@safis avatar
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1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
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@safis avatar
1979 P150X, 1983 P200E, 1987 PK125XL Elestart, 1988 T5, 1995 PX200E, 2011 Yamaha Fazer 600 S2
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UTC quote
Have you bled the pump?? If air is present in the main line it won't prime itself…

As for the choke brackets. I always used the 90 degree one, along with the clamp, to mount the choke on one of the CVT's cover bolts so it's easily reachable…
Bleed screw…
Bleed screw…
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@mjrally avatar
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Safis-

Aha! Totally forgot about that. I'll bleed and report back.

I thought about putting the choke on the belt cover but there was no weatherproofing/ rubber to protect it. I figured it would get dirty and cause problems so I went with it inside. So far it's been a one push start with immediate idle. I doubt I'll even have to use it as I'm in such a warm climate area.
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@mjrally avatar
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Ok bleed screw did the trick. Much better now. Took her for a one block run. 84 main jet too big. Will drop to an 80.
@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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UTC quote
MJRally wrote:
Morning restart. Is better, but still introducing air. Definitely leaning towards an oil pump failure causing the original problem. New oil pump is $30.

Compared the clutch engagement to my wife's Buddy and I'm gonna swap to the white springs. This thing needs to be revved up way too high before the wheel turns. Gonna be annoying as a beach scoot if the rear wheel doesn't turn when I twist the throttle.
I was wondering about with a 5k RPM clutch engagement.
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@mjrally avatar
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
We'll the plot thickens. Riding it around I have to baby the throttle to get it to rev out. Doesn't matter which jet. 70, 80, 84, 90. Big wide open shot will kill the motor. If I flip the choke on (or what I think is on) the motor revs out cleanly and I can get wide open.

So, is it a jetting problem, or do you think I've been riding with the choke off (But really on).
@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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UTC quote
MJRally wrote:
We'll the plot thickens. Riding it around I have to baby the throttle to get it to rev out. Doesn't matter which jet. 70, 80, 84, 90. Big wide open shot will kill the motor. If I flip the choke on (or what I think is on) the motor revs out cleanly and I can get wide open.

So, is it a jetting problem, or do you think I've been riding with the choke off (But really on).
On mine, when lever is at a 90° angle it's not on or adding extra fuel for enrichment. When you pull it straight out, in line with cable it pulls cable up a little and opens extra jet for enrichment. If it's like mine disconnect cable, spring above plunger on carburetor will hold plunger that caps off jet in place and see what you get. That should be enrichment circuit off with cable disconnected from lever.
⚠️ Last edited by Christopher_55934 on UTC; edited 1 time
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@mjrally avatar
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Ok so disconnected choke, 90 MJ, stock needle W16 at highest clip setting. Still have to baby to get it to rev to 70% ish, won't go past it.

Lowered the clip to the lowest spot. Still same.

Put the choke back on and I can rev out cleanly to 90% and then it's bogging. Ease off the throttle and it'll keep revving clean.

Everything I've researched and seen online has folks with expansion chambers with 19 mil carbs jetting in the high 80s. Weird I'd need something higher than a tuned scoot.

One idea I'm thinking of involves the air filter. I haven't had good luck jetting PHBH or PHBLs with the air filters installed. Since this is the younger brother to those, could there be some correlation? I've got the stock airbox with the 3 holes per the carb instructions with the red mesh Malossi filter element (oiled).

Worth a try unless anyone has ideas?

Ok scratch that. Definitely needs the air filter to run right. Couldn't get 10 feet either way
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@mjrally avatar
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Google search says to swap to a W7 or W9 needle from the get go. Figure I'll buy that and a 95& 100 main jet tomorrow unless anyone else has ideas?
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@mjrally avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Got the 90 MJ and swapped to a W9 needle, second clip from the top. Too fat right now and lost some top end. Going back down to an 85 MJ.

Getting max revs but still can't break the 40 mph barrier. Any variator tuning ideas?
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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@xantufrog avatar
UTC

Moderibbit
1980 P200E - "Old Rusty", 1976 ET3 Primavera
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@xantufrog avatar
1980 P200E - "Old Rusty", 1976 ET3 Primavera
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UTC quote
I'm having flashbacks :-p

I would try lightening the variator weights because the stock ones might be "shifting up" too early essentially for the powerband of your setup. I used Dr Pulley sliders and liked them a lot because they had a smooth feel.

That being said, i feel like something else is going on. I think you'd brute force past a low shifting vario tune and still eventually break at least 45

Something seems fishy with the carb/mix stuff you were describing above
@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
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UTC quote
Your not asking about getting there quickly or staying on pipe. Are reaching your max RPM trying to get to max speed? To go faster without changing pulleys only options are to move further out on front pulley and further in on rear. Basically change gear ratio.

Start with a marker and color in lines on all pulley halves, run it to WOT, max speed for a few miles. Post pictures of what you have for marks after that. If it is capable of faster with what you have you're not out to edge on one of them. Last variator I tuned, challenge was getting belt to outer edge of front pulley.

