Modern Vespa

I have a quandary.

This November, I will hit the 30-year mark at my current job. It's been a great job, and I count myself as incredibly fortunate for (a) lucking into it, (b) managing to keep it for so long, and (c) loving it (most of the time).

While this job has been occasionally frustrating, often grueling, almost always stressful, and sometimes downright miserable, on the whole it has been personally and financially rewarding. Most of all, it has been immensely educational. I have been given the opportunity mandate to learn new things over and over and over again, constantly seeking out ways to grow, personally and professionally.

I've worn a few hats over those not-quite-30 years, but mostly just engineer, then manager, and now engineer again. Clearly, I like the engineering part more than the manager part. In my current capacity, I am doing work that I love, working for a great manager (that I actually hired, when I was a manager), working with smart people, helping to birth new technologies that don't even exist yet. It is, in short, the best version of this job I've ever had. There isn't a single job position at this company that I would rather have.

And yet, I want to give it all up.

I have this overwhelming sense that 30 years is enough. I no longer have any interest in climbing the corporate ladder. This job requires an immense amount of mental focus, and at 55 years old, I am definitely feeling my faculties starting to fade. I probably (though not definitely) have enough money to retire, and I am extremely grateful for that. And finally, I feel like I'd rather quit while I'm ahead, so to speak. I don't really want to work until I die, and I would like to enjoy not working while I am still relatively healthy.

If this were a bad job (as it certainly was while I was in management), this would be a much easier decision to make. But it's not a bad job. It's a great job. I feel like a schmuck for complaining here.

If I'm going to do it, though, I feel like retiring on the exact day of my 30th anniversary is, symbolically, the perfect end. Working for another day, or month, or year, while I am certainly capable of it, diminishes that intangible symbolism. This just feels like the right time.

So why is this so hard?

Your thoughts on this subject are most welcome.

It's a huge decision for your family. Lots of discussions should be had and budgets should be gone over.

You could work for a nonprofit, donate your expertise, become a teacher or mentor. Or do none of that and just enjoy being you for a while. Ride, play, travel.

I can say from experience, willful unemployment is fantastic.

Take a year off if you can.

You might have missed the career changing bus by about 5 years.

I am a Federal Servant 65 Years old Drawing SSN Still Working have a home Business but if I retire I don't know i feel your pain.

I retired at 56 after a 34-year career as an engineer/scientist/manager. Felt I had to, as my wife had become paraplegic with progressive MS and needed my help at home. I really didn't have enough retirement income guaranteed to meet most folks' expectations of their needs. But -- despite having a very rewarding job -- I was burned out and ready for a change.

To stay within shouting distance of my wife, whose health continued to fail, I started a home-based business building high-end custom 'ukuleles. Didn't make much money, but I enjoyed the hell out of it for 13 years until my hearing deteriorated and I had to give it up. It was a labor of love and allowed me to exercise my talents for art and design and knowledge of physics, specifically acoustics, as well as my passion for artisanship. It also gave me an opportunity to leave behind a real legacy... a couple hundred fine tools for musicians to enjoy for many years into the future.

I really am retired now -- except for my new wife's never-ending honeydo list -- and my retirement income and savings have turned out to be adequate for a comfortable lifestyle.

I don't regret my decisions in the least.

Follow your passions.

I'm an Ex Fed. It was the most toxic job ever with some of the nicest people on the planet.

It is a very personal decision, the parameters involved are many.
I took partial retirement at 57 years of age, three years ago under a state law that facilitates exit from work for those with a work disability greater than 2/3; when I reach the age of 66 and a half, it will become a permanent retirement pension with full pay.
In the meantime I can continue to work but with many physical facilities and I have rented a large part of my business, in practice I am an agricultural consultant.
So I get partial state retirement income, business rental income, and consultant income which still involves the annual payment of partial pension contributions and various taxes. Complicated? Yes and no...
This solution and other similar solutions allow some categories of workers to partially or individually leave the world of work, whether self-employed (me) or dependent.
I make this premise Jess to tell you that if you want (if you can) you don't have to retire completely leaving all your precious technical knowledge but so you can better manage your time ...
You can leave one door and re-enter another, which is also good to mitigate the shock of retirement.
PS: in Italy 42 years of contributions are needed to go into full retirement and I have "only" 37.

