Modern Vespa

I made a bunch of noise and dust today, along with a little bit of welding. Most of the time was spend trimming and fitting the sheetmetal to a final fitment shape. I ended up procuring a VB1 fuel tank...off of my OTHER VB1 that i picked up a couple months ago! Unfortunately the tank is rotted out, but at least i can use it to mock up for my fuel tank clearances.

A couple pics of the recently acquired VB1 that i'm using its fuel tank for mocking up in my rusty VB1.


I got some future plans for this one. Hopefully they will come to fruition? I do have VERY low mile 2005 PX150 engine sitting on my shelf. Lord knows that a kitted 150 engine will be 20x easier to install than the dang 200 engine! I would also plan to lea

This VB1 came as a package deal when i bought that crushed NSU Prima 3 a few months back.


Last edited by whodatschrome on Fri, 04 Nov 2022 05:17:30 +0000; edited 1 time

I used a bar clamp to REALLY compress the shock's rubber bump stop. I figuring that on a hard landing jump that the bump stop will compress about 50%...and the rusty frame will break in half. So i cut and trimmed more of the frame to account for that.


If you look hard, you can see the rubber bump stop compressed.

I welded back in some pieces of the frame that i saved. I'm REALLY glad i kept them! Rest be sure that the only reason i kept them is because i've learned from past experiences from throwing stuff like that away.


we'll just put that piece back...

and sanded smooth

i didn't have the piece that originally went here, so i had to fashion a new one



piece welded in

This piece took a while to get just right. Since i'm a carpenter, and love to do finish carpentry, this was a cake walk. I tried to not go overboard though.






pic of where the fuel tank will reside. There was a fair amount of massaging with heat and a hammer in order to get clearance for both the carb box, air filter screen, and bottom of the fuel tank.

I'm so impressed with this type of work. It's artistry at its finest, IMO. Keep up the good work and thanks for the pictures and explanations!

Here are a couple pics showing what it looks like mostly finished. I still need to make some welds underneath, but i want to wait until i flip the scooter frame over on its other side first.


SIP shock at full extension

SIP shock at full compression. The bar clamp is very strong and it's the rubber bump stop is compressed as far as i can get it.

I'm planning on using this screen...buuuuut now i'm thinking about a way to use an OEM air bellows that goes into the frame. There should be enough room under the cowls to do something like that...if i so choose.

looks like the cowl covers a multitude of sins


Last edited by whodatschrome on Sat, 05 Nov 2022 23:11:34 +0000; edited 4 times

I think this is about as far as i need to go on the rear portion of the frame at this point. I can now focus on figuring out how the finer details on the front P/PX hybrid fork. At this point i don't feel like i have a rush to work on that at this point. I currently have a Jeep project in my shop that i'd like to button up ASAP. While i'm working on the jeep, i can ponder more about a frame bellows.


stupid jeep needs out of my shop!

nice work John! you're making amazing progress!

I hear ya on the jeep work... there's one in my shop too that just won't leave. I am currently at this stage of the game:

OK...i had to finish up the upper rear shock bracket before i up and ghost the bike for a while.

The two stainless spacers (M10x10mm) that i ordered from McMaster arrived yesterday evening, so i did a little bit of grinding on them. It should be self explanatory why i needed to install them.






it was difficult to reach the spacers with the spool gun, so the welds look less than amateur. But since i only need them tack welded, the welds will be plenty strong enough.

I also welded in another little piece of plate in order to hide some of my ugly welds. Those ugly welds are now boxed in and hidden. I tack welded in a thin strip of stainless that "locks" in and keeps the rubber mount from turning...even through there's close to a zero chance of it turning, it now has zero chance!

I'm planning on putting a thin piece of rubber (just like it was with the original shock bracket) between the frame and the bracket. I'm fairly confident that the 316 alloy of stainless steel will outlast the rust frame. So that bracket should still be around in a 1000 years from now...you, me, and the scooter, not so much.

I thought i wasn't going to do anymore work on the scooter for a while, but i couldn't stay away from it. I still wanted to button up the rear portion of the frame while i'm still motivated.

It was finally time to bolt the amalgamated SIP/Whodats Wideframe adapter bracket to the frame. I'm using a 1/4" x 2.5" x 9.5" piece of aluminum (because i conveniently had a piece in my shop) as a reinforced backer, and two M10 bolts to hold it together.


1/4" aluminum plate



pic of the 1/4" backer piece installed

I also boxed in the frame where i cut and angled up a portion of the frame.




fitted

And welded. I'm sand down the welds at some point.

The other side got filled in as well.






The frame is now all boxed in.

And what it looks like with the bracket and engine temporary installed.

In for a penny, in for a pound. I removed the engine and now i'm going for "it". I'm hoping to finish it up tomorrow. You'll just have to wait and see what "it" is...

