Modern Vespa

Hey everyone,

For all of the long haul touring people out there, any recommendations for tuning on your vintage vespas you can share?

I'm planning on doing a three day tour this summer on my px125. It is kitted w a dr180 and will have a sip pipe on it. Approximately 500-800km in total.

I finally have it running the best it has run since I rebuilt it thanks to a friend. I have a 24mm carb in it with a 116 main jet. B7hs plug. Runs well and pulls strong.

Just wondering if I should make any additional changes before taking it on this long journey.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Cheers.

If you have a rack I'd suggest getting a set or two of the 12-42" Rok straps. These have been my favorite method for securing bags and other cargo to my scooter. I have some on the front rack of my scooter, and a set attached to my backpack so I can secure it to the rear passenger back rest.

CHT/EGT gauge with a red line at a reasonable limit marked on both. Stay below the line and all is well.

No tuning suggestions. When in doubt, jet richer than you need.

3 days isn't too long on the road. Give your scooter some love before you get on the road and she'll take care of you. Torque everything down, check your tire pressure in all 3 tires, carry extra oil, enough tools to limp you to a town with a garage and extra carb gaskets and jets in case things change. Other than that, have a credit card and don't rely too much on sat navs. A little bit of wandering is good for the soul!

I think this is key, I had mine out yesterday racking up the miles and getting closer to breakin , also with the Dr180 but with a 20/20. Although my trail tech temp gauge is at the hump and I have to stop to see it, I felt pretty happy at seeing a temp of 207 F after riding a solid 20 minutes alternating throttle revs. This tells me the cylinder is having a nice cool bath through breakin period.
I do have a 48" extension on the way from across the pond.

Lynn,

How are you finding your dr180 kit with the 20/20 carb?

I had a hard time dialing it in (even though a ton of people run 20mm carbs)and so I switched to a 24/24 carb and the bike actually came alive.

I plan on running a cooler plug considering the trip is from Niagara region to Kingston in the middle of July. Lol.

Facts: a cooler plug does not make the engine run any cooler.

Disclaimer: Knowing the facts I still run a cooler plug (NGK 8 normally) on long runs

That's going to be a lot of back road riding to get over to Kingston , love it.
Ok first off the guys here have been an incredible help, absolutely amazing. If you want to make sure you're dialed in right with your 24/24 simply post what you have in there now including timing exhaust and jetting in the carb.

I'm still breaking my new motor in , it's recommended 500 miles alternating speeds up to 40 ish mph and to get everything nice nice. I'm up to 375 miles as of yesterday and it's running great. I've gotten use to the fact that the cylinder needs the throttle to cool the engine so on steep downgrades I stay on the throttle revving. I'm running without an air filter with the bellow only. Right now I have AC140/BE5/118 and a 50-120. As I stated on earlier post my Trail Tech temp gauge said 210 Fahrenheit. When I get to 500 miles I'll start bringing down the main jet until I get no higher than 280 ish. But basically it's running great. I'm not new to big bikes and I'm quite familiar but these Vespa's are a whole new learning curve for me. I'm up North/West of you in Sault Ste Marie.

If it were me I'd Stick an 8 heat range plug in it as it won't hurt your setup for long runs. I use a 7 around town and 20 mile trips. On 50 plus miles I stick an 8 in. I have exactly same engine setup as you and anything under 122 plug was lean. Maybe have some bigger jets and a couple of 7 and 8 plugs spare just in case.

Just curious you had said you had the exact same engine setup as Nelluch , I'm assuming 20/20 or 24/24 and the Dr180?
So riddle me this , I also have " similar " but 150 vbb with the dr180 and 20/20 with 140/BE5/118 mj and a 50-120 pilot and I don't run with an air cleaner and a BGM Tour Box , Ducati ignition and the case has the 3rd port cut in and timed to 20-21 Btdc. I'm still breaking in so mj is rich but it's running great, now what makes the big difference in the jetting? Is it the 3rd port, ignition , the 150 bottom end, or timing setup?
I've been reading back on other posts from Nelluch and it appears he has been having problems getting setup proper yet all three of us have the same top end.
Sorry just trying to increase my knowledge and understanding here and perhaps give Nelluch some insight.

OK, well I might have got wires crossed. I replied to original post about my dr177 sip road 2 24mm carb ac140 be5 122 main and 120/50 pilot. I run b7hs and b8hs on 50 mile plus trips. The setup was the same accept the 122 main which was allarruved at with the jet stack combo by help on here. With lower jetting it was lean and 116 118 dangerously so. If poster is now on a 20mm carb apologies if I've got things muddled. Been in sun too long and having senior moment its a straight bolt on with original air filter with drilled out section.it pulls like a train and hits indicated 110km all day every day and revs out due to gearing.