Znomit's comment on taking a year off is a good one.

This would of course mean missing your 30 years milestone. I'm personally too practical to mind exact year milestones and such, but I think I understand the symbolic value.

Depending a lot on the company you work for, another thing could be to try to negotiate a part time deal? If you really like what you do and the company both appreciates this and is 'independent enough' to make deals, you might find a nice win-win?

A few years back, I've spend almost a year doing 4 days week - there's a major difference how consuming that is both mentally and physically compared to 5 days. Really, it is a big deal even if it doesn't sound like that.

I can also comment on the money side. I've once given up, voluntarily, a very nicely payed job. For family and personal reasons. I was able to get a semi-nicely paid job instead from an other company. Moving from a nice income to OK income was actually not very painfull. Took some adjustment to spending, but not really anything that mattered much.

Later, I changed to a job with even smaller income. That was a mistake for me personally. Stepping down from nice to OK was easy, but after so many years of nice and OK, stepping down from OK to meeh was not as easy as I thought. After a while I moved a bit up again and felt right at home, in the OK territory. I learned to think more about my own wishes and spending habbits instead of copying them from someone else.

I've also taken once a half year sabbatical. Secure income after that, so no financial worries included. All I have to say was that the time went like wooosh! I didn't even do anything special, just lived normal life, enjoyed lazy mornings etc. I realized then, that althought I've also been 80% super lucky with my jobs, honestly enjoyed most of them, I could easily live without one if someone paid me for that

Jess, I understand your desire to retire on an anniversary. I had exactly the same desire, except mine was a 20 year anniversary with the same employer. I was working in a job that I loved with people who I enjoyed being around. I got beyond the age where the universal superannuation began being paid to me (it isn't means tested in New Zealand) and I was comfortable that the 20 year anniversary would arrive and I would leave. However, the best laid plans etc. and my employer re-employed someone who had left in bad grace 5 years earlier - everyone was an a$%^hole and all that. I suspect they hoped his stint in Australia had calmed him down, but no such luck - he is the a$%^hole. I started NOT enjoying my job, discussed it with my wife (who continues to work because she enjoys it) and put in my resignation.
The 20 year anniversary went by in my retired state and I hardly noticed. In fact, had I still been working without the thorn in my side there I may have gone beyond that date IF I WAS STILL ENJOYING IT.
I understand your dilemma but can't offer much advice. I don't regret my decision at all and now work part time drive delivering cars for the local VW and Audi dealers. I get to drive some pretty cool cars that I don't have to own, and I'm happy. The money is pretty minimal and a bunch of us "old fellas" work as contractors. Do what feels right, then do it without looking back.

The quote from 'The Shawshank Redemption' comes to mind: Every culture has its norms, and the place/priority that work takes in your life is pretty central to your cultural identity.

In the US people are all about what they do professionally. Think about one of the first 'chit-chat' questions people ask when meeting a stranger; "What do you do?". They aren't asking about your hobbies, marital status, family size or tastes. They are trying to pigeonhole and have you self-define according to what vocation (hopefully) pays your bills.

Think also about how awkward it is to lose a job; not so much because of the financial insecurity, but because of how that chit-chat questions is now somehow unanswerable. You almost cease to exist in a social setting.

Most of the world isn't like that. In Europe and parts of Asia, for example, more emphasis is placed on the part of life that occurs outside of the workplace/professional setting.

The 'work-to-live' - 'live to work' debate shouldn't (IMHO) be a debate at all. It may sound trite, but nobody finds themselves on their deathbed regretting not having spent more time at work!

To be fair, not everyone has the choices that you now contemplate, and many (far too many, IMHO), are trapped in survival mode until they literally cease to survive.

