Mon Aug 16, 2021 8:24 am

Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 2581
Location: Veria, Greece
 
Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 2581
Location: Veria, Greece
Mon Aug 16, 2021 8:24 am linkquote
I'd get it blasted or dipped to uncover the "cancer" lurking underneath. My Ps frame had rot at the tunnel, under the outer sheet. I cut it, cleaned it up, treated it with rust stabilizer, welded a new sheet and then used solder instead of bondo...













Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:46 am

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:46 am linkquote
SaFiS wrote:
I'd get it blasted or dipped to uncover the "cancer" lurking underneath. My Ps frame had rot at the tunnel, under the outer sheet. I cut it, cleaned it up, treated it with rust stabilizer, welded a new sheet and then used solder instead of bondo...
That came out so nice!

What did you use to cut the metal? It's so clean. I was thinking of using a Dremel with a small diamond cutting wheel. The curve along the bottom is such a tight angle.

Yes. Going to get it sandblasted. I think first going to fabricate a brace for the frame, then remove the rusty metal, so I can blast the interior parts that have rust.
Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:50 am

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:50 am linkquote
qascooter wrote:
Rough casting marks that were never cleaned up. I got a new front fork for the Allstate, an FAItalia, and it had the same rough outer cast stuff. I just filed it off clean and installed. All is well...

And I just saw the pics of the body. Bummer! Seeing that hurts....I feel for you....
That's good to know! One part that isn't destroyed. Piaggio didn't ever clean up casting marks. There are so many.
Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:57 am

Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 2581
Location: Veria, Greece
 
Ossessionato
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
Joined: 02 Aug 2015
Posts: 2581
Location: Veria, Greece
Mon Aug 16, 2021 9:57 am linkquote
I have a mini air angle grinder and used 1mm cutting discs. A Dremel should be fine too...
Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:20 am

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:20 am linkquote
SaFiS wrote:
I have a mini air angle grinder and used 1mm cutting discs. A Dremel should be fine too...
I found these. They seem perfect.

And then I'm going to use a file sander to remove the spot welds, and hopefully not remove any material from the bottom sheet.



Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:48 am

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Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Fri Aug 27, 2021 9:48 am linkquote
Finally ordered the body parts.

This is the first time I've ordered from SIP. And not too bad!

It took them two days to process, and the shipping was a fortune. My items were $250, and the shipping was $120.

But three days from Germany to California once they processed. I thought it might take a month.



Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:39 pm

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Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu Sep 02, 2021 4:39 pm linkquote
Parts.

Got the frame pieces from SIP, which wasn't too bad. It took a week.

These are Carlucci, and quality is not as high as I'd hoped. The floorboard especially. The beading is different than the Rally, it's shallower, and has a different shape along the floorboard area.

I this is my OCD, and can work with it, but it's not perfect. I guess better than fabrication.

I'm tempted to consider a different floorboard, but this might be ok.




These are stitched together from four pieces.




The length is right.


The curvature here seems slightly different.


The beading shape at the floorboard just carries over from the legshield.


Hard to see here, but the original beading isn't as wide, and ends at a right angle.


This will be a challenge. These don't match at all. This is under the legshield trim, though


This part is perfect. It's got all the damaged areas.


old and new


The curvature up at the top seems more angled, less round. But maybe I'm wrong about this.

Fri Sep 03, 2021 7:26 am

Hooked
PX 200
Joined: 25 May 2016
Posts: 416

 
Hooked
PX 200
Joined: 25 May 2016
Posts: 416

Fri Sep 03, 2021 7:26 am linkquote
Makes me want to gut mine…

My floor board in reality is like a piece of Swiss cheese, thin patches of filler have patched up the holes, but the struts are starting to buckle…

One day… one day…
Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:39 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:39 pm linkquote
Wiring question.

The 1974 American market Rally had a unique (and really buggy) wiring system.

That leaves the option there to recreate the wiring harness from reverse engineering the original, possibly.

But there's this one. The German market one looks very close. It had a battery and indicators. And instead of the ignition switch, had a kill button at the frame.

Will this one work?

It looks like it would just possibly need a modification to add the wires for the rear turn signals. I don't know if the lights are connected to the ignition switch, but possibly that too.