The weather was clear today in NW oregon, so i took the frame outside to do some more welding and grinding. I got done what i wanted to get done today. I even came up with a game plan for my next step. I can't proceed with it just yet though. I need to place an order with McMaster for a few particulars...


Thanks to Clauss Studios for the cardboard template.

I'm using 16 gauge steel for sectioning my patch panels.




Last edited by whodatschrome on Wed, 09 Nov 2022 04:29:07 +0000; edited 1 time

Pics of the frame boxed back in. I also cut a round piece of steel that will get welded into the original carb intake hole in the frame. I think i used about a 3" diameter hole saw?








i'll weld this piece in last. It makes it convenient to get access to inside the frame with my fingers while i'm fitting everything.

And here's the reason why i squared off the portion of the frame yesterday. The picture should be self explanatory!

Yes, i'm running an air bellows through the frame...which means that the carb will breathe easier, which means Jack will breathe easier, which means that my jetting will breathe easier, which means that I will breathe easier!

I drilled a 2" diameter hole. I had a random scrap piece of stainless thin wall 2" OD tube in my shop that i'm using for mock up purposes. I ordered a new piece of stainless 2" tube online so that i can start with a fresh piece. The stainless tube will get welded directly to the mild steel frame. I ordered a ________ from Mcmaster, which i hope will tie everything together nicely (like i said, hope). My order won't show up until next week though, so i'll just have to wait.

Running my own intake into the frame is giving me ideas. Maybe i could relocate my air intake REALLY high up and fab a snorkel? It would definitely come in handy if i have to ride underwater...for when i have to outrun a volcano (think Dante's Peak movie).


suspension extended

suspension compressed

looking through the front door on the frame

looking straight down into where the tank sits

I welded in the original carb inlet hole today. I also drilled a hole to run both the choke and throttle cables. I have no idea if it will work or if the cables will just bind. I guess there's really no way of telling until i give it a test ride.

I received my order from Mcmaster today, but i can't use the critical item that i had planned to use. I ordered a handful of 2" i.d. round rings to test out to see just which diameter would work the best. I was hoping i could get away with using a 5/16" diameter ring (a stainless steel ring was only available in a 5/16" diameter). I did order a 3/16" ring in a mild steel, so at least i could mock things up for now (a 3/16" stainless ring is on order with ebay). That ring probably won't show up until next week, so until then these pics will have to whet your appetite.


2" o.d. stainless exhaust pipe, 2" i.d. ring, and a P200 air bellows

the ring slips over the pipe

cut the end off of the readily available P series air bellows

test fit a 1.5" long scrap piece of pipe through the frame. Slip of a smaller diameter 3/16" ring over the pipe. In my hand is too large of a diameter 5/16" ring.

This is roughly how far the pipe will protrude out from the frame. Pic is of a 3/16" mild steel ring (that i won't be using).

a look see from inside the frame. The pipe will get trimmed down and welding in after i receive my 3/16" stainless ring in the mail.

I rode my PX2 over to my friend's house late afternoon today. He lives about 20 miles away, and the temperature was about 45 degrees out when i left my house at 3pm. He TIG welded the stainless ring onto the stainless pipe with his fancy Miller welder. I left his place a few hours later, so by the time i got home it was around 38 degrees out. The new to me windshield works pretty well to keep me warm! So maybe the $20 i spent on it wasn't in vain?

My plan tomorrow is to weld it into the scooter frame.




a very nice water cooled Miller welder!

Whodat!
Just caught up on half dozen + posts.
Man - loving this.
Creative as hell with craftsmanship to boot.
Distance gone to have stock(ish) bellows on this beast is terrific.
Some additional stiffness to frames center under seat to boot.
Everyone loves a round tail - and this one is going to be bad ass!
Totally motivating me to pull my rust bucket out and commence some form of custom project with it.

Holy Batman dude! That is a lot of intricate work. It looks like it could end up looking like one of those uber-cool German muscle bikes.

Really nice welding and fabbing. Hard to make the welds disappear like that. Not something I have ever done on my Vespa but plenty of times on my VW bus…usually fabbing small sections to preserve factory seams and structures.

I got the air intake thingy welded in today. It's a tight squeeze, but the rubber bellows doesn't rub against anything. I'm more than happy with the final results.


Yes, this is shaped to the contour of the frame.

A couple more pics with the cylinder shroud installed and the air bellows hooked up.


suspension compressed

suspension extended

A peak through the front door...

With the back end of the frame more or less completed, it was time to turn my focus to the front end. So i picked up the scooter (with the engine still installed) and flipped it right side up on the saw horses.