But since you aren't in that category... and since you asked the questions, I'll quote another film: 'Good Will Hunting'. I think (and I apologize in advance if this seems harsh), you need to frame your questions not in terms of whether you *should* retire, but rather what a slap in the face to others who don't have your choices it would be for you to remain stuck in your safe, comfortable, inertial place. In case it wasn't clear, my vote is to cash in your lottery ticket and enjoy the life you've been given, my friend.

If there is an opportunity to work there part time, say 20 hours per week, that's what I would do.

I would look into becoming a consultant in your area of expertise maybe offer to work on that basis for your current employer on 3 days a week, failing that set up your own company and just do contracts when you feel the need.

Tricky one jess. But I fully accept the sentiment, the need to want to retire early.

That's what I did at the age of 59. I too have been mostly an engineer for all my working life and I loved it. For me the decision came after a heart attack caused, wait for it, by a cat bite! The cat bite caused an infection so bad in my arm that I required surgery to save the arm. The surgery caused a blood clot, this sent me into Atrial Fibrilation where half of my heart stopped working. I then arrested but was very fortunately brought back. Thankfully I recovered very quickly (without damage to any part of my heart) and 3 months later started to think about the future.

Retiring for me was easy. I wanted to get a Vespa (I of course did), give up my large motorcycles and start to do the things I and my wife have been wanting to do. Money? I'm not rich but well enough off to live comfortably. I now have all my pensions and my back account is looking rather nice but it's got to last me a long time (I hope).

So if you have an inclination to retire and if it's financially feasible then I'd take it. Oh just one thing. You may find, as I did that folks will come after you to do engineering projects offering large sums of money. It happened to me and I weakened and went back to work for a 6 month period to manage an engineering project (engine development). I won't do that again though as it interfered with my own fun! Lol. Whatever you decide I'm sure it will be the right thing. As long as the finances are ok there isn't really a wrong decision for most people. Good luck jess!

Just do it!

Move to Porto.

Enjoy what is left of your life.

Bill

It's just a number. 30, 31, 40.... Retire when it makes sense.

My old accounting professor retired when he was 40. After 2 years , he got extremely bored playing golf everyday so he applied to be a professor at the local university. They promptly hired him when he said he didn't want pay. He said the sense of fulfillment was enough.

Seems like you have a great job, which is more than what most people can say. Hold on to it. Cut back on hours if you feel you need more free time.

Good luck.

Jess, I suggest you hone your retirement plan and collect up a list of activities that you want to do as a retiree. Start living on your retired budget now. Then continue to work a few more years knowing you have the luxury to immediately start your retirement at a moments notice. Having that option in your pocket is priceless and liberating.

Bill

I never met anyone who regretted retiring early - when they could vs waiting until they "had to" or "it was time to".

One person's advice I recall was; "as soon as you're able to retire - do it". It will take some adjustments, more than you might think (mental, as much as anything else) but it brings so many rewards and freedoms. And you can always work part time or volunteer or Do Whatever the Heck You Want to Do. It's an incredible feeling. And it only gets better...

"You never know what is enough unless you know what is more than enough."
- William Blake

(Not referencing savings... but I suspect you knew that already.)

I've been at my job for 24 years and I'm 50 now. Unlike your situation my job requires little precision thinking, and the job is super laid back. People at this employer hang around as long as possible because the job treats us well, has great benefits, pension plan, 401k that's company matched and the company is solid. So you have to look at the other things outside of your employer.
Can you comfortably afford to retire?
Can you continue your health insurance after retiring?
Can you tolerate your other half on a daily basis?
Can/would you be willing to do a part-time job if needed?
Have retirement plans/dreams mapped out yet?
Lots of things to consider and that's a very short list. We have this conversation at work on a regular basis. Falls under the same conversation as 'What would you do if you won a large lottery?'. None of us are ready to retire, and pretty sure we wont win a lottery, but it makes for a good time passing conversation. Same conversation we're having right now.