Is it otherwise the same?

The onlt other difference with the American ones, as far as I know, was a front brake switch, which added a post to the front brake lever.

But might be totally different regulator, stator, etc.




You can see the kill button by the bag hook.

Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:46 pm

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:46 pm linkquote
If it has a wiring diagram, see how closely it maps to yours. And worst case, you can always either intercept the kill switch wire and pull it out of the sheathing under the tank or just run your own since it's basically just a short to ground.
Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:56 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
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Mon Sep 13, 2021 12:56 pm linkquote
chandlerman wrote:
If it has a wiring diagram, see how closely it maps to yours. And worst case, you can always either intercept the kill switch wire and pull it out of the sheathing under the tank or just run your own since it's basically just a short to ground.
That seems like it would be ok. The American one had this switch, which amazingly you can still find NOS. They were also used in Fiat cars.

The wiring might be a bit different. I think the switch also killed the lights, but there's also an off/on switch for those on the handlebar, so if the key just kills the ignition, that's probably ok.

I'll check the diagram.



Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:50 pm

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Mon Sep 20, 2021 12:50 pm linkquote
My slow project.

Parts. Found a shifter tube to replace the damaged one. And a NOS turn signal bracket. Scooterwest had just one of the four, but it was the one I needed!




40 year old rubber part, holding up.

Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:59 pm

Molto Verboso
Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
Joined: 16 Apr 2011
Posts: 1921
Location: Siam
 
Molto Verboso
Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
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Posts: 1921
Location: Siam
Mon Sep 20, 2021 8:59 pm linkquote
It's so cool when all the little NOS bits somehow come together.
Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:50 pm

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Thu Sep 23, 2021 12:50 pm linkquote
Cleaning up the flywheel. This is interesting.

The bolts on the flywheel are stamped Fiat, which must be original.



Fri Oct 01, 2021 9:51 pm

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Fri Oct 01, 2021 9:51 pm linkquote
Rebuilt stator.

Scooterwest did this, and did a really nice job.



Tue Oct 05, 2021 2:06 pm

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Tue Oct 05, 2021 2:06 pm linkquote
Some progress. Had San Francisco Scooter Centre put in the critical engine parts, I was afraid to do wrong, after having to replace the engine case once.

New crank, bearings, seals, clutch, shifting cross, engine mounts, all the moving/wearing parts.

Starting to look like a vespa. At least the engine.




Carb all rebuilt. New clutch.


coming together.


Was going to toss the shock, but it seems to work fine. So cleaned it up.


I love that the shock has a Piaggio stamp.


These little plugs that cover missing coil bolts aren't in any parts book.


Turns out they are the same as the ones that go on the cowl bracket


Perfect!!


A very clean rotary valve.

Thu Oct 07, 2021 4:45 pm

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Thu Oct 07, 2021 4:45 pm linkquote
Case stud questions.

It seems like the case studs for the selector box are too long.

I have 8. Six the same length, and two short ones. The short ones go on the carb box, but seems like the selector box ones are too long.


Short ones on the carb box. The crank ones aren't tightened yet.


This looks right


Longer studs on the selector box.


Does this look right? seems so long.

Thu Oct 07, 2021 4:47 pm

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Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Thu Oct 07, 2021 4:47 pm linkquote
Clutch parts.


Pressure plate pops right in.


New finger thing and brass depressor.

Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:17 pm

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Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
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Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
Thu Oct 07, 2021 5:17 pm linkquote
Ah. With the studs tightened down a bit, it looks right.

Afraid of pushing these things through the case.





Sat Oct 16, 2021 2:12 pm

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Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
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Sat Oct 16, 2021 2:12 pm linkquote
Some progress.

I keep running in to places where I need parts, and have to wait thee days. I initially planned to use all the original hardware, but it's so weathered, that new ones are better in a lot of cases.




More vespa-like




This serves no purpose?


I love the old shield stamp here.


Rebuilt stator in place


I love the new wires. These are always so degraded. Scooterwest did a nice job rebuilding.


I don't know if I'm missing parts here. There's a cam thing for the ignition, and it appears to fit between a taper and the flywheel. I think this is all the parts.

The bike was all apart, and this is a specific Rally thing.


