Modern Vespa

Just picked her up yesterday afternoon from a local guy who has/had way too many scooters.

The good: only $450, that patina!!!
The bad: none

well aside from needing to be completely rebuilt.

I'm not sure what route I'm going to go with this aside from not wanting to paint it at all. The kickstart lever spins on the crankshaft and the bolt to tighten it is rusted in place so I gotta soak that with some wd-40 or lithium grease(?) and see if I can tighten it and see if she'll kick over.

If she won't kick over and is seized I'm thinking about putting a P series engine in instead and removing the 125 rebuilding in then storing it so if I ever want to sell the scooter later it'll have the original engine still. It'll be a long project, I currently have no room to work on it in my shop so I'm gonna slowly order replacement parts to have a pile to go off of when I have space and time to start the teardown.

Super excited. Even know I preferred a mid 70's Rally or P200 I can't complain about a 58 especially for that price. 98% of the visible rust is surface rust. Just one little rust hole about the size of a BB on the floor board and one other spot has a little bit too.

That said is it a simple swap to put 10" wheels on this? What other things should I be aware of or worried about or need to check asap? Pro's/Con's of going more modern on the engine side of things? Will the stock stator power an LED headlight, I'm clueless on this since there's no battery.

I can't figure out how to post all the pics in one posting.

Front view

125cc's of glory

Dig it!

I would humbly suggest that you leave it on 8's.
Source a good front fork. And instead of going the P200 route rebuild the engine with a Pinasco ignition and 177 top end. I just did it for a 63 VNB and it has as much grunt as my P200...albeit a touch less top end. Scoot is straight money for city driving with 3 gears.

I second the vote to keep it rolling on 8"s, even if you go with a PX motor. It's a different feel and one you'll come to love if you've never done it. If you put the 177 on it, that'll definitely give you all the power you need.

But if you do get PX motor route (which might be appealing for the fourth gear), you can get an 8" hub from SIP that works great and only cost like $100. I have it on one of my LML motors, so that's not an either-or decision.

people gonna hate but I'd be painting that, cool scoot dig the sheet metal headset.

Cool little details on this bike:
Choke lever under seat
Split headset
Seamless fender

I'd also vote against going 10" , but it's your bike...

gonna stick with the 8's and see how I like it first I think. Ride it how it was meant to be before getting on with upgrades that may not upgrade really ya know?

The fork looks like it has a damper so it's not as rigid as they typically are? I'm too tired to get up and go into the shop and look right now, took a lot outta me getting her outta the trunk of the car and pushing it up my ladder/plywood ramp into the shop. Didn't realize how much heavier a Vespa was compared to my Yamaha Vino which is all plastic.... should have gotten a friend to help!

I'm still 50/50 on the paint issue. depends on how it looks once I try to clean up the surface rust. by that point it just may *need* to be resprayed.

Just from pure lack of knowledge. Is it a 58? The front fork with damper I though would be a later? And Acorn style light, I was under the impression it was 63 and later?

Your vin doesn't lie, I ask purely in the interest of knowledge.



Also, CLR and 0000 steel wool then clear coat. Will have some amazing patina!

I have a 1965 Allstate . I kitted a PX125 with a Polini 177 kit, 24/24, Sip Road 2 exhaust, Vape electronic ignition, and a SIP 10 inch front wheel kit. The mechanic who built the engine says it is one of the most scary fast he has ever ridden.

Keeps up with P200's easily

Also went with better shocks front and back (my front fork isnt original) and a Stoffi spring

No cutting was required so I can go back to stock if required

excellent I have CLR and 0000 steel wool already!
and pretty sure it's a 58 just has some oddities to it. Where should the VIN/chassis number be? I check inside the engine cowl and nothing is stamped in there.

From what I understand is it will be under the fuel lever on a plate. I have yet to find anything stamped on my 62 either.

Here's my 62 so you can see the plate

Very nice honest old bike, looks complete and nearly all original. But you lucked out, the old AllState pogo stick fork has already been replaced by a Vespa fork it appears. And at that price, you got such a deal

Yep, looks a lot like my '58 and may have this same model number.


