Modern Vespa

How many times have I been asked the question, "When are you going to get a real bike?"

Sure, in the States motorcycles are seen as being more manly to most. No question.
Though the only insult I ever received was, "that's an awfully big helmet for such a little scooter!".....said the man, looking at my Nolan and pointing to my Honda NSS300 Forza.
Damn
I appologized for my 4XL head.

O.S.

Granted I am a woman so I would receive less gendered stereotypes about choice of PTW, but even I have had a handful of "why not motorcycle" and then I show them a picture of me being able to carry supermarket hauls (filled underseat, top case, along with bag on front handle, etc) and they can't deny the practicality of it. This is also not to derail with the "it's so unsafe" comments...

Anyway, my epic journey up the western coast from Los Angeles to Vancouver Canada on my GTS 250, I took a ferry to Vancouver Island. There was a lineup for motorcycles, which includes me. All "tough guys" on big ol' bikes, mega touring setups and Harleys, etc. You'd think they'd scoff at me, but they were very impressed as the single woman there on a Vespa. "WOW! How'd you get here without a 1200cc?" some of them remarked. Also "WOW! How did you do it without a windscreen???" Etc. I mean, on the 1, it goes from 25-45mph speed limit, why do you need a large bike? I think some literally can not fathom that a 150-250cc is perfectly serviceable and most likely even more practical. I camped up all the way with only a topcase and I carried tent, sleeping bag, mat, cooking gear, etc.

The only people who asked me when I was "getting a real bike" were people who didn't ride, or regularly ride. I don't care what you think, I like my bright yellow GTS.

I have a good friend who has a Harley and I have a Vespa 300 super. We ride weekly in AZ. What is noted is I am faster off the line and way more manueverable, especially on U-turns. So far no real comments from people, but he gets all the waves from other riders, I rarely get a wave, but so what, I love my Vespa, and also it fits in my garage with our two cars. I just ordered the rear OEM crashbars as I like to do something for the Vespa every year or two, can't with for them to arrive. Be happy and be safe.

The model is the Harley Davidson XA. Indian's version was the 841. The V-Twins had cooling issues in the North African desert, so the US Army asked Harley Davidson and Indian to come up with models that would work as well as the BMW R71 and R75 in the desert. The Harley Davidson XA is a near identical bike to the R71, but Indian came up with a design from scratch, with a 90 degree V twin layout much like Moto Guzzi would make famous in the 1960s. There were about 1000 of the XAs and 841s made. Neither of them saw much action, but quite a few still exist.

It's never a good idea to feed the trolls. But it's also not a bad idea to remind homophobes who enjoy sitting on big, throbbing V-twins that the cowboy, indian, construction worker, cop and soldier weren't accompanied by a guy on a Vespa.

I have been riding for over 50 years; 30 bikes over those years, the last 3 have been scooters. I expected snide comments when I switched to a scooter, but it never really happened. A couple motorcycle riding friends questioned my switch, which was originally because of a deteriorating hip, but there was never any denigrating comments. After getting a hip replacement, I can ride whatever I want, and I still want to be riding my Vespa. I enjoy the ease and performance.

As far as a concern about sexual preference, it should really only matter if you are about to have sex with that person. I don't give a rat's ass about someone else's insecurities. Ride your own ride and enjoy.

C'mon, are you calling homophobes those guys who enjoy a huge, hot, powerful vibrating roaring masculine monster at their rear end and crotch?

My experience with a Vespa is that it attracted positive attention.

Female, who otherwise were not interested in motorcycles at all, found it 'cute', approachable or something along that line.

Males mostly found it positive and symphatetic.

Adults pointed it out to their kids, the same who'd probably cover the kids's ears when a 'normal' motorcycle goes by.

When I occasionally rode my Vespa to one of the local bike meet venues ~30 kms from the closest town, nobody questioned the fact that I rode there with a 'city scoot' or that it was my chosen vehicle.

Interestingly, when I did the same with my Suzuki VanVan 200 a few times, that bike attracted even more attention among fellow bikers, but 99% of them were surprised to hear that it was my only bike at the time - so apparently folks saw how one can easily live and survive with a small scoot, but not so well with a 'full size' underpowered tiny motorcycle

I'm lucky though, we have very mixed bunch of bikers around here, all fit in.

