Dealer cost to change tires?
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Hooked
Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 146
Location: PA
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:26 am quote
Just curious how many billable hours does your dealer charge to change both front and rear tires on a GTS?
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:51 am quote
oh, here we go again.

you're gonna get a wide range of responses:
- oh, the dealer?!
- i can do it in 20min in my driveway with a sheepskin and two rocks
- just buy the tools and DIY it's not that hard. just youtube it.

anyway general dealer rate is 1.5 hr anything over that i'd have questions.

expect to be touched up for tire tax, disposal, stems, a split pin and possibly a exhaust gasket.

hth

-g
Hooked
Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 146
Location: PA
Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:54 am quote
They are telling me 2.5 hours at $95 an hour. That痴 why I知 asking.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:01 pm quote
mankite wrote:
They are telling me 2.5 hours at $95 an hour. That痴 why I知 asking.
are they a vespa dealer or just a powersports place? were you a pushy asshole when you asked for a quote? are you bringing your own tires?

(all of this matters tremendously)

-g
Hooked
Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 146
Location: PA
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:05 pm quote
Vespa dealer.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:12 pm quote
mankite wrote:
Vespa dealer.
they should know better, hard pass.

find an indy.

and, don't ring back the dealer and be all: well the internets said it should be 1.5 or i shopped around and that's wayyy high on labor can you come down or match it. because that, my friend, is how you get shitty service. or on "the list".

anyway my best guess is a coin flip: they either priced out the work because they don't want it, and if they do it they want it worth their while, or they're starving and trying to make it up one over padded job at time.

-g
Hooked
Joined: 17 Mar 2007
Posts: 146
Location: PA
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:17 pm quote
They claim it痴 the price to change tires. They just picked up Vespa a year ago. They are a Harley dealer. I値l pay the $95 an hour but I知 not paying over 1.5 hours. That痴 what I paid at my last Vespa dealer before they dropped Vespa and they were only $70 an hour.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:19 pm quote
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6410
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Tue Apr 20, 2021 3:42 pm quote
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:07 pm quote
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6410
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:16 pm quote
greasy125 wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
Thank goodness I didn't buy your starter kit....
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 4:43 pm quote
i'd say it comes with an instructional video, but nobody wants to see that.
Ossessionato
2006 Vespa GT (Rocket): 2005 Vespa GT (Razzo): 2006 Vespa GT (Crash): 2007 Vespa GT (Vanessa): 2009 Yamaha Zuma 125 (Zoom): 2018 Yamaha Xmax (Max),
Joined: 26 Sep 2006
Posts: 4440
Location: Jacksonville, Florida
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:10 pm quote
I take the wheels with old tires mounted along with new tires to a local independent motorcycle shop.

They remove the old tire, install new valve stem and tire, then fill it with nitrogen and balance.

$25 each.

I usually wait and never sit for more than thirty minutes for two tire mountings.

I tried doing it myself once but gave up after a few hours.

Bill
Member
'06 GTS 250; '18 GTS 300
Joined: 21 Jan 2018
Posts: 44
Location: Oregon
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:17 pm quote
same same, I take the wheel / old tire + new tire to the indy shop, they quote me $20-$30 per depending on their mood.

The removal of the rear wheel can be nontrivial, I had to fabricate a tool to get the bracket off the axle. YMMV of course. Now that I've done it a time or two it's now easy but the first time, a PITA.

Other shops in my area typically $50 or more.

Also, I did this job myself with the finest harbor freight tools and it completely sucked, I never ever want to change a moto / scoot tire again in my lifetime.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
2007 LX150 2015 GTS 2013 BV 350
Joined: 13 Sep 2012
Posts: 9784
Location: Fond du Lac, Wisconsin
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:29 pm quote
WLeuthold wrote:
I tried doing it myself once but gave up after a few hours.

Bill
Few hours? Bill, you are a patient man. I'm sure I couldn't last that long.

I put in an hour with a snowblower tire this winter and it was all I had.

