seriously and you take it as a personal affront when somebody has a different oppinion than your own. I know my abilities and I can tell you without a doubt that I am no Mr. Know-it-all. I never went to College, I never studied Metalergie like Madison or am no Rocket Sientist like jimc, but I can at least say that I have been a learned Mechanic and Welder for 35 years now. You and a few others who will remain nameless at this time need to chill. Keep giving advice though. It does help those who really need it and they and I myself do apprieciate it emmensly. You guys do have pretty good ideas. You just should try to bring it across better with a little Deplomacy. I don't mean just you, but also the other nameless few. I hope I didn't step on anybodies toes writing this, but this perticular discussion seems to be getting out of Hand.
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2009 MP3 400, 2004 Honda ST1300
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@pmatulew avatar
2009 MP3 400, 2004 Honda ST1300
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UTC quote
If you search YouTube for "micbergsma mp3" he has several take apart videos that might be helpful.
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2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
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2009 MP3/250, 2012 GTS Super 300ie
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UTC quote
roadster wrote:
pmatulew wrote:
OAD: I'd like to see it done without removing everything. I'll bring the popcorn. Heck I'll bring the beer!

I considered the possibility of jacking the motor up and down. Not sure how much it would help or how much travel is available as the pipe still has to pass through the lower bracket.
I've done it at least four times to fit and then remove an aftermarket full system on the MP3 400. The right hand nut/stud is unscrewed from beneath and the left hand one via the spark plug access cover. A wide selection of tools is needed as well as plenty of patience because sometimes you can only find room to turn the nut by one or two flats at a time. The biggest time saver was a ratchet ring spanner which only worked after I had cut about 1 inch from the handle so that I could get it in on the spark plug side with room to turn it.
Yes !
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Gilera Fuoco 500ie
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UTC quote
what a BS about not welding used RVS done it many times no problems
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Piaggio MP3 500
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Yeah, welding vs new/used is a value proposition rather than a question of whether it possible. A new header is around $100 and taking the pipe to a welder, getting it welded by a professional at exactly the correct angle with a weld that will hold up is going to be about $100 too. Unless you have a TIG welder in your garage, which most of us don't. For something like this, I'd just buy a new one.
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Gilera Fuoco 500ie
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UTC quote
Welding should be more then 30 bucks thats what i ask for customers
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Agree to disagree. Getting a welder to do a careful job of fixturing, stoppering and flooding the tube with argon, then TIG welding with skill the correct stainless steel -not all shops have all types of stainless steel filler rod- will cost a minimum of $100. It's about an hour job with setup and $100/hr is the going rate for immigrant landscapers around here, let alone skilled craftsmen.
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UTC quote
Follow up question: We purchased the exhaust gasket (#26 in the diagram) from scooterparts. The description said it fits a 400 but it looks like it's a slightly different size than the old one. The older one isn't as thick and fits tighter when it's seated in its place in the pipe. Is this normal for a new part?
Squeazel wrote:
Looks like you need a new exhaust header. The flange part sheared off. AF1 will have one, but I'd try EBay too. Do you have an aftermarket exhaust or stock? Sometimes aftermarket mufflers put a lot of stress on the header.

Anyway, the only way to get those two nuts off the head is to use a ratcheting box-end wrench from the side. 13mm is the size. It barely fits. You can drop the bracket that the pipe goes through, but that's a much bigger job because there are a couple of needle bearings that will come loose and need to be reassembled and the preload will need to be set on them.

Make sure to get a new exhaust gasket as well as a new graphite gasket. You'll probably need new nuts and may need new studs for the head.

In the diagram below- #29, #26, #11, and 2ea #25. The studs are on the cylinder head assembly, but if their threads are bunged up, I'd get a pair of those, too.
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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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@jimc avatar
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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UTC quote
They wear thin quite quickly. A new gasket is always thicker than an old one that's been in for 1000 miles or so. This is why nipping up the clamp on a regular basis is a wise move, and prolongs the life of the gasket.
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jimc wrote:
They wear thin quite quickly. A new gasket is always thicker than an old one that's been in for 1000 miles or so. This is why nipping up the clamp on a regular basis is a wise move, and prolongs the life of the gasket.
Interesting. Thank you!
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@madison_sully avatar
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
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UTC quote
I'm not so sure they 'wear' thin so quickly, but rather get smooshed.
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2007 GTS
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2007 GTS
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UTC quote
# 26 folks is the head to pipe gasket not the graphite pipe to muffler bushing.

the new copper gasket should be thicker than the old one as is does squish down thus creating the seal.

did you also get the new studs and copper nuts? highly recommended .
@jimc avatar
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The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
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UTC quote
old as dirt wrote:
# 26 folks is the head to pipe gasket not the graphite pipe to muffler bushing.

the new copper gasket should be thicker than the old one as is does squish down thus creating the seal.

did you also get the new studs and copper nuts? highly recommended .
Ah, sorry. I never remove the downpipe - not even when removing the engine, so didn't even consider that gasket!
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MP3 400 "Orion"
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UTC quote
Once again, many thanks for everyone's advice and help. Merlin will ride again. <3
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UTC quote
Madison Sully wrote:
I'm not so sure they 'wear' thin so quickly, but rather get smooshed.
Yes, they get smooshed when they're installed- makes them thinner and bigger in diameter. That's why I don't re-use the old one; the seal may not be as good with a re-used gasket, and I *hate* taking that header off because the nuts are so hard to get to and I'm willing to spend the extra $5 to make sure I don't have to.
OP
@carolan avatar
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MP3 400 "Orion"
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UTC quote
Squeazel wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
I'm not so sure they 'wear' thin so quickly, but rather get smooshed.
Yes, they get smooshed when they're installed- makes them thinner and bigger in diameter. That's why I don't re-use the old one; the seal may not be as good with a re-used gasket, and I *hate* taking that header off because the nuts are so hard to get to and I'm willing to spend the extra $5 to make sure I don't have to.
Yeah, we certainly learned THAT on this project! My husband did the bulk of the work but needed my smaller hands to get those nuts threaded. Getting them out was a pain, but getting them back on was brutal. I dropped the danged thing three times before I got it going. Then he wedged the wrench in and ratcheted it down ONE CLICK AT A TIME.

We did use the new gasket, and a new graphite gasket on the other end.
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2010 gts 300 super. 09 MP3 500 lite
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UTC quote
interesting welding in the first part of video. what kind of welder is that? or is it just good technique with tig with heat turned up?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWNgTlmVXYI
[img]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NWNgTlmVXYI[/img]
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