"Lato Esterno." or "this side goes out."

Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:52 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Fri Oct 22, 2021 5:52 pm linkquote
The engine is all together except the hub and top end, which I think I'll wait on until it's close to finished, so the hone stays perfect.

Next week, body work. I found a shop where I can grind and weld without disturbing neighbors (Moto Guild, which looks amazing).

Having OCD with this. But I guess it doesn't have to be perfectly original. Feels like it should be.


Ricambi air filter.


The original air filter had a cut out for this jet. This one doesn't but also doesn't fit so tight. So hopefully it's ok. What is this jet?


The original air filter was orange. Or turned that color over time?


This one is painful. I got new case studs, and they're chrome, instead of the original black. Does this kind of detail ruin a restoration? It doesn't look original.


New cylinder studs are also chrome, but the original ones were hacked up and rusty.


Flywheel on. Just needs a cylinder!

Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:56 am

Enthusiast
Rally 200
Joined: 11 Apr 2021
Posts: 87
Location: Altrincham
 
Enthusiast
Rally 200
Joined: 11 Apr 2021
Posts: 87
Location: Altrincham
Sat Oct 23, 2021 5:56 am linkquote
Beautiful n clean, you're doing a cracking job 😎
Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:01 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
Sun Nov 14, 2021 11:01 pm linkquote
Got a new tank (well, used). Didn't even notice at first, but has a big dent in the top.

Wonder if this is fixable. It's subtle, but indents in the middle. The interior is very clean.






All the things I need for welding and removing old spot welds.

Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:08 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:08 pm linkquote
Exciting.

I think I may have found the last remaining set of NOS CEV 173 chrome turn signals in existence. Where have these been sitting for 50 years?

Took a whole month to arrive from Italy.







Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:23 pm

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 5439
Location: Hustletown, TX
 
Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
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Posts: 5439
Location: Hustletown, TX
Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:23 pm linkquote
All of this is amazing.

And those new turn signals…. Swoon!

Great job all around.

Those raised tanks having a dent from the seat is pretty common. My ss180 also has a bit of a dent.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:28 pm

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Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Location: San Francisco, CA
 
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:28 pm linkquote
I think I can live with the dent. I didn't even notice until I compared to the old tank. But that one has dents, too.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:49 pm

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6215
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6215
Location: So Cal
Wed Nov 17, 2021 1:49 pm linkquote
Ooooo those signals are sweet. Did you get stalks too?
Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:04 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
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Addicted
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:04 pm linkquote
e I had three of them. The missing one, amazingly, was one Scooterwest had as NOS. They only had one of the three, but the one I needed.

And found those really nice repro gaskets.

It looks like the original one has some light plating, but pretty rough casting. I think I can polish the others to match.





Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:39 pm

Not So Moderator
VNB VSC VBC VSX*2
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 2:39 pm linkquote
Where did you find the repro gaskets? I'll need those for my 74 super if I can run them down.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:08 pm

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:08 pm linkquote
Scooterworks also has a pretty decent repop turn signal replacement now. It's not a perfect match--they recommend buying in pairs--but they look pretty close and certainly better than nothing.

Dunno if they have stalks, though.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:59 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 4:59 pm linkquote
Clauss Studios.
https://www.claussstudios.com/store/p546/Vespa_Turn_Signal_Gasket_Set_74_-_78_Rally_Super_Sprint.html

Scooterwest also has them (I think from Clauss Studios). This actually might be better. They ship a lot faster. I think Clauss might make them to order, and Scooterwest has them in stock.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:02 pm

bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6215
Location: So Cal
 
bodgemaster
63 GL, 76 Super (x2), 74 Primavera (x2), 79 P200, 06 Fly 150
Joined: 26 Sep 2013
Posts: 6215
Location: So Cal
Wed Nov 17, 2021 5:02 pm linkquote
Bar Italia has them.
Wed Nov 17, 2021 8:14 pm

Addicted
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
Joined: 06 May 2019
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Location: PNW from LBC
 
Addicted
Too Many piles of Junk that need too much work and too much money
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Location: PNW from LBC
Wed Nov 17, 2021 8:14 pm linkquote
hjo wrote:
Clauss Studios.
https://www.claussstudios.com/store/p546/Vespa_Turn_Signal_Gasket_Set_74_-_78_Rally_Super_Sprint.html

Scooterwest also has them (I think from Clauss Studios). This actually might be better. They ship a lot faster. I think Clauss might make them to order, and Scooterwest has them in stock.
The Clauss gaskets are top notch. I got the grey for my Super 150. Correct color and well made, just as all their products are. Most orders are made to order; so shipping can be slow...
Wed Nov 17, 2021 11:24 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
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Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Wed Nov 17, 2021 11:24 pm linkquote
The ordeal begins.

