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@swiss1939 avatar
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
Anyone have more info on what engines are in the piaggio apes? Are they the same as the scooter models? I'm looking for service and parts manuals online for them and any info about them mechanically.

Really curious how they are similar or different from the scooters.
⚠️ Last edited by swiss1939 on UTC; edited 1 time
@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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Location: Rochester, Minnesota
 
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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Location: Rochester, Minnesota
UTC quote
swiss1939 wrote:
Anyone have more info on what engines are in the piaggio apes? Are they the same as the scooter models? I'm looking for service and parts manuals online for them and any info about them mechanically.

Really curious how they are similar or different from the scooters.
You buying an APE? I think it would be neat, I just don't have room for anything else.
OP
@swiss1939 avatar
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
I wish. Just been really curious for a while. If I came across one for a decent price that needed work and they are essentially the same engines then why not! I'd make space for it.
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@swiss1939 avatar
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
Someone a few blocks from me has one with issues running. Just contacted me looking for help. I'm really interested in taking a close look at it and if it's essentially the same engines then I may be able to help them get it running again.
UTC

Hooked
various, but less than I used to have
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Location: San Anselmo
 
Hooked
various, but less than I used to have
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Location: San Anselmo
UTC quote
essentially the same as a vespa. The later they are the more they deviated from the scooter. My '53 is the same as a '53 Vespa.
@christopher_55934 avatar
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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Location: Rochester, Minnesota
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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UTC quote
Service Station Manual for the 1984 Ape P 501 (MPR2T)

Still trying to find a parts manual or where spare parts are even available/sold.
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
Popped over to the random neighbors place literally 1 block from my house (crazy there is an ape so close to me and I've never known before) today to check out this Ape that was having trouble starting.

1984 Piaggio APE P 501

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

No spark at the plug, but continuity at the HT coil confirmed because the starter button would work when both wires plugged into the HT coil, but wouldn't when the pink wire from the starter button in the cab was disconnected from the HT coil. Continuity from the HT coil to the points ignition, so I know that should work. Pressing the starter button, the starter motor would crank over and engine would turn over, but wouldn't start cause no spark at the plug!!! So what's up with the HT coil to the spark plug??

HT COIL:
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Starter Motor:
External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

I tested the resistance.. I forget exactly what it was.. I'll go back and check resistance again on the tabs for the ignition switch and to the points, I think it was something like 3 ohms but I'm guessing right now.

After an hour of digging around, testing continuity and following wires up to under the plastic dashboard, fighting to remove the windshield wiper motor so I could remove the plastic dashboard and get a better view of all the wiring under it.. I stumble upon this random ass radio shack looking toggle switch hidden under the dashboard. FUCKING KILL SWITCH! Problem solved!

External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text

Wouldn't idle well though no matter what I set the SHB 27-24 carb to.. so that means time to take the carb off and give it a nice ultrasonic clean. It needs it cause it was completely encased in crud as is every vespa engine that hasn't been cleaned in decades.

But as is everything piaggio... the carb is kinda a pain to access and remove! Gotta remove the engine plastic cylinder cover and exhaust heat shield to get enough room to barely get a 10mm wrench in there and struggle to remove the two nuts mounting it to the engine.

Oh boy this is fun! I need me one of these! I'll take more pics of things I should have taken pics of when I go back with the cleaned up carb to get it running again. Lots of cool stuff, under the seat, dashboard, etc. I'm also going to have to teach her how to drive it cause she doesn't know how. BTW, this thing has a reverse!!!! I can't wait to drive it around.

Some more pics for enjoyment:
engine with the cover off.  Two part plastic cover.. back half still on with heat shield.
engine with the cover off. Two part plastic cover.. back half still on with heat shield.
cylinder cover front.   one half of it removed.
cylinder cover front. one half of it removed.
air box removed, to access the carb mounting bolts.
air box removed, to access the carb mounting bolts.
there she is!  after I cleaned the outside off with lots of baby wipes!
there she is! after I cleaned the outside off with lots of baby wipes!
those two pesky 10mm nuts are hard to get a wrench in there and loosen.
those two pesky 10mm nuts are hard to get a wrench in there and loosen.
choke cable and choke.
choke cable and choke.
throttle cable with throttle slide
throttle cable with throttle slide
@hibbert avatar
UTC

Molto Verboso
Vespa
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Location: California
 
Molto Verboso
@hibbert avatar
Vespa
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Location: California
UTC quote
Wow looks like fun from here!
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@swiss1939 avatar
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
Carb full of black sludge. Two cans of carb cleaner and 20 min in the ultrasonic later and this thing is spotless!

Pics of the carb:
SHB 27-24
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
idle jet
idle jet
main jet
main jet
sludge!
sludge!
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
toxic avenger sludge
toxic avenger sludge
mj sludge
mj sludge
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
cleaned
cleaned
re-installed
re-installed
idle mix screw cleaned
idle mix screw cleaned
idle mix screw reinstalled (works differently from SI carb idle screws)
idle mix screw reinstalled (works differently from SI carb idle screws)
air fuel mix screw cleaned
air fuel mix screw cleaned
idle jet cleaned (50)
idle jet cleaned (50)
idle jet, a/f and idle screws re-installed
idle jet, a/f and idle screws re-installed
choke cleaned
choke cleaned
choke re-installed
choke re-installed
main jet (120) cleaned
main jet (120) cleaned
main stack with o ring cleaned and ready to go.
main stack with o ring cleaned and ready to go.
fuel banjo screw and filter ready to go.
fuel banjo screw and filter ready to go.
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@swiss1939 avatar
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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
cont.

