Modern Vespa

New £20,000 Ex Demo £13.450.

Bill has made some R18 offer to entice the mechanic to do the work?

I did think about taking the offer on the R18 on the condition they sorted out the RT and I use it as a 2nd or 3rd bike.

Once again, I shouldn't listen to the voices.

Without knowing anything about the prices in the UK, sounds like a nice price tag for a fresh ex demo.

Ours ain't no country for cruisers, R18 is likely to remain a rare niche bike over here. BMWs we have plenty and those tend to keep their value well.

I just saw a rare ad, a 2021 R18 from the first owner, who has not even done the break-in mileages yet. The price tag - just some fine dust blown away from the blood freezing original.

The ad said, that R18 has a 5 year factory guarantee...did not say what this covers.

Madness this might well be, but YOLO, and all that.

I know that feeling all too well.... I need to keep telling myself all 3 of my bikes serve a different purpose so it makes perfect sense! Money is so overrated :-\ . My last impulse is probably going to push me a year out from "real" retirement. Sadly with work this is about the extent of my adventures on the new GSA

Good luck Bill!

The R18 would probably be amazing to own but I fear that it's an overpriced one trick pony.

The Moto Guzzi does everything the R18 could do but without the rareity or the cost.

A GS would be a far better idea but I wouldn't use it to it's full capability so it would be wasted on me.

I think for as soon as the last independent tech gets in touch ( 5 days waiting for a reply now ) the RT will go there to be fixed.

To trade it against something else in a showroom for £1500 would devalue all the new Parts and Labour spent on it

Guzzi vs. R18 - I'll admit thinking the same.

For a GS - around here many don't see it so much as an ADV bike, more like a budget version of an RT. Not quite as comfy as the RT, nor quite as good to ride as the R, but still very comfy with some weather protection.

I was just reminded about this when I parked my T120 Bonnie at a cafe yesterday. A brand new 1250 parked next to me. Standing side by side, the GS had a tad lower seat height than mine (obviously with a lowering kit). The owner had opted street tyres vs. all-terrain tyres. It did look a bit funny with the fog lights, wardrope boxes etc. adv decorations, but seemed to carry two persons nicely and the fairings were massive - compared to my naked Bonnie, at least.

I had the chance to buy a customer's R18 for the price a BMW dealership was offering him on a trade in and passed on it, in part because it was the 'Pure' trim, and in part because I just didn't see the value for my dollar being there. Bought another customer's F700GS with 2,400 km the next week instead.

Before COVID I had a couple techs working for me, and truthfully, we had more opportunity for jobs than we had time to work on the bikes. Anything that was a pain in the butt, we just referred people to other shops.

I wonder if part of what you're going through is because the good, experienced techs, are so in demand, that they can pick and choose what jobs they take and still be fully booked up for weeks.

Example: Right now in Toronto the nearest Ducati dealer is scheduling appointments just over a month away, and one of the indie shops sent out a message to customers that he is not even booking any new service appointments for 3 weeks until he gets through a backlog.

What's the situation like where you're at?

That's an excellent question. The closest Motoraad dealer's lead time is the 3rd weekend in July which is better than nothing I guess.

Maybe I'm being a little naive but even if you didn't really want to work on the bike wouldn't you suck it up and be grateful for the business rather than flatly refuse to work on it ?

After all how many of us are working jobs that we don't particularly enjoy ?

I guess that the privilege of owning your own business, being able to pick and choose the work that makes you money but doesn't present a challenge.

Asked. and answered

The first few years I literally took no vacation time... I'm presently on an open ended vacation and not worried about scheduling anyone for whenever I feel like coming back because I know the minute I turn the light to "on", they will come.

I think a lot of the shops in the biz are in the same mindset... Which in the short term sucks for the customers unfortunately... but the complacency will make fertile ground for hungry new up and comers... Now we just need to keep encouraging people to consider getting into the trades to fill that void.

Yes and with any luck they will be willing to be less choosy and show a little more willing to work on customers bikes.

I don't have an issue with having to wait a few weeks but I do have an issue with businesses actually declining work because it could be a little difficult.

You're a Tech, it's what you do for a living. You can do it, you just don't want to do it.

That is part of the problem I imagine. Kids are not getting on to the trades like they used to. If I had a kid I'd tell them the best thing they could would become a master carpenter, plumber or electrician etc. Very good money to be made there but tech jobs are eating up a lot of talent that otherwise might have chosen a trade. My wife is a CPA and she says the same thing about trying to find good accountants now. A lot of there talent that may have gone in to accounting now work in IT. Good motorbike mechanics I'm sure are a very rare breed especially in temperate regions that do not have a year round riding season.

you're only a customer when they decide they want to work on your bike

whilst demand outstrips supply, individuals and companies can 'chose' who they want to deal with

I haven't had anyone turn down working on my Vespas, but the chap I take my Peugeot to always moans about it

Yes, but he's getting paid.

