Modern Vespa

Just FYI...
He got 213,000 miles and 14 years of service from his 2008 Prius. He was getting 48 mpg until a few weeks ago when it decreased precipitously to 35 mpg. Then he started seeing other charging and storage problems. The final sign that something was wrong was the big red circle with exclamation point on the display. That got his attention. Tmw, he's having a mechanic read the diagnostic codes to verify it's the batteries. He's gotten quotes of $1500-$2000 to install new batteries and recycle the old batteries.

He also just changed brakes shoes and discs for the first time in 212,000 miles.

He paid $24,000 for it new in 2008.

Personally, I think he got good value for his money. He's never had any problems with the car. If he doesn't fix it, he'll likely buy another Prius.

Last edited by Miguel on Mon Jun 20, 2022 8:29 pm; edited 1 time in total

I'd call the Warranty Dept.

He paid $24,000 for it new in 2008. That is a steep price to pay in 2008.48 MPG is not that good of gas mileage. He did not save any money based on sale price.

$24K prolly included tax, license, registration, destination fees, 'cetra, 'cetra. I just looked up MSRP for the 2008 Prius. It was $22K.

Even by today's standards, The Prius is still a fuel-efficiency leader amongst gas-powered cars according to this government site: https://fueleconomy.gov/feg/best/bestworstNF.shtml. The 2022 Prius gets 56 mpg, my bro's Prius got 52 when new in 2008. The data shows his nearing-end-of-life 48 mpg was excellent when compared to both 2008 and 2022 cars.

The most impressive aspect of his car's performance IMO was that the battery lasted so long. He operated his car in Florida and Washington DC and was never garaged so it experienced extremes of heat and cold. It's only a single data point but shows that electric car batteries can indeed operate for many years. And I don't know how his car performed relative to other 2008 Prius' so can't comment on the the statistics of the battery's performance. But it is a case-in-point. Toyota estimated the batteries to last 100K and ten years. His Prius certainly exceeded their estimate.

Another impressive aspect was that the brakes lasted 212,000 miles. I've never had a car with brakes going that far without servicing. I will add that we have a 2013 Hybrid with 75K miles and my mechanic says the brakes still have plenty of life. Just sayin.

Cheers.
Miguel

Last edited by Miguel on Wed Jun 15, 2022 6:12 am; edited 6 times in total

14 years and 213k miles is long out of warranty. LoL

It was a joke.

Do you remember when we laughed ?

Sometimes you only need to replace a few of the cells in the battery pack. The Dr Prius app will give you voltage of the cells, as long as you have a Bluetooth OBD reader. It might even just be one bad cell. Very handy tool to see what's what.

Tons of 'how to' videos on how to replace a few of the cells to get the battery back up to running order.

I have a Lexus CT (same engine as the Gen 3 Prius, different body). Average 55 UK mpg over a 65,000 mile period so far. Doubt this thing will give up any time soon! We tend to have shorter journeys here, so MPG could be better depending on where you live.

Recently did a round trip at 72 MPG just to prove it could be done. There were hills involved etc, not a flat run. These things LOVE 50-60 mph roads, and can get 70 UK MPG in those conditions.

Original discs and pads still have plenty of life. Only one tyre change so far (but I have two sets of wheels - summer and winter, so that's why they last long).

The only maintenance so far has been oil and filter changes. One spark plug change in line with the service interval. I did the transmission fluid for peace of mind at 60,000… and cleaned the EGR circuit (it was FAR from being clogged, but did it anyway).

I'm amazed by the other choices on the market, which have worse fuel economy & reliability… yet are more desirable for some reason.

Last edited by OscarSass on Thu Jun 16, 2022 12:31 pm; edited 2 times in total

This isn't to bash a GM dealer, but ... wait. Yes it is.

My neighbor has a Chevy Volt. He's had it since ... when did they come out ... 2011. He was the first one in the area to have one.

He has always run it primarily on battery. It has well over 150K miles on it.

Late last year he took it to the dealer for some other work. It was gas motor related; oil leaks and such. He spent around $3K on repairs. And then he started having battery issues.

He took it back to the dealership and they told him the battery pack was shot. It would be $20K to replace it. The car is worth a small fraction of that.

I was furious, because what dealership in their right skull would NOT check the condition of the battery in an 11 year old hybrid with north of 150K miles on it BEFORE charging a customer for $3K in repairs?

So, he resigned himself to just driving it as is until he can't. It still runs on gas.

Two days ago we were talking, and the battery issue seems to be resolved. It's acting normally again. H said it ran through three tanks of gas and now it's back to running on electric.

So, A: Yay. Bob has his car back and B: Freaking dealer could have recalibrated his battery for him, but they would have replaced it unnecessarily.

Here's to hoping that EV batteries last longer than predicted. Sure hope mine does.

