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pbcoole wrote:
That sent me looking for a donate button for the forum. I'd certainly be happy to chip in from time to time. I appreciate the time and effort you've put into this project, and the general kindness, helpfulness, and good will of everyone who posts here. Is there a means by which forum members can support the forum?
It's not necessary, and nobody should feel compelled to support MV. We run this as a service to the scooter community. If you like, you can use the smile.amazon.com link at the bottom of the page when you shop on Amazon, IF you shop on Amazon. MV will get a small referral fee, and you will simultaneously get to support a charity of your choice. Everybody wins!

It is appreciated, but not required.
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I am also in a similar situation (a good paying job I like most of the time), although financially I really can't pull the trigger just yet.

If you're in the position where you can reasonably do what you want in retirement, I'd say go for it. You might find a part time job abroad that you'll really like to help offset some expenses and keep your mind sharp.

Both my parents worked until their mid-60's, but their health was already starting to decline at that point. They could have afforded to retire early, but they did not and ultimately really weren't able to enjoy their retirement. My older brother (and only sibling) died at 53 a few years ago.

The lasting lesson I've taken from these losses is this..."Do what you want to do while you can still do it."
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CrazyCarl wrote:
Both my parents worked until their mid-60's, but their health was already starting to decline at that point. They could have afforded to retire early, but they did not and ultimately really weren't able to enjoy their retirement.
This is a major factor for me. The essential compromise is financial certainty vs. ability to enjoy retirement.
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wmak wrote:
My dad died at 65, he had been retired for a couple of months, so all the plans he and mom had for travel were never realized.
Very sorry to hear that. One of my worst fears.
wmak wrote:
VCdM, the group that Al (Aviator 47) started
Al and Ardy are the reason we are considering moving abroad. Had it not been for his example, it never even would have occurred to me.
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How are you 55 already, Jess? Oh, wait; I turn 68 the day before your next birthday! Arrrr

Our experiences are probably very different than yours, as the cost of living in the midwest is pretty low, comparably.Neither Deb nor I had high paying jobs, never getting close to $100k combined, but we did purchase an inexpensive home which we paid off early, and invested half my income and a quarter of hers. That allowed us to retire at 56 for me and 54 for her. Having grandparents put both girls through college was the real reason that allowed us to retire, though.

Like anyone who has retired early, we've never regretted it nor looked back. I left a job I like after 30 years, and the suggestions I got of consulting or part time work sounded like more of the same to us. Not having to plan around anything is what gave us the freedom to travel, or not, lazy about, or go like gangbusters on a project, or whatever struck our fancy. We too looked at the idea of moving abroad part of the year, but aging parents, children, and now a grandchild made that a non starter for Deb.

The *only* fly in the ointment financially was health insurance. I knew there would be highs and lows in the market, and having zero debt allowed us to splurge when we could and shrimp when we should. But having insurance premiums increase at 20-25% a year was wayyyy outside of any scenario we'd planned for.

Retiring early along with a mediocre income left a pension that barely covered the electric, cable, and cell phone bills. Everything else came out of investments and savings. So when the insurance shot up every year, we found ourselves eventually paying $34,000 in premiums the year before I took medicare. Then back up to $27,000 two years later when Deb was eligible. Medicare and SS have been like a $70,000 a year raise for us!

I know Portugal has completely different health care, and don't know what your eligibility would be, but be sure to double, then double again a couple of times your expected health care costs for the next ten years if it is US based.

I look forward to following your adventures, and good luck to you both!
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We retired two weeks before my 53rd birthday - 15 years ago tomorrow. No regrets. We had family and friends tell us, "You're too young! What will you do with yourselves? What happens if you run out of money?"

Yesterday, while on the way to our summer destination (for a few months of really good riding), my wife and I were talking about this "early retirement thing." She said, "I am SO glad we retired when we did. I think of all the things we can't physically do now that we could do back then. So many great experiences! A lot of them I don't care to do now, but would have regretted if we hadn't done it when we could."

We sold our business, commercial property, and our home. We had a career that we enjoyed, a home that we had custom built, and all the toys. We traded that in for a couple years of cruising on our boat. During those two years, we were offered jobs all the time. I said no, as I felt I was just getting really good at the whole retirement thing. Then a captain job offer that allowed us to be in some spectacular places, at the best time of year, and the best part: only a seasonal commitment. After 3 or 4 months, we could get back on our own boat and head out again.