Take a sabbatical and see what you can see.

Health Insurance was my problem even though I was eligible for Medicare my wife seven years junior would not have the same insurance so I worked three more years until one day I walked in and gave them my two-week notice, nothing could have been better.
Turns out insurance wasn't as bad as I thought money wise, no third Vespa, but good, and then the wife gets a part-time job with full benefits.

I like working around the house.

You seem to have solid reasons for moving to another chapter. Good for you!

One day a co-worker asked, "Tom how old are you? And don't you have about 30 yrs in with the State?"

"Yes."

"You're past full SS retirement age! - what the hell are you still doing here, working with those 2 idiots and for that loser?"

"I like the work I get to do, sometimes."

But, she got me to thinking. I talked it over with my family.
I took about three more humiliations from my new boss (arbitrarily banning my scooter from it's parking spot - didn't help), and one morning when he came around to the office I'd finished building. I told him, "I'm going to need another 5 gal. of this color.. Oh, and I just got off the phone with Peggy, in personnel. I gave her my 2 weeks notice."


I let several of my dept. friends know I was leaving. But asked for a quiet exit. No announcement, no cake in the conference room, etc.
My last afternoon I walked around the 325 employee Human Services Agency - to the desk of 7 special employees to say goodbye, that I was leaving today and how much they had brightened my day every time I saw them. I rec'd 7 startled hugs w/some tears.. It was nice.

I had so much vacation and sick time in the bank that I continued on the State payroll for a few months while I sorted out all the insurance and pension questions. You're supposed to start attending retirement planning sessions 5 yrs prior to your end date!

20 yrs ago a co-worker asked my how I could be in such a good mood every day in spite of our idiot supervisor and "itchy & scratchy", her two mean brown-nosers?
The job offered great benefits, insurance and retirement for a head of household w/six kids --- but I suspect it was also because I thought I didn't deserve any better.

Then one day, I did.

O.S.

PS: 5 mins before quitting time - the new agency director passed me in the hallway without a word. ("30 yrs") I caught up with her, shook her hand and told her, "if I see you again, just ask - I Super Size you for free!"

Saving this for later. I haven't gotten through everyone's comments.

The fear to jump into the unknown is logical.

The suggestion to try working less hours/consult - as a way to ease out of work sounds ideal to me.

Also - I'm a bit of a nerd, but this seems like a time to have consultation with a financial advisor to double check your retirement savings math.

That's what I have been doing.

I'm a barber and it is a very low stress job. That's important to me.

I'm 59 and on average I have reduced my working hours by about 10 hours a week every 15 years. That wasn't planned from the start but how it worked out.

When I was in my 20s I was working 50 hours a week, later 40 now I work 30 hours a week and when I get to 65 I plan to go to 20 and will probably stay with that as long as my health holds out.

I feel like if I didn't have a reason to get up I would just sleep in late every morning.

Not really advice, just an observation.

Thanks much for all the advice. I have read everyone's responses and will re-read them again after I've had some tea this morning.

I did leave out a big piece of the puzzle, though: my wife and I are intent on transitioning to life abroad post-retirement. We're not going to wholesale sell everything we own and move overseas the day I retire, though. Rather, we are likely to spend increasingly-long periods in the city and the country that we have picked, trying it on for size and getting to know that city's neighborhoods, its flavor, its character.

If we were retiring-in-place, living in the house that we've already paid off, finances wouldn't really be a question. But transitioning to a life overseas makes financial questions like "will I have enough to retire?" and "What will my retirement budget be?" especially difficult, almost impossible. We really don't know what our budget will be, and we likely won't know that until we've re-settled. We can roughly estimate based on cost of living in that country, of course. But it's just a rough estimate. There will be many unanticipated costs, hence the uncertainty.

The city I'm talking about here is Porto, which I fell in love with on our first recon mission to check out Portugal. We also visited Lisbon and even Madrid, for good measure. But Porto was the city that just clicked for me.

If you are in a position to transition out of your job, I say go for it!

