Different rollers in HPE?
steelbytes
Tue May 03, 2022 3:36 pm
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steelbytes
Molto Verboso
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Tue May 03, 2022 3:36 pm linkquote
Has anyone tried different rollers in an HPE?

@Motovista has asserted that lighter rollers have been 'proven' in an HPE yet I haven't seen a thread here about them?

Curious for example about the malossi 13g rollers (6613697.M0). what rpm do these give when *accelerating* at say 40-60kph? stock is around 6250 at that point. and what rpm at 100kph (speedo), stock is around 7250. taking off at the lights very quickly hits 6250 then has a slight dip to 5900 around 28kph and then rises to 7000 as it heads up to 100. and of course crusing rpm are lower than these numbers and would also be interesting

would love someone with a supertech (or 75th gts or gts with the pmp2 optional module) to use my app and capture some info ... I like hard data, not seat of the pants. (I currently have 17,500km of recorded data for looking at these numbers with stock)

ref: https://modernvespa.com/forum/post2542772#2542772
Motovista
Tue May 03, 2022 9:32 pm
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Motovista
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Tue May 03, 2022 9:32 pm linkquote
PM me your address and I'll send you a couple things to play with.
Positive
giallo
Wed May 04, 2022 4:44 am
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giallo
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Wed May 04, 2022 4:44 am linkquote
steelbytes wrote:
Has anyone tried different rollers in an HPE?

@Motovista has asserted that lighter rollers have been 'proven' in an HPE yet I haven't seen a thread here about them?

Curious for example about the malossi 13g rollers (6613697.M0). what rpm do these give when *accelerating* at say 40-60kph? stock is around 6250 at that point. and what rpm at 100kph (speedo), stock is around 7250. taking off at the lights very quickly hits 6250 then has a slight dip to 5900 around 28kph and then rises to 7000 as it heads up to 100. and of course crusing rpm are lower than these numbers and would also be interesting

would love someone with a supertech (or 75th gts or gts with the pmp2 optional module) to use my app and capture some info ... I like hard data, not seat of the pants. (I currently have 17,500km of recorded data for looking at these numbers with stock)

ref: https://modernvespa.com/forum/post2542772#2542772
When you get that data, I hope that you will share it with all of us.
steelbytes
Wed May 04, 2022 6:13 am
Molto Verboso
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steelbytes
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Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
Wed May 04, 2022 6:13 am linkquote
giallo wrote:
When you get that data, I hope that you will share it with all of us.
Of course.
waspmike
Wed May 04, 2022 11:47 pm
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waspmike
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Wed May 04, 2022 11:47 pm linkquote
steelbytes wrote:
and of course crusing rpm are lower than these numbers and would also be interesting
Do you have cruising rpms for different speeds? Using them and physics I could tell you what I think.

If you have a spare variator lying around you could measure the max radius of the grooves the weights travel in. That would improve accuracy but even so I have a good starting point.

Given we already have 6250/7000 for rpm during accel.

Last edited by waspmike on Thu May 05, 2022 5:13 pm; edited 1 time in total
sc00ter
Thu May 05, 2022 5:59 am
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sc00ter
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Thu May 05, 2022 5:59 am linkquote
I ordered the AF1 recommended Malossi lighter rollers for my Liberty. Really woke it up.
⬆️    About 1 month elapsed between posts    ⬇️
steelbytes
Fri Jun 10, 2022 2:55 pm
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steelbytes
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Fri Jun 10, 2022 2:55 pm linkquote
an update: thanks to @motovista I'll be testing the malossi 12g and 13g rollers soon in my supertech. just trying to make up mind about replacing the belt which is currently 8000km at the same time which would distract my testing as it would be stiffer when put in and need 'breaking in' ...
Motovista
Fri Jun 10, 2022 4:24 pm
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Motovista
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Fri Jun 10, 2022 4:24 pm linkquote
steelbytes wrote:
an update: thanks to @motovista I'll be testing the malossi 12g and 13g rollers soon in my supertech. just trying to make up mind about replacing the belt which is currently 8000km at the same time which would distract my testing as it would be stiffer when put in and need 'breaking in' ...
You're overthinking it. The new belt will be at factory specs. If your old belt has worn and is narrower than it should be, it will affect the performance of the scooter, but not to a degree you can probably notice.
Positive
greasy125
Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:01 am
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greasy125
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Sat Jun 11, 2022 1:01 am linkquote
per moto. the new belt won't be any variance.

knock those rollers in and report back.

I fully expect a detailed report!
Positive
steelbytes
Sat Jun 11, 2022 5:22 pm
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steelbytes
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Sat Jun 11, 2022 5:22 pm linkquote
Motovista wrote:
You're overthinking it. The new belt will be at factory specs. If your old belt has worn and is narrower than it should be, it will affect the performance of the scooter, but not to a degree you can probably notice.
greasy125 wrote:
per moto. the new belt won't be any variance.

knock those rollers in and report back.

I fully expect a detailed report!
I always overthink everything in life.

I was really just taking the opportunity to think as I wish to minimise variables when testing and also I had to break in a new set of tires (changed 1 week ago) and also wait for good weather to get a benchmark before and after

the reports will be detailed and have pretty graphs - ya might have realised by now that I like concrete numbers not somebody's feelings or half arsed measurements with a stopwatch which are all too often bollocks. so today i'm thinking about revisions to my graphing code (filters and smoothing etc) to allow clearer comparisons
steelbytes
Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:12 pm
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steelbytes
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Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:12 pm linkquote
12g malossi rollers installed. And also new oem belt (it was cracking and had done 8400km) and the sliders cause they had done 31,000km.

dont ask for thoughts yet as I've only done 20km of errands so far. of course I'll report back when I have solid numbers and thoughts.
Touring300
Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:06 pm
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Touring300
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Tue Jun 21, 2022 11:06 pm linkquote
8400 klm for a belt doesn't sound a lot. I thought you were meant to get at least 10000 klm before they needed changing?
steelbytes
Wed Jun 22, 2022 12:18 am
Molto Verboso
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steelbytes
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Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
Wed Jun 22, 2022 12:18 am linkquote
Touring300 wrote:
8400 klm for a belt doesn't sound a lot. I thought you were meant to get at least 10000 klm before they needed changing?
Would it have survived to 10,000? Sure. But since it definitely wasn't fresh looking and i had a new one handy, thought i might as well
steelbytes
Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:54 pm
Molto Verboso
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steelbytes
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Wed Jun 22, 2022 9:54 pm linkquote
early observations with 12g:
(not going to give ya graphs or numbers yet as I want to do at least one day trip in the country first).

stable speed: not noticing a difference, but haven't really studied this yet. have been paying more attention to rpm during acceleration

low-mid acceleration: not radically different (seems to be a small increase in rpm)

mid-high speed acceleration: it revs plenty higher. eg when cruising a bit below the speed limit on the freeway and then give it a kick like when changing lanes. have yet to start crunching these numbers further

point at which the vario maxs out and the speed v rpm increase linearly together: this is at a distinctly higher speed and rpm.

near speed/rpm limits: no idea yet.


that change to revs during acceleration at mid-high speed is *very* evident on my graphs. stay tuned (pun intended )
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