Then, my wife said she wanted to RV again (I sold our diesel pusher motorcoach right before we retired). We bought an RV that allowed us extended living, and divided our time between that, the boat, and our small "vacation" home. 8 years of what she called "fun summer jobs" left me a bit burned out on boats, so we sold our cruising boat and spent more time RVing; coast to coast, border to border. I worked my last captain job in 2017 and have successfully dodged any further job offers... being gainfully unemployed suits me.

If you have your finances in order, the toughest thing about making that commitment to retire is... pulling the plug. A lot of us guys define who we are by what we do... and if we don't have a career, do we still have self-worth? I am proof that... yes, you served 30 years, you owe it to yourself to try a lifestyle without pressure, deadlines, stress (even if it is self-induced). Now, there will still be daily stress, just from living. In the last two years, I have dealt with a hip replacement and cancer. Physically, I am in better shape now than I was 10 years ago. Two weeks ago, I got another "Go live your life" from the doctor, but... "Come back for another follow up in 6 months."

Truth be told, I never thought I'd live this long. I liked fast cars, fast motorcycles, airplanes, and racing sailboats... all things I did to escape the working world. For the next few months, all I want to do (other than some of the daily things that you still have to do) is ride my Vespa on some truly great roads. Take my lovely wife (we've been together since high school) out for lunch, and walk my big burly cat Rufus around the RV resort where we are staying. It's a schedule I don't mind.

If you read this far, that's how we did it. You will find your own best way. I can't offer any suggestion about how you should retire or what anniversary date to do it. But, I do suggest giving retirement a good honest try. For years, I used to say, "I can make more money, but I can't make more time." It's a cliche'... but it is also very true. You can "un-retire" at any time if you want, and are physically able. But, you can't turn back the years.

Good luck with the decisions, Jess.

Jim
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folks who are worried about that big paycheck normally live payday to payday. those who have put that nest egg back are pretty frugal.
Since going from semi retirement to full retirement, meaning working while drawing a retirement ck to not working for a W2 and check I can say I have busier not getting that W2 than getting that W2. Do I miss that W2 NOPE no way no how.
My wife still works FT but she likes it and is going PT next year hopefully.
I do odd jobs for little ol ladies who have lost husbands who can afford contractors who rip em off anyway. change an outlet here na there, install a new light or ceiling fan and other misc stuff like that, it gets me cookies and cakes and every once in awhile a 20. plus smiles on folks faces.

now the decision to pull the cord and live life to enjoy things is while you still can is not easy but totally doable.

A VERY good friend of mine who is very successful in his boat dealership just had a life changing incident at 62. he tripped and did a face plant against a wall and screwed up his C2/3 a month ago. he is currently going the rehab and learning how to deal and cope with the chair he most likely will never get out of. REALLY hurts my soul to see this. He was just fixing to semi retire and turn over the business and start enjoying trips and things.

You don't know what tomorrow really can be like, life is shorter than you think.
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Steve wrote:
How are you 55 already, Jess? Oh, wait; I turn 68 the day before your next birthday! Arrrr
Time marches on, yeah?
Steve wrote:
The *only* fly in the ointment financially was health insurance. I knew there would be highs and lows in the market, and having zero debt allowed us to splurge when we could and shrimp when we should. But having insurance premiums increase at 20-25% a year was wayyyy outside of any scenario we'd planned for.
This is a big concern for us. As long as we're living in the US, health insurance is going to be quite expensive. We have a rough estimate of what it will cost us, but of course that is likely to go up until we each separately hit Medicare age.
Steve wrote:
I know Portugal has completely different health care, and don't know what your eligibility would be, but be sure to double, then double again a couple of times your expected health care costs for the next ten years if it is US based.
As non-citizen residents in Portugal, we'll be required to carry private health insurance. This is vastly more affordable than it is in the US, however. The catch is that this is on top of what we will have to pay for US health care, at least until we become full-time residents in Portugal (if we do in fact make that final leap).