Paid to do a job that he can do.

Yes, that's pretty much the way it feels right now.

I see 3 ways out of this.

1 Wait for the last independent workshop to email me back and go from there. No email go to 2.

2 Take it to the only Motoraad dealer who actually wants to work on it. Failing that, go to 3.

3 Buy the R18, trade the RT and be done with it.

I am a 6th generation Plasterer. As of October 2022, I have been in the trade for 48 years. I have three daughters and one son. I have never encouraged any of them to follow in my footsteps. Reason? The demand for tradesmen (and women) is there, but the pay is not. I made more money in 1991 than today. I am in a small shop, just six of us and we have 42 weeks of work ahead of us, not counting one job that will take about 5 months to complete. But you can't get any more for these jobs than you could three or four years ago.

Aren't they beautiful?

Anyone with a trades business will tell you the same thing. Young kids don't want to work. They want to get rich off of bitcoin, a stock market they know nothing about and gambling websites.

Booked the RT in on the 1st of August at a Motoraad dealer.

Sat on an R18 and the front wheel was in another Postcode.

Noticibly heavier than the RT. Probably too heavy.

I really like the look of the R18 but its just not as functional as other bikes for me so never even sat on one.

Personally, I think the K16 is probably a better bike than the R18 for most people. I know Harbinger loves his. Yes it is heavier than an RT but once underway, it's evidently quite balanced and nimble.

"Front wheel being in a different post code": People have said that about some of the the K1600 models too.

Go sit on a new R1250RT and GS while you are at the dealership as well. They are both about the same cost when they are similarly equipped. People think the GS is less expensive because but it doesn't come with all the add-ons the RT includes as standard (side cases, top case, motorized windscreen, ....)
Miguel

I sat on a GS 1250 at a used dealership a couple of months back and it felt really intimidating.

Way too big for me so it would be hard to justify and pointless to own. Scrub that.

Not only was it the size of the R18 that put me off but the amount of effort it took to actually pick it up off it's maintstand really surprised me.

This is before they fit it with fairings and touring gear. Scrub that also.

A K1600 is a possibility but early ones are better because as a couple of years back BMW pegged the performance back to reduce emissions, but once again I fear it's too big.

Possible scrub.

Oh and I'm still waiting for the 3rd independant to get back to me.

"Bill Dog"]
I sat on a GS 1250 at a used dealership a couple of months back and it felt really intimidating.

Way too big for me so it would be hard to justify and pointless to own. Scrub that.

Not only was it the size of the R18 that put me off but the amount of effort it took to actually pick it up off it's maintstand really surprised me.

This is before they fit it with fairings and touring gear. Scrub that also.

A K1600 is a possibility but early ones are better because as a couple of years back BMW pegged the performance back to reduce emissions, but once again I fear it's too big.

Possible scrub.

Oh and I'm still waiting for the 3rd independant to get back to me.
[/quote]

This thread came to my mind when I went to a British bike meet this weekend. It's mostly about true Brits, from 50's etc, but the folks are liberal in a sense that they'll welcome us Taiwanese twins too.

2 things:

the ergonomics of the old bikes are amazing. As is the center of weight. In this area the bike industry has been fixing something that was not broken.

Second, seing those, mayby 200-300 bikes, many of them 50-70 years old, coming from all over Finland, it is sad that your relatively new RT seems to be in the 'too old, too complicated to fix, not interesting'- category.


Ignore the beauty on the right and the chopper on the left, the older Norton is a good example how easy the formula for good ergonomics should be

I felt the same but once you get over the size of the tank and height it's handles incredibly. I can't entirely flat foot with my 32" inseam but it's close and I'm good with one foot down. As someone who owned a K series the GS Adventure is actually lighter and noticeably. Not that it's light by any means. I can fortunately duck walk the bike fine so backing in to spots is OK. Also picked up a lowering kit that drops the front of the saddle 10mm which may not sound like much but it helps and cost about $10 online.

Now the getting off the side stand... I've had to practice that and it took a bit of getting used to. One - look where you park - I backup with the stand down and watch the ground below for a good sticking point. Also had to get comfortable with bum hanging off the saddle, foot down and push up. For mounting I stand on the peg and swing over quickly. Looks better than struggling and catching the panniers.