Once COVID settles and I get my ducks in a row, I'm going to bug someone down the road for some guidance. That might be you, Robert... Gotta negotiate fees....
Addicted
2010 S50 Modified "Punkin"; 2003 ET4 Malossi 187 "ISO"
Joined: 18 Feb 2017
Posts: 731
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:47 pm quote
Greetings:

Once the rims are off, the Harbor Freight Mini Tire-Changer made the job far easier than my previous method; Cussing and Brute Force. Particularly if you own more than 1 scooter.



Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Tue Apr 20, 2021 7:15 pm quote
the HF mini served me many many years and finally gave up the ghost. i bought a new one as a stop gap, until i clear a space in the shop for a floor mounted unit.

but if you're a DIY and home wrencher, the HF and a pair of spoons with with some rim protectors will do you well.

also, wheelman, can you please change out your knee pads and grips to black?


-g
Addicted
GTS 300ie Touring - Signora D'argento
Joined: 03 Jun 2018
Posts: 778
Location: Limassol, Cyprus
Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:12 am quote
15.00/$18.00 per wheel for fitting & balancing here in Limassol. I'm happy to pay that, it gets done in a matter of minutes and I don't have to get my hands dirty.
Hooked
GTS 300 SS BB
Joined: 03 Nov 2018
Posts: 232
Location: QLD AUS
Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:57 am quote
greasy125 wrote:
also, wheelman, can you please change out your knee pads and grips to black?


-g
It would be great if also the rims did match..
Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 5650
Location: Latina (Italy)
Wed Apr 21, 2021 12:58 am quote
Touring300 wrote:
15.00/$18.00 per wheel for fitting & balancing here in Limassol. I'm happy to pay that, it gets done in a matter of minutes and I don't have to get my hands dirty.
Same price from my dealer (who is also Piaggio) but remember that it costs more to change the rear tire, it takes longer.
PS: As usual i find the greasy's working comments tasty and informative.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:31 am quote
Burt37 wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
also, wheelman, can you please change out your knee pads and grips to black?


-g
It would be great if also the rims did match..
Fronts easy. It痴 the back that痴 a pain... and painting one would leave your ride incapacitated for a hot minute unless you had a spare.
Member
2006 Piaggio Fly 150, 2016 Vespa GTV300ie
Joined: 02 Mar 2021
Posts: 18
Location: USA
Wed Apr 21, 2021 4:29 am quote
This is timely. I am new to scootering and am taking my new (to me) Piaggio Fly 150 in for new tires and an oil change later this week. Indy powersports shop quoted me $275 for a set of Pirelli Angel tires, tire install, and oil change. Considering that another indy powersports shop in town quoted me $175 JUST for the tire change (not including the cost of tires), I guess $275 isn't too hateful?

(I greatly admire all you DIY'ers on this forum!! So far I'm just confident enough to do little stuff like installing racks and whatnot. Eventually I hope to graduate to do more maintenance stuff on my own. Baby steps!)
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6410
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:43 pm quote
cnvh wrote:
This is timely. I am new to scootering and am taking my new (to me) Piaggio Fly 150 in for new tires and an oil change later this week. Indy powersports shop quoted me $275 for a set of Pirelli Angel tires, tire install, and oil change. Considering that another indy powersports shop in town quoted me $175 JUST for the tire change (not including the cost of tires), I guess $275 isn't too hateful?

(I greatly admire all you DIY'ers on this forum!! So far I'm just confident enough to do little stuff like installing racks and whatnot. Eventually I hope to graduate to do more maintenance stuff on my own. Baby steps!)
That $275 seems reasonable to me.
Addicted
2010 S50 Modified "Punkin"; 2003 ET4 Malossi 187 "ISO"
Joined: 18 Feb 2017
Posts: 731
Location: Deepinnaharta, Texas
Wed Apr 21, 2021 2:58 pm quote
Greetings:

Quoth Greasy:
Quote:
also, wheelman, can you please change out your knee pads and grips to black
What?! Anna make Signori Piaggio cry?! The saddle is Tobacco brown, and though the knee pads are a little Cafe Latte, it is the livery on delivery. I am not about to second-guess the Artistes who determined the best combination.