Health care costs in the US are actually one of several major reasons we want to live abroad. It might have been the core reason why we started this process to begin with.
Steve wrote:
I look forward to following your adventures, and good luck to you both!
I am unlikely to be posting anything on FaceBook. So you'll likely have to stick around MV to find out.
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Talk to your Financial advisor, as this is a financial decision. Talk to you family, your wife and kids need a say. Then retire. Set up an account that is funded monthly which pays your recurring bills like power, heating/cooling, mortgage etc. That is the best thing my wife and I have ever done. You will still have bills to pay, but the process is much simpler.
Now, lounge around a while, ride, get more family time, whatever turns your dials.
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jess wrote:
I am unlikely to be posting anything on FaceBook. So you'll likely have to stick around MV to find out.
I don't do Facebook. And I plan on sticking around this time. 😉
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Lot of really interesting posts here. My own story includes a recent decision along the lines of what you're thinking about, Jess, if on a smaller scale. I have a job I basically like, been there for over 25 years, moved around from technical to managerial and now back to technical roles.

Over the course of 2020, I worked from home a lot, and also had the benefit of PPP time, so in the end I was home, well, most of the time. Turned out, not only did I like it, but so did my wife. So I/we decided to take advantage of a company policy allowing reduced hours. I now work M-R 7.5 hours each of those days, and have 3-day weekends going forward. It's supposed to be reviewed every 6 months to "be sure it's working for both sides".

Last weekend was my first real 3-day weekend.

I liked it.

A lot.

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Well Jess I would say your answer is somewhat hidden in your question. I've known you for 15 years and you are one of the most intelligent, articulate and thoughtful people I've ever encountered so I'm certain you will eventually make the correct choice.

I retired last July at 56, besides my health situation it's been wonderful and allowed us to do many things we've never had the time to do. I'm not certain I'm retired forever however taking a time out from 40 years in the transportation industry has been a blessing.

The question of do I have enough assets to continue this always creeps in however if we decide to stay retired I'll buy two more rental homes and be done forever on that front.

Taking a time out allows us time to contemplate carving a new path or different path, irrespective of the money.

You'll get it right, you always have. My best to you pal.

SDG
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The big question for me is always, "What will satisfy that intellectual curiosity and replace the euphoria that comes when you finally solve a hard problem or finally understand how something works or get something working that you'd been working on for months or years."

We'll stay tuned...
Miguel
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Miguel wrote:
The big question for me is always, "What will satisfy that intellectual curiosity and replace the euphoria that comes when you finally solve a hard problem or finally understand how something works or get something working that you'd been working on for months or years."
It's an excellent question. Does this count? [NSR] Character Set Hell
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Also if you become a permanent resident in the EU, if you wish, you can come and pick kiwis from me and others in my area in the period between October and November; working holiday ...
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Miguel wrote:
The big question for me is always, "What will satisfy that intellectual curiosity and replace the euphoria that comes when you finally solve a hard problem or finally understand how something works or get something working that you'd been working on for months or years."
Sudokus of course.
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znomit wrote:
Sudokus of course.
How does retirement work in NZ?
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Attila wrote:
How does retirement work in NZ?
Upon reaching the age of 65 (that's the age that half of people were dead already when the scheme was introduced, contemplate that for a second) we get a pension from our benevolent government. You have to have been in NZ for only 10 years to qualify for this, which is kinda ridiculous (most countries stipulate 20 years). It's about $700 per week for a couple which is OK to get by on if you own a house.

Most people also invest in our superannuation scheme where you pay in 3% of your salary and your employer matches that, which should give most people a modest nest egg come retirement time. I've been around long enough to be in a stupidly generous scheme that basically means my income doesn't drop when I retire. My grandkids will be well spoilt.

Health care is substantially free too.
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Porto - that's a good clarification. So it's either sabbatical(s, for several experimental stays in there?) or releasing yourself fully for the adventures.

Spain and Portugal are both quite popular destinations for Finnish pensioners too. Lower living costs and nice weather, that's it in a nutshell

The latest estimates say there are about 25 000 - 30 000 Finns living in the Spain, mostly in the Southern Spain.