No no , I probably confused the matter , I know he has both a 20/20 and a 24/24. Was just trying to understand why mine runs so well with similar top ends and he's having issues , he did mention he doesn't have 3rd port cut in, do you have a 3rd port cut into yours? I think your ac140 Be5 is a good choice but don't understand how such a rich mj unless it's the bigger carb and no 3rd port? More research needed.

Poster's using a 24/24.
I have the same plan this Summer, except mine is a hilly and hot Central California tour. I'm rolling in city traffic with a 118 mj. For my tour I'll replace it with a 122, since feeling good isn't ideal jetting. A kitted bike needs to run rich, to the point of almost crappy.
Speaking of carbs, I tried a 20/20 for my "in city" setup. That was a mistake. Felt like jogging with a mask on.
Stole the shorter (slotted Spaco) idle screw off it, though. That was an expensive screw.

Hey guys that's for al the responses.

To clarify: I was running a 20mm carb. 160/be5/112-116. I'm still breaking in the dr cylinder. Which was bolted on. No matching. No porting. Etc. All in a px125 chassis and engine cases.

I was running it a bit rich and not going over 1/2-3/4 throttle. But sounded like crap and just didn't feel and respond right.

The 20mm was suggested to me by my mechanic and a lot of folks here run this kit w the 20mm but I slapped on the 24mm last night with stock p200 settings and the bike came alive. However I'm sure I'm not maximizing the potential of that carb because I didn't match the box to them base of the 24 mm carb.

I am still In awe of guys getting over 100kph on a dr180 kit and a 20 mm carb. That totally blows me away.

But for the folks with the ported cylinders, reed valves, and air box matched carbs --you have the advantage over my bolt on set up.

This is a where my differences lie when compared to yours.

I feel that I could do better than 100kph , it pulls like a freight train , I've only done it a few times to just bounce off it but out of the respect for all those that have helped me I've been behaving myself and keep it hovering around 40 mph until I hit the 500 mile mark.

Perhaps there is a something wrong with the 20/20 , mine was new out of the box and was used for the bench test. Maybe strip the 20/20 down , works like a charm on mine , but again I have the 3rd port and don't know what that means for carb setup.

Now you are 400miles run in id advise you to give it some bursts of throttle and take her up to50mph for short bursts. As to your jetting I was In similar state running in,all seemed well until started to do the wot runs towards 500miles ruin. Plug started going grayish white and clearly jetting was OK tootling along 40mph but not so on 55 plus. As to speed of indicated 110 kmh its actually in real world with GPS 63.5 mph.

Thanks , I got back out today and I'm up to 470 miles , I was revving up to 50-60 , it actually seems to feel better as I'm rolling the throttle compared to cruising at 40. Ps Ass is killing me

I would prefer not to have any RPM or engine temp indicators. Vespa's have been running extremely well since almost 80 years, people have done around the world trips, so we all know it runs well, it is damn reliable, easy to fix and in case of a problem, it is part of the journey. I think we all have a tendancy to check useless things if we have access to it (such as temp or rpm). It makes us nervous for stupid reasons, anxious, and even if the old Vespa was running perfectly well before installing the new gages, we think something bad may or will happen.
Have a good trip. Not a long time ago, anybody on any scooter could travel for thousands of kilometers without anything more than a packsack with clothes and a few tools. The Vespa are the same, we changed...

We did.
We got older, which by nature (for some) leads to a more conservative take on risk management. That, and maybe more disposable income to afford neck saving gadgets and such.
I got on the freeway a while back. Maybe 65-70 for 100 yards. Hats off to you guys who don't get off at the next exit.

Also many of the individuals on here with the many gauges and temp sensors have definitely not stock engines. Sure the stock engine is rock solid and does not require any of these additional tools, but when you start tuning the crap out of your engine, all bets are off and then these additional crutches become almost necessary.

So there is the travel the world and or long distance on a stock vespa with no care in the world method.. and then there is the travel the world and or long distance on a vespa upgraded in a way that it was never intended to be, with lots of cares in the world. They are mutually exclusive, and each valid.

Choose your poison.

I can vouch for the long tour without CHT, EGT or RPM instruments, but totally understand why people have them for peace of mind. In my case, a 1200 mile tour of northern Spain with a pillion and luggage, taking in freeways for long stretches, twisty mountain roads and high air temperatures. Not sure if a Pinasco 225 counts as tuned, but it's far from factory.