Make sure front pulley halves can touch in center under normal operating conditions. Just because you took out speed restricting spacer doesn't mean they can touch. I had to spend time understanding how my particular variator worked to get to edges.

Repeat for rear., except you need to get all the way in.

After that your getting into finding an exact length belt to get to edges if your not there.

Overdrive pulley setup is easiest but can be expensive unless someone knows of factory pulleys you can bolt on from a bigger bike.

I was just screwing around to see what I could get, in the end an overdrive pulley kit set got me to 53 or 54 mph with a 70cc kit. She was WOT at max RPM.

Example

Vespa ET2 Polini Hi Speed Control Variator Review
⚠️ Last edited by Christopher_55934 on UTC; edited 2 times
@xantufrog avatar
UTC

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1980 P200E - "Old Rusty", 1976 ET3 Primavera
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@xantufrog avatar
1980 P200E - "Old Rusty", 1976 ET3 Primavera
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UTC quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Start with a marker and color in lines on all pulley halves, run it to WOT, max speed for a few miles. Post pictures of what you have for marks after that. If it is capable of faster with what you have you're not out to edge on one of them
That's a great idea.
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@mjrally avatar
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UTC quote
Thanks for the replies fellas. I'll get a marker out and see where the belt is rubbing to.

On the lines of gears, the only thing that wasn't in the multivar kit that I installed was a torsion controller. I'm wondering if it's not allowing the clutch pulleys to come together as much as they need to?

Engine rpm wise, it revs up pretty linearly. Clutch engages around 3-4K mark and you feel the back tire go. Then nice wind up. Pretty standard CVT feel/sound.

Definitely not screaming engine revs and then back tire catches up. No bogging.
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UTC quote
My 50cc Challenge - ET2

Good read here, should help.
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@mjrally avatar
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UTC quote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
My 50cc Challenge - ET2

Good read here, should help.
It's a good one. Read that when I first started this project. Sadly doesn't have specifics ie the red clutch springs. Ok, who made those red clutch springs??? You can bet that when this is done, I'll post a detailed list of everything on it.

Today I have other plans but tomorrow is to rebuild the clutch and try out my torsion controller theory
@motovista avatar
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GT 200
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GT 200
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UTC quote
I would try dropping to about 5.5 grams on the rollers and an 80-82 main jet. The rollers are not allowing the bike to spin up properly, and it sounds like it's running really rich.
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@mjrally avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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UTC quote
Just disassembling for the rebuild tomorrow. Pics of the belt wear on the brand new pulley.
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@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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Location: Rochester, Minnesota
UTC quote
MJRally wrote:
Just disassembling for the rebuild tomorrow. Pics of the belt wear on the brand new pulley.
Looks like belt isn't making it to outer edge, that's one thing to figure out.
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@mjrally avatar
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Veni, Vidi, Posti
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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Location: Oceanside, CA
UTC quote
So spent the last few days messing with things. First issue was the torsion controller. Guys at Scooterwest eyeballed it's and said it wasn't letting the clutch open up all the way. I guess it's meant for other springs? Maybe stock? Wasn't part of the multivar kit so don't install it!

Changed the small clurch springs from Malossi yellow to the Malossi white ones. It's a little jerky but much easier to use for everyday riding. I checked the black ones and managed to lose one Facepalm emoticon 80 MJ installed and babying the throttle got me to 46 mph. Had a bogging issue mid throttle.

I was having problems getting to WOT and was thinking my main jet was too large. Goose it at any speed and it would bog. I just had an epiphany and thought about the special washer that goes under the main jet. I think I read that's for diffusing bubbles? I was running out of things to try and did a 180* with it. That cured my throttle issues and acceleration/WOT is instantly smoother.

Top speed with the 90 MJ is 42mph now. I can hold it wide open and it doesn't bog but sounds better if you let off the throttle some. Gonna buy an 88 MJ and see if that helps increase top speed without sacrificing cooling.

If I'm happy with that, I'll swap to 5.5g weights and update.
Washer/ weird thing under the main jet in the CORRECT orientation.
Washer/ weird thing under the main jet in the CORRECT orientation.
⬆️    About 1 year elapsed    ⬇️
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@mjrally avatar
UTC

Veni, Vidi, Posti
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
Joined: UTC
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Location: Oceanside, CA
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
@mjrally avatar
73 & 74 Rally, 76 ET3, 80 P200, 61 Ser 2, 65 Silver Special,, 2015 HD Road Glide Special
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Location: Oceanside, CA
UTC quote
Had a little too much fun last winter and wrecked the front end. Thanks to Greasy I'm back on the road! Wrapping this one up but wanted to list the final settings in case anyone else wants to go down this path.

Malossi 70cc top end
Malossi Wild Lion exhaust
Malossi Multivar Variator kit - no washer
Malossi black clutch springs
PHBG 19mm carb and manifold
86 main jet, W9 needle 2nd clip from the top
Malossi 5.5g rollers (19x15.5)


Runs 45 mph sitting upright all day long. Probably a little more tucked in.
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