Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:42 am

Hooked
2020 GTS300 HPE "Whiskers"
Joined: 10 Nov 2020
Posts: 237
Location: Bama
 
Hooked
2020 GTS300 HPE "Whiskers"
Joined: 10 Nov 2020
Posts: 237
Location: Bama
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:42 am linkquote
Just under 2000 miles on the clock and I’ve been checking my oil every 400 miles utilizing Trip Odometer B to keep track of those intervals.

The motor runs just great. Verrry smooth and strong. And I like to ride it “quick” - though most of my actual cruising takes place between 45 and 60mph. Occasionally I’ll have to hit the interstate where running it up to 75-ish becomes necessary. I’ve managed to hit the limiter a few times.

My oil consumption is pretty consistent so far: at the 400 mile mark, the oil level is right at the minimum mark on the dipstick. The very lowest point on the “hashmarked” section.

I find that topping it up to “full” is requiring 180ml. Just putting that out for inquiring minds to encourage HPE owners to check their oil levels regularly in some fashion. Don’t take my numbers and methodology for granted - no doubt everyone rides differently and no two motors will act exactly the same.

Hope this is helpful. Don’t neglect it! They do get thirsty…
Mon Jul 05, 2021 6:01 pm

Member
2020 GTS 300 Super Tech
Joined: 26 Apr 2021
Posts: 23
Location: NY
 
Member
2020 GTS 300 Super Tech
Joined: 26 Apr 2021
Posts: 23
Location: NY
Mon Jul 05, 2021 6:01 pm linkquote
Interesting I'm going to make sure I start checking. I drive it quick also
Mon Jul 05, 2021 6:07 pm

Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
 
Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
Mon Jul 05, 2021 6:07 pm linkquote
sounds 'bout right.

I find I top up somewhere between 600-1000 km. ish. Haven't kept very close eye on the actual distance. Also have the feeling that it's not as often as before now that I'm at 15,000 km ...

I definitely check every 300-500 km
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:37 pm

Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
 
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
Mon Jul 05, 2021 11:37 pm linkquote
Typically, until the motor is fully bedded in (about 4000-6000 miles) the motor will use more oil, and especially during the initial running in process. But the HPE is destined to be the "oil user" of the GTS range so checking it often is the key. Personally, I'd not let it go anywhere near the lower line on the dipstick for several reasons. But won't go into that here.

The other thing that will help reduce oil consumption is sticking to good established running in principles (in accordance with the owners manual) and not following the "ride it like you stole it" advice. That removes too much metal from the cylinder and actually in contradiction to what folks think, doesn't allow the rings and bore to fully match each other and properly harden. In other words, you wear out your motor more quickly and use more oil in the process.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:04 am

Enthusiast
GTS300 supertech
Joined: 04 Aug 2020
Posts: 80
Location: York, Pa
 
Enthusiast
GTS300 supertech
Joined: 04 Aug 2020
Posts: 80
Location: York, Pa
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:04 am linkquote
In general, how does this compare to a non HPE GTS300? I bought a 2018 last year with 700 miles on it, so I don't know how it was initially broke in. The first thing I did was change the oil. 2000 miles later and it hasn't used a drop. Did I just get lucky or is there that big of a difference in oil consumption with the HPE?
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:30 am

Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
 
Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:30 am linkquote
The HPE is a different animal. High Performance Engine and thus uses more oil.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:31 am

Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
 
Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
Tue Jul 06, 2021 4:31 am linkquote
2wheelsDan wrote:
In general, how does this compare to a non HPE GTS300?
Old GTS didn't consume lots of oil.

I had a 2009 gts300 and it never needed topping up between services in the 8 years and 20,000km that i had it.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:04 am

Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
 
Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
Tue Jul 06, 2021 5:04 am linkquote
This is a newbie question. Will the HPE engine get dirtier faster because of all this burnt oil or does it all just go out the tailpipe?
Tue Jul 06, 2021 6:57 am

Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
 
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
Tue Jul 06, 2021 6:57 am linkquote
Evidence from oil companies, the motor and bike trade suggests it won't cause any problems, head and valves will stay clean. This is in part due to modern oils that burn more cleanly without leaving muck everywhere, and the better petrol we all use. Using E10 also helps keep engines much cleaner.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 7:22 am

Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
 
Ossessionato
2016 Vespa GTS300ie abs/asr/ess Settantesimo '70'
Joined: 11 Jun 2011
Posts: 3766
Location: East Anglia, UK
Tue Jul 06, 2021 7:22 am linkquote
2wheelsDan wrote:
In general, how does this compare to a non HPE GTS300? I bought a 2018 last year with 700 miles on it, so I don't know how it was initially broke in. The first thing I did was change the oil. 2000 miles later and it hasn't used a drop. Did I just get lucky or is there that big of a difference in oil consumption with the HPE?
It's normal to have to top off the oil on all the GTS bikes and the euro 3/4 bikes are just the same in that respect. But they don't use as much oil as the HPE. You'll notice with euro3/4 bikes that after a service with new motor cycle oil and filter the bike doesn't actually use any real amount of oil until you get past 2500* miles or so (unless you ride it hard all the time). And as the miles pass the bike will use more and more of it. That's completely normal because the oil additives start to break down thinning the oil a little. This breaking down is not a problem though and it doesn't actually affect the oil film strength in any meaningful way as some folks think. However, if you have been daft enough to use a car oil or diesel engine oil this breaking down of the oil process starts even earlier and she'll use greater amounts of oil than she would if a proper mc oil was used. And of course, the oil film strength of car oil or diesel engine oil, even when it's brand new oil is nowhere as good as mc oil and disproportionately deteriorates compared to mc oil increasing engine wear. Mostly this is because car and diesel engine oil is not designed to operate at the higher revs our bikes work at and as such doesn't contain the correct additives for our bikes to make it both clings to internal engine components at high revs, or maintain it's viscosity and additive durability.

My own GTS needs two or three top ups during the 6250 miles in-between annual changes to hold the level at the 'full' mark. Currently now doing 7000 miles a year. In reality, this topping up for me isn't very much oil and probably amounts to around 110ml in 6250 miles of mixed but largely normal riding (which includes long periods at 65mph sometimes with a passenger). The majority of that oil is used from 3000 miles onwards as the oil starts to thin a little. I always change my oil on time but this is rarely before the 6250 mile mark. If you are only doing very low miles of 2-3k per year then you are unlikely to have to top up much at all. How much oil a bike uses is very much up to the owner and is almost completely dependant on how the bike was run in and on how it's ridden and serviced.

* after the bike is fully run in and comformed.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 7:54 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
Tue Jul 06, 2021 7:54 am linkquote
On my little 155 (oil capacity 900 grams) the oil must be changed every 4000 km so don't complain but just check the level ... After all, what does it cost you?
Tue Jul 06, 2021 8:05 am

Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
 
Hooked
2020 GTS 300 hpe Touring
Joined: 31 May 2021
Posts: 378
Location: Upstate SC
Tue Jul 06, 2021 8:05 am linkquote
Attila wrote:
On my little 155 (oil capacity 900 grams) the oil must be changed every 4000 km so don't complain but just check the level ... After all, what does it cost you?
Not much... just a little aggravation because of where they put the dipstick.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 9:09 am

Hooked
Gts 300 notte
Joined: 27 May 2020
Posts: 197
Location: Toronto
 
Hooked
Gts 300 notte
Joined: 27 May 2020
Posts: 197
Location: Toronto
Tue Jul 06, 2021 9:09 am linkquote
Had to carry spare oil in my backpack for a long ride recently. The bag wasn’t exactly the best 🙄 just wondering if something like a sealable water bottle is ok to keep oil in for a trip? So it doesn’t leak…..or do these oil bottles need to vent?



Tue Jul 06, 2021 9:36 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Buddy Kick 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 12674
Location: Oregon City, OR
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
GTS 300ABS, Buddy 125, Buddy Kick 125
Joined: 29 Dec 2007
Posts: 12674
Location: Oregon City, OR
Tue Jul 06, 2021 9:36 am linkquote
Hummus2 wrote:
just wondering if something like a sealable water bottle is ok to keep oil in for a trip? So it doesn’t leak…..or do these oil bottles need to vent?
Oil is shipped and sold in containers which are not vented so I think the answer must be no. Small fuel containers for taking fuel backpacking should be good containers for bringing along small amounts of oil without worrying about leakage. I believe Primus makes several sizes including .35 L.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:15 am