Much less in Portugal, although Portugal was a 'pensioners tax paradise' for us until recently, as we could enjoy there Finnish pension with Portugese tax levels. Now that loop hole is fixed with heavy pressure from the Finnish goverment, lucky us

Why Spain is so popular - well, as you know, the economy there is in a better shape than in Portugal. This makes the overall feeling a bit more familiar from our viewpoint. Living costs are of course higher than in Portugal, but still very low compared to ours. The other key factor is other Finns in there - many Finns wish to make their great escape with the safety net of familiar faces and voices around them, especially when getting a bit older. Choose a random apartment block somewhere in the Costa de Sol area and the good changes are it is fully occupied by Britts, Finns or Germans. Hmmm... which leads us to the benefits of less populated, more rural Portugal

I'll have to add - I've been countless times in Spain, both for work and pleasure. Amazingly, I've never yet been in Portugal. So no first hand experience there.
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RRider wrote:
Spain and Portugal are both quite popular destinations for Finnish pensioners too. Lower living costs and nice weather, that's it in a nutshell
Yep! The Portuguese people are friendly, too. Portugal has a lower cost of living than Spain, but still has a relatively high EU standard of living.
RRider wrote:
Much less in Portugal, although Portugal was a 'pensioners tax paradise' for us until recently, as we could enjoy there Finnish pension with Portugese tax levels. Now that loop hole is fixed with heavy pressure from the Finnish goverment, lucky us
As US citizens, we will be taxed in both countries no matter what. Fortunately, taxes paid to one country can be deducted from the other country, so we will likely pay US taxes and then a bit more on top of that to Portugal.
RRider wrote:
Why Spain is so popular - well, as you know, the economy there is in a better shape than in Portugal. This makes the overall feeling a bit more familiar from our viewpoint. Living costs are of course higher than in Portugal, but still very low compared to ours. The other key factor is other Finns in there - many Finns wish to make their great escape with the safety net of familiar faces and voices around them, especially when getting a bit older.
I would say that the cuisine of Spain is also better -- exceptional, even -- compared to Portugal. But Portuguese cuisine is still quite good, with some notable exceptions. The tomatoes we were regularly served in Portugal would be an insult to any Italian.
RRider wrote:
I'll have to add - I've been countless times in Spain, both for work and pleasure. Amazingly, I've never yet been in Portugal. So no first hand experience there.
Crime rates in Portugal are lower than Spain. The interior is sparsely populated, though this has a lot to do with the exodus from Portugal during the 90s (and migration to cities). Rural property can be purchased at a discount, though we probably won't go that route.

Perhaps the most important difference for non-EU citizens is the path path to citizenship in Portugal vs. Spain. There are some very attractive visa options offered in Portugal, designed to bring foreign money into the Portuguese economy. And after 5 years of residency (or relaxed residency, if going the Golden Visa route) one can apply for citizenship. In Spain, it is 10 years before you can apply for citizenship. Further, Portugal allows for dual citizenship, whereas Spain does not (except for citizens of certain Latin American countries). So there are clearly some advantages in favor of Portugal, at least for us.

Portugal is also the proverbial "road less travelled". And that's attractive to me.
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jess wrote:
If we were retiring-in-place, living in the house that we've already paid off, finances wouldn't really be a question. But transitioning to a life overseas makes financial questions like "will I have enough to retire?" and "What will my retirement budget be?" especially difficult, almost impossible. We really don't know what our budget will be, and we likely won't know that until we've re-settled. We can roughly estimate based on cost of living in that country, of course. But it's just a rough estimate. There will be many unanticipated costs, hence the uncertainty.
The conundrum is not an all or nothing venture. You make the decision to move/relocate and do it. The decision to continue to stay in Porto can be made continuously, year by year, or month by month. There will be circumstances which arise, out of your control, for which you will need to make new plans/decisions. Life.

You will have downsized, immensely, prior to the move out of the USA. If a return is needed or required, you still have the resources to return, and a lighter load to come back with you.

Too bad the Peace Corps is no longer in Estonia, for one example, like it was in the 1990's. As a PC Volunteer, it would have gotten you closer to your destination.

My brief two cents.
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znomit wrote:
Upon reaching the age of 65 (that's the age that half of people were dead already when the scheme was introduced, contemplate that for a second) we get a pension from our benevolent government. You have to have been in NZ for only 10 years to qualify for this, which is kinda ridiculous (most countries stipulate 20 years). It's about $700 per week for a couple which is OK to get by on if you own a house.

Most people also invest in our superannuation scheme where you pay in 3% of your salary and your employer matches that, which should give most people a modest nest egg come retirement time. I've been around long enough to be in a stupidly generous scheme that basically means my income doesn't drop when I retire. My grandkids will be well spoilt.

