OP
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Vespa 150 VBB2T
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Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
'65 vbb 150 front brake,I just can't seem to get it adjusted correctly.
Taken the hub off there's about 3mm of pad left is this enough? I have engaged the brake by hand then offered up the hub and it wouldn't go on so I would assume there's enough on the pads. Put it all back together but it just won't bite. Any advice or tricks? Thanks
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@zachyzach avatar
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Addicted
'64 VBBs, '74 BMW R75/6 airhead, '74 Bultaco Alpina 250, Lambrettas + projects
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@zachyzach avatar
'64 VBBs, '74 BMW R75/6 airhead, '74 Bultaco Alpina 250, Lambrettas + projects
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Location: Western Mass., USA
UTC quote
It's involved with VBBs because you need to take the axle off to replace the shoes and the spring for them. There isn't room under the 4 stud plate if you don't, as far as I know. There are more steps than with say a Super or whatever.

During the process you probably need to either replace the bearing or reuse it while correctly reinstalling it (it may come off with the axle.) You'll also find a felt seal that often you can reuse. The speedo gear needs to come out first before the axle so it doesn't get smashed.

My entire front end/fork is off the bike while I am restoring the VBB, so that made things easier. I replaced the shoes (originals are asbestos and the dust is terrible stuff) and during reassembly I needed to do some mild axle whamming (shot filled plastic mallet) for the bearing to seat correctly and to get the axle turning nicely.

Before starting, I cleaned everything with brake cleaner. Then during rebuilding I greased the axle and bearing well. Keep the shoes pristine but grease the pivot. Reinstall the hub and the speedo gear and check it's moving right.
@moto64 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
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@moto64 avatar
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1876
Location: S.Salem, NY
UTC quote
Are the steel contact clips are on the ends of the shoes ? I would put some new shoes in there.
Also.. the cable should be clamped so it runs in line with the clamp and doesn't come out of the top at a angle the way you have it. Should be as straight a pull as possible and if done correctly , it looks like there would hardly be enough travel to engage the shoes.
It also looks like your speedo cable is too long. The big loop with the sharp bend at the fitting is pretty tough on the inner cable.
@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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UTC quote
Moto64 wrote:
Are the steel contact clips are on the ends of the shoes ? I would put some new shoes in there.
Also.. the cable should be clamped so it runs in line with the clamp and doesn't come out of the top at a angle the way you have it. Should be as straight a pull as possible and if done correctly , it looks like there would hardly be enough travel to engage the shoes.
It also looks like your speedo cable is too long. The big loop with the sharp bend at the fitting is pretty tough on the inner cable.
Yes to all of this. The speedo and brake cable should be even round curves that are running straight into the fork and their respective housings. The brake cable clamp should likewise be a straight pull back to the fine adjuster.

If they're too squishy, make sure that the brake cable is properly seated into the headset, too. That's a slack spot that can get overlooked and make the front brake nearly worthless.

To adjust it, I like to put a bit of excess cable outer on the end of the brake cable, then use a fourth hand tool on the cable to gradually tighten the arm until it just starts to drag on the brakes. You can then tighten the holding nut down and if you need to, you can tweak that last fraction of a millimeter with the fine adjuster.
OP
UTC

Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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Location: Bournemouth UK
 
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Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Moto64 wrote:
Are the steel contact clips are on the ends of the shoes ? I would put some new shoes in there.
Also.. the cable should be clamped so it runs in line with the clamp and doesn't come out of the top at a angle the way you have it. Should be as straight a pull as possible and if done correctly , it looks like there would hardly be enough travel to engage the shoes.
It also looks like your speedo cable is too long. The big loop with the sharp bend at the fitting is pretty tough on the inner cable.
Thanks for the reply I will have a play with cable. Yes I thought the speedo looked too long but if I cut it I would cut off the square end...any suggestions
@ray8 avatar
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Molto Verboso
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Molto Verboso
@ray8 avatar
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UTC quote
Highly recommend the best Happiness/$$$ ratio upgrade I can think of. You'll have braking power/feel very close to disc:
https://www.sip-scootershop.com/en/product/brake-kit-sip-performance-front-vbb-style_23208620?q=8%22%20rim