Hooked
Gts 300 notte
Joined: 27 May 2020
Posts: 197
Location: Toronto
 
Hooked
Gts 300 notte
Joined: 27 May 2020
Posts: 197
Location: Toronto
Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:15 am linkquote
Dooglas wrote:
Oil is shipped and sold in containers which are not vented so I think the answer must be no. Small fuel containers for taking fuel backpacking should be good containers for bringing along small amounts of oil without worrying about leakage. I believe Primus makes several sizes including .35 L.
i figured, haha thanks man! are those kinds of bottles metal inside? the metal wouldnt affect the oil or the engine or anything would it? thanks again!
Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:34 am

Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(35,000)Red Devil SH150i (2000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2944
Location: Orange Park Florida
 
Ossessionato
Black Beater SH150i(35,000)Red Devil SH150i (2000)
Joined: 27 Dec 2013
Posts: 2944
Location: Orange Park Florida
Tue Jul 06, 2021 11:34 am linkquote
I use an empty weed eater sized bottle. They hold about 3.5 oz. When my Honda oil reaches about 1/4 full, it takes half the bottle. I use my trip meter. At 200 miles i check the oil and reset the trip meter.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:28 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
Tue Jul 06, 2021 12:28 pm linkquote
If Piaggio had used a liner with Diasyl coating instead of a cast iron liner for the engine cylinder, this problem would not have existed.
Perhaps Malossi will provide.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:53 pm

Molto Verboso
Xevo 250 ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 1555
Location: Sunshine Coast, Australia
 
Molto Verboso
Xevo 250 ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 1555
Location: Sunshine Coast, Australia
Tue Jul 06, 2021 1:53 pm linkquote
Maybe Piaggio will discontinue the HPE engine after a year or two?

Like they did with the fly by wire throttle, and the electric driven water pump and the front shock redesign.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:00 pm

Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
In garage: Yamaha Tricity 155 Urban 2019 - MV Agusta 125 RS 1956
Joined: 21 Jul 2007
Posts: 8291
Location: Latina (Italy)
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:00 pm linkquote
GTdespatchcourier wrote:
Maybe Piaggio will discontinue the HPE engine after a year or two?

Like they did with the fly by wire throttle, and the electric driven water pump and the front shock redesign.
With the BV 400 they did the same thing but there is still no news on reliability after a medium distance (above 15,000 km). Too new ...
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:11 pm

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:11 pm linkquote
GTdespatchcourier wrote:
Maybe Piaggio will discontinue the HPE engine after a year or two?

Like they did with the fly by wire throttle, and the electric driven water pump and the front shock redesign.
Surely all the Piaggio fuel-injected engines are fly by wire, as the throttle cables merely turn a potentiometer (variable resistor) in the throttle body, not the throttle butterfly itself which is moved by a stepping motor.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:15 pm

Molto Verboso
Xevo 250 ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 1555
Location: Sunshine Coast, Australia
 
Molto Verboso
Xevo 250 ie
Joined: 12 Jun 2008
Posts: 1555
Location: Sunshine Coast, Australia
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:15 pm linkquote
I thought they did one with no throttle cables, ie full fly by wire.
It was about the time they did the electric water pump.
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:17 pm

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Tue Jul 06, 2021 2:17 pm linkquote
You could well be right - but that couldn't possibly have been as robust as having it all contained in the throttle body. So I'm not surprised that if they did try that, that they soon decided it was a poor and expensive idea.
⬆️    About 1 year elapsed between posts    ⬇️
Sat May 14, 2022 1:37 am

Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
 
Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
Sat May 14, 2022 1:37 am linkquote
Morning all - can I just check what the correct oil is for a 300 HPE, my oil light just flickered on and off so I think I need to go and get some.
Sat May 14, 2022 2:28 am

Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
 
Molto Verboso
2019 Supertech (EURO3/APAC)
Joined: 17 Nov 2020
Posts: 1622
Location: Batmania aka Melbourne, Australia
Sat May 14, 2022 2:28 am linkquote
fusionsplice wrote:
Morning all - can I just check what the correct oil is for a 300 HPE, my oil light just flickered on and off so I think I need to go and get some.
And the manual says



Sat May 14, 2022 3:35 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6967
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6967
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Sat May 14, 2022 3:35 am linkquote
fusionsplice wrote:
Morning all - can I just check what the correct oil is for a 300 HPE, my oil light just flickered on and off so I think I need to go and get some.
It's not an oil "level" light, it's an oil "pressure" light.
Which may have been caused by low oil level but low pressure can be caused by other things too.
Sat May 14, 2022 3:44 am

Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
 
Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
Sat May 14, 2022 3:44 am linkquote
It flickered on once after breaking from about 75mph.

