@greasy125 avatar
UTC

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
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Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
@greasy125 avatar
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14524
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
UTC quote
hey boss, I measured 3 different cogs. one measured 3.8 and the other two 3.4

fwiw, the thickest had no bevel at the edge of the gear teeth, of the other two one did, and the other did not. that bevel appears to be about .8

you are welcome for the further muddying of the waters.
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@brok3nr0b0t avatar
UTC

Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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Posts: 266
Location: SoCal
 
Hooked
@brok3nr0b0t avatar
'71 Sprint Veloce
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Posts: 266
Location: SoCal
UTC quote
orwell84 wrote:
I have broken a couple rings and was really surprised. I have handled much more delicate, 3 piece VW rings and never broke one, but I seem to get ham handed with Vespas.
Yeah I was trying to be careful but I just lifted it "up" instead of "out" just a bit too much and it snapped like dry pasta. One of those moments where you just sit there and stare at your mistake for a few beats before resigning to the fact that you done goofed and move on Laughing emoticon
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@brok3nr0b0t avatar
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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Hooked
@brok3nr0b0t avatar
'71 Sprint Veloce
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Posts: 266
Location: SoCal
UTC quote
greasy125 wrote:
hey boss, I measured 3 different cogs. one measured 3.8 and the other two 3.4

fwiw, the thickest had no bevel at the edge of the gear teeth, of the other two one did, and the other did not. that bevel appears to be about .8

you are welcome for the further muddying of the waters.
I thank you for taking the time to measure for me. I do not thank you for the further confusion, ha! I kid, this is good info to have.

My long-con of having you slowly measure the thickness of every washer ever used in a Vespa motor is on track...
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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@brok3nr0b0t avatar
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
Happy Friday, scooter friends.

I decided to just get a new piston and rings to get me rolling while I really research the go-fast bits. I don't want to rush into a $$$ top end and regret my decision later. Thanks again Ray8 for helping me identify what I had to make this possible! They came today and I just had some n00b questions.

Should I set the ring gap on the lower or higher end of the spec? Right now I have them filed to the low end of the Blue Book range at 0.2mm, with the ring sitting about 25mm into the cylinder from the top.

The cutouts for the ports on the new piston are slightly larger. Any disadvantage to this?

The new piston slides in the cylinder nicely (no rings) but stops at the place in the picture below. The old piston will slide right through and come out the top no problem. In reality, the piston will never be this high in the cylinder (or else we've got real problems) but is this any kind of red flag? I can always just use the old piston if that's better...

TIA!
New on the left, old on the right
New on the left, old on the right
Naturally stops here when dropped in from the bottom
Naturally stops here when dropped in from the bottom
@greasy125 avatar
UTC

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14524
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
@greasy125 avatar
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14524
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
UTC quote
brok3nr0b0t wrote:
I thank you for taking the time to measure for me. I do not thank you for the further confusion, ha! I kid, this is good info to have.

My long-con of having you slowly measure the thickness of every washer ever used in a Vespa motor is on track...
jokes on you! kajiit keeps detailed records for collection in the future!

all kidding aside, happy to help. if I got it in reach and, the key part, can find my calipers, it's no big deal.
@greasy125 avatar
UTC

Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14524
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
Sergeant at Arms
@greasy125 avatar
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
Posts: 14524
Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
UTC quote
brok3nr0b0t wrote:
Happy Friday, scooter friends.

I decided to just get a new piston and rings to get me rolling while I really research the go-fast bits. I don't want to rush into a $$$ top end and regret my decision later. Thanks again Ray8 for helping me identify what I had to make this possible! They came today and I just had some n00b questions.

Should I set the ring gap on the lower or higher end of the spec? Right now I have them filed to the low end of the Blue Book range at 0.2mm, with the ring sitting about 25mm into the cylinder from the top.

The cutouts for the ports on the new piston are slightly larger. Any disadvantage to this?

The new piston slides in the cylinder nicely (no rings) but stops at the place in the picture below. The old piston will slide right through and come out the top no problem. In reality, the piston will never be this high in the cylinder (or else we've got real problems) but is this any kind of red flag? I can always just use the old piston if that's better...

TIA!
I'd keep the gap toward the tighter side of .2

don't sweat the cutouts. just be sure to chamfer them and the ports on the cylinder. dress everybody down, no sharp edges.

I'd drop the piston in the barrel in the operating range and measure the side clearance just be be on the safe side, but you should be okay.
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
Thanks as usual, good sir.

So, I've talked to a local shop and my current plan with the engine is to take it to them in its current state to have them asses my crankshaft install. It's probably fine, but I'd like a second set of eyes on it just to be sure, since if it is wrong, it kind of critical. I was going to go this morning, but the weather in SoCal (snow?!) was crap so I decided to push it to next weekend. Hopefully, it's all good and I can get the holy water thrown on it and move forward.