I'm 55 too, and it's an odd age, at least for me. I can still spend two weeks backpacking through the Grand Canyon, (which I do once or twice a year if possible), but my body is simply starting to hurt. I keep getting tendonitis in my elbows, (the last time from a day of posthole digging in hard dirt). My lower back gets stiff. Now something weird is going on with my upper arm making it hard to grab things off a shelf. Add to that, my doctor is out of the country until September, but I usually tend to avoid doctors like the plague, so I'm not in a hurry.

My body just seems to be saying to me - Dude, you're getting older.

I don't like it.

I had the great fortune of being an at-home-dad for the first twelve years of our having children. Then I started working part time, and for the past four years, I've been in my position full time. It's an administrative assistant position, and it's something I'm poorly qualified for, though everyone is always thanking me for the great job I do. I'm a dab hand at troubleshooting almost anything, but performing routine tasks over and over again makes me crazy, and that's a good part of my job. I feel a little bit of impostor syndrome while I sit here looking busy and posting on Modern Vespa.

I do imagine it would be harder to leave my position if I really loved what I do. As it is, I love where I work, but not what I do for work.

Right now, my son is receiving free tuition at his college because of my work here, but after he graduates in three years, I'll be looking to transition to something else.

The friend I backpack with is in his mid-seventies, so as long as he keeps going, I feel I can't complain about being too old, but it certainly doesn't seem like my body bounces back like it used to.

Sorry Jess - you were asking for advice about your situation. I'm afraid I just rambled on about myself.

Uncertainty always sucks. I love stories of people who just chuck everything and head off in pursuit of their dreams. The stories always work out, but I always seem to have the ability to bask in the paranoia that I will end up panhandling for ramen in the cold, cold rain.

I blame my parents.

Choose Portugal Jess, many retired friends went there ...
Good quality of life and services and in any case an EU country.
From that location you can tour all over Europe and beyond.

This is exactly why we chose Portugal, before we had even set foot in the country. Fortunately, we fell in love with Porto as soon as we got there.

Good to see you here, Trep. And with some sage advice, too. Thanks.

I expect all of us who took the chance to retire early will agree that it's one of the best decisions we ever made. Get out and enjoy the world while your mind and body can take full advantage. You will find rewards that you can't even guess at right now.

"I wouldn't be where I am today...."

Although I work for a living, I'm also not 100% about what I'd do 8am till 5pm Monday to Friday if I didn't?

It is a worry that I won't find out what that other thing is until it's too late!

I have had this conversation with an ex-colleague in his 70's. He had thought the same, got out anyway in his 60's, and now doesn't know how he ever had time to go to to work.

So maybe the answer has to be once you can stop working to live, stop. Then the rest sort of just happens I guess..

What an incredible thread to read. "Congrats Jess"! Without a doubt the best thread and intro post that one could hope to write. I am jealous and envious but so glad to read here that many of you have managed to peg what I feel is, "The American Dream".

Too much going on in my head to keep typing now or it will quickly become a TLDR post.

But, I wanted to tip the hat to your attraction to Portugal. I have at least one colleague who I left behind when I punched out of an aerospace career to come to Hawaii who is about to retire there as well. He was always very calculating and made very smart and conservative choices and if that is where he says is good.....then it's the place! I think he is looking further South than you, same coast but south of Lisbon somewhere.

All I can say is must be nice and God speed....awesome-sauce!

Many of us had, or will have, difficulty in walking away from a long-term career job. In my case the answer was consulting work. I spent two years consulting about half time as a transition period. That definitely took the trauma out of the change. It also let me transition financially. It has all worked out very well and I am certainly not looking back.

Do it now. I'm no expert, but I can relate. I've been in metrology in the auto industry for thirty years. This year, in fact.