From one of the YouTubers that I subscribed to.
"Ride like there's nothing to prove".
"Any day one is on 2 wheels is a beautiful day".

https://m.youtube.com/c/NothingToProveMoto/videos

Wow, Having found the Vespa to be total garbage off road I'm surprised to hear that its decent in the snow.

Not that I'm going to try it. I'll ride in cold weather, below freezing if I feel the need, but after wasting a bike after some heavy crashes in the snow and on ice I draw the line at snow or ice riding.

I did find my 200cc enduro to be quite a bit of fun in the snow mind you...

off road: do you mean gravel with a few potholes or do you mean trying to be a dirt bike doing jumps?

yes and yes.

actually, I found the small frame 90 to be a decent dirtbike, jumps and all, and I found the GTS to be shite on loose gravel/dirt roads.

I ride mine a lot on gravel. I have replaced the shocks with SIP. Love it. I even do a few 4wd tracks ... really should switch tires

"For that much money, you could get a real motorcycle," comes up whenever a scooter costs more than a couple grand.

Here they say "You could buy a car" to both motorcycles and scooters... and even e-bikes sometimes.

My dear old boss once pointed out that you could have the nicest motorcycle in town* for the cost of a fairly ordinary car.
I guess you can get a very nice scooter for the cost of a fairly ordinary real motorcycle.

He thought he did, though many though his Paso was a POSo

Well, yep. If I had enough money to buy something like new Triumph Bonneville, I'd try to get 2006 Scarabeo 500 with ABS and a great Vespa GTS. And, I guess, another garage next to mine.

These guys did not diss my scooter. They just wanted to ride it.

My main complaint about Sprint & gravel roads with loose, harsh gravel was the rattling noise coming from... well, pretty much everywhere

I also did found the balance of weight a bit odd for the occasional... hmmm.. recreational slide I tried on grass/mud and soft sand... kind of like a good old Porche 911, a bit butt heavy? Nothing to stop having fun, for sure!

I've fixed so many rattles. Annoyed me just riding down the street long before i got addicted to bad roads

And I an MP3 500.

The only vehicle I haven't beaten off the line with my BV350 at a stoplight has been a Dodge Challenger Hellcat.

It is only because the others weren't trying.

Your BV350 probably goes 0 to 60mph in 8 to 10 seconds.

Most cars available for sale over the past five years have been faster.

By the way, I also beat them while riding my Vespa GT (0 to 60 in 14 seconds)

Most drivers don't care.

Bill

Never said I beat them to 60mph. Or in a 1/8 or 1/4 mile.

I've beaten people through intersections multiple times. I'll "win", then they'll pass me, only for us both be stopped at the next stoplight. At that point, I know they want to "race" again, and I'll again beat them through the intersection, and again, they'll pass me shortly after that. I don't try to do more than that.

And for the record, the Hellcat caught me half-way through the intersection.

I've beaten people.

That is all.

Off paved roads with the Vespa

I expect some of you good folks have to ride on dirt/gravel roads to get around.
When I lived in Italia, many of the unpaved roads and paths were compact and
somewhat smooth surfaced from constant use. The Vespa was used on these
side ways.

I really don't see riding around off road on a Vespa. My scooter riding group, even
with larger wheels and engines, avoids gravel/dirt roads like the plague.

I love off road on a dirt bike/Scrambler. They are designed for this kind of riding.
All the Vespa gets is rock chips and dirty. Not for me.

Bob Copeland
Minnesota

I liked Bill's first comment (with a smile, of course); and by all means avoid, "Well, I wanted a Harley, but I couldn't afford those Village People outfits you guys wear."

Mr. F

Scooters on dirt
Until recently I lived a 1/3rd of a mile down a hardpacked dirt road, which would be in various states of disrepair depending on the season

I avoided the mud as cleaning underneath tupperware sucks

Limited suspension travel, limited ground clearance & automatic clutch rules out jumps taller than 2"-3"

The rear weight balance of scooter is offset by the less aggressive steering geometry
Scooters do nice controlled broadslides & snap back in predictable ways without significant headshake

Small, narrow, hard tires are not good for soft surfaces
Gravel, sand, mud require commitment, fast enough to keep the front from digging in
Bend at the hip keeping your weight more nearly centered over the bike as opposed to leading with your shoulder