Which means this weekend, I'm doing cables and new harness. I got all the new cables installed today! Only small hiccup was that my cable kit I ordered, came with two throttle cables - one for injected bikes, one for non-injected. The difference is basically the inner is about 1" longer on one of them. I didn't know if the longer or the shorter of the two was for injected, so I just went based on what was in there before (it was the shorter). But the problem was, the one I needed didn't have a top hat on it. The previous cable did, and the other cable in the kit did, but not the one that was the right length. I don't know if there's a reason for that or if it was just left off by accident. Either way, I didn't have the proper stuff to be able to clip the end and solder a new one on, so I did some top hat surgery. Stuck a top hat in the vise, dremeled a slit in it so I could fit it around the cable, then clamped it shut in the vise. Definitely not a perfect solution, but based on the way the cable fits in the headset, I think it's better than not having a top hat.

Hopefully I can get the wiring harness done tomorrow. I'm thinking of starting at the front and pushing it toward the back, but any secrets are welcome.

Getting really close! I really want to make it to Rides of March and shake some hands for all the help I've gotten from everyone. Oh yeah, and actually RIDE! Fingers crossed!
"Scalpel!"
"Scalpel!"
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
I understand now why everyone was politely trying to steer me away from updating the wiring harness. Zen-like patience required. CTRL + Z'd all my cable work yesterday. Also realized there is a bunch of 2T oil at the front of the tunnel from my leaky tank. Must've been how its been sitting in my garage, all settled in the front. Going to figure out how to clean that out first and then try cables and harness, ahem, harness then cables, again.
@greasy125 avatar
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Sergeant at Arms
Weird 80's Vespas & Cool Vintage Lambrettas
Joined: UTC
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Location: The state of insanity, SoCal
 
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@greasy125 avatar
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UTC quote
it's... it's almost like we've been there before....

I keed, I keed.

did you tear everything out? I hope not... or at least left a guide wire...
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
greasy125 wrote:
it's... it's almost like we've been there before....

I keed, I keed.

did you tear everything out? I hope not... or at least left a guide wire...
Yeah I've got a guide wire in there. I tried taping the new harness to the old one to help pull it through, but once it hit the oil puddle, the tape came apart. Facepalm emoticon No way was the harness going in with the cables in place. The harness has the connectors pre-attached as well, which aren't going to fit down the tiny hole in the headset. Once I discovered there was that much oil in there, I realized I have to clean the tunnel out real good before proceeding. I don't want my harness sitting in oil. This oil in the tunnel business kinda makes me want to ditch the auto-lube as well but...cross that bridge later.

That almost 90º turn going up to he headset with a freakin' knifes edge is such a pain! We'll get there...
@v_oodoo avatar
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Style Maven
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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Style Maven
@v_oodoo avatar
'74 50s x3 '78 P200 E '84 Cosa '91 PK50XL2 - & - '58 AllState '68 Sprint '66(?) Super125 and '72 DanMotor Super150
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UTC quote
This might help you: I like to use spray teflon dry lube when running both cables and wires. I spray it on the new parts going in and also in the frame where they're going into.


External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
I use this stuff but there are many others.
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@brok3nr0b0t avatar
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
Thanks, Terry. I'll definitely try that stuff out in round two.
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Molto Verboso
1958 Allstate 177VMC, 1962 Allstate, Yamaha Vino 70cc
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Molto Verboso
1958 Allstate 177VMC, 1962 Allstate, Yamaha Vino 70cc
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UTC quote
V oodoo wrote:
This might help you: I like to use spray teflon dry lube when running both cables and wires. I spray it on the new parts going in and also in the frame where they're going into.


External inline image provided by member with no explanatory text
I use this stuff but there are many others.
I use tire fitting paste. Any non petroleum based lube will help. And wires go in first always! As you found out the hard way I see…
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
Back to the engine…

Was reading back through the thread and came across CM's quote:
chandlerman wrote:
Normally, I'd say that if you need to borrow the clutch nut tool, get a modern hex clutch nut, but you have a six spring clutch, so you'd need to upgrade to a seven spring, which isn't a big deal, other than you'll need to break a flange off the inside of the engine case (vice grips are your friend) and that scares some people.
I upgraded to the modern nut, but have the 6 spring clutch. Does this work ok? Seemed to torque down fine but want to make sure…
@qascooter avatar
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Ossessionato
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
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Location: Florence, OR
 
Ossessionato
@qascooter avatar
79 P200E (Ruby), 62 Allstate (B-62)
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UTC quote
Yes, the nut works on both 6 & 7 spring clutches.
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@brok3nr0b0t avatar
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Hooked
'71 Sprint Veloce
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UTC quote
qascooter wrote:
Yes, the nut works on both 6 & 7 spring clutches.
Thanks, qas. It would be just my style to have that thing come loose 5 mins down the road Laughing emoticon
@chandlerman avatar
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Lucky
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate
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Location: Nashville

84 Days Since Last Explosion
 
Lucky
@chandlerman avatar
76 Sprint V, 63 GL, 62 VBB, 05 Stella, 66 Smallstate
Joined: UTC
Posts: 9167
Location: Nashville

84 Days Since Last Explosion
UTC quote
In my case, the nut wouldn't clear the bell. If it fits into the bell, then it's fine. They obviously come with different sizes of flanges. I had that problem like four years ago.
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