As for matching rims, all in good time.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:43 pm quote
275 for tires installed and an oil change is a deal. Take it.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Wed Apr 21, 2021 3:46 pm quote
Wheelman-111 wrote:
Greetings:

Quoth Greasy:
Quote:
also, wheelman, can you please change out your knee pads and grips to black
What?! Anna make Signori Piaggio cry?! The saddle is Tobacco brown, and though the knee pads are a little Cafe Latte, it is the livery on delivery. I am not about to second-guess the Artistes who determined the best combination.

As for matching rims, all in good time.
Saddle looks black in pics!

But yeah, change those other bits out. Make it flow. The brown just grabs the eye funny with everything else red and dark.

And if ya need a rim, hit me. I致e got em piled up and ready to deal.

-g
Ossessionato
2009 GTV250 (Gone), 2003 Inder trailer, 2001 BMW R1100RT
Joined: 24 Jun 2009
Posts: 4783
Location: Santa Cruz California
Wed Apr 21, 2021 4:25 pm quote
greasy125 wrote:
275 for tires installed and an oil change is a deal. Take it.
I also think 275 is a pretty good deal. Tires are typically $100 + mounting and balancing. Then the oil change is prolly $30 in parts + labor.

Me? I'd have them change the tires and do the oil service myself. I't REALLY easy and both Scooterwest and Micmergsma had good YouTube vid on it.

Best
Miguel
Ossessionato
2013 Vespa 300 Super, 2007 Burgman 400
Joined: 30 Mar 2014
Posts: 2037
Location: Minneapolis USA
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:02 am quote
New Tires Front and Back
I looked at the service receipt for replacing tires on my GTS300.

Change front tire $51.41, change rear tire $73.04. The labor to change was
more than the cost of the tires. The deal with buying the tires from the
dealer and install was $188.49.

Believe me, much better for them to do it.

Bob Copeland
Minnesota
Hooked
2006 250ie
Joined: 13 Jun 2012
Posts: 329
Location: Bellingham, WA
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:09 am quote
To think that I almost took a pass on reading this post
greasy125 wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
I would致e missed out on another one of G痴 pearls of wisdom.
Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 4844
Location: Hustletown, TX
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:21 am quote
greasy125 wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
LOLZ...
G-man hall of fame stuff right there.
Ossessionato
2013 Vespa 300 Super, 2007 Burgman 400
Joined: 30 Mar 2014
Posts: 2037
Location: Minneapolis USA
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:23 am quote
Wrenching on your Scooter
I am 72 years old. There was a gentler time when everyone did all the
work on their houses, vehicles, machinery.

I am one generation off the farm. Before, everyone learned how to work on
stuff with their Dad - who actually had tools. Those practical instructional
experiences are gone for most of us.

I do admit, I was the only one in my neighborhood who actually painted his
own house.

Also, the "Labor Theory of Value" comes into play. If you earn appreciably more than the individual building your new front steps - go work at your job and hire him to replace the steps.

Obviously, many of you gain a great deal of satisfaction working on your scoots.
Hats off to you. The real deal is having the experience to do the job without
completely wrecking the scooter.

Bob Copeland
Better at Robbing and Stealing than Wrenching and Building.
Hooked
SilverWing 600-- 4nprevious Vespa
Joined: 13 Oct 2010
Posts: 462
Location: chattanooga tn
Thu Apr 22, 2021 11:24 am quote
And to think---Vespa used to have easy to get off rear wheel, split rims (if not rusted) easy to get tires off....and spare. I have forgotten what Sears charged for tire...but not much.
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:39 pm quote
Re: To think that I almost took a pass on reading this post
phaskins wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
I would致e missed out on another one of G痴 pearls of wisdom.
i barf them out time to time amongst my running diatribe of nonsense. best to stay tuned on the station, never know what may pop up!
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:42 pm quote
Birdsnest wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Madison Sully wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
Find an Indy. They値l do better work and probably at a lower cost.
Agree.

Or, find those two rocks and a sheepskin.
That sheepskin will come in handy for those long rides you'll have on the new tires.
The rocks, however, I have no idea what those are for....