I think you could save that paint, but while it'll never look 'nice' again, it can look pretty 'cool' if you like that sort of thing. It shines up better than you might think, that original paint is TOUGH!




ugly mess, but solid


still blotchy, but took a nice shine most places. I did finally get the right speedo, but original is nearly impossible to find. Thread here: Scruffy AllState, crappy headlight finally fixed!

[quote="V oodoo"]Very nice honest old bike, looks complete and nearly all original. But you lucked out, the old AllState pogo stick fork has already been replaced by a Vespa fork it appears. And at that price, you got such a deal

Yep, looks a lot like my '58 and may have this same model number.



Yep I have the same model number plate. Does yours have no choke knob? Just the fuel switcher thingy?

only thing I've found that isn't original so far is the gas line. Unless Vespa had a huge stock of Goodyear branded fuel lines?

I didn't see that in the pics the first time. Right on! You are ahead of the game there.

First, never mind the kickstart, does the motor turn over? You should be able to rotate the flywheel, the back wheel may want to turn if it's still in gear. If it turns over, now you might see about tightening the bolt up, but likely the splines are stripped in the aluminum lever and it might work sorta half ass coz you need a new lever.

You need to pull the motor, start taking stuff apart before you think about ordering a bunch of parts I think. You might search here and make a simple motor stand too, which will really help you. Then you can focus on the bodywork as you figure out what's up motorwise and wait for parts.

If your motor's dead and you decide to swap in a 10" newer motor, the 10" conversion in front becomes the issue. I did it OK on a Super ,but your front hub etc is different and I dunno if it's the same conversion. More here on what's required: Unpainting a scooter

If you read my AllState thread, you know I gave up on the original motor and used a newer rotary valve Bajaj motor which uses a different choke. I added a choke lever under my seat which is a bit of a hassle but works well.

[/quote] First, never mind the kickstart, does the motor turn over? You should be able to rotate the flywheel, the back wheel may want to turn if it's still in gear. If it turns over, now you might see about tightening the bolt up, but likely the splines are stripped in the aluminum lever and it might work sorta half ass coz you need a new lever.

You need to pull the motor, start taking stuff apart before you think about ordering a bunch of parts I think. You might search here and make a simple motor stand too, which will really help you. Then you can focus on the bodywork as you figure out what's up motorwise and wait for parts.

If your motor's dead and you decide to swap in a 10" newer motor, the 10" conversion in front becomes the issue. I did it OK on a Super ,but your front hub etc is different and I dunno if it's the same conversion. More here on what's required: Unpainting a scooter

If you read my AllState thread, you know I gave up on the original motor and used a newer rotary valve Bajaj motor which uses a different choke. I added a choke lever under my seat which is a bit of a hassle but works well.[/quote]


Flywheel won't spin by hand. I did kinda take your advice with the tear it apart before I order anything. I've got the easy bits off already. Seat is off (holy cow that leather felt like stiff plastic), Gas tank is removed, cowls are off (why did they make the glove box side so hard to get to that last screw???), Cylinder head is off, headset is off and headlight etc. I have little baggies labeled for all the screws and such and got a big tupperware bin to hold most of the smaller bits.
Would it be easier to covert a P motor to 8" wheels instead of converting the fork for a 10"? That's if I can't get the motor to spin.... the threads on the kickstart lever are toast. The rear wheel does move but I didn't look to see if the flywheel was spinning at all when I was pushing it around.

It will be infinitely easier to convert a 10" motor to 8" than a front fork from 8" to 10"

If you got the head off, squirt some penetrating oil in there, give it some time and see if the piston will move in the cylinder. If you can get the cylinder off, you can see what's going on in there somewhat, and why it seemed stuck. Does the crank turn OK now, or is it kind of 'crunchy'?

Convert 8" bike to 10" or 10" motor to 8"? Probably 50/50 difficulty in my experience. Read all of both linked threads, I did BOTH there and did it just for your convenience


10" motor after couple of parts and 15 minutes work. Just READ about the gearing problem without more work.


Your front is different, may be more required. This one was dead easy. 15 minutes.

BTW, that last nut getting the toolbox cowl off? Clever Piaggio device to ward off clumsy oafs and nervous wimps, and looks like you maybe passed??? Wait til you go to put it back on!

