OP
UTC

Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
 
Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
UTC quote
I'm not really too clever when it comes to sparks. I bought the SIP Vape sport DC for my mk1 T5 because the EGT gauge needs a DC supply.
I don't want to fit a battery even though I have a suitable one if need be. I've got a DC horn and indicator box to go in.

Can I just feed one of the red DC outs into the loom and disregard the other DC out?

Wires is wires? Thanks v much for any replies.
OP
UTC

Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
 
Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
UTC quote
Only 1 red out, my bad.
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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76 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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Location: Nashville

76 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
If you look at the wiring diagrams that came with the installation guide for the Vape, on page 4, you can effectively cut out the battery loop and shift the fuse inline from the stator.

The key thing to be aware of is that you need to keep your AC ground (black ground) and DC ground (brown ground) separate or you'll kill the flywheel.

From there, it's red wire out of the regulator into your existing wiring harness, wire up the kill switch (normally green in the harness) to the blue-white off the CDI.

Check out This thread which has extensive discussion of the topic.
OP
UTC

Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
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Location: Leeds, England
 
Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
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Location: Leeds, England
UTC quote
Thanks CM. I've already read that thread but I am too simple! Thanks for the tip about the earths but even that has me scratching my head. They all earth to the frame anyway so aren't they sorta connected?
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9975
Location: Nashville

76 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9975
Location: Nashville

76 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
RunsLikeSlug wrote:
Thanks CM. I've already read that thread but I am too simple! Thanks for the tip about the earths but even that has me scratching my head. They all earth to the frame anyway so aren't they sorta connected?
You need to isolate the earth between the regulator/rectifier and the stator (the black ground in the diagram). That's the simplest one since it's the one direct wire.

The ignition ground is yet another ground and we don't talk about it
@safis avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
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Location: Veria, Greece
 
Ossessionato
@safis avatar
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4321
Location: Veria, Greece
UTC quote
@CM: I know we've discussed this before, but even SIP's & VAPE's directions show a common ground for both. Same goes on my P although with a Ducati ignition. Is there a chance your LML harness is different or the flywheel was "killed" through voltage returning from the starter's safety / clutch relay??

RunsLikeSlug: FYI, you'll lose the tachometer. It needs a regulated 12v AC "pulse" to work. Careful sending DC to the "old" AC line. SIP sells the VAPE for the T5 classic (no tacho)...
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9975
Location: Nashville

76 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9975
Location: Nashville

76 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
SaFiS wrote:
@CM: I know we've discussed this before, but even SIP's & VAPE's directions show a common ground for both. Same goes on my P although with a Ducati ignition. Is there a chance your LML harness is different or the flywheel was "killed" through voltage returning from the starter's safety / clutch relay??
I used the common ground from the AC Ground out of the stator to the regulator, which is what I think killed it. Isolating that seems to have fixed the problem, hence my belief that it's the "right" way to do it, rather than actual understanding of the underlying engineering.
@jimvanmorrissey avatar
UTC

Addicted
Vespa PX200
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Posts: 553
Location: Belgrade
 
Addicted
@jimvanmorrissey avatar
Vespa PX200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 553
Location: Belgrade
UTC quote
Hey Chandlerman, where specifically did your separate ground connections hook up to the frame? Just curious how you did it.

Like many, I loathe wiring. Instead of understanding the underlying science I prefer to ape the implementations of others.

Speaking of which, one thing I'd also love is a "Run the AC pulse signal to the SIP Speedo for Dummies" guide. If anybody's got one.
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Location: california
UTC quote
Jim - I couldn't get a proper signal without all sorts of interference from my VAPE to my SIP speedo - so I went to this to stop it bouncing all around.
It has been flawless since.
https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/product/rev-signal-filter-koso-sip-rev-counter-speedometer_KOBA0040?q=Kosovo%20signal
@jimvanmorrissey avatar
UTC

Addicted
Vespa PX200
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Location: Belgrade
 
Addicted
@jimvanmorrissey avatar
Vespa PX200
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UTC quote
Hey Charlieman, thanks for the tip. So how does this work -- the business end of it clamps on to the HT cable somewhere? Like a timing strobe?
@charlieman22 avatar
UTC

Nedminder
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
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Location: california
 
Nedminder
@charlieman22 avatar
62 VBB1T Round Tail W/ leaner sidecar
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4109
Location: california
UTC quote
Yes - exactly.
Seriously - the brown wire from speedo to white wire on CDI thing that SIP says "sometimes works" was absolutely useless to me.
In their own fine print after they state that - they say you may need a Koso like filter - which... I did.

Just clamps to HT. I made a new clamp top out of a piece of sheet metal - because Koso's clamp seemed to be designed for about 12 gauge wire. I made it with tin snips in about 20 seconds, bent it by hand around the HT lead - and haven't thought about it for a year.

It will fix your rev counter demons if you are experiencing them.
OP
UTC

Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
 
Enthusiast
Vespa T5 251, Lambretta GP200
Joined: UTC
Posts: 74
Location: Leeds, England
UTC quote
There must be a reason for Piaggio to have run copper from the stator to just earth near the V reg...I don't know why but if they could have saved copper they would have I think.
A mate with a Lammy wrapped the AC feed for the SIP speedo around the HT lead a good few times and the tachometer works. That did not work on my Lammy!
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