On the street
The smaller skinny tires turn a smaller circle, the skinny forks only clamped at the bottom of the steering stem, the frame under floorboards, flex & twist, but never in a twitchy scary way
I feel like a Shriner on a mini bike, able to do intricate maneuvers at most speeds
The Liberty being fairly light. stopping distances are very small
I feel like it enhances my ability to avoid danger

The back end on scooters being wheel, motor & gearbox combined & short travel are noticeably less compliant only a small step above a hardtail
I had a 400 burgman with a link on the single shock which was slightly better
The worst was the 650 burg having the heaviest combo
The Liberty has a relatively light rear combo, I have the single shock set on 3, takes a big hit or G-out without complaint
On a scooter you don't get the same feedback from the back wheel through the footpegs as on a motorcycle
What you do get is the pulley's & crank acting like a gyro improving low speed manners

The power delivery on a scooter is effective without being excessive as motorcycle power delivery can be
You can pin the throttle without ill effect
Fuel injected scooters are very easy to hold speed on, the throttle by wire MP3 even better
Of course you can go too fast on a scooter, you have to mean it

Analog CVT's are cheap
I despise the care & feeding of chains, the grunge slowly covers everything on the back half of the bike requiring more than elbow grease to clean up
Most CVT systems only require occasional service, the mess is a bit of dry belt dust
The Liberty set-up is smooth
As the power goes up, dry clutches will chuff chuff a bit off the line
My 400 burg shook & shuddered, very similar to 500 MP3
650 burg with it's wet clutch & servo controlled pulley is smooth & powerful, but heavy, complicated & expensive, compare to motorcycle transmission repair, not for the faint of heart

Scooters have no added distraction of coordinating both hands and feet,
Having your left hand run the back brake is more sensitive, than your foot,
In a panic situation less likely to lock the back wheel

One of the things that drew me to scooters is step-through/over
As I got older it's getting harder to swing my leg over the seat of a motorcycle
The straight up and down riding position of a scooter is better for my old battered body, clip-ons or rear-sets are right out!
On the Liberty I have a sheepskin over a thin pad to flatten the seat some for more seating/foot choices
I miss being able to change bars, adjust switches & levers

A scooter is an ad-hoc roller coaster where you get to choose the track

I grew tired of explaining that I also have 4 BMW motorcycles.
Now I just say: "I pick up more ladies on the Vespa!"
They don't answer that one.

And if I can't afford the T Shirt I certainly can't afford the bike.

I liked the V-Rod and the Street models. Real twenty-first century engineering without the hype. When you build the same old thing decade after decade it becomes more about appearances than progress in design. My 1983 Kawasaki has dual overhead cams, shims under buckets, electronic ignition, air shocks and a redline of ten grand. Also nearly as much horsepower as Harleys twice the size and it handles better and has three disc brakes.

Maybe one day I'll succumb to DCT, but not this week.

I think that the Pan America and new Sportster both mark the start of bucking that trend.

If they sell. There have been many bikes here that sold well the first year when everyone who wanted one, bought one. After that they collected dust on the showroom floor. Yes, the Pan America sold well in 2021. Let's see what 2022 brings.

Harley created a culture that's biting them in the butt now.

I'm not convinced that a Motor Cycle Manufacturer can create a culture but there is a certain demographic that follows that brand around and it takes a lot for them to look outside of the brand when they are not dying off.

I'm pretty certain that those two bikes will initiate a slow and steady comeback for Harley Davidson which I'm sure we all want to see.

My question is, will died in the wool Harley owners buy a product that's aimed at younger riders ?

I'm not so convinced that Harley has its head on straight about younger riders. The Street models are a perfect example. They put a modern engine in a Sportster XCLR look-a-like and by heavens, just like the XLCR, it didn't sell. What if they put the engine in a bigger 1986 to 2014 Honda Rebel look-a-like cruiser? Even the V-Rod. One ugly Drag Bike that you either liked or hated. Why not a Wide Glide V-Rod? A Tour Glide V-Rod.

So now the new 1250 engine in an ADV bike or Cruiser with ugly pipes for over 12k? All their ads for that last 35 years have been pushing the F models and giving the impression that a Sportster is your Sister's bike.

And Indian sales continue to grow.

This is a function of your geography. Scooter guys here ALWAYS wave, ALWAYS wave back, doesn't matter if kymco, vespa, bmw. Harley guys never do. They don't even wave you by as you split lanes right past their wide buttocks.

You haven't being fair now...

Do you know how hard it is to remain attached to a monkey bar with just one hand!?!?