If you are thinking of keeping 8" wheels and using any PX engine you will need to change the primary drive in order to re-gear for the 8" wheel. I have the UK equivalent of the Allstate/VNA 125 which is what you have, I did this and it works really well. The other option is to try and get hold of a later 70's 150 Super engine and change the hub using the following:

https://www.ebay.com/i/224053942542?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=711-117182-37290-0&mkcid=2&itemid=224053942542&targetid=935083617347&device=c&mktype=pla&googleloc=9058679&poi=&campaignid=10455986539&mkgroupid=104612010460&rlsatarget=pla-935083617347&abcId=2146002&merchantid=113749378&gclid=Cj0KCQiAhZT9BRDmARIsAN2E-J32hAtPK_ybxNzxTJyJJ6-5vwBOIXgOnJuqx5Isp4wE7EwEMahHbm4aAl75EALw_wcB

Then you can use your original 8" hub.

This is also good for working out what primary drive you need:
https://www.scooterhelp.com/tuning/vespa.gear.calc.html



Good luck.

Here's where some mice made a nice home.

Still haven't figured out how to get the bars off. Anyone got any tips on removing the throttle tube and shift tube?

Inside leg shield badge

Super Classaire is more like it...

Busted speedometer. Already contacted Speedo King. Not able to help so I gotta find a replacement. Only 5939 miles though!

View of the engine sans the carb

Rear tire holds air! Front does not.

Gotta get these tubes off to get that rust off at least where the grips sit. Unless they'd protect it a bit?

Here's the carb and airbox

That booty

soaking the seized piston in penetrating oil.

You need to pull the wires out and then the bolts by the arrow I think?, and spring clips that pull out of the tubes to let them slide off. Don't lose any of the four split plastic bushings, you'll probably have to make one if you do. Yeah, that rare. I can pop my top off to verify if needed and you get stuck.


see the clip to the right?

I could not get those bolts by the arrows off without removing the lower headset cover. Had to rubber mallet the headset completely off then I could reach the 2 bolts under the stem (is that what that part is called? It would be on a bicycle anyways) but once the whole thing came off those 2 bolts at the end of the throttle tube were easy to reach. Shift tube isn't budging though and can't find any screws that may be hanging me up. I have about 33709087 hours of wire brushing the rust away now lol. Hoping to find the little light that goes on top, looks better than just having a hole there.

Hoping to be able to enjoy the sun with this babe next summer. I think my current plan is to get her running then do a better engine swap out later. Easier said than done though since this piston is stuck TIGHT. Been soaking in penetrating oil for 3 days now and nothing. Hoping it starts to seep in there soon.

IF you can get the old piston ported motor free and turning you may very well make it run with some crank seals & rings unless its all rusted up. I got my
VNA running after sitting for almost 50 years. I got lucky, i never opened up the motor, in fact i put new tires on a day ago and took it out for a spin today. Its not the fastest thing but its a still a joy to ride.

My non stripped kickstarter will be here tomorrow so I can see if I can get it to budge. Figure that'll at least give me some leverage. We'll see tomorrow.
They are such good looking scooters. I was out on my Vino today. A rare 75 degree day in November!

Try to turn over motor with flywheel first, should be much easier than with kickstart lever plus you can move it back and forth if it starts to loosen up.

I think that if you can't turn over the flywheel after penetrant soak, you'll never do it with a new lever and might damage the lever. Could be wrong, but I think you'd be splitting the case and removing the crank, bearings, piston and cylinder all in one ugly rusted piece, I have been there and those parts were junque.

That's a great garden sculpture now!

And I'm gonna let it soak for a few more days then see if it budges. I can't spin the flywheel but I also have 2 fake shoulders so I'm not working with much in the way of leverage or strength

Hey FridayMatinee. Look into getting a copy of the manual for the scooter. Makes things easier when understanding how things go.

https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1472927/Allstate-788-94493.html#manual

Thank you so much! I got them off finally, but it'll be a huge help to have the manual

some pic updates!

First up is some body damage... the horncast seems to need to be fixed here as does the small hole in the leg shield