As far as my preparation was concerned, I equipped the scooter with new tubeless tyres on SIP rims, gave the engine a good service beforehand, checked and tidied up any wiring that could possible create problems (CDI, junction boxes, headset), adjusted brakes and shock absorber pre-load, changed brake fluid, checked/adjusted all cables, and fitted the uber comfy seat from my 2012 PX.

The glovebox was full of carefully chosen compact tools and spare spark plugs, bulbs and cables. The only tools I needed was a socket to check the plug from time to time, and an 11mm ring spanner to drain the gearbox oil in some small Spanish town because I was checking for gas in the oil (it was fine).

A good, well maintained Vespa will take you anywhere you want to go. Just be sure to treat it with respect and take nothing for granted!!

When I was a young lad at 17 i would set out on my mk1 px125 to drive to ridiculously long places in the UK, 200 miles there and it would take the whole day especially when going with some small frames. We never cared about seizing, the internet didnt exist, sticking in a different jet was something we didnt know about when you stuck on your 80's fresco exhaust and we screamed along regardless. Yes, we made mistakes, the wrong length spark plug knocking hole in piston crow, blowing up engine cases and all sorts of mishaps through ignorance.. That all changed for me when i got a wee bit older and my p200 mk1 seized at 50 mph with a pillion passenger. I didnt have time to pull the clutch in and the whole of time seemed to slow down to like a movie. The scooter spinning on its side panel heading down the road. My girlfriend flying along the road towards the curb and my leathers burned through to the skin welding against my arm. It took me a bloody long time to get back on a scooter as it scared the crap out of me.

I am a lot more cautious. Seizing a scooter at speed can be life threatening and this isnt meant to scare anybody but its very real when you have an off. Drive within your limits of speed you are comfortable with. Assume every driver waiting at a junction wants to pull out on you, they do, if sun behind you they cant see you. Pay attention to your engine and that tiny little thing called a spark plug is my definitive goto and i dont claim to be an expert one bit, the guys on here help me a lot to understand whats right and what isnt. I check it every month or after a long run where ive hammered it some. If you are travelling long distances, pull in, have a break, let the scoot cool off. Check your plug, is it happy? Its a big tell visual inspection. Yes, the PX is a very reliable machine, they are good for many thousands of miles. But dont be flippant with safety. If heat gauges reassure you then thats good as there is nothing worse than driving feeling paranoid. I do get flashbacks once in a while to some of my crashes, and yes, get back on the horse as they say but its always in the back of your mind. Ride safe everybody and enjoy.

I rode to Kingston from Toronto in the before times for the Isle de Wolfe rally. Highway 2 is great. Had a fantastic time except it took for ever!

Hiway 2 wasn't what it is now is it?

I mostly take it when the 401 backs up. Absolutely love it.

Yes. The isle of Wolfe. Covid has put a damper on that rally for these past two summers.

I told my friend about how I wanted to ride there. So we organized a ride to Belleville. The following day after we arrive, we ride to Kingston and tour the surrounding area.

Sunday, we make the trip back home.

I just want my bike to make it in one piece.

👏👏👏 I like it.
Heavily modified bikes are for the track, no?

Have you thought of setting up a worst-case support vehicle, like maybe a friend with a hitch?
Going to buy a motorcycle hitch with a ramp, a way to get rescued.
I don't plan to have to get rescued. Got all my tools, cables, plugs, etc ready to ride.

Up here in Canada my support vehicle has always been CAA.

Hey everyone,

thanks for your great replies.

After some work, I finally have my vespa running better and I can safely and confidently continue to break in the cylinder.

I went back to the 20mm carb for efficiency (and the fact that I didnt match the top of the cases to the base of the larger carb)

My question for touring is----should I upgrade the carb to the 24mm and jet appropriately in order to safely run my scoot for such a long distance (with long distances in the same throttle positions etc?)
or should I stay with the 20mm?

Thanks in advance.

From what I've tried on mine , although a bit noisy, you should be just fine with your present setup as long as your breaking in rich. Extra plugs just in case , everything secure on the motor for cables , extra headlite bulb ( even though most times I ride with mine off unless I'm in heavy traffic) , the right tools, and good rubber. I do find it a bit tough on gas when your doing all higher speeds, but mine just loves 60-60 mph so that accounts for that. Hope you got one of Gicks mix cups for fill up.

Good advice!

We also used heroin to treat sore throats and used humans as slaves. Just because something worked before doesn't mean there isn't a better way!
Temp gauge and rpm gauge all day everyday. More info is never a bad thing.

Seconded! More info is never a bad thing

As long as the 20 is jetted correctly for the conditions, leave it.