Gonna have to drain, filter the gas and replace the inline fuel filter as that crap is full of sludge! Don't want no clogged carb in 3 days!
re-installed.  banjo is still on the fuel line on the ape.
re-installed. banjo is still on the fuel line on the ape.
float/needle cleaned
float/needle cleaned
installed
installed
float lid and o ring cleaned
float lid and o ring cleaned
assembled
assembled
float lid and main stack installed.
float lid and main stack installed.
bam!  you can eat off this thing!
bam! you can eat off this thing!
OP
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
Now to figure out how to set this carb up properly. Not much info out there, and the service manual instructions are opaque!
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2007 Stella 225
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@christopher_55934 avatar
2007 Stella 225
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Location: Rochester, Minnesota
UTC quote
You'll get it, your not trying to rejet, just clean it up. If the manual has float height your set. Everything else is pretty much generic.

https://www.allensperformance.co.uk/
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Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
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Location: Siam
 
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Vespas 1964 GS160, 1965 SS180, 1977 V9A1T, 1983 PX150E
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Posts: 2537
Location: Siam
UTC quote
I'd love to have an Ape. They look so fun to drive, and very practical for hauling loads, going to the beach, camping, etc. What more could one want? 🦄
OP
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
More photos. Also confirmed the HT Coil pink (ignition) to black (points) resistance is 3.6 ohms.

Re-installed carb, replaced the fuel line, inline filter and drained and filtered the gas to clean it out. Finally, got everything running and idling well. Took it for a test drive around the block and this thing is scary as all hell! Its fun as well, but the gear shifting, clutch and reverse gearing is very stiff, clunky and hard to get into correct gear. It was tough for me to drive, having experience driving vespas when control cables are not set up properly. The woman that owns it was having so much more difficulty driving it.

I forwarded her to the local vintage vespa repair shop so she can hopefully get them to rebuild the clutch and refresh all the cables and set it up smoother.

My job is done in that it runs and is useable for them!

EDIT: just realized I installed the inline fuel filter backwards! ha
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
points ignition under the dome
points ignition under the dome
point dome lid removed
point dome lid removed
point ignition
point ignition
fuel tap control arm.  left reserve (extremely slow flow), down is on, right is closed.
fuel tap control arm. left reserve (extremely slow flow), down is on, right is closed.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
removable engine compartment cover for the bed.  I freekin love this vehicle!
removable engine compartment cover for the bed. I freekin love this vehicle!
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
passenger side door needs its hinge bent about an inch so the door can close properly
passenger side door needs its hinge bent about an inch so the door can close properly
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
forward and reverse shifter knob
forward and reverse shifter knob
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
one of the small knobs is a choke, the other is apparently a "cabin heater"  not sure where the cabin heat comes from
one of the small knobs is a choke, the other is apparently a "cabin heater" not sure where the cabin heat comes from
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
under bench seat storage
under bench seat storage
OP
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
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Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
 
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
cont.

Video the owner texted of me driving it down a dead end street trying to make sure the gear shifting, clutch and throttle were working. Its extremely stiff and difficult to shift or get into reverse or back into forward gear.

BTW, its kinda insane, but you can literally drive this thing in reverse in 1st or 4th gear. So you could drive waaaaaay too fast in reverse if you were insane enough to try it! haha
jack hidden under the spare wheel and spark plug wrench
jack hidden under the spare wheel and spark plug wrench
bench seat lifts up from the back and those two pegs sit in a metal mount with c clamps that hold it down when in seated mode.
bench seat lifts up from the back and those two pegs sit in a metal mount with c clamps that hold it down when in seated mode.
believe this is the voltage regulator behind the battery
believe this is the voltage regulator behind the battery
30a fuse installed when it should be a 15a fuse.  Had the owner replace it with correct.
30a fuse installed when it should be a 15a fuse. Had the owner replace it with correct.
Here I am driving it around testing the shifting and clutch.  Its rough and difficult to control.
Here I am driving it around testing the shifting and clutch. Its rough and difficult to control.
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UTC

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79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
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Location: Florence, OR
 
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@qascooter avatar
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
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Posts: 4285
Location: Florence, OR
UTC quote
That is so fricken cool!
OP
@swiss1939 avatar
UTC

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P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
 
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@swiss1939 avatar
P208, Stella VMC Stelvio 187, Stella 150, VNX1T, V9A1T, V9B1T, 02 Sportster XLH1208
Joined: UTC
Posts: 4110
Location: Staten Island, NY
UTC quote
I was wrong... Reverse is only 1 gear.. separate from all the other gears. I was thinking there was some external gearing that reversed the normal gearbox output, but there is apparently an actual reverse gear in the gearbox I'm guessing.. based on the service manual description of the gearbox ratios.
Forum member supplied image with no explanatory text
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