What.I hate is my concern about dropping the damn thing. Not worried about me it's that the damn thing is so expensive. But it's built to handle it and picked up some cheap drop bar bumpers. Honestly I was shocked the K's did not come witch any drop protection from BMW until a few years ago. Even the most experienced rider can forget the kick stand is not down or slip on a gravel driveway.

I just got back from a 2,000 km trip two up on a BMW G650GS, the old 650 single. Fitted with two cases, two bags, aftermarket seat, and a used touring windscreen, we had everything we needed for 1/3 the displacement and 1/5 the price.

I also have an f700 GS and totally admit that would have been the better bike for the job, but we're thinking of two up touring across Italy on the g650 so this was like a practice run of sorts for us before we commit to shipping the G overseas

The C650GS was one of the favourite bikes I've ever owned. A few years down the road when the GS Adventure may become a bit too much bike I see another one in my future. I'd buy one when we move to the house but my better half would have me sleeping in a dog house in the back yard if I bought another bike without getting rid of one.

Harbinger, I missed your return because I've had to cut down on my online time a bit recently. It sounds like you sold the K1600 and replaced it with a R1250GS. My across the street neighbor just got a 2022 R1250GSA. She loves it and has been doing a lot of adventuring with it with several friends. She's dropped it several times in sand and hitting rocks but she outfitted it so any damage is cosmetic. It's already a bit scratched up but she's no problem with that. She says, "It's just bike and that's what I bought it for."

I'm still riding my R1100RT. Regarding getting it off the side stand, my technique is to stand on the left peg, lean my body out over the right side of the bike and swing my leg over over the side cases and back rest. Leaning your torso over the right side of the bike changes the center of gravity which reduces the weight on the side stand. Like you, I'm always conscious about where the side stand foot lands.

BTW, Adri said he was rode his G650, not the C650.🙂

Good to see you back. BTW, we've two friends that just moved to Vancouver Island, from Vancouver, just a bit up the hill from the ferry to Denman Island and I wonder if you might end up crossing paths with them.They don't ride but the island is a relatively small place.

Miguel

I have a 29" leg and the RT is about the limit of where I want to be height and weight wise so I may well end up keeping it post repair.

Lets face it, there's not much else that can go wrong now everything has been replaced.

I also have an aversion to chain drive.

Yeah I caught that after I posted. Still did love the C650GT though I'd have corrected it but was out for a ride

Yep, the Island is pretty small compared to Toronto! Really I think you have Victoria, Nanaimo and "other" . We will be in North Nanaimo which is apparently a great neighbourhood and about 10 minutes from the ferry I think.

Yes, one good thing about the GSA is if/when I drop it it's no big deal as it's designed to survive a tumble and I have all the drop protection for the drop protection. Also have the 719 package which includes the cylinder protection. Ditto.

Independent BMW Workshop #3 got in touch today which means that I can cancel the Motoraad booking and it's also going to cut the bill in half.

Such an irony that since the new exhaust has been swapped over it's actually stopped leaking.

Yay! Finally some traction here. Here's hoping the timeline isn't too torturous, although I can guess that's not at the top of your list of concerns right now.

Got bored of waiting for the 3rd independent BMW workshop to call me back so rather than wait any longer I've bought a 2004 Kawasaki KLV 1000 as a contingency.

Germany and France in August can't be postponed so a decision had to be made.

11,000 miles, FSH, Panniers and oddly enough Suzuki built it. True.

Collect it tomorrow.

Sorted.

Suzuki-built 'saki? Will wonders never cease.

Sucks to hear the get-it-fixed timeline is working against your own, though.

Suzuki built it on the same production line at the V Strom.

It has the same engine as the TL1000 ( Widow Maker ) but with less aggressive cam profiles.

It's nothing special but my future prediction is that the RT won't be ready for August so I'm not going to piss around waiting to be let down.

So the KLR went for its MOT yesterday and the Suzuki Mechanic working next door took an interest in the bike as he'd never seen one and wasn't aware of the Suzuki/Kawasaki connection.

I mentioned the saga of the BMW and the reasons for buying the Kawasaki, then I asked him when he could do an engine service on it so that when I return home in late July I can ride it straight off to Germany and France.

Tuesday ? He said.

I could have kissed him.

What a difference in the attitude of this guy and all the other BMW Techs.

Booked.

Cool. You should have kissed him!
Miguel

I'm sure the dude was fine with just a handshake.

And, yeah, quite the difference in timing and attitude, Bill.

In a strange twist I got a text from the original Tech who first worked on it today and he offered a slot in late August which I've taken.

Cancelled the Motoraad booking soon after.

That should half the price of the repair.

You and I need to have this conversation over coffee.

I'm surprised that we haven't already.