This is super hard.

I thought I could just remove spot welds, and go. But it's taking a long time. The sheet metal isn't that bad, but there's rust between the panels, that is this sandy texture, and about 3x the width of the metal.

But it's working now.

The file sander isn't great for spot welds. I was hoping it would be easier. I think I need to drill them, then file them.


Oh. Have three Piaggio stamped rims now. This one is from 1981, which is cheating but still original.


Shop space. Moto Guild in San Francisco. Awesome place.


To brace the frame. Welding a bar from the fork tube to a seat bracket. So can unbolt when it's done.


Washers and threaded rod.


Cut the bar. So far so good.


And ... welded! I am now a welder. But I need more practice. It's hard!


My first weld in a while.


It's actually much harder to remove this stuff than I thought. There is so much rust between the panels. But the underneath panels seem ok.


It's hard to remove this stuff! Took hours.


This is as far as I've gotten. You can see there's like sand between the panels. The spot welds are holding, but all has to come out. The metal underneath looks not bad. But lots of work.

Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:51 pm

Addicted
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Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Thu Nov 18, 2021 10:51 pm linkquote
I'm feeling better about this. Made some progress.

It's so strange. The metal is not that damaged, but so much rust has built up, it's pushing apart the metal.

It seems to be only in the horizontal areas.

I wonder if this bike spent time completely submerged in water. I've never seen this on a Vespa.

But... it definitely seems salvageable.

The hard part will be the small curves at the floor. I don't know how to cut that out.


Attempt #2. Spot weld drill bit.


The gross rust plague.


The inside of the top sheet.




After removing the surface rust, the bridge tunnel looks pretty good. Not sure how far back to go, but this seems like it will work.

Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:28 pm

Hooked
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 149
Location: northern New York
 
Hooked
Joined: 14 Oct 2016
Posts: 149
Location: northern New York
Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:28 pm linkquote
I feel your pain. Busting out spot welds and peeling apart rusty steel baclava is a bitch. My experience with this is with VW buses. Welding it all together again is way more fun. Nice work though. You're doing it right. Be thankful it's not a bus.
Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:36 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
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Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:36 pm linkquote
orwell84 wrote:
I feel your pain. Busting out spot welds and peeling apart rusty steel baclava is a bitch. My experience with this is with VW buses. Welding it all together again is way more fun. Nice work though. You're doing it right. Be thankful it's not a bus.
It really is baklava!

It seems overwhelming, but it's really just very small pieces. I feel so much better about it after cleaning out the worst rusted areas, and seeing that the metal underneath looks good.
Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:45 pm

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
Fri Nov 19, 2021 3:45 pm linkquote
The only problem with this thread is that it has me wondering how much rust is lurking inside the frame of my GL.

Other than that, I'm totally digging it and taking notes for future projects.
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:31 pm

Addicted
Scattered remnants of 1974 Rally
Joined: 30 Jul 2009
Posts: 837
Location: San Francisco, CA
 
Addicted
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Location: San Francisco, CA
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:31 pm linkquote
Is this cylinder head usable?

It has some light pitting, but not sure if that's an issue.





Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:33 pm

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
 
Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella
Joined: 16 Jun 2011
Posts: 4244
Location: Nashville
Mon Nov 22, 2021 1:33 pm linkquote
hjo wrote:
Is this cylinder head usable?

It has some light pitting, but not sure if that's an issue.
So long as you can get a good seal, that's fine. I run a head that looks a LOT worse than that in my tuned out GL's motor.

I'd say lap it a little bit to make sure you have a good smooth sealing surface and you're good-to-go.
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