I took it as such but there's also a bit of a proposal in there that I brought up to my bro Stephen. Maybe he should approach Toyota to tell them about his battery's performance and see if they would consider some type of quid pro quo where they get to advertise his car's long term performance and he gets a new set of batteries. Unfortunately, he needs his car almost daily and really can't wait to get it fixed or buy a new one. He works as an aircraft ground traffic controller for a subsidiary or American Airlines at Washington DC National Airport and often works late into the night and long after public transportation has ceased operations so he needs his car to get him to and from work. It's his only vehicle. Even still, your suggestion was not necessarily as wild as you intended it. I remember years ago that Volvo highlighted the performance of someone's old Volvo that had traveled something like 500K or 1M miles. I don't remember what he got from Volvo but it was something more than a coffee cup and a picture of him and his car in a Volvo ad.

Thanks! Miguel

There are probably a load of Prius Taxis with over twice that mileage out there.

In the words of Tom Jones, It's not unusual.

Thanks for that.

Prolly.

My daughter has a 2nd gen Prius, with currently 224,000 miles on it. We bought it used with 186k. Only problem was, it had sat for awhile but before that it was used by a saleman I knew that spent most of the time on the highway. The battery went out within a year. For about $1,000, I had a rebuilt one installed. It's still going 5 years later. Now my other 2 daughters own Prius' as well. If my Toyota truck ever wears out (256,000 miles) , I will buy one too. I do all the maintenance on the cars.

The latest...

My bro Stephen had a local shop read the codes. It is indeed the battery. (the local shop didn't charge him but the Toyota dealer wanted $150.) The local shop can't or won't replace them. But there's a mobile mechanic that will come by his house to replace the batteries and recycle the old ones for $1500. He's doing that. He was told about just replacing the bad cells but he needs a reliable car so decided to just replace them all figuring it's just a matter of time before he'd replace them all but replacing them over time. He says he will not let them leave until all the warning lights go out.

Stephen is not afraid to do the work himself but he makes more money working than spending time replacing batteries. He works at a busy airport and because of the busy summer travel season this year and the traditional weather delays, he's working a lot of overtime. It's also peace of mind, convenience and the satisfaction of just being done with it.

My bro did the same calculations Einstein did!

With the amount of mileage he put on it in the 14 years he has owned it, and given the gas mileage and price of competing vehicles at the time he purchased it, he likely saved money. A 2008 Toyota Corolla LE gets about 32 mpg (combined) and MSRP in 2008 was around $16,000 ($6000 less than the Prius' $22,000 MSRP that the OP mentioned in a later post). So, in over 213,000 miles, the Corolla would have used 6656 gallons of gas. The Prius would have used 4438 gallons of gas at 48 mpg. That's 2218 gallons of gas saved by driving the Prius over a Corolla. I have to go to work, so I don't have time to find the average price of gas from 2008 to 2022. But the "break even" gas price between the cost of the of the Corolla and the Prius is about $2.75 per gallon.

Certainly saved some money on fuel.
But the fact that the general public breathed in a little less pollution than they otherwise would have done had he driven a 'gas guzzler' all that time is priceless. Thank you.
Good work that man!

I've always been a die-hard petrol head. I've owned well over a hundred cars in my life so far. I started back in the musclecar era, then graduated into vettes, and eventually reached the pinnacle of cool cars with Italian exotics. My daily drivers for the last 25 years have usually been premium German vehicles. Currently drive an 8 year old Audi Q7 Diesel. With a weight of 3 tons, all the creature comforts, lots of room, and strong towing ability...I can still manage around 34mpg on the highway at 65mph if I'm careful.

In all my life I never thought I'd consider a hybrid or electric vehicle. But I do have to admit, I would get one if the situation was right. I saw a Rivian truck in traffic the other day and it was nice. The owner saw me gawking at it and decided to show off, when the light turned green he put the 835 horsepower to work and launched away in a silent fury! I was speechless...

I used to scoff at the Prius and similar vehicles - but no more! Pretty cool now...

Currently on my 4th Prius, love it to bits!

Nice to hear it doesn't cost the earth (no pun intended) to replace the battery

but hey, what do I know.. I ride an Italian Shopping Bike

Mechanic coming by his house at noon tmw to replace the batteries. Be interesting to hear the details on the replacement process. Miguel

We have two cars in our household "stable". One is a Prius V (the "station wagon" style Prius) and the other is a LEAF (a pure EV). The Prius is approaching 10 years old and has been a model of reliability. We use it mostly for longer distances where the EV is less practical. These 2 vehicles mean we are not being hurt much by the drastic increase in gasoline prices.

Yeah, where's Toyota's "Robot" when you need him? 😁

Impressive mileage.

Not surprising from a Toyota though: my wife has one, old gasoline powered. I believe I've changed my car at least...loosing count, mayby three times while she still has the same one. Shiny as new, even with our winter and salted roads. No issues ever, well maintained.

When I got my current car, a plug-in hybrid, I test drove quite many plug-in hybrids from many brands. If I'd done the choise based on hybrid technology and comsumption only, Toyota would have been a clear winner. My German car can beat it at many fronts, but looses clearly in consumption and the level of sophistication in the way electric driveline is combined with the ICE.

I would have liked to get a full EV, but my use and charging points over here were not, yet, a perfect match...I sold my environmental soul to convenience...and Toyota's great mileage to German comfort

The mechanic we contacted to change out the battery in my daughter's Prius drove 150 miles one way to us and arrived in a Prius. The change out took about an hour, he then checked the entire electrical system, then drove to his next client. Five years later, it still runs great and she recently drove it 900 miles to a temporary job as a intern in her field of wildlife biology.