Again, there's no wisdom in my advice. I've made some pretty stupid decisions. What I can say is this ... tomorrow has no guarantees. My older brother died suddenly at age 58 this past February. We just had his memorial last Saturday. He loved what he did and worked himself to death. Another coworker/friend had just seen his children grow up and leave home. He and his wife of 30+ years were putting things in place for retirement when he was diagnosed with ALS. They had to switch gears from shopping for resorts to shopping for an electric wheelchair. They gave him 2-5 years.

That's not to sound all doom and gloom, but if there's anything 2020 taught us is that a year from now things could look ... different.

I've been socking money into retirement accounts since 1991. I have no illusions that it could all be gone tomorrow. If you have the wherewithal to do so, ask yourself, "Would I rathe go to work today or [insert any other activity here]." My wife and I paid our house off last fall (17 years - yay us), and if I could square away insurance and a couple of other loose ends I would walk away from this whole industry and not look back. And I like what I do.

Just my perspective. Best to you on whatever you decide.

My Father-in-law was Professor of English at a university in the city.
He delayed his retirement for 'academic' reasons.
He retired in the December of that year.
In January he went in for a surgical procedure to correct a life-long pectus excavatum (sunken chest) so that he and his wife could travel.
He never recovered despite being on a ventilator for almost a week.
His retirement lasted less than six weeks.

I retired three months before my due date.
Working in the Public Service is stressful and worst when a new administration comes into power. With an election pending and a new Minister (US=Secretary) I knew from past experience that the new Minister would bring his pet projects to the table and expect them to be prioritised for immediate implementation, despite the fact that the fiscal budgeting cycle had already committed the budget to priority projects under the previous administration.
I was not prepared to undergo that highly stressful situation in the last three months of my working career. I quantified the cost in terms of gratuity and monthly pension, and decided to leave early. I have never regretted it. From my colleagues who remained behind, the period was most toxic for all and they envied my departure.

If you want to leave, do it now.

I was fortunate to be able to retire at 57, with a generous pension. I could have kept working, but the opportunity to travel in the off season and shop on weekdays was irresistible. My dad died at 65, he had been retired for a couple of months, so all the plans he and mom had for travel were never realized. I have met a ton of folks directly or indirectly through MV, and have been on seven amazing trips with the VCdM, the group that Al (Aviator 47) started. The clock is always ticking, so enjoying life is the best thing you can do for yourself. Cheers to you and the new journey!

My younger brother just went through this. He was in tech security working with many large corporations over the years and making buckets of money. We talked about how it's difficult to put in so many years and not at least feel defined by your work-especially collaborative work. He also talked about his "team" that he'd be letting down by retiring. It took two extra years but he finally gave his notice and officially retired last week.
It sounds like you definitely have a plan, Jess, and a good one at that. Go for it.

I am 48 and I am fortunate!
My father was a pharmacist and my family owned a drug store in Detroit for almost 100 years but my dad loved the circus, old arcade games and things like that so he started a second business which was also his passion. It's been built into one of the most MARVELOUS arcades/mechanical museums in the world (we've been on American Pickers, Mysteries at the Museum (2X), Modern Marvels and tons of other stuff). I lost my father a few years ago now but I still carry on his legacy and LOVE IT! I get to be a kid all day and deal with people who are coming to have fun (generally a positive attitude). I could sell the collection and easily retire (my wife being a Dr makes that even easier) but I ask myself what would I do all day?
My point is you have to enjoy what you are doing, especially at this point in life. Don't retire find something you really enjoy and start it as a side business and see if you can build it up to something that can supplement your savings till you can leave the "job". I manage a portion of my investment portfolio as well as I find it fun and it keeps my mind active, I also own a company where I sell high end watches and am a partner in the largest online watch dealer to dealer trading platform.

That sounds really cool! I've already done that. You're reading it right this minute. I mean, it doesn't really generate any income (it's been a net loss for almost its entire existence) but it does keep me busy.

That sent me looking for a donate button for the forum. I'd certainly be happy to chip in from time to time. I appreciate the time and effort you've put into this project, and the general kindness, helpfulness, and good will of everyone who posts here. Is there a means by which forum members can support the forum?