I used the most expensive straightedge i could find...which was my 6' level. I mounted bare SIP tubeless rims both front and rear. I figure that they would be the straightest wheels i would have. I clamped the straightedge to the rear rim and lined up the front rim to match. Once everything was lined up where i wanted it, i welded the lower 20mm PX fork lug to the upper 16mm P fork. A 20mm PK fork possibly might be better suited for a conversion fork, but i don't have a spare PK fork.








laid in the welds with 220v volts. Definitely not the spot where you would use a 110 welder.

I lowered the fork by 2- 3/4". Now i need to try to figure out how to fit the VB1 fender without it rubbing against the frame or the tire rubbing against it when the shock is at full compression.

Amazing stuff, and fun to watch this from the peanut gallery!

Thank you! I'm glad i'm still having a fun time building it.

Yeah, i guess it is yes kinda looking like one of those German muscle bikes....but without all the muscle (since my engine is still mostly a stock 200). So maybe a more accurate description of my engine is a "toned 200"?

No question, This thing is all Olivia newton john in leggings.

If Olivia were Italian, and had a p200 motor - both having a very nice tush.

Like the solution on lining up the fork!
Welds look hot with deep penetration - talkin bout the scoot here. That joint is a no nonsense one for sure.

2 3/4" seems like a lot!
Surprised - but perhaps it's just the nature of the beast. An inch less than that would be cut off on a VBB. How did u determine how much you would shorten?

2 3/4" is quite a bit! I did a bunch of research online and from what i found, is that one of the German shops where lowering the P/PX forks by 65mm...which is pretty close to 2 5/8". I'm not really liking how the fork's trailing link is at such a steep angle though. I think if i added 1" to the fork leg then it would be at the perfect angle. I can extend the fork, but i'd prefer to leave well enough alone. I'm also using a PK shock in a P fork. The PK shock's are shorter than a P shock, so that was the other reason to lower fork.

The hang up now is the rear portion of the fender to legshield clearance. My thought is to cut the upper portion of the fork tube in half and extend it 1", then install a 1" spacer right under the lower fork bearing race. By doing all of that, it should give me enough clearance between the fender and legshield...emphasis on should.


With a P fork i loose out on just how far i can turn the handlebars to the right.

You can see where the aluminum casting on the fork link fouls out against the legshield.

I started working on the front fender. The VB1 fender is quite slim and difficult to fit over a P fork. A PK fork is built a little bit more compact up where the shock and fender is mounted, and it would have been much easier to fit a fender over the top of...but since i didn't have a spare PK fork, then a P fork will have to do.

I got hung up on trying to get everything lined up, but then i just decided to get out the angle grinder and made it happen.


i cut out plenty of sheetmetal...

...only to weld back in the metal that i had just removed.

I'm a bit hesitant to post pics of the rest of the stuff i got accomplished this evening...only because i have no idea if this fender will even fit while on the scooter without it rubbing against the legshield. Hopefully that's not the case, so i'll post up pics of how far i got on the project this evening.


a piece of 2" stainless tube that i had randomly in my shop that i cut in half lengthwise.

slipping it over a 3" steel pipe so that i could get it the right diameter.

After a minute of tapping the stainless tube with a body hammer.

And this is as far as i got tonight, a rough mock up of what the bulge will look like. The stainless bulge is not welded yet, it's just sitting on the fender.

I made decent headway on the fender today. I learned that a VB1 fender comes NOWHERE close to fitting a P/PX fork!


This is the fender support bracket that i pruned off the P fork.

i trimmed it down enough to reuse it with the VB1 fender.

tack welded in place

100% welded

My ugly scrap piece of stainless had some TIG welding puddles on it from when i was practicing some TIG welds 20 years ago. That ugly piece pretty much matches the patina of the scooter, so in it goes!




I ran the piece long so that i can trim it up later.



i used a 90 degree drill for the fender support bracket

And a few more pics of what it looks like. I had to go back and weld in more metal to the spots where i cut out too much.

Since i used a P fork, the rear portion of the mud guard rubs HEAVILY on the legshield. I think my plan has to be to lower the fork around 1/2"~3-4". Which means fabbing up spacers for the lower forks bearing and race....AND extending the upper portion of the fork the same length. There will be a gap between the bottom of the horncast and the top of the mid guard, but that's just how it will have to be.

I will also need to make a support piece that will fit the new bolt pattern that i drilled into the top of the mud guard. That will be a simple straightforward piece to fashion though.

Oh, and fork stops. I gotta build those too. I'll probably make them out of aluminum?...we shall see.


the mud guard rubs big time here!



Somewhere in here i need to make some sort of fork stops.

A couple last glamour shots for the day. I'm really contemplating on just leaving the weld beads as is. I could sand them down smooth, but the welds really do match the rest of the scooter. What's your ya'll thoughts on that? The scooter isn't going to get painted, so what you see is what it will be.