You'd have to change both the cable inner and outer to take full advantage of this kit.
@moto64 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
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@moto64 avatar
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
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UTC quote
Another thing to check is the condition of the corners of the actuator post where they contact the shoes. If they are worn and rounded off, the lever will have to be set even closer to the cable terminal on the plate and will have to travel further to engage the shoes.
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Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Moto64 wrote:
Another thing to check is the condition of the corners of the actuator post where they contact the shoes. If they are worn and rounded off, the lever will have to be set even closer to the cable terminal on the plate and will have to travel further to engage the shoes.
Yes I have to push the lever right in so there is no room for the cable clamp to engage the brakes. The last picture is how far the lever has to be to engage! So surely this means new pads etc or the whole set up suggested by Ray8.
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@chandlerman avatar
UTC

Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate, 79 P200E, 66 Lammy S3
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Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
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UTC quote
A new brake pin and putting a shoe on the upper brake pad will both help improve the amount of pressure you can apply against the drum.

I'm eyeing that new drum myself at this point, but will probably spring for some tubeless 8"s first since I'm having so much fun riding the hell out of the VBB and 65mph on tubes gives me the heebie-jeebies if I think about it too hard.
@moto64 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
Joined: UTC
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Location: S.Salem, NY
 
Molto Verboso
@moto64 avatar
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1876
Location: S.Salem, NY
UTC quote
The upper shoe looks less worn than the lower and the steel contact clip is missing which means the end of the shoe is probably worn and therefor not moving out as far as the lower. Shoes are cheap. I'd try a new set.
OP
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Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
A new brake pin and putting a shoe on the upper brake pad will both help improve the amount of pressure you can apply against the drum.

I'm eyeing that new drum myself at this point, but will probably spring for some tubeless 8"s first since I'm having so much fun riding the hell out of the VBB and 65mph on tubes gives me the heebie-jeebies if I think about it too hard.
Many thanks, looks like some new shoes for me then!👞🕺
I just want to get out and ride it!
OP
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Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Moto64 wrote:
The upper shoe looks less worn than the lower and the steel contact clip is missing which means the end of the shoe is probably worn and therefor not moving out as far as the lower. Shoes are cheap. I'd try a new set.
So the clip goes on the end of the shoe to make the arm/pin roll more easily and protect the shoe. Brilliant!
Many thanks will let you all know how I get on
@moto64 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1876
Location: S.Salem, NY
 
Molto Verboso
@moto64 avatar
'64 Motovespa 150S (177) , '65 VBB, '66 Allstate SF, '66 180SS
Joined: UTC
Posts: 1876
Location: S.Salem, NY
UTC quote
It's a wear plate so there is steel against steel instead of the alloy. And it should be lightly greased.
@ray8 avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
Joined: UTC
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Location: Los Angeles
 
Molto Verboso
@ray8 avatar
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Location: Los Angeles
UTC quote
chandlerman wrote:
I'm eyeing that new drum myself at this point, but will probably spring for some tubeless 8"s first since I'm having so much fun riding the hell out of the VBB and 65mph on tubes gives me the heebie-jeebies if I think about it too hard.
Keep eyeing it!

I feel less of the jeebies with a strengthened SIP inner-tube. Don't know the speed rating of those combined with S83's, but side-by-side vs other tubes it's ridiculous-beef.

I had a rear tire(heat) blowout at around 45. Guessing a front blowout at even 20+mph means going to ground. S83 became a twisted clump with no air pressure.

*A little concerned about the condition of the OP's front end
Like either brake pad clips evaporate or it wasn't installed, which then *may* rhyme with a kind of Hodge.
⬆️    About 1 month elapsed    ⬇️
OP
UTC

Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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Location: Bournemouth UK
 
Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Thanks guys all sorted now put the shoes on with no probs all good, thanks for the advice. Haven't had any time of late to work on it but finally got round to it. Got to sort the lights/electrics now, should be fun
@subetherbass avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
1997 Italjet Formula 125, 2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
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Location: Australa, Mate
 
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@subetherbass avatar
1997 Italjet Formula 125, 2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
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Location: Australa, Mate
UTC quote
Did you fit the missing end clip thingee?
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@subetherbass avatar
UTC

Ossessionato
1997 Italjet Formula 125, 2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4814
Location: Australa, Mate
 
Ossessionato
@subetherbass avatar
1997 Italjet Formula 125, 2 matching N.Z. '69 VBC Super, 177cc Racer, VespaCross Bodge, Puch SRA150, Piaggio Zip 100! & others
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4814
Location: Australa, Mate
UTC quote
Hopefully you used a real circlip here
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OP
UTC

Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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Posts: 23
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Member
Vespa 150 VBB2T
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UTC quote
Yep, end caps and circlip all new and fitted
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