This is my 5th 300, but first HPE and I've never had to look at oil before, although my daily commute is a lot faster now and they probably all got stolen before they needed it!

I will check the levels though as not looked at it since first service and now about 6800kms.

So 5w40 is the one...thanks for the advice.
Sat May 14, 2022 4:03 am

Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
 
Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
Sat May 14, 2022 4:03 am linkquote
Glad I checked...dipstick isn't exactly wet...which makes me a bit of a dipstick really!

So off to get some 5w40 synthetic oil and some sort of flexi-hose.

Thanks for the help this morning.
Sat May 14, 2022 4:53 am

Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
 
Member
Vespa GTS 300 Super HPE
Joined: 14 May 2022
Posts: 10
Location: London
Sat May 14, 2022 4:53 am linkquote
Is any 5w40 oil suitable or does it have to be motorbike specific?
Sat May 14, 2022 6:11 am

Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
 
Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Sat May 14, 2022 6:11 am linkquote
During warmer months could you use a 20w-50w synthetic to reduce oil consumption?
Sat May 14, 2022 7:29 am

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Sat May 14, 2022 7:29 am linkquote
fusionsplice wrote:
Is any 5w40 oil suitable or does it have to be motorbike specific?
The 'experts' say it must be motorcycle specific. I just used the cheapest synthetic 5W-40 that Halfords had.
Sat May 14, 2022 9:14 am

Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
 
Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Sat May 14, 2022 9:14 am linkquote
jimc wrote:
The 'experts' say it must be motorcycle specific. I just used the cheapest synthetic 5W-40 that Halfords had.
Do these have a wet clutch? My full size bike has a wet clutch soaked in engine oil and you need to be careful as you can ruin plates with a friction modifier.
Sat May 14, 2022 9:15 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6967
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
MP3 500, GTS 250 (both 2008 MY), 2013 Piaggio BV 350, 2014 Can Am Spyder RT
Joined: 02 Mar 2013
Posts: 6967
Location: Madison, Wisconsin
Sat May 14, 2022 9:15 am linkquote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Do these have a wet clutch? My full size bike has a wet clutch soaked in engine oil and you need to be careful as you can ruin plates with a friction modifier.
No wet clutch.
Sat May 14, 2022 9:17 am

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Sat May 14, 2022 9:17 am linkquote
Christopher_55934 wrote:
Do these have a wet clutch?
No.
Quote:
My full size bike has a wet clutch soaked in engine oil and you need to be careful as you can ruin plates with a friction modifier.
Even the BV350 (with wet clutch) doesn't share the engine oil with the clutch.
Sat May 14, 2022 9:24 am

Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
 
Ossessionato
2007 Stella 225
Joined: 02 Nov 2019
Posts: 2682
Location: Rochester, Minnesota
Sat May 14, 2022 9:24 am linkquote
jimc wrote:
No.
Even the BV350 (with wet clutch) doesn't share the engine oil with the clutch.
Interesting
Sat May 14, 2022 10:33 am

Veni, Vidi, Posti
LX190 Friday afternoon special, Primavera, some pushbikes
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 8109
Location: Hermit Kingdom
 
Veni, Vidi, Posti
LX190 Friday afternoon special, Primavera, some pushbikes
Joined: 12 Oct 2007
Posts: 8109
Location: Hermit Kingdom
Sat May 14, 2022 10:33 am linkquote
fusionsplice wrote:
Is any 5w40 oil suitable or does it have to be motorbike specific?
Since you're just topping up don't stress about it.
Sat May 14, 2022 11:23 am

Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
 
Moderaptor
The Hornet (GT200, aka Love Bug) and 'Dimples' - a GTS 300
Joined: 26 Aug 2007
Posts: 41072
Location: Pleasant Hill, CA
Sat May 14, 2022 11:23 am linkquote
And on 'topping up' - my personal advice is to fill no further than half-way between the max and min marks. The engine is happy, and there's no chance of over-filling, which is a particular problem with some 500cc models.
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