I paid about $35,000 for a new car in 1999. $24,000 in 2008 is hardly "steep".


Oh, and that car I bought? 18-20 MPG.

I've got a 2017 Leaf with 26k miles that's down 3 battery capacity bars.

I should be losing a 4th battery bar in the next month or so (I lose 1 battery bar a year, roughly), then it'll be time for a FREE 40kw battery under the 96 month/96K mile battery warranty.

I have a 30kw (107 miles) battery, but Nissan doesn't carry them any more, so they're replacing them with 40kw (150 mile) batteries as they wear out.

At that point, I'll have a low mileage BEV (that I paid 1/2 price for in 2020) that I can take on trips up and down I-20 and I-35 (Dallas, Waco, Austin, etc.) which is where most of Texas' non-Tesla EV infrastructure is located.

Little victories.

What plug-in hybrid did you get? TIA. Miguel

I'll throw this in again.

My Hyundai I10 will regularly achieve 55 mpg. Before that I had a Toyota Aygo which did 65 mpg most of the time with no need for a Hybrid.

Save the planet and just buy a smaller car.

FTFY

Oh, the Moto Guzzi does 75 mpg most of the time. The BMW some what less.

I almost did… smallest I could realistically get was a golf-sized hatchback for the very long work journeys, and kit I needed to carry.

I was regularly driving 5 hrs a day. A longer wheelbase really helps in that regard. Would definitely not go smaller than that.

Highway/motorway is what kills fuel economy (ie anything over 60mph)… which diesels are very good at (the whole anti-diesel thing was blown out of proportion). Manufacturer shenanigans didn't exactly help. 🙈

The Hyundai's mpg improves with more miles on the highway. I think the best I had was 57 mpg on the way back from Spa in Belgium.

1100 in a day in the Aygo across Spain and France was fun also. That car was so light it felt like it would blow away in the wind.

My 2020 Toyota Corolla hybrid regularly does 61-66 mpg, although Jule's Kia Nero Hybrid does a shocking 51 mpg - Guess we're taking the Toyota to the South Coast this year!

Graham

Actually - forgot to mention something.

The options list (particularly wheel/tyre packages) affect economy too. Over here, a car can be pushed into a higher tax band because certain options increase emissions.

Like trying to walk in trainers vs high heels... you get the gist. 🤣

Last edited by OscarSass on Fri Jun 17, 2022 5:34 am; edited 1 time in total

Not in America. Americans would rather buy large SUVs and then complain about fuel costs…

Other than the Mustang, Ford doesn't even make "typical" IC cars for the the U.S. market; if it doesn't look like an SUV, it doesn't sell.

Good luck finding the Hyundai I10 here in the States. We do get the AWD Hyundai Palisade here, though - it gets 21 combined mpg. Is the Palisade a big seller across the pond?

It's now time for me to complain about the "high" gas prices of $5.00 per U.S. gallon…. What's gallon of petrol cost in the UK these days?

That's an attitude that more people should have. We can always do things better and there are various degrees of better. It's not an all or nothing solution, but politics here would make it so.

The minute you mention EVs in the states it becomes a politically polarizing conversation. I have to clarify all the time that I love cars. Just because I drive an EV doesn't automatically make me some patchouli smelling, kale eating eco-warrior. Not that there's anything wrong with kale. We also have - and love - our Toyota Tundra and I'm currently putting more money than it's worth into my '89 Volvo because I dearly love the car.

We're looking at a new car for my wife and leaning heavily toward the Corolla Cross. It's not an EV or even a hybrid. It won't be driven a lot, but it ticks all of the boxes for what we want in a car.

It's already been said that people here in the states either want an SUV or a pickup. Pickups are EVERYWHERE. Useful tool, but most of them are just daily drivers for one person. And then people scream at the government about gas prices when there's a whole lot more involved with global oil cost.

I dunno ... buying the scooter back in 2013 was my first foray into saving gas money; the EV is just an extension of that. Even my Dad, who's political affiliations have him constantly looking over his shoulder for lizard people secretly injecting him with microchips to track his bowel movements, is considering a hybrid in favor of the Dodge Ram that is daily taking food out of his mouth.

His neighbors have had a Prius for several years. He was very impressed riding in it. I hope he gets into one.

Aaahhh ... Yes there is 😝

$10.25 a Gallon.

At least a Hybrid isnt as Carbon intensive to make than a full EV.

My argument is if a high mpg is your thing you don't need a Hybrid. Just a small car.

Small IC car buyers don't have many options here in the U.S. With the options available, about 40 mpg combined is what can be expected (at best). Granted U.S. gallons are a bit smaller than those in Britain, but I don't think there is a "purely IC" car available in the U.S. that gets 45 mpg. See:

https://www.caranddriver.com/features/g15382442/best-gas-mileage-nonhybrid-cars-gasoline-nonelectric/

An EV makes up for the carbon used in manufacture in one year of average driving.