Health care is substantially free too.
As a public servant, I contributed 7% of my salary to the Government Employees Pension Fund. The employer conributed 8% to the scheme, for a defined benefit pension, calculated as a percentage of my average salary for the last 24 months of employment utiplied by the total number of months as a contributing member.

I enjoy continued medical scheme cover, partly covered by an ongoing contribution from the previous employer.

Unfortunately, when I started contributing, the South African Rand was worth around one German Mark. Now I have to pay 18 Rands for one Euro! So I can only afford to live here as my wife and I own our house and are totally debt-free...
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I'm 54 with 3 kids under the age of 18 at home and we're squeaking by, but happy. A huge factor in our decision was my mom passing at 59 (accident), my dad at 63 plus 2 weeks (pancreatic cancer). If you can swing it, don't delay.
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Jess, my advice would be to retire and not look back. I was a NYC prosecutor for 36.5 years and loved my job almost the entire time. I was a homicide trial attorney and/or homicide chief for 70% of the time. I won't lie; my job was a significant portion of my identity. Most people believed I had a very stressful job, but I rarely found it to be. When I reached the minimum retirement age without any penalty (62) I left three days after my birthday. After more than four years, I have never returned to the office and have no desire to. I do not miss it in the least (well, perhaps when pulled over for speeding).
Part of the decision was made easier by my wife's profession basically disappearing in her late forties, so she was already retired and we had grown used to living on one income.
I suspect that you will find things to keep you busy if that's what you want. I sometimes feel bad for friends my age who are still working, but many have no intention of retiring anytime soon. I can't imagine they love their jobs any more than I did, but something motivates them to keep at it. Darned if I know.
As to retirement in Porto; you picked a great town. I've fantasized about living overseas but my ability to learn a foreign language is non-existent.
We first visited Porto in 1997, and again in 2019 with VCdM; significant changes to Portugal in 22 years, but the gentle vibe remains.
I have met meany people fearful of retirement, but can't think of any that regretted it, likely because the ones who would, never retired.
Hope whatever your decision, it makes you happy.
@attila avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@attila avatar
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: UTC
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
UTC quote
Kayemtee wrote:
Jess, my advice would be to retire and not look back.
That's right, I am happier and healthier now that I have my time and my choices.
Language is learned well by living in the place where you are, practicing it.
For years people have been traveling the planet and no one has ever had communication problems, at least the alphabet is not very different from the English-speaking one; it would have been more complex with Greek, Cyrillic, Arabic and Chinese ...
@caplan avatar
UTC

Hooked
Triumph Bonneville T120
Joined: UTC
Posts: 123
Location: Bentonville
 
Hooked
@caplan avatar
Triumph Bonneville T120
Joined: UTC
Posts: 123
Location: Bentonville
UTC quote
Gasmk1 wrote:
I would look into becoming a consultant in your area of expertise maybe offer to work on that basis for your current employer on 3 days a week, failing that set up your own company and just do contracts when you feel the need.
I love this idea. As an engineer you should have your pick of projects.
OP
@jess avatar
UTC

Petty Tyrant
0:7 And counting
Joined: UTC
Posts: 37837
Location: Bay Area, California
 
Petty Tyrant
@jess avatar
0:7 And counting
Joined: UTC
Posts: 37837
Location: Bay Area, California
UTC quote
Big_Boys_Mother wrote:
The conundrum is not an all or nothing venture. You make the decision to move/relocate and do it. The decision to continue to stay in Porto can be made continuously, year by year, or month by month. There will be circumstances which arise, out of your control, for which you will need to make new plans/decisions. Life.
Agreed. And we will be keeping our house in California for the short term while we investigate Portugal further and build up a first-hand knowledge of the financial requirements there. Our intent is to have our house in California as a fallback position. At some point (maybe 5 years down the road) when we are certain that we want to stay in Portugal, we will then liquidate our belongings (and the house) in California. But not until we are relatively certain on all fronts.

The thing with California is that once you've left, it's really hard to come back. The cost of entry is just too high. We probably couldn't afford the house we live in today if we were going to buy it at market rates.
@athena61 avatar
UTC

Enthusiast
Vespa 150, 50
Joined: UTC
Posts: 75
Location: Minneapolis
 
Enthusiast
@athena61 avatar
Vespa 150, 50
Joined: UTC
Posts: 75
Location: Minneapolis
UTC quote
Hi Jess. Sent you a PM.
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