I use tire spoons and it was a ROYAL pain in the ass to learn it.
It's amazing how much easier things get once you actually know how to do them....
the rocks are for smashing your balls for even thinking that you should embark on such a journey. the sheepskin is for laying upon while you reflect on the poor decisions you've made in life while vomiting profusely from hammering yourself in the groin with said rocks.

all kidding aside, using levers or spoons is very much a learned technique. but once you get that touch and the rhythm down it's easy peasy. just like life, it's about lube, pressure and angle of attack. and rim protectors. and the right tools for that job.

-g
LOLZ...
G-man hall of fame stuff right there.
should we start a self published book?

Bribs & Greasy- how to work on the shitbox eye-talian shopping trolley
(abridged version)
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Thu Apr 22, 2021 2:56 pm quote
Miguel wrote:
greasy125 wrote:
275 for tires installed and an oil change is a deal. Take it.
I also think 275 is a pretty good deal. Tires are typically $100 + mounting and balancing. Then the oil change is prolly $30 in parts + labor.

Me? I'd have them change the tires and do the oil service myself. I't REALLY easy and both Scooterwest and Micmergsma had good YouTube vid on it.

Best
Miguel
my thoughts exactly. tires are easy 100, add in oil and a filter at a generous 30, and you're paying 145 in labor for tires AND an oil change? roll on that mess.

i'm indy and cheap (in my area) and i'd be 200 in labor just for the tires and oil change (service) plus parts. you bring your own, or you pay my rate on the bits. if you just dropped it off was like: knock some tires on this and do a service, you'd be looking at close to 5 at the end of the day. and again, i'm one of the cheapest games in town.
Addicted
2015 Vespa GTS300 Super
Joined: 26 Sep 2017
Posts: 552
Location: Connecticut
Sun Apr 25, 2021 5:07 am quote
WLeuthold wrote:
I take the wheels with old tires mounted along with new tires to a local independent motorcycle shop.

They remove the old tire, install new valve stem and tire, then fill it with nitrogen and balance.

$25 each.

I usually wait and never sit for more than thirty minutes for two tire mountings.

I tried doing it myself once but gave up after a few hours.

Bill
+1, except it痴 $35 per tire and no nitrogen. I never tried to do it... I致e done (or tried) a lot of stuff on my Vespa, but tires? No, no, no.
Molto Verboso
'95 Yamaha Riva 125- '05 Piaggio BV200-'05 Honda Reflex-'08 Honda Metropolitan
Joined: 22 Oct 2005
Posts: 1727
Location: Ohio
Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:22 pm quote
A couple years ago I took my BV to an independent shop for tires. I bought the tires from them- I even solicitated their recommendation for the brand/ model since Michelin stopped making the Gold Standards that I had initially. I printed out all the specs and torque values since I knew they weren't familiar with my scooter. The tech was so happy that I did that! When I picked up the scooter he said " I really torqued down those pinch bolts since they seemed too loose". I didn't think too much into that until I took it to a real scooter dealer to replace the headset bearings. The independent shop idiot broke my fork! The scooter shop sent me a picture of the damage along with the diagnosis that the independent shop used super glue to hold it together! Never again!!! It needs tires right now and I will do whatever it takes to get it to a shop that knows what they are doing! Don't skimp here folks. Skip on the quality of your next few 12 packs instead...

Bob
Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: 21 Oct 2005
Posts: 8695
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:48 pm quote
Not all indy痴 are idiots just as not all dealers have real mechanics.
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2012 Honda NC700 DCT, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6410
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:56 pm quote


Skimp on BEER??




NEVER!!

I'll do the job myself first!
Molto Verboso
'95 Yamaha Riva 125- '05 Piaggio BV200-'05 Honda Reflex-'08 Honda Metropolitan
Joined: 22 Oct 2005
Posts: 1727
Location: Ohio
Sun Apr 25, 2021 1:59 pm quote
greasy125 wrote:
Not all indy痴 are idiots just as not all dealers have real mechanics.
100% true! I was just making the point that folks try to save money in the weirdest places. This is your life we're talking about.... Pay the effin money and get it done right!

I remember talking with a furniture salesman years ago that made a great point. He said people will skimp on a couch that they sit on every day for hours at a time but will not think twice about buying a car with a sunroof that they will open maybe 5 times a year.....I live in Ohio